2015 Toronto FC Offseason News

[El Hombre]

19 hours ago, Bully said:

Nice. It would be unreal to have Oso and Johnson starting every game and developing chemistry. Floroisms aside. 

It would be interesting (and not all that unlikely) if Johnson's playing time came at the expense of Osorio's.  Wonder how that would change the Floroisms.

[Fussball_eh]

So Milan Borjan keeps retweeting rumours that he is going to TFC. Make of this what you wish.

[shamrock]

16 hours ago, Fussball_eh said:

So Milan Borjan keeps retweeting rumours that he is going to TFC. Make of this what you wish.

They need a solid goaly, he needs a starting spot. I wouldn't be to surprised if this came to fruition. However I hink there's cheaper options available already in the MLS pool (Borjan's probably better than 90% of them but he won't be cheap). 

[Free kick]

On December 19, 2015 at 11:41 AM, El Hombre said:

It would be interesting (and not all that unlikely) if Johnson's playing time came at the expense of Osorio's.  Wonder how that would change the Floroisms.

I doubt it.  I always liked Johnson's contributions to the national team but Osorio is just a better player. Despite what Floro thinks.    He (Osorio) can create and make plays in the offensive third. He is a good ball passer who dribbles and controlls the ball well in traffic.  Granted, the skill sets of the two are different but what osorio brings is harder to find and replace in a league like MLS.

Midfield play was not an issue last season so i tend to see the Johnson acquisition as depth move.  And next season they may need depth given the number of international matches going on. 

 

[BuzzAndSting]

6 minutes ago, Free kick said:

I doubt it.  I always liked Johnson's contributions to the national team but Osorio is just better IMO.  He can create and make plays in the offensive third. He is a good ball passer who dribbles and controlls the ball well in traffic.  Granted, the skill sets of the two are different but what osorio brings is harder to find and replace in a league like MLS.

Midfield play was not an issue last season so i tend to see the Johnson acquisition as depth move.  And next season they may need depth given the number of international matches going on. 

 

 

I just posted in the WJ thread in response to Obina's comment about Cheyrou being a better player and I'll repost my comment here in response to you. I don't understand why WJ is getting no love! 

"Whaaaaat?!?! WJ is a 3 time MLS all star, with his last appearance in 2014, before his horrible accident. He is a two time MLS Champion and was the Portland Timbers supporters Player of the Year for 2013. He has also been named Canadian Player of the Year and won the Goal of the Year in MLS.

WJ's injury was bad but there's no reason to believe he won't regain the form that made him one of the best players in MLS."

[Free kick]

Cheyrou was very under rated.  TFC were visibly a better team with him in the lineup.   He had great career in France and played for big clubs over there.  I was very surprised that they were able to get him in MLS and he lived up to my expectations.   No objective observer would rate Johnson higher than Cheyrou based on what is known eachs career.  

As i said in the past,. I have always liked Johnson's play on the national teams and he deserves to be a starter based on the squad that Floro is calling up.    So i am getting in tough territory here.  But, still, we really tend to over rate players just because they are on the national team.  Bradley, Cheyrou, Osorio have to come ahead of Johnson in terms of starting roles. 

[BuzzAndSting]

28 minutes ago, Free kick said:

Cheyrou was very under rated.  TFC were visibly a better team with him in the lineup.   He had great career in France and played for big clubs over there.  I was very surprised that they were able to get him in MLS and he lived up to my expectations.   No objective observer would rate Johnson higher than Cheyrou based on what is known eachs career.  

As i said in the past,. I have always liked Johnson's play on the national teams and he deserves to be a starter based on the squad that Floro is calling up.    So i am getting in tough territory here.  But, still, we really tend to over rate players just because they are on the national team.  Bradley, Cheyrou, Osorio have to come ahead of Johnson in terms of starting roles. 

There's an argument for Cheyrou having a better career than WJ but at this point I wouldn't say he's better player.

My comment to you was more about Osorio, I love the guy but to me he's definitely not better than WJ.

It could be my red & white coloured glasses...

[BearcatSA]

^Well, I'm probably wearing those same red & white glasses when I say that even if Johnson was tasked with playing on the right side of TFC's midfield his contributions would have been much better than those provided in either end of the field by Findley this past season.

  

 

[Unnamed Trialist]

Borjan is a good rumour. I have been thinking these days with recent signings that TFC should break the bank and pay for a top keeper, pay more than anyone ever has for a keeper in MLS. I think no one has ever made more than 350-400 thousand, unless there are some now. In any case, the player that came to mind was Cameroon veteran Kameni, at Málaga. He is very athletic and experienced, but I am not sure what he'd cost, probably 7-800 grand. 

