ThiKu Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 The good news for TFC? 1. Lindsay is back. Give him an offseason and see where he's at. 2. They are in position to get an excellent draft choice - be it a Perry Kitchen, or a Darren Mattocks they should get a very worthwhile contributor. 3. They have an outstanding world class training facility - now they can fill it with proper coaches. Their youth program had better start filling the first team with guys they'll play, as opposed to Cordon (who is a technically bright player) and never play him. USE THE KIDS! If TFC has any brains - any at all, anywhere - they'll trade guys like Maund or whoever else for draft picks. Anything they can do to get some good 1st round picks they must do. Am I a "pro-draft" kinda guy? Not at all. But pending massive off-season senior signings TFC must get the top NCAA talent they can get. Seems to be Beckie would be a good start, but there are obviously others down there. Who else has "Good News"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 The journeymen on the club could easily be replaced by Matheson, Murrell, Thomas, Chapman. There are lots of TFC Academy players in NCAA at the moment. Maund was a 1st round pick, fwiw, though probably not a very good one. Mickey Lopez would be an interesting pick if he opts in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 MLS teams are built on journeymen. Shipping them out wholesale and throwing the kids out there is a recipe for (another) disaster, IMO. The key is to find the right journeymen that will compliment the star players. The kids need to earn their spots if they want to develop, just like Ashtone Morgan did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 MLS teams are built on journeymen. Shipping them out wholesale and throwing the kids out there is a recipe for (another) disaster, IMO. The key is to find the right journeymen that will compliment the star players. The kids need to earn their spots if they want to develop, just like Ashtone Morgan did. If you assume that the "star" players are your 8 internationals, TFC is going to have a very hard time attracting NASL or MLS "journeymen" of the quality I think you're talking about given their reputation. Besides, it's difficult to earn your spot as a youth player when you're playing at college and not competing with said journeymen (who's actually not Alan Gordon, but rather Quincy Amarwika or Andrew Wiedeman). The OP wants to draft a bunch of college kids. My point was simply that you don't need to because you already have good ones playing at top NCAA programs. If I was a TFC fan and honestly thought Allando Matheson was not as good as Andrew Wiedeman or whatever other dolt Marriner will sign, I would hang myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 If you assume that the "star" players are your 8 internationals, TFC is going to have a very hard time attracting NASL or MLS "journeymen" of the quality I think you're talking about given their reputation. Besides, it's difficult to earn your spot as a youth player when you're playing at college and not competing with said journeymen (who's actually not Alan Gordon, but rather Quincy Amarwika or Andrew Wiedeman). The OP wants to draft a bunch of college kids. My point was simply that you don't need to because you already have good ones playing at top NCAA programs. If I was a TFC fan and honestly thought Allando Matheson was not as good as Andrew Wiedeman or whatever other dolt Marriner will sign, I would hang myself. I get what you're saying but Wiedeman scored a ton of goals in NCAA. Success at the college level doesn't automatically equate to MLS success. Matheson will get his shot eventually (although I've heard of friction between him and the club, but that was a couple of years ago so maybe it's water under the bridge at this point), as will other TFC Academy kids, former and present, who are shining. I still don't think that means TFC should shun the draft. Why should they limit themselves to one stream of players when they have access to two? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 I think I misspoke when trying to explain myself. Never a good sign.... I did suggest picking Mickey Lopez if he goes GA. I think they should use the draft.Though I'm not sure you need to trade for picks, as I think the OP suggests. I'm not convinced the draft offers the ready-made "journeymen" that you speak of. I think you're talking about guys like Alan Gordon, Mike Magee, Jeff Parke, etc. These guys all went to college and got drafted, but MLS developed them. I don't see why the TFC youth players can't be brought along in a similar fashion. Many of the USA-B players had far less pedigree, but had a league that gave them opportunity to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 The kids with TFC Academy have a better opportunity than journeymen of the past ever did because of the fact that they can continue to play for their academy in the College off season. TFC needs to dump Wiedeman ASAP, the guy is due for a 124 k salary next season. I really wonder how a guy like Wiedeman ever got offered a GA deal, sure he had decent numbers in university but I've never seen the slightest glimpse of MLS talent, and the bar isn't set that high. I'm not sure he'd even start in NASL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Free kick Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 MLS teams are built on journeymen. Shipping them out wholesale and throwing the kids out there is a recipe for (another) disaster, IMO. The key is to find the right journeymen that will compliment the star players. The kids need to earn their spots if they want to develop, just like Ashtone Morgan did. Yes. No sports organization in any pro team sport can win by fielding a squad of all 18-22 year olds. And, ultimately it would be counter productive as far as their progress and development. While its its all well and good to track and rout for the prospects, its important to remember that that is all that they are right now; prospects. A couple of them might become stars, another larger group may become average to decent professionals, a number of them may need time to become that, and finally, the largest part of that group will never make it. Thats the way it is everywhere. And what i am laying out is best case scenario. From what i saw of Lindsay, when they put him out there a few years ago before his injury, he looked to me like the real deal. And i said so at the time. He could attack defenders and win one on one, you could see that instantly and thats a trait that i have rarely if ever seen in a Canadian. But even then, there is no guarantee. What someone like tha needs is a competitive environment where he can develop the right eithics of professional. You dont accomplish that by putting him out there along side a bunch of other kids. Instead you put in there slowly and let earn more playing time and spot. That said, it was very dispointing to see Mariner park him on the bench yesterday, and use Cann as fwd in replacing Ryan Johnson instead of trying Lindsay in what was a meaningless game . