Raven Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Article from Metro News - by Bill Beacon http://www.metronews.ca/storyCP.aspx?pg=./R030116AU.xml Two things I get out of it quote:Montreal could be an instant rival, but Saputo said there are no plans to try to join MLS for at least the next two or three years. quote:"Toronto FC hasn't proven anything yet," Impact president Joey Saputo said Thursday. "We're still the best team in Canada and our goal is to continue to be the best team in Canada and, if we have the opportunity to play Toronto FC, our goal would be to prove it." I'm an Impact fan...but the best team in Canada right now are the Whitecaps... Anyway new kits look great and with Vancouver in talks with MLS and Saputo now considering it, we may have a brighter future for Canadian "football" signed Stranded in Prince George... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Puma kits, stadium news briefly (allways welcome), broadband webcasts, things are a-foot Montreal way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Raven Article from Metro News - by Bill Beacon http://www.metronews.ca/storyCP.aspx?pg=./R030116AU.xml Two things I get out of it I'm an Impact fan...but the best team in Canada right now are the Whitecaps... Anyway new kits look great and with Vancouver in talks with MLS and Saputo now considering it, we may have a brighter future for Canadian "football" signed Stranded in Prince George... I'm sorry Mr Saputo but Toronto FC peoples have proven one thing, they know ow to interact with their fans, something the Impact is struggling to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 I heard the interview with Saputo on CTV tonight in which he says the same things quoted in the article. If he is not making any plans for an MLS team for the next 2-3 years why did he make such a fuss about TFC getting 2-3 years exclusivity as the sole Canadian franchise? Happy to see Arrango sign with the Impact and think Moojen will be good as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Grizzly I heard the interview with Saputo on CTV tonight in which he says the same things quoted in the article. If he is not making any plans for an MLS team for the next 2-3 years why did he make such a fuss about TFC getting 2-3 years exclusivity as the sole Canadian franchise? Happy to see Arrango sign with the Impact and think Moojen will be good as well. Perhaps the more pertinent question is why was it taken as gospel on this board 12-16 months ago that Saputo would never consider MLS and that Vancouver's "stated goal" was MLS in 5 years and thus the exclusivity agreement was just a toss away that MLSE wanted for no real reason and the CSA happily tossed in for no real reason. Indeed, perhaps the most pertinent question is to what extent is Saputo's (and Kerfoot's) planning shaped (and limited) by the exclusivity agreement? Not only in terms of application to MLS but in terms of the pace at which they are driving their respective stadium developments? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Gordon Perhaps the more pertinent question is why was it taken as gospel on this board 12-16 months ago that Saputo would never consider MLS Because Saputo used to make comments that lead us to believe that (although I don't know that people thought he would "never" consider MLS). Perhaps the instant success of TFC is what is causing Joey to make comments that lead us to believe that he has changed his mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 Yes Saputo made comments before Toronto was awarded a franchise that he was not interested in MLS because of the ownership structure. At the time he had all the advantages over Toronto if he wanted to apply for an MLS team. Then when Toronto did get a franchise he was apparently pissed off about the exclusivity clause. Yet from what he said yesterday it didn't seem like the exclusivity clause was his concern rather that among other things he wanted to see how things turned out with the stadium first. I am not really sure what he really wants or what motivates his comments. My personal opinion is that whether or not Toronto got an MLS franchise or not that Saputo probably would not have made any serious effort to join MLS during the period of the exclusivity agreement so the complaining about it was either just petulance or political posturing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Grizzly Yes Saputo made comments before Toronto was awarded a franchise that he was not interested in MLS because of the ownership structure. At the time he had all the advantages over Toronto if he wanted to apply for an MLS team. Then when Toronto did get a franchise he was apparently pissed off about the exclusivity clause. Yet from what he said yesterday it didn't seem like the exclusivity clause was his concern rather that among other things he wanted to see how things turned out with the stadium first. I am not really sure what he really wants or what motivates his comments. My personal opinion is that whether or not Toronto got an MLS franchise or not that Saputo probably would not have made any serious effort to join MLS during the period of the exclusivity agreement so the complaining about it was either just petulance or political posturing. Or simply the recognition that the exclusivity agreement gives MLSE right to the Montreal and Vancouver markets until the end of 2009 in a league noted for the absence of single entity ownership. The lesson though, is that things change and what is true today is not necessarily true tomorrow. For whatever reason that point is repeatedly missed by some (generic comment, not directed at the poster being quoted). 