Thing is, if TFC has a top keeper and top defenders, experienced with ability to play out from the back ,then you have an MLS Cup winner. So I say it is worth sending out a message and paying the highest ever salary to a keeper in MLS history.

[AvroArrow]

1 hour ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Borjan is a good rumour. I have been thinking these days with recent signings that TFC should break the bank and pay for a top keeper, pay more than anyone ever has for a keeper in MLS. I think no one has ever made more than 350-400 thousand, unless there are some now. In any case, the player that came to mind was Cameroon veteran Kameni, at Málaga. He is very athletic and experienced, but I am not sure what he'd cost, probably 7-800 grand. 

Thing is, if TFC has a top keeper and top defenders, experienced with ability to play out from the back ,then you have an MLS Cup winner. So I say it is worth sending out a message and paying the highest ever salary to a keeper in MLS history.

Would it be better to break the bank on a keeper or on a central defender?  The greatest keeper in the world is not going to be able to stop a tap in to an empty net if your defense consistently breaks down.

[Free kick]

4 hours ago, AvroArrow said:

Would it be better to break the bank on a keeper or on a central defender?  The greatest keeper in the world is not going to be able to stop a tap in to an empty net if your defense consistently breaks down.

Agreed.  I would add:  Philadelphia, a few years back, used a DP slot on a Colombian goal keeper.  It didnt help.   This goes to show that when all teams are playing with limited resources, you got to allocate more heavily to areas that will contribute to goal scoring because thats where you have the lesser margin of error and are more able to distinguish talent and predict future performance.     With goal keepers and, to a lesser degree, you can always find a diamond in the rough.  

[Free kick]

20 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

^Well, I'm probably wearing those same red & white glasses when I say that even if Johnson was tasked with playing on the right side of TFC's midfield his contributions would have been much better than those provided in either end of the field by Findley this past season.

  

 

I am ok with that.  Maybe he does start. That would great.  I just take issue with  the assessment that some are making in regards to players like Osorio.  Osorio has played very well, though not always consistently.  

[BearcatSA]

6 hours ago, Free kick said:

I am ok with that.  Maybe he does start. That would great.  I just take issue with  the assessment that some are making in regards to players like Osorio.  Osorio has played very well, though not always consistently.  

I don't see Osorio losing a starting spot in this midfield.  He has lots of good skills and makes plays that contribute to goals without getting on the score sheet.  However, I still see a young guy who needs to work on the mental side of the game (alluding to your consistency point):  he still can get taken out of a match for too long a stretch if things aren't going right, such as not getting calls in his favour, turnovers, or simply facing well organized defending against him and the rest of the team (see playoff loss or perhaps even the GC match at BMO).  Can he pick it up during those times of adversity?   That's the next step in his progress, especially if wants to be in that preferred and coveted  central attacking mid role.

Cheyrou has been an improvement over the other guys who partnered Bradley in the centre of midfield in the year prior to his arrival because of his ball playing skills but also because Bradley seemed to have more belief/faith in the Frenchman's abilities.  Having Johnson on board will really help Cheyrou in the defensive side of things.  Hopefully he stays healthy.

  

 

[Blackdude]

10 hours ago, Free kick said:

Agreed.  I would add:  Philadelphia, a few years back, used a DP slot on a Colombian goal keeper.  It didnt help.   This goes to show that when all teams are playing with limited resources, you got to allocate more heavily to areas that will contribute to goal scoring because thats where you have the lesser margin of error and are more able to distinguish talent and predict future performance.     With goal keepers and, to a lesser degree, you can always find a diamond in the rough.  

1) Philadelphia never used a DP slot on a goalkeeper. The Colombian goalkeeper was Faryd Mondragon helped that team in the one year he was there. That's the only time that the team made the playoffs. So they sign a great goalkeeper and it helped.

2) The only DP goalkeeper that was ever signed was Frank Rost by New York because they couldn't trust Coundoul or Sutton. It didn't work, but to be fair, but it's a mid-seasons signing, so I wouldn't make it like it was a bad signing. 

[Yohan]

Philly had MBohli from Algeria as DP.

He sucked

[Blackdude]

26 minutes ago, Yohan said:

Philly had MBohli from Algeria as DP.

He sucked

Mbohli wasn't a DP. 

[Yohan]

3 hours ago, Blackdude said:

Mbohli wasn't a DP. 

