Whitecaps 2017 Season

[Unnamed Trialist]

Seriously, I just threw out that bit about Vancouver making the MLS Cup final---no one in Vancouver is anywhere close to even imagining such a thing. Mostly because we play in such as way that our destiny is not in our hands, we get results without really being the team stamping our identity on games from start to finish. So we are vulnerable. In fact no team in the West is even close to thinking about it, except some in Seattle thinking about repeating. Basically, the West has overall underperformed, and they know it, so it is really game to game and here's hoping.

And the East has three strong teams, and if you want some others that as G-L says can be dangerous and have talent like Atlanta (apart from a quality coach who can read a knockout round well, and the momentum of that new stadium). So the East is way harder to get out of, but in spite of that TFC basically has get to the final and win it as the sole leitmotiv right now. That is a lot to ask. 

[jonovision]

11 hours ago, Gian-Luca said:

After TFC beat Montreal in Montreal Bradley said that the next game - a fairly inconsequential one against a non-playoff team in Philadelphia - was the most important game of the year. Then they said something similar prior to the SJ match, against a team that isn't even in the same conference & likely won't make the playoffs either.

I don't doubt that TFC's players are focused and determined but this type of answer ("the next game is our most important one") is the kind of thing athletes say when they don't want to say anything interesting.

[jonovision]

Accidental double post.

[Unnamed Trialist]

Just thinking, if neither TFC nor NYC get into the Cup final and we do, that might mean it being held at BC Place. Which is cool, since if you win, you get a celebration; and if you lose, you get a downtown riot. It's a win-win situation. 

[The Beaver]

7 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Just thinking, if neither TFC nor NYC get into the Cup final and we do, that might mean it being held at BC Place. Which is cool, since if you win, you get a celebration; and if you lose, you get a downtown riot. It's a win-win situation. 

Nicely done! 

As for the Caps making the finals: why not? As we all know, the West has been very unimpressive this year.  Any of 6 or 7 teams could be legitimate contenders out of the West. We have near parity over here.  What the Caps have going for them is a mostly healthy roster and several games in hand, this latter point only relevant in that it gives the Caps some time to integrate Ghazal and find some chemistry throughout the midfield. If Reyna and Ghazal and Freddy and the wingers can figure shit out, then we won't need to sit back so much and counter attack all the time. We can win the ball and keep it a bit more. We've been missing a general in the middle of the pitch all year. Ghazal is the first dude who looks like he has the chops to boss shit. He just needs to get game fitness and build chemistry and understanding with everyone around him. The team needs to get points in the next three home games, with a couple of wins at least, and then the interesting test will be to see what they do on the road against some tough opponents. The good news is that there is some time to sharpen things up before the playoffs.

 

[Free kick]

Right now, with the games in hand, the Caps look like a favourite comming out of the western conference.  They and Atl look like the hot teams now. 

But its been such a crazy year.  For a while, Dallas looked like the sure bet but now they re just plain lousy.  Then it was Chicago who seemingly couldnt lose but then they dropped like stone.   Even SKC, Hou and even Mtl had thier moments for while and then couldnt sustain it.  Only NYC and TFC have been consistent. 

Schedule may have a lot to do with it,  i just dont like this situatiion where on any given week, everyone has played a differnt number of games. 

[TRM]

23 hours ago, Gian-Luca said:

To be fair, I think it is the fans and the media that are falling into the hype more than the club or players are.

True.

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I am cheering for Montreal to make the playoffs

Me too.

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Montreal vs. Toronto makes media headlines over here so that's also good for the sport.

Same out west with Van & Port/Seat. More interest from casuals is great for the sport.

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I see a team like Atlanta potentially being trouble for TFC because they will have nothing to fear and no pressure on them as a first year team.

Atlanta with their run and gun could take out anyone on any given day.

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I actually worry for Vancouver that the same could happen - they actually have 1st place in their own hands 

Me too. Tonight will be a measure to see if we can take max points off the weaker teams. I hope we are over that "play to the level of your opponent" nonsense. When you do that they tend to surprise you. I've seen enough of that to last me a lifetime.

