Road to India - u17 World Cup

[Unnamed Trialist]

To be fair and responding to those criticizing Canada, Spain struggled like hell and is only through on small details and a bit of luck. And they're current champs.

We all know our youth, women and men, need real work as we're not matching our senior expectations at all. 

[BearcatSA]

13 hours ago, The Ref said:

The team may have been well prepped and with enough friendlies, but perhaps not having the best selection of players a mediocre team, no matter how well prepped, will still not be up to level.  Not the players fault, but that of a coach unable to pick the right women.

I'd be interested in listening to Herdman himself (Humphries is a Herdman acolyte, no?), or a Japanese youth TD on how you build a national team at this (very) young age level.  What are you looking for in a player at this level and how do you rank those traits?  How does that transfer and develop as she matures?  What are the specific goals and areas of growth do you want to see from individual players and the team beyond the results and "compete" levels at such tourneys?

I'm always interested in the "graduation" rates of young NT players from the U17 (and even earlier at U15) ranks to U20/U23/senior NT.  For all the prep and sports science, it still seems like such a lottery (and political) game when selecting players.

Thoughts?

[red card]

7 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

I'd be interested in listening to Herdman himself (Humphries is a Herdman acolyte, no?), or a Japanese youth TD on how you build a national team at this (very) young age level.  What are you looking for in a player at this level and how do you rank those traits?  How does that transfer and develop as she matures?  What are the specific goals and areas of growth do you want to see from individual players and the team beyond the results and "compete" levels at such tourneys?

I'm always interested in the "graduation" rates of young NT players from the U17 (and even earlier at U15) ranks to U20/U23/senior NT.  For all the prep and sports science, it still seems like such a lottery (and political) game when selecting players.

Thoughts?

Priestman hired Humphries. They're married.

Japan starts its national training centres at the u12 level while Canada seems to be at u15. 

In the u20 World Cup thread, I mentioned the the high was 7 from the 2014 u20 that made the senior team. 2016 & 2018 had 3 each (5 if fringe players are included). 

At the u17 level, 2 from the 2019 4th place World Cup team are on the senior team (Riviere & Huitema). Jade Rose played in the qualifiers but wasn't on the World Cup team.

2016, 2014 & 2012 World Cup teams produced 4-6 each but at least half are fringe senior squad players.

It seems the production picked up after Herdman came on board in 2011 and implemented pathways/training centres. 2008 & 2010 World Cups only produced 1 player each.

While it is a common refrain that Canada Soccer is overlooking youth female players, I mentioned in the u20 thread that of the 60 person senior team list for Concacaf W Championship, only 10% (Gilles, Lacasse, Viens, Alidou, Hellstrom & Pridham) didn't play for a Canadian youth team. With half being Quebecois, this could be a blind spot.

But now there are >100 Canadians playing pro in Europe of which many weren't on youth teams. This may show more blind spots. We have already seen Gilles emerge and now maybe Lacasse & Larisey.

 

 

Edited October 20, 2022 by red card

[Unnamed Trialist]

7 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

I'd be interested in listening to Herdman himself (Humphries is a Herdman acolyte, no?), or a Japanese youth TD on how you build a national team at this (very) young age level.  What are you looking for in a player at this level and how do you rank those traits?  How does that transfer and develop as she matures?  What are the specific goals and areas of growth do you want to see from individual players and the team beyond the results and "compete" levels at such tourneys?

I'm always interested in the "graduation" rates of young NT players from the U17 (and even earlier at U15) ranks to U20/U23/senior NT.  For all the prep and sports science, it still seems like such a lottery (and political) game when selecting players.

Thoughts?

Adding to @redcardor really a more peripheral thought.

It used to be that women were appearing on NTs earlier, younger, as often happened in a lot of women's sport. Related to physical maturing, like we see with swimming, gymnastics. So basically: a young female player in general had a faster track to a senior call-up.

Then because pro options were weaker, they would often lose interest and opt out before the age of 30. There were few incentives financially of any kind. Women droppped out earlier too.

Not as much any more. While for men there does seem to be a bit of a youth revolution, for some nations at least.