Yes he was. He was a DP due to transfer fee.

 

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/1110/major-league-soccer/2015/04/10/10623302/the-worst-designated-player-signings-in-mls-history

[Blackdude]

16 hours ago, Yohan said:

Yes he was. He was a DP due to transfer fee.

 

http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/1110/major-league-soccer/2015/04/10/10623302/the-worst-designated-player-signings-in-mls-history

He wasn't and your link doesn't say something to that matter. HE was making close to DP money, but wasn't a DP.

[BuzzAndSting]

2 hours ago, Blackdude said:

He wasn't and your link doesn't say something to that matter. HE was making close to DP money, but wasn't a DP.

According to this article he was listed as a DP for the expansion draft.

http://www.brotherlygame.com/2015/3/9/8166629/the-latest-on-the-new-cba-and-designated-player-rules

 

[Free kick]

On December 24, 2015 at 5:46 AM, Blackdude said:

1) Philadelphia never used a DP slot on a goalkeeper. The Colombian goalkeeper was Faryd Mondragon helped that team in the one year he was there. That's the only time that the team made the playoffs. So they sign a great goalkeeper and it helped.

2) The only DP goalkeeper that was ever signed was Frank Rost by New York because they couldn't trust Coundoul or Sutton. It didn't work, but to be fair, but it's a mid-seasons signing, so I wouldn't make it like it was a bad signing

I am pretty sure that they made Mondragon a dp

 

[Blackdude]

15 hours ago, Free kick said:

I am pretty sure that they made Mondragon a dp

 

They didn't. He was making good money, but he wasn't officially a DP.

[Unnamed Trialist]

On 23/12/2015 at 8:18 PM, AvroArrow said:

Would it be better to break the bank on a keeper or on a central defender?  The greatest keeper in the world is not going to be able to stop a tap in to an empty net if your defense consistently breaks down.

Actually, the greatest keepers in the world stop tap ins all the time, look what Courtois stopped on Monday, think it was that Herrera tap in. How many tap ins have I seen Casillas save. 

Apart from that, great keepers help their defenses to not break down, they organize them, cover their backs, and are in dialogue with them constantly. Taps ins usually come off counters when a player gets past a defender, a good keeper who can come off his line will be involved in cutting them off, either crosses or the long balls breaking them free.

Anyone who saw the MLS final and was not a regular MLS fan would have thought the same, Crew's entire season ruined by an incredible bonehead error. No point having a Giovinco and all those goals if you are getting scored on easily, the other team gets ahead and they can sit back and absorb your strikers. Making your effectiveness drop incredibly. What happened vs Impact in the playoffs this year?

Whitecaps difference between making the playoffs and not was the keeper this year, good for 8-12 points I'd say.

I understand teams think they can save money on keepers and always have in MLS, even Mondragon did not make more than 400,000 don't think. When they stop doing that the prestige of the league will jump considerably, all goals will mean more, and it will be way more respected internationally.

Buy Kameni TFC, he was a genius today vs Levante. He makes around 650 thousand pounds a year and is pushing 32.

[BearcatSA]

43 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

 

Buy Kameni TFC, he was a genius today vs Levante. He makes around 650 thousand pounds a year and is pushing 32.

My buddy watched him in Malaga earlier this fall and also agrees with your assessment.

[Unnamed Trialist]

8 minutes ago, BearcatSA said:

My buddy watched him in Malaga earlier this fall and also agrees with your assessment.

Glad he agrees.

As Málaga is at risk of going down, and he'll find it hard to get a final contract near what he has now, it is great time to make a move. 

As Whitecaps picked up Morales from Málaga, there is a precedent for them negotiating with MLS teams even.

[TRM]

On 2015-12-30 at 10:21 AM, Unnamed Trialist said:

Whitecaps difference between making the playoffs and not was the keeper this year, good for 8-12 points I'd say.

I understand teams think they can save money on keepers and always have in MLS, even Mondragon did not make more than 400,000 don't think. When they stop doing that the prestige of the league will jump considerably, all goals will mean more, and it will be way more respected internationally.

 First point is very accurate. Ousted was the biggest difference. Having Waston and Parker/Kah in front sure helped and having Laba in front of them was a total godsend. Only one of those 4 is a DP so looking for quality bargains is a good idea.

I think it goes deeper than that. What is the point of bringing in all these big name offensive talents if the keepers shut them down? Less goals is hardly something MLS management want to see. Sadly I don't see it stopping any time soon.