Get healthy and round into form just before the playoffs and ride the wave to the cup is a common element amongst the winners of the MLS playoffs.

[jonovision]

Is Jordan Harvey really better than Marcel de Jong? MDJ certainly had a strong match tonight?

[TRM]

3 Canucks start, good squad rotation, excellent performance by the 'B' team players, 3 goals for us and a clean sheet for our keeper. Damn good night all around.

PS. We did what we should do to weaker teams! 

[TRM]

Just now, jonovision said:

Is Jordan Harvey really better than Marcel de Jong? MDJ certainly had a strong match tonight?

I was glad to see Russ bounce back with what I thought was the best of the 3 Canucks with Marcel being a solid second. Davies had his moments but was clearly gassed by the 65-70 minute mark. 

Marcel seemed to get stronger as the game went on. He did get caught out of position twice early on by going for intercepts and missing but had a great assist to Reyna for the first goal. His other crosses were not as good. Comparing the 2 (Marcel & Jordan) is tough as both play very well. Harvey is 4 years older than Marcel so I expect to see more of Marcel as Harvey ages out. 

[harrycoyster]

 

7 minutes ago, jonovision said:

Is Jordan Harvey really better than Marcel de Jong? MDJ certainly had a strong match tonight?

I wouldn't say he's better or worse. Harvey is a safer, more physical presence whereas De Jong offers a more complete game but can often overrun his ability to track back. I think it's going to be De Jong vs. weaker teams and Harvey vs. stronger teams from here on out unless the offense stalls. 

[The Beaver]

Rotated 5 players and got the 3 points. Solid result. Yup, the squad is pretty decent. Still think we are a helluva lot better with a healthy and in form Bolanos. Hope he recovers quickly. Great to see Rusty have a solid game. Hurtado and Shea too.  And Reyna has even more to offer. Chemistry seems to be building all around

[harrycoyster]

The Caps have signed Danny Barbir, a 19 year old American CB. He is a former Union academy player who moved to Man City, then West Brom before being released this summer after refusing a pay cut. 

What's hilarious about this move is that the Caps apparently had his discovery rights. How we were able to sign an American that was in another MLS academy through the discovery system is beyond me. 

[Big_M]

With the second team

VANCOUVER, BC – Vancouver Whitecaps FC announced on Thursday that the club has signed American centre back Danny Barbir to a contract with Whitecaps FC 2 (WFC2) for the remainder of the 2017 USL season.

[TRM]

Manneh & Tchani (hey it even rhymes) both figured in the 2-2 result today against their former teams. Manneh with an assist and GOTW candidate. Tchani put in the late equaliser to tie it up. Reyna with 2 off the posts. 

[harrycoyster]

4 hours ago, TRM said:

Manneh & Tchani (hey it even rhymes) both figured in the 2-2 result today against their former teams. Manneh with an assist and GOTW candidate. Tchani put in the late equaliser to tie it up. Reyna with 2 off the posts. 

Of course, Manneh plays like a man possessed against us. Reyna and Montero can look awfully lonely up top when Techera is off like he was today. Great game from Ousted.

[Unnamed Trialist]

I thought the performance and the football proposition from the Caps was appalling, once again, the deficiences of Robinson were visible on the pitch, in spite of the result. For me it was hard to stomach that they are passing that kind of football off as entertainment. 

To reiterate: 

-the players do not play as a cohesive team, as a group, except the two CBs and Ousted. It's a crap shoot, and very ugly.

-there is no defensive commmittment to get the ball back and we were being embarrased by the Crew's tiki-taka when they were up a goal. We were hopeless and hapless. Nor is there proper positional play defending, they simply stack up in the middle and let the opponents have numbers on the sides and the top of the box even. Outdated football.

-we had two DMs who both coasted through the game, running back to their designated spots on the field like children instead of reading plays as they were happening, with very little width, not supporting properly, and getting completely embarrased on plays like the one leading to the Manneh goal. Apart from that, Tchani is still barely able to pass, his skill set is very poor, even having improved a bit.