2 years ago the notion of MLS in Toronto was preposterous. Not so long ago, the Whitecaps ownership was a problem and nobody figutred their was a billionaire in the woodwork but lo and behold, we have MLS in Toronto and a Billionaire owner in Vancouver. Changes the whole greating landscape in both of those markets, and in Montreal as well if they want to keep up with the Jones' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca Because Saputo used to make comments that lead us to believe that (although I don't know that people thought he would "never" consider MLS). Perhaps the instant success of TFC is what is causing Joey to make comments that lead us to believe that he has changed his mind. Thank you, its petty I know, but I just wanted to see it said . It might be "instant success" to you but at least one of us was predicting just this sort of response (16K I believe was my prediction for average attendance in the first year - and long before Beckham too). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 It is my strong impression that the 2009 exclusivity agreement will be negotiable. If TFC is a success attendance wise, are competitive on the field and are able to field an adequate number of Canadians there will no longer be a reason to maintain the exclusivity. If anything, TFC would benefit immensely by having Canadian rivals and in particular Toronto's traditional rival, Montreal. If Saputo were really interested in bringing MLS to Montreal as soon as possible he should be inquiring now and stating his interest publicly. I think the exclusivity clause is not what is preventing him from this, rather he is just acting conservatively and making sure all the pieces are in place beforehand so he is not taking a big risk when/if he joins MLS. As much as I would like to have MLS in Montreal as soon as possible I am not criticizing his approach as it may be the most wise one. The only thing that is strange is why he made such a big fuss about the exclusivity agreement in the first place if this is how he is approaching things now. I suspect that by bitching about how the CSA is treating him unfairly he feels he can win some concessions from them in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 At first I thought that because some owners have a few teams in MLS, which is unorthodox and even illegal in most leagues, MLSE may be thinking about how they could also get a jump on what happens in another Canadian market. Or at least make a move for a 2nd team, or look for an alliance. Another way to go about doing that business is to receive payment to cede rights. But the soundest scenario is the one they are playing out, and is in the contract: exclusivity. It helps them strengthen their Canadian market, it gets them exclusive arrangments with Canadian sponsors and tv and even merchandizing revenue (though Caps and Impact get a modest income from both, but only local), and it gives them an edge on any other MLS team that could emerge in the future. So it is the option that most benefits them. Add to that the fact that they are used to building teams slowly, and understand what that means, I seriously doubt that they will allow any other MLS team emerge until after the date stipulated in their agreement with the league. Just to add one thing: since if the Lynx came out saying they were the top team in Canada, or even if TFC came out saying it without having played an official game, a lot of people would have jumped on their arrogance. So I think it is only appropriate to give the arrogant pricks at Impact the same treatment: you are not the best in Canada, you might want to try to come back to be the best, but all indications are that you are in fact slipping. I would say as is Impact is third if that. Just for coming out so pompously with that headline, not that I really care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJT Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 Other than the fact that it is clearly safe to assume that the top three teams are (in alphabetical order) Montreal Impact, Toronto FC and Vancouver Whitecaps, it's impossible to tell how these three rank relative to each other at this time (at least). One has never played an official match and the other two have not played for over 5 months. None of the rosters are even finalized, so you can't even do the "on paper" thing. Now, instead of blabbing about these things through the media, what they should be talking about is putting together some matches against each other that would establish a national championship... or, if they prefer to be children about it, that would allow for some sort of bragging rights that are actually earned on the field (even if a short tournament cannot establish who is truly "best")... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.T. Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S. Just to add one thing: since if the Lynx came out saying they were the top team in Canada, or even if TFC came out saying it without having played an official game, a lot of people would have jumped on their arrogance. So I think it is only appropriate to give the arrogant pricks at Impact the same treatment: you are not the best in Canada, you might want to try to come back to be the best, but all indications are that you are in fact slipping. I would say as is Impact is third if that. Just for coming out so pompously with that headline, not that I really care. FYI, the Lynx are still tagging, "Highest Level of Soccer in Toronto" to their press releases:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Oranje Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 It is great for soccer in Canada to have these regional rivalries. I think MLSE and many others in Canada are beginning to realize that the market for professional soccer in Canada is big. The challenge is getting credibility. Asking and getting exclusivity for MLS in Canada until 2009 was just risk mitigation and good business practice, especially for a start up franchise. Now some are realizing that the Canadian market can probably sustain more teams. Some games between Canadian franchises could become another financial opportunity for all involved even when they are in different leagues. A little bit of trash talking in the press is just good marketing. It is also a way for Vancouver and Montreal to leverage MLSE marketing. Showing how big the Canadian market is to sponsors can only increase cash inflow. We have, what probably is already becoming clear, three of the strongest franchises in North America. I doubt Joey Saputo's comments were ever about an animisity towards MLSE or Ontario Teachers Pension Plan (especially since they are one of the largest institutional investors in the Canadian food industry). There was probably some disappointment at first, but it would have been mostly about protecting his business venture. Times definitely change and will be changing more quickly as we move forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 I agree about the rivalries, and think if we had three teams in MLS all three would have over 10,000 season ticket holders, and crowds would be excellent in general. They would be three great franchises, and if it meant Saputo and Kerfoot in as well, three very monied owners with margin to move and grow. The possible risk as MLS grows is that with more teams it is much harder to win something, and easier to find oneself mired in the bottom of the table if you don't do things right. This is one reason we could really do with a Canadian Cup beyond the V-Cup as it is one more thing to play for and win, thus a good motivator for fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bxl Boy Posted March 3, 2007 Share Posted March 3, 2007 Are the Voyageurs there or are the Voyageurs dead ? I'm wondering... In 2002, those “Voyageurs” created the Voyageurs Cup, an unofficial canadian championship to reward the best team in Canada. The Montreal Impact won it 5 times in a row, so it's legitimate they call themselves the best team in Canada... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted March 3, 2007 Author Share Posted March 3, 2007 Good point, I was thinking along the lines of the USL standings and championship, but the Impact have won the Voyageurs Cup 5 times.....making them according to us the best in Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJT Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Bxl Boy Are the Voyageurs there or are the Voyageurs dead ? I'm wondering... In 2002, those “Voyageurs” created the Voyageurs Cup, an unofficial canadian championship to reward the best team in Canada. The Montreal Impact won it 5 times in a row, so it's legitimate they call themselves the best team in Canada... Well, no one is a bigger supporter of the Voyageurs Cup than I am, but I would not call the winner the "best" team in Canada, for various reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 If Montreal and Vancouver can have new SSS ready by 2009 (which seems unlikely....that's just over 2 years away and there are no approvals and no shovels in the ground), then I can't see why TFC would object to waiving their exclusivity to the Canadian market (assuming MLS wants to expand in 2009). I highly doubt MLSE has designs on getting a 2nd team in another market and the only reason there are situations with 1 owner owning multiple teams currently is because otherwise, MLS would have died off years ago. When some teams were ready to fold, strong owners stepped in and bought them to keep the league viable. I fully expect that this consolidation of ownership will disappear in due time and you will have a more normal ownership structure take hold (and maybe a little more competition among owners for talented players). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest speedmonk42 Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 Bah on a very important not, my mouse just died and since clicking on this quick reply pane was the last thing it ever did, I felt it important to say so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnipeg Fury Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 quote:Originally posted by DJT Well, no one is a bigger supporter of the Voyageurs Cup than I am, but I would not call the winner the "best" team in Canada, for various reasons. TFC have money and season-ticket holders, but until they can achieve something on the field, I think Montreal and Vancouver can brag all they want. Personally, I love Montreal's attitude. There could be nothing better for Canadian soccer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vancouversoccerman Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Winnipeg Fury TFC have money and season-ticket holders, but until they can achieve something on the field, I think Montreal and Vancouver can brag all they want. Personally, I love Montreal's attitude. There could be nothing better for Canadian soccer. It's amazing! Just a few years ago, you could go on this board and read pages and pages of angst and despair over the state of Canadian Soccer. Edmonton & Calgary folded (more poor ownership & facilities than anything else)...Montreal and Vancouver needed new owners to save the teams...the CSA couldn't get anyone in Toronto to take their $20 million dollars to build a stadium! What do we have now? Two really strong, established teams that have won USL championships and have huge fan support, a new stadium, two new stadiums planned, and a MLS side that seems to have finally tapped into the sleeping soccer giant that should be Toronto. We're really on the verge of something great in Canada. Hopefully, it's just a matter of time before all of our teams get to solve this issue on the pitch. And may the best team from Vancouver win! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 Last night an extensive interview with Saputo on CTV Montreal. I don't want to appear too critical of him so I will state first off that he seemed like a decent guy, is very well spoken and I agreed with much of what he had to say. He talked about the stadium being the club's current priority and that it should be open for the 2008 season. He said the club's main purpose was to develop interest in the sport in Quebec and develop Quebec players. He is still enjoying running the club and is happy with the support in Montreal. Then once again when MLS was mentioned he stated he didn't like how the whole TFC thing went down and how the CSA handled it without saying why. He qualified this a bit by saying he understands this is a business and sometimes things go down like that. Then when asked if the Impact were interested in MLS he said never say never but the club is non-profit and he does not like the ownership scheme of MLS and doesn't think it fits with the Impact's non-profit status. He said he will see how things go in Toronto and in a couple of years he might change his opinion but that would be at least 2 or 3 years in the future. Once again I really have a hard time seeing how the Impact/Saputo were wronged by MLS/CSA/TFC even though I am an Impact fan and would love to see MLS in Montreal. As long as I have followed Canadian soccer Saputo has been saying he doesn't like the MLS ownership structure and was not interested in joining MLS and he is still saying that to this day. If he had been campaigning to join MLS and was passed over for TFC I could understand the complaining but he has consistently stated that he wants to stay in USL and even did his part in sabotaging plans to maintain/start a Canadian national league. It seems to me his bitterness is mostly due to jealousy and selfishness. It reminds me of a woman who is slighted by a man she had no interest in until he started going out with another woman. Maybe someone can inform me better of what his beefs are but I have to say as much as I appreciate what he has done for soccer in Montreal I am not too fond of his attitude towards TFC. It seems that once again it is an example of people in Canadian soccer not working together for the good of everyone but only looking out for themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJB Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 Maybe his beef is that the CSA is in bed with MLSE. The Impact have clearly been Canada's top supported team for some time now, and the CSA gave them a bit of a slough-foot by allowing MLSE to usurp that title. But it sounds to me as if he's being non-commital. I don't know how he can have those goals for Quebec soccer, and not eventually make it into the top league in North America. The real question is whether or not more Canadian teams would be welcome. They have thirteen clubs now, and have said they'd stop at 16, meaning that if Montreal and Vancouver join, there will only be room for one more club after that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 quote:Originally posted by Grizzly Once again I really have a hard time seeing how the Impact/Saputo were wronged by MLS/CSA/TFC even though I am an Impact fan and would love to see MLS in Montreal ... It reminds me of a woman who is slighted by a man she had no interest in until he started going out with another woman. Think Saputo would put it down more as the ex-wife who slaved away and suffered through the lean years only to find herself put to the curb for the younger trophie wife after her husband had finaly "made it". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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