JB_Tito Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 Ok so we have two more US players next year,well between 2 US MLS level players and 2 Canadians Braz and Reda,only insane coach would choose Braz and Reda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldtimer Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Rudi For the record Kenny has still been making public appearances for TFC. Got his autograph yesterday... [8D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Ault Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Rudi Jon Busch was acquired by TFC... in March of 2007. He was ciut a few weeks later. He was re-acquired in the waiver draft. Kenny's status is unknown to my information - he wants to stay, TFC would like to keep him, Tromso wants a little too much money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 Busch gaffe aside (and you've got "sign" as "sing" in one spot, I also like that article, Bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Ault Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Bill Ault Busch was re-acquired in the waiver draft and is expecting to sign. Kenny's status is unknown to my information - he wants to stay, TFC would like to keep him, Tromso wants a little too much money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Ault Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca Busch gaffe aside (and you've got "sign" as "sing" in one spot, I also like that article, Bill. Sign / sing it's Christmas time... (or some other excuse) I'll fix that one up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 quote:Originally posted by JB_Tito Ok so we have two more US players next year,well between 2 US MLS level players and 2 Canadians Braz and Reda,only insane coach would choose Braz and Reda. Sure, but what about guys like Jakovic or Brittner coming out of the NCAA. Are these guys going to get a fair shake or are we to expect a team stacked with foreign journeyman? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB_Tito Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 quote:Originally posted by jpg75 Sure, but what about guys like Jakovic or Brittner coming out of the NCAA. Are these guys going to get a fair shake or are we to expect a team stacked with foreign journeyman? If they good enough they will have chance to play,sorry but this is nothing different than in Europe.How many English players have MANU or Arsenal on their roster.It is in club interest to win and they don't care about NTs why should be here different.It sucks for Canadian talents to get the chance but that the life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 I don't see why through regulation by the league that Toronto FC should be forced to field a lesser team than they otherwise might. Professional soccer is a business and in my experience the majority of fans are more interested in a winning team that plays entertaining ball than which country's passport each player carries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 quote:Originally posted by JB_Tito If they good enough they will have chance to play,sorry but this is nothing different than in Europe.How many English players have MANU or Arsenal on their roster.It is in club interest to win and they don't care about NTs why should be here different. Because it is different here. There would be no MLS team in Toronto if there wasn't a mandate (supported by goverment funds) to develop Canadian soccer. Furthermore, Man U & Arsenal aren't playing in a league that was deliberately designed to help foster domestic talent, which the MLS was. The US MLS teams were put there to grow US soccer, its players & help the US national team. Why should Canada's MLS team(s) be any different with those goals in respect to Canada? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB_Tito Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 It was some deal with CSA to have certain number of Canadian players on the roster. Unfortunately I can't find the article with this info in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Richard I don't see why through regulation by the league that Toronto FC should be forced to field a lesser team than they otherwise might. Every team in the league is forced to field a lesser team than they otherwise might. They all have a salary cap & they hall have domestic quotas. The different being now that Toronto's quotas have been loosened even more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JB_Tito Posted December 19, 2007 Share Posted December 19, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca Because it is different here. There would be no MLS team in Toronto if there wasn't a mandate (supported by goverment funds) to develop Canadian soccer. Furthermore, Man U & Arsenal aren't playing in a league that was deliberately designed to help foster domestic talent, which the MLS was. The US MLS teams were put there to grow US soccer, its players & help the US national team. Why should Canada's MLS team(s) be any different with those goals in respect to Canada? The US MLS teams were put there to make money like all other sports in North America. Leagues without relegations(NBA,NHL,NFL etc),clubs or so called franchise are created to make money only.It is a product to sell in the first place.I wish you were right but you can see rules are being change so often for one reason only to sell the product better. I think 100 years ago when EPL started they started to compete against each other with their local talents, and not as franchise that can be sold and moved to other city overnight. How many Canadians are playing for Raptors or Blue Jays? It's all about $$$$$$$$ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhat Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 quote:Originally posted by JB_Tito The US MLS teams were put there to make money like all other sports in North America. No. The league was started in 1996 (right after WC 1994) to assist the development of soccer in the U.S. for American players. The players are "owned" by MLS, and the owners LOST money. Each team, unlike EPL or La Liga, has a quota of Americans in their line-up and are limited in the number of non-Americans they can sign. Because they were focused in the development of U.S. players however, the U.S. has reached EACH World Cup since 1994. As much as I would prescribe to the American notion of PROFIT, MLS was started not for that reason. MLS teams are not in the same situation as European teams where they can sign all Brazilians if they want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trident Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 quote:Originally posted by JB_Tito The US MLS teams were put there to make money like all other sports in North America. Leagues without relegations(NBA,NHL,NFL etc),clubs or so called franchise are created to make money only.It is a product to sell in the first place.I wish you were right but you can see rules are being change so often for one reason only to sell the product better. I think 100 years ago when EPL started they started to compete against each other with their local talents, and not as franchise that can be sold and moved to other city overnight. How many Canadians are playing for Raptors or Blue Jays? It's all about $$$$$$$$ So the NHL was created around 100 years ago for profit only? Come on now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ag futbol Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Bill Ault Completely unconfirmed if true at this point. Both Soccer Insider and SBI quoted as saying nobody