Now we have  more of these intermediate steps, which delay a player competing at a top level. Less and less u-20s will be in the senior mix. Less NCAA players. We'll see more players opting for pro, even a modest career or lower paid league, and we'll be drawing from there. But that means that senior women's teams are older, approximating ages to men's sides (men on WC teams  have an average age of @27-28 years old).

[Free kick]

Spend two days looking for the group standings.   Why on earth can't i find it????!!!!!!

https://www.fifa.com/fifaplus/en/tournaments/womens/u17womensworldcup/india2022

I have sifted through the above page several times.   Gone round and round.  clicked on many links.   Nothing that shows group standings.  Nothing shows scores for games involving Canada.  Never ever had this problem with other FIFA tournaments 

Suggestions?  anyone?

 

Edited October 20, 2022 by Free kick

[The Ref]

28 minutes ago, Free kick said:

Spend two days looking for the group standings.   Why on earth can't i find it????!!!!!!

https://www.fifa.com/fifaplus/en/tournaments/womens/u17womensworldcup/india2022

I have sifted through the above page several times.   Gone round and round.  clicked on many links.   Nothing that shows group standings.  Nothing shows scores for games involving Canada.  Never ever had this problem with other FIFA tournaments 

Suggestions?  anyone?

 

Click on each group and scroll down.

https://www.futbol24.com/international/FIFA/Women-U17-World-Cup/2022/Group-A/

[Free kick]

12 minutes ago, The Ref said:

Click on each group and scroll down.

https://www.futbol24.com/international/FIFA/Women-U17-World-Cup/2022/Group-A/

Thanks.  That looks like a betting site.  By the way, I also just found it here now: 

https://www.google.com/search?q=u17+female+world+cup+groups&rlz=1C9BKJA_enCA802CA803&oq=u17+female+world+cup+groups&aqs=chrome..69i57j0i22i30j0i390l2.40044j1j7&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#sie=lg;/g/11qnpdx765;2;/m/08v3jw;st;fp;1;;;

But its crazy that its not on the tournament page.  What is the most main reason to go to the Tournment page? Standing, results, game summaries, box scores…etc.  cant find it. 🤮

Edited October 20, 2022 by Free kick

[Unnamed Trialist]

5 hours ago, Free kick said:

Thanks.  That looks like a betting site.  By the way, I also just found it here now: 

https://www.google.com/search?q=u17+female+world+cup+groups&rlz=1C9BKJA_enCA802CA803&oq=u17+female+world+cup+groups&aqs=chrome..69i57j0i22i30j0i390l2.40044j1j7&hl=en-US&sourceid=chrome-mobile&ie=UTF-8#sie=lg;/g/11qnpdx765;2;/m/08v3jw;st;fp;1;;;

But its crazy that its not on the tournament page.  What is the most main reason to go to the Tournment page? Standing, results, game summaries, box scores…etc.  cant find it. 🤮

Had the same maddening problem 2 days ago. Just highlight videos. What, they think this is the NBA?

[Unnamed Trialist]

Little detail: I see Tatiana Flores, also eligible for Canada in her day, played for Mexico. I saw part not all of Mexico-Spain and she was solid, an attacking threat. Mexico's only win, they were eliminated.

 

[narduch]

11 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Little detail: I see Tatiana Flores, also eligible for Canada in her day, played for Mexico. I saw part not all of Mexico-Spain and she was solid, an attacking threat. Mexico's only win, they were eliminated.

 

Related to someone that plays at Real Oviedo

[Unnamed Trialist]

Just now, narduch said:

Related to someone that plays at Real Oviedo

Prediction: she'll end up having a career at a higher level than her brother.

[Unnamed Trialist]

US fell to Nigeria in penalties, missing two. Was 1-1 after 90 minutes.

Nigeria to semis.

[Unnamed Trialist]

Germany beat Brazil yesterday.

Colombia had a big win vs. Tanzania 3-0 and face Nigeria. They scored early, then Tanzania went down to 10 then 9 ladies to cards. Stats say they did shoot on goal and tried to get back. Colombia star Caicedo injured it seems.

I did not watch Japan-Spain but will later. Seems like a great match. Japan scored a screacher from 40 metres mid 2nd half, Spain's Vicky López scored a brace with just minutes then seconds remaining to get the win and avoid penalties. 

