Vancouver Fan Posted May 27, 2006 Author Share Posted May 27, 2006 Just to lighten the mood here a bit. My wife mentioned that maybe someone complained that the banner read "Voyeurs for Canada.":) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest speedmonk42 Posted May 27, 2006 Share Posted May 27, 2006 I just think the most likely thing is someone had no idea what it was. They were concerned it was someone putting up something that might violate agreements with sponsors. This is almost certainly a case of ignorance, not malevolance. Just as frustrating and will likely serve to be a lightening rod for many other complaints. However, lets not burn bridges with this and instead make a solid case for somekind of financial and organizational support for the 2007 games. The will is here, we just need a bit of help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted May 27, 2006 Share Posted May 27, 2006 "lets not burn bridges with this" I agree wholeheartedly. Best take a pragmatic approach and not simply antagonise the CSA folks because that definitely won't get you what you want for 2007. Voyageurs need to cultivate the CSA not alienate them. No matter how much you might disagree with how they go about their business, they are running the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted May 27, 2006 Share Posted May 27, 2006 I don't think anyone is suggesting that we get abusive or insulting or anything like that, but standing firm, insisting on getting an explanation and assurances that this will never happen again at upcoming home matches (especially with 2007 coming up) is the sort of thing I suspect most have in mind. If it is the case that somebody asked to take it down because they didn't know who we were, taking a stand & making our presence felt will help to ensure to the best of our ability that this never happens again, because hopefully they will know who we are next time. Assuming of course that ignorance was the reason for the insistance of the banner being taken down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 If Voyageurs never wrote a letter as a group complaining about not getting a home game from the senior national team for 3 years, we are not going to write a letter about a banner that was taken down at a friendly game with 25 m. to go. It would not be consistent with the philosophy of the group. Which is to complain a lot, wait for some lame explanation, then whitewash the whole thing in the CSA's favour and everything back to normal. The Voyageurs does not have a legal status, nor an address, nor anything official about it, and most of us prefer it that way. But how can the CSA respond to an organization that does not officially exist in an official way? The other thing is if someone offers an explanation, which would be nice. I personally think that, with the WCO7 in mind, they were doing a test run in crowd control. They pretended the Voyageurs banner was, say, from a Corsican separatist group put up during a game with France playing. And they took it down. My point, in any case, is that if you are upset about something you write a letter or make a phone call like a responsible adult in a democratic society to the person who might be able to respond. I have done it on a few occasions related to soccer in Canada, very few in fact. The latest was in mid-January. Before that maybe years passed. Doubt, seriously, that most of those getting up in arms here have ever actually taken a tenth of the time spent posting to write a letter to someone else related to a soccer concern. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S. Doubt, seriously, that most of those getting up in arms here have ever actually taken a tenth of the time spent posting to write a letter to someone else related to a soccer concern. Since you don't know me, I don't take your generalization seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aussoccerfan Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 I've sent lots of complaint letters to the CSA. They almost never get answered. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 quote:Originally posted by aussoccerfan I've sent lots of complaint letters to the CSA. They almost never get answered. "Almost never"... so you have had responses to some of your letters? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJT Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S. But how can the CSA respond to an organization that does not officially exist in an official way? That is precisely why I suggested that one person act as an official representative in this case, and Vancouver Fan has in effect done that. This is how we have been operating all along: for whatever project we have going on, one or two people are the official representatives for that project, even though there are no overall leaders of the group. While theoretically I see many potential problems with this system, I think in practice it has worked fairly well so far. If the CSA or others (eg. the clubs) were to respond by saying that they won't deal with us because we are not officially organized, or were to not respond at all, then we'd have to think about making changes, but this has never happened, as far as I know. I think Vancouver Fan has done everything right so far, and I thank him for his work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolando Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Richard " No matter how much you might disagree with how they go about their business, they are running the show. decided two vaguely democratic Cuban sugarcane farmers. "Another fifty years of our quiet complaints and we should have them fully cultivated." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted May 28, 2006 Share Posted May 28, 2006 quote:Originally posted by DJT That is precisely why I suggested that one person act as an official representative in this case, and Vancouver Fan has in effect done that. This is how we have been operating all along: for whatever project we have going on, one or two people are the official representatives for that project, even though there are no overall leaders of the group. While theoretically I see many potential problems with this system, I think in practice it has worked fairly well so far. If the CSA or others (eg. the clubs) were to respond by saying that they won't deal with us because we are not officially organized, or were to not respond at all, then we'd have to think about making changes, but this has never happened, as far as I know. I think as well in this case the "official existence" is a moot point - the point is we have a very real existence at matches, because we actually show up at matches as a group and form a supporter's section, and we've done that in the past on occasion with the help of some members of the CSA. We obviously plan to do this in the future, especially for the WYC in 2007. So in this case the CSA has to deal with us and the reality of our existence at future matches, whether we are "official" or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vancouver Fan Posted May 29, 2006 Author Share Posted May 29, 2006 I won't be at a computer to check E mails until I get home from work.I'll make a post on Monday after I check my E mails between 5 and 6 pm Pacific. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CSAplayer Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 hey everyone.. i'm new here, i happen to be a player from the U-20 squad that played in the brazil series. who i infact am is irrelivant but i thought i might be able to comment on some things from a players perspective. This whole fan deal is indeed bothersome, the amount of catering we do as a nation is demoralizing as a player. picture a friendly series IN brazil...i'm sure they wouln't have canadian cultural music playing with canadian go-go dancers during warm up... we get a bit confused watching the brazilians laughing and dancing to their own music in warm up at a match in a different country.. i'm glad you guys noticed this aswell, it difficult to motivate urself for your country when they're buisy ordering foreign dance teams... i really appreciate all the trouble u guys go through to support us, and i just though i'd let u know that it doesn't go unnoticed by the players. thanks for all of your support. ...a thankfull U-20 player.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 quote:Originally posted by CSAplayer hey everyone.. i'm new here, i happen to be a player from the U-20 squad that played in the brazil series. who i infact am is irrelivant but i thought i might be able to comment on some things from a players perspective. This whole fan deal is indeed bothersome, the amount of catering we do as a nation is demoralizing as a player. picture a friendly series IN brazil...i'm sure they wouln't have canadian cultural music playing with canadian go-go dancers during warm up... we get a bit confused watching the brazilians laughing and dancing to their own music in warm up at a match in a different country.. i'm glad you guys noticed this aswell, it difficult to motivate urself for your country when they're buisy ordering foreign dance teams... i really appreciate all the trouble u guys go through to support us, and i just though i'd let u know that it doesn't go unnoticed by the players. thanks for all of your support. ...a thankfull U-20 player.. And that, right there, is why despite the CSA, despite the officiating, despitethe situation in the stands, in the halftime shows, despite it all . . . I love supporting these guys and girls and will always back our national teams. We have a year to get ready . . . I think we should make the most of it . . . cheers, matthew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolando Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 here here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 quote:Originally posted by CSAplayer hey everyone.. i'm new here, i happen to be a player from the U-20 squad that played in the brazil series. who i infact am is irrelivant but i thought i might be able to comment on some things from a players perspective. This whole fan deal is indeed bothersome, the amount of catering we do as a nation is demoralizing as a player. picture a friendly series IN brazil...i'm sure they wouln't have canadian cultural music playing with canadian go-go dancers during warm up... we get a bit confused watching the brazilians laughing and dancing to their own music in warm up at a match in a different country.. i'm glad you guys noticed this aswell, it difficult to motivate urself for your country when they're buisy ordering foreign dance teams... i really appreciate all the trouble u guys go through to support us, and i just though i'd let u know that it doesn't go unnoticed by the players. thanks for all of your support. ...a thankfull U-20 player.. Look forward to seeing you boys in Toronto next year. Look for the supporters in the north end, that's where you guys will be jumping when you score your goals Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loud Mouth Soup Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 VancouverFan needs to copy and paste that comment to Earl Cochrane in any follow-up letters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhat Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 quote:Originally posted by CSAplayer i really appreciate all the trouble u guys go through to support us, and i just though i'd let u know that it doesn't go unnoticed by the players. thanks for all of your support. You (the players and the team) are the reason we travel to show our support. Not the CSA, who sometimes do not appear to have a clue. (Like Brazil needs a cheering squad ... what was the CSA thinking?)[}] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Rudi Look for the supporters in the north end, that's where you guys will be jumping when you score your goals Won't we be on the south side? And yeah, that post from the U20 player should be copied and pasted to every soccer association (national or provincial) or any other organization that has a hand in organizing the "entertainment" at international matches we host. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 While I agree with the whole point, without any proof that this post was indeed written by an U-20 player I can't see how it could help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 It could help if people give him the benefit of the doubt, which is what most of us are doing. I don't expect a young player in that position to identify himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca Won't we be on the south side? From what I can gather from the renderings and my two visits to the site, the larger end-zone stand (for lack of a better term) will be on the north end, attached to the remnants of the Hall of Fame building. We actually discussed this yesterday, but I'm not sure if you had shown up by that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca It could help if people give him the benefit of the doubt, which is what most of us are doing. I don't expect a young player in that position to identify himself. I'm not expecting an U-20 player to give is name here but I wouldn't expect the CSA or any provincial association to give a lot of credibility to an anonymous letter. Doesn't cost anything to send this post but I,m not sure it will help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca It could help if people give him the benefit of the doubt, which is what most of us are doing. I don't expect a young player in that position to identify himself. I'm not expecting an U-20 player to give is name here but I wouldn't expect the CSA or any provincial association to give a lot of credibility to an anonymous letter. Doesn't cost anything to send this post but I,m not sure it will help. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju Posted May 29, 2006 Share Posted May 29, 2006 I have a hunch the CSA boys read this forum and have read this whole thread. If I knew of an active internet chat forum that discussed what I do at work I'd sure as hell read it. The Brazilian fans bought their tickets to get in. Once they got in they weren't going to buy any CSA merchandise. There was no more money to be made from them, so why let them have a dance squad? Why go out of your way to make opposing fans and opposing teams happy in your stadium, is there something to gain from it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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