was taken in the MLS waiver draft for this season. No press release through mlsnet or any other cooborating articles. Some people dug out the old press release from March 07 and assumed it was for this waiver draft, but that's all i've seen. RB blog published a false report based on the information. theoffside also published the report followed by a correction stating that nobody was selected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 Rio, Wes Brown, Gary Neville, Michael Carrick, Paul Scholes, and Wayne Rooney are English. Oh yeah, and Owen Hargreaves! Arguably the most English club on the north side of the premiership table. If they do a good job with the academy there's no reason the next generation of DeGuzmans, DeRosario, Hutchinson, Brennan, DeVos and Stalteri can't/won't come from TFC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 I guarantee it was never the intention of the founders of the MLS and the owners who paid to keep the lossmaking teams in business that the league and its investors should lose money indefinitely. MLS and its franchised teams are a a business like any other, they just happen to be in sports entertainment not manufacturing or high tech or whatever. Like any business venture for sure there was provision in the long term financial planning for losses during the initial years but certainly not forever. Even the NHL when it was formed I'll guarantee was never designed to make losses for ever. Despite all the 'right' words about developing the sport and raising the quality of the player pool at the end of the day it is a business and the final judgement depends solely on the bottom line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone Rio, Wes Brown, Gary Neville, Michael Carrick, Paul Scholes, and Wayne Rooney are English. Oh yeah, and Owen Hargreaves! Arguably the most English club on the north side of the premiership table. If they do a good job with the academy there's no reason the next generation of DeGuzmans, DeRosario, Hutchinson, Brennan, DeVos and Stalteri can't/won't come from TFC. Or the Whitecaps who clearly have a jump start on TFC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david2 Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 The CSA!!!!!! Don't make me laugh. They have no influence in an American 1st division league. The gov got evolved because of the U-20. Thats as far as the CSA was evolved. You don't even see the CSA logo on the MLS website. Do you even see any mention of Canadian National Team results? The CSA influence in MLS is so minimal, no non existent hat it's laughable. It's an American league with a FIFA exemption for a Canadian team. The CSA has no say in how MLS sets its rules. Labour laws are another story. Ontario law indicates that jobs must be given to Canadians who are ready , willing and ABLE to meet the jobs specs. The able part is very subjective when you deal with professional athletes. Most foreign players are better then are Canadians.........Sorry. Hopefully the Academy will alleviate that problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Richard I guarantee it was never the intention of the founders of the MLS and the owners who paid to keep the lossmaking teams in business that the league and its investors should lose money indefinitely. MLS and its franchised teams are a a business like any other, they just happen to be in sports entertainment not manufacturing or high tech or whatever. Like any business venture for sure there was provision in the long term financial planning for losses during the initial years but certainly not forever. Even the NHL when it was formed I'll guarantee was never designed to make losses for ever. Despite all the 'right' words about developing the sport and raising the quality of the player pool at the end of the day it is a business and the final judgement depends solely on the bottom line. Richard, did anyone ever mention that you are posting on the wrong forum? Here is where you belong: http://www.businessforum.net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoyleG Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Cheeta This rule which states that TFC can have 2 additional international players but only if they're American, is that legal? Unless Canadians are afforded similar opportunities with the US based teams I don't think that rule (as well meaning as it's intended) would stand up to Canadian labour law. If a such an agreemnt does exist, then there's little one can do to challenge it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 quote:Originally posted by redhat No. The league was started in 1996 (right after WC 1994) to assist the development of soccer in the U.S. for American players. The players are "owned" by MLS, and the owners LOST money. Each team, unlike EPL or La Liga, has a quota of Americans in their line-up and are limited in the number of non-Americans they can sign. Because they were focused in the development of U.S. players however, the U.S. has reached EACH World Cup since 1994. Thank you. I would also add, to the latest silly attempt to compare TFC to the Raptors & the Blue Jays (I seem to run into one on an internet board of some kind every week), those two teams were not created with the express goal of developing Canadian talent & they don't play in a league with domestic quotas in place for that purpose. Anyone who thinks that wasn't an expressly stated mandate is either uninformed or interested in revisionist history. The reason the quotas are being loosened a bit (one extra spot & no YI/SI distinction) across the league is obviously the expansion. There aren't enough quality American players to adequately staff the 13 (and soon to be 14) US MLS teams to that high a degree. To suggest that there aren't enough quality Canadians to partially staff one Canadian team is ludicrous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 quote:Originally posted by DoyleG If a such an agreemnt does exist, then there's little one can do to challenge it. If such an agreement existed than it would be a fair deal and little cause for challenging it. Think I read it wrong anyway. Those two international spots, if not occupied by domestic Canadian players can't be filled by any foreign national except Americans. Not sure if that's legal either (or in Canada's best interest) but in theroy it does limit Trader Mo's options and nudge him towards recruiting Canadians. Of course, only in so long as the salary cap remains low enough to limit the US teams ability to recruit quality import players to really take advantage of the increased number of international spots and combat the thinning of the US player base. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted December 20, 2007 Share Posted December 20, 2007 If there were a mechanism to ensure that the likes of Pat Onstad, Dwayne de Rosario, Andy Williams and Ante Jazic had no option but to play for TFC then clearly there wouldn't be a problem. Having those four plus Pozniak, Harmse and Serioux playing elsewhere next season shows that the players are there to stock one MLS roster with Canadian domestic content. The problem is that currently there isn't enough depth to the Canadian talent pool for TFC to easily be able to do it as well without winding up with players like Reda, Braz, Lombardo and Canizalez who simply aren't good enough. The key thing surely on the player development side is the youth program that TFC are going to be putting in place from next summer onwards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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