Spain go against Germany in the other semifinal.

[red card]

It's too bad Spain & Japan played each other in the quarters.

Spain controlled possession and created a number of chances against a Japanese team that looked to be the tourney's best in show. But like their group stage matches, Spain couldn't score. UEFA's top scorer in the qualifiers hasn't scored one yet and skyed a penalty.

But they got their first goal on weak goalkeeping and the second on good dribbling or Japanese defenders not looking to foul in added time. Spain's talent pipeline continues to churn out players at assembly line levels.

Tanikawa scored the goal of the tournament and has looked to be a generational talent in the group stages. More subdued in today's match.

 

Edited October 22, 2022 by red card

[Unnamed Trialist]

3 hours ago, red card said:

It's too bad Spain & Japan played each other in the quarters.

Spain controlled possession and created a number of chances against a Japanese team that looked to be the tourney's best in show. But like their group stage matches, Spain couldn't score. UEFA's top scorer in the qualifiers hasn't scored one yet and skyed a penalty.

But they got their first goal on weak goalkeeping and the second on good dribbling or Japanese defenders not looking to foul in added time. Spain's talent pipeline continues to churn out players at assembly line levels.

Tanikawa scored the goal of the tournament and has looked to be a generational talent in the group stages. More subdued in today's match.

 

I think Spain mostly dominated, I just watched it. Then that Japan goal, fabulous. Spain then hit the post next minute from López again. Then her deserved brace. 

Her second is a beauty too. She's a rare breed, she can dribble in very tight space. Then she's amazingly fit. I think she'll be a star, so few players in the women's game can dribble through quality opposition.

The overall maturity of the entire tournament is notable, apart from some lax keeping and clearing.

Edited October 22, 2022 by Unnamed Trialist

[The Ref]

There will be an all Latin final between Colombia and Spain.  While the third place country will be decided between Nigeria and Germany.  It will be a Sunday fill with soccer. 

 

[Unnamed Trialist]

I thought I'd posted on the Spain Germany, sorry--I think I had it on my phone but got distracted and didn't post. Here goes.

Very tough match, even, with an edge to Germany. Spain could not get going at all first half, were naive in possession and Germany took it off them smartly. Then off a short corner, Germany combined and scored well, think it was Adler, who was their best player. Tough, aggressive, tenacious, very powerful mentality. The VAR took about 4 minutes, terribly long, and it was hard to figure out what they were looking at. But it was a sliver offside on the short corner backpass to the taker. 0-0. 

Second half Spain came out better and was combining more smartly. Had Germany on their back foot more, without great chances. Both teams had long hard strikes barely going wide or over. More aggressive match, but the ref did a good job, managed cards well and only tended to want to give long speeches to players (you really expect 17 year olds to be fluent in English?).

Looked to be going to the wire, remembering that Germany beat Spain in penalties in the European final earlier this year (for me, both teams looked a lot more mature after 6 months). 

Then late, Spain combined in the box, Alguacil made a nice change of direction, crossed, Corrales side footed it in. No time left for Germany to do much. Great rivalry as has been the case in Europe youth teams in the last decade or so. 

Spain-Colombia was very evently matched in the group stage. Perhaps Spain has the edge for the experience, Colombia could pay a lack of game experience. But I'd be surprised if Spain ran away with it, as I don't think Colombia has had a bad game.

[The Ref]

All the German planning proved once more too cumbersome in front of the strong Nigerian gals and their kicking accuracy.

Colombia was unlucky in the final and proved to be just as good as Spain. 

[Unnamed Trialist]

I'm pleased for Spain, now holders of u17 and u20 world championships. The team was very balanced, so even López, voted tournament MVP, was not the key player in the final. Very well chosen squad, Kenio the coach made very smart subs the whole way through.

Little advantage of Spain having a league with more teams than most (16) countries is that there are weaker teams and the younger players on top sides can get pro minutes against them. Then you have that 100 more top flight pros than say England or the US, mostly Spanish. Plus 2 divisions of 16 in 2nd tier, so a broad base of aspiring players. And Spain has a collective agreement.