Alex D Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I've come across an interesting article from Steve Sandor about his views on Canadian context in the Canadian championship. http://the11.ca/2011/12/23/does-canadian-championship-need-a-can-con-rule/ To summarize his article, he is worried about the lack of Canadian content on the Impact and Whitecaps at the moment, and sees the Voyageurs Cup as a way to enforce the need for Canadian player development. The CSA caved in on the MLS roster quota, with the argument being that there wasn't enough MLS calibre Canadians to compete against US teams. In the Cup however, all teams would be on an even playing ground. Sandor suggests mandating 3 domestics on each clubs game day roster, but I think we can go further and have 3 domestics minimum on the pitch at all times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Sandor suggests mandating 3 domestics on each clubs game day roster, but I think we can go further and have 3 domestics minimum on the pitch at all times. Totally agree with you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juby Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 Yeah, were not exactly a xenophobic bunch but three would be a nice little minimum. If it's three canadians on the pitch, it would probably have to be three on the pitch and like five overall because you'd have to have canadians handy to sub some off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shermanator Posted December 24, 2011 Share Posted December 24, 2011 I like the idea as well. Not sure if Montreal or Vancouver would like it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Gagne Posted December 25, 2011 Share Posted December 25, 2011 Sandor suggests mandating 3 domestics on each clubs game day roster, but I think we can go further and have 3 domestics minimum on the pitch at all times. I'm not sure the "at all times" stipulation would work in practice... I don't think a rule affecting a coach's substitutions would be well received by any of the clubs (including those with significant Canadian content). IMO a better option would be to mandate 3 minimum in the game day 18, but also dramatically increase the minimum # of CAN players in each team's 30 man tournament roster... e.g. ~8 min. The CSA could further define these as "CAN eligible players" (i.e. eliminating dual nationals like Rochat from the equation). By necessity the 8 Canadians on a clubs V'cup rosters would have to practice with the first team leading up to, and for the duration of the tournament. Forcing clubs to include CAN players in V'cup starting 11s would increase the # of games played for a handful of CAN players, and would be useful for the image of the tournament; however, IMO the greater benefit from a development perspective would be derived from giving a substantially increased number of Canadian kids a crack at training with the top team for an extended period of time. Either way though I hope the idea of a V'cup CAN-con get some traction. My two cents. (Marry Xmas!) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shway Posted December 26, 2011 Share Posted December 26, 2011 i think this rule SHOULD be implemented in the 2013 NCC. Giving it a fair opportunity for Montreal to have their core set from the expansion season Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted December 