-even with Reyna playing well, he did not support Montero properly, and you could see we are still not helping and combining right in attack. Reyna-Montero could be deadly, and sure, Reyna hit two posts, but they are basically just doing their own thing.

-It is a bunch of talented individuals doing their own thing. That is why there is so much finger pointing, and shouting at each other, and impatience. 

In the interview on ExtraTime this week Robinson had the gall to compare what Caps were doing with Leicester, trying to suggest he had a counterattacking proposition. And humbly putting himself on a par with Ranieri. Of course they played that way out of necessity, but coherently, with talented players. But Caps have no possession because he simply does not know how to coach it. There is no evidence his players are not able to play possession, he just has no clue how to take them there, nor does he ask for it. He is happy with what for me is very defective soccer, and totally vulnerable. While our talent might just solve games and even get us deeper into playoffs, we are too improvised to get through very far, unless, somehow the rivals give us a break.

[TRM]

4 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

-we had two DMs who both coasted through the game, running back to their designated spots on the field like children instead of reading plays as they were happening, 

I would disagree with this part as I thought Aly was very good defensively especially inside the 18. 

[Dub Narcotic]

@Unnamed Trialist I think you are going a bit too far in some cases but I generally agree with the gist of what you are saying. Manneh (and Mattocks, and Hurtado, and etc..) used to take a lot of blame for the lack of 'caps possession but it's clearly the way Robinson coaches. However, this year they are a more cohesive counter-attacking team, mainly due to talent, than they have been in the last couple of years. They look legitimately dangerous on the break with players like Reyna, Shea and Davies now.

However, they are still looking good for a home-field advantage if not a first-round bye in a very weak West this year, so Robinson-ball is going to be around for a while longer. It does look like years of boring, no-possession counter-attacking soccer (Rennie too) has sapped some of the energy out of BC Place. Attendance and atmosphere has been mediocre this year, even with this pretty successful year-to-date.

[Unnamed Trialist]

2 hours ago, Dub Narcotic said:

@Unnamed Trialist I think you are going a bit too far in some cases but I generally agree with the gist of what you are saying. Manneh (and Mattocks, and Hurtado, and etc..) used to take a lot of blame for the lack of 'caps possession but it's clearly the way Robinson coaches. However, this year they are a more cohesive counter-attacking team, mainly due to talent, than they have been in the last couple of years. They look legitimately dangerous on the break with players like Reyna, Shea and Davies now.

However, they are still looking good for a home-field advantage if not a first-round bye in a very weak West this year, so Robinson-ball is going to be around for a while longer. It does look like years of boring, no-possession counter-attacking soccer (Rennie too) has sapped some of the energy out of BC Place. Attendance and atmosphere has been mediocre this year, even with this pretty successful year-to-date.

I was watching a Sky feed and they were saying how dead BC Place was, they were even downplaying some of the supporter sections (which I could hear clearly on the feed, so I think they were not entirely fair, I heard the Curva clear as day) for not boucing or chanting with any coordination, true, that was after we saw a half-hearted image. But the fact is that stadium looked really uncommitted and cold, was not the best of atmospheres. 

Sorry to @TRM but I felt the double DM was really weak. Neither had any range and they were not biting at all. Just rewatch the Manneh goal, that defending was not worthy of this level of soccer.

 

[TRM]

5 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Sorry to @TRM but I felt the double DM was really weak. Neither had any range and they were not biting at all. Just rewatch the Manneh goal, that defending was not worthy of this level of soccer.

No problem. We differ. That just means that you're wrong

Splitting the 2 DMs with quick acceleration is what Manneh does as good as any. His coast to sprint is impressive. I think both assumed the other would take him and Manneh rode the line down the middle perfectly. A moment's indecision or lack of communication is all it takes and on that play cost us. 

26/28 passing, 3 ints, 1 clear, 6 recovers for Aly 
23/29 passing, 1 int, 0 clear, 2 recovers for Tchani

The thing is that Laba was the only DM Robbo trusts alone in that role. We will see 2 DMs the rest of the way. I still think Aly was the better of the 2 especially defending and if Bolanos gets healthy maybe we'll see if he can do the DM role alone. It really leaves too much distance to the forwards to have 2 players doing the DM role.