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 I'm not convinced the draft offers the ready-made "journeymen" that you speak of. I think you're talking about guys like Alan Gordon, Mike Magee, Jeff Parke, etc. These guys all went to college and got drafted, but MLS developed them. I tend to agree with that, but even though TFC doesn't have that 'calibre' of journeyman on its current roster outside of Ryan Johnson, that's not to say one or two of the current guys can't become that (remember that even the scrubs on the team are fairly young). I don't see why the TFC youth players can't be brought along in a similar fashion. Many of the USA-B players had far less pedigree, but had a league that gave them opportunity to play. Definitely, but they all didn't get the opportunity to play at the same time on the same team, as that would just result in another massive failure. The academy kids are talented as a group, but bringing them along slowly and individually is the best course of action, unless TFC wants to continue to be the doormats of MLS in perpetuity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tuscan Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 They'll **** things up, just like they did last season, and the season before that, and the season before that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted October 30, 2012 Share Posted October 30, 2012 The bad news is that half the salary cap is tied up in 5 players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob.notenboom Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 They'll **** things up, just like they did last season, and the season before that, and the season before that... Careful ... I might launch a 250km counter attack to that tone . Put your Whitecaps fandom aside for a second ... a stronger TFC has a lot of upside. Less options for sniping at Lars, but significant other benefits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThiKu Posted October 31, 2012 Author Share Posted October 31, 2012 TFCA kids are a far superior option to anything they TFC first team is getting from the likes of Amerikwa or however you spell it. If not short term than certainly long term and if for no other reason than they likely live and die for the club that raised them. But don't kid yourself, Whitecaps are the same. Klazura on the roster and not Fisk? Just one example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFC07 Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 TFCA kids are a far superior option to anything they TFC first team is getting from the likes of Amerikwa or however you spell it. If not short term than certainly long term and if for no other reason than they likely live and die for the club that raised them. But don't kid yourself, Whitecaps are the same. Klazura on the roster and not Fisk? Just one example. Agreed. TFC's end of bench should be filled with youth players with upside not MLS rejects or journeyman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 For some reason, when you suggest signing 4 or 5 guys to bring your U20 contingent to say 10 on a 30 man roster, MLS apologists (myself included at times) freak and an say you're killing their development. The other option right now is to go to NCAA. Here critics argue they get **** coaching and training. Without a D2 option, you can't win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheKottonmouthed1555362307 Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 The MLS needs to use the USL more for loan spells. Bright Dike for example spent time in the USL and now is contributing for Portland consistently. USL & MLS need to become more entangled. I am surprised the Caps haven't done this with Tiebert or Salgado, even Alderson. The USL could take a lot of advantage of an arrangement like that just as the AHL does with the NHL. I think it could even help expand the interest of the USL brand amongst MLS exclusive fans. Also, it might not be the dream of promotion and relegation that exists, but it is likely the most viable situation MLS would be open to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted October 31, 2012 Share Posted October 31, 2012 The only good news for TFC that would really help would be to have MLSE sell the team to an owner who is like Saputo and Kerfoot. They know soccer and MLSE knows marketing. As long as MLSE owns TFC the club will have to succeed in spite of their owner not because of them. PS. Klaz is a defender and Fisk is a striker. We have a lot of strikers and Clarke has got some minutes this year so I guess he is ahead of Fisk in the striker depth chart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 Also Fisk is committed to Stanford for next season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 ^I believe that's Huitema. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 The only good news for TFC that would really help would be to have MLSE sell the team to an owner who is like Saputo and Kerfoot. They know soccer and MLSE knows marketing. As long as MLSE owns TFC the club will have to succeed in spite of their owner not because of them. MLSE as an organization just changed hands (Bell/Rogers have a 75% combined stake, IIRC), so it is in essence a brand new ownership with the same name. Whether or not the two telecoms will make better owners than the previous ones did, only time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greatest Cockney Rip Off Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 MLSE as an organization just changed hands (Bell/Rogers have a 75% combined stake, IIRC), so it is in essence a brand new ownership with the same name. Whether or not the two telecoms will make better owners than the previous ones did, only time will tell. New ownership but same management structure at TFC. Anselmi is still in charge of making important sporting decisions. I think his point was that with a new ownership would hopefully come a proper management structure with knowledgable sports people making sporting decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 ^I believe that's Huitema. Yep. Fisk has an agent and is thus permanently ineligible for NCAA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted November 1, 2012 Share Posted November 1, 2012 Ooh ok my mistake, glad he's choosing the pro route. Still, surprised Huitema is taking that route from what I've read he might be in a position to win a contract soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThiKu Posted November 2, 2012 Author Share Posted November 2, 2012 How Huitema hasn't played for the youth nats yet is beyond comprehension. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegan Posted November 2, 2012 Share Posted November 2, 2012 How Huitema hasn't played for the youth nats yet is beyond comprehension. How? Where would he fit in right now? He's a 95 so he'll still be eligible for the 2015 u20 team and he isn't eligible for the 2013 U17 team so it's just not his time unfortunately but he'll be there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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