[BearcatSA]

On ‎9‎/‎17‎/‎2017 at 3:17 AM, Unnamed Trialist said:

I thought the performance and the football proposition from the Caps was appalling, once again, the deficiences of Robinson were visible on the pitch, in spite of the result. For me it was hard to stomach that they are passing that kind of football off as entertainment. 

To reiterate: 

-the players do not play as a cohesive team, as a group, except the two CBs and Ousted. It's a crap shoot, and very ugly.

-there is no defensive commmittment to get the ball back and we were being embarrased by the Crew's tiki-taka when they were up a goal. We were hopeless and hapless. Nor is there proper positional play defending, they simply stack up in the middle and let the opponents have numbers on the sides and the top of the box even. Outdated football.

-we had two DMs who both coasted through the game, running back to their designated spots on the field like children instead of reading plays as they were happening, with very little width, not supporting properly, and getting completely embarrased on plays like the one leading to the Manneh goal. Apart from that, Tchani is still barely able to pass, his skill set is very poor, even having improved a bit.

-even with Reyna playing well, he did not support Montero properly, and you could see we are still not helping and combining right in attack. Reyna-Montero could be deadly, and sure, Reyna hit two posts, but they are basically just doing their own thing.

-It is a bunch of talented individuals doing their own thing. That is why there is so much finger pointing, and shouting at each other, and impatience. 

In the interview on ExtraTime this week Robinson had the gall to compare what Caps were doing with Leicester, trying to suggest he had a counterattacking proposition. And humbly putting himself on a par with Ranieri. Of course they played that way out of necessity, but coherently, with talented players. But Caps have no possession because he simply does not know how to coach it. There is no evidence his players are not able to play possession, he just has no clue how to take them there, nor does he ask for it. He is happy with what for me is very defective soccer, and totally vulnerable. While our talent might just solve games and even get us deeper into playoffs, we are too improvised to get through very far, unless, somehow the rivals give us a break.

^This. 

[Dub Narcotic]

AFTN just had a big interview with Robinson where he blamed his inelegant style on a lack of funds to afford a MIchael Bradley-type. Of course, they were then passed off the park by Columbus and Greg Berhalter who spend way less on their squad.

[Unnamed Trialist]

18 hours ago, Dub Narcotic said:

AFTN just had a big interview with Robinson where he blamed his inelegant style on a lack of funds to afford a MIchael Bradley-type. Of course, they were then passed off the park by Columbus and Greg Berhalter who spend way less on their squad.

He simply does not have the technical knowledge to coach it. He never played it, he is from the old school, and he can't coach it. It is a question of will and knowledge, he may have the first (though I am not sure about that), but lacks the latter. Because possession is especially about positioning off the ball, where you are in relation to a teammate receiving, and developing mechanisms favouring possession. 

The players are just as technically good as any other squad in MLS, we have Uruguayans, Argentines, Colombians, Peruvians, Costa Ricans. They can all do it. They are just not coached to do it and have no incentive either. 

Funny thing, you see WC2 do it more, not always but with more criteria. And when I saw the Residency u-16 quarter final last summer, vs. Sounders, they played control possession perfectly. So maybe there is someone in the dregs who has a clearer idea than Robbo of what to do. 

Without possession, it is a crap shoot hoping, first, the team can score first and sit back, the CBs can handle dozens of balls into the area and Ousted comes up big. Basically what we have seen with Caps for a few years now. Which is not the best formula for playoffs, and has proven unreliable this year. 

[BearcatSA]

16 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

The players are just as technically good as any other squad in MLS, we have Uruguayans, Argentines, Colombians, Peruvians, Costa Ricans. They can all do it. They are just not coached to do it and have no incentive either...without possession, it is a crap shoot hoping, first, the team can score first and sit back, the CBs can handle dozens of balls into the area and Ousted comes up big. Basically what we have seen with Caps for a few years now. Which is not the best formula for playoffs, and has proven unreliable this year. 

Man, I think I am a member of your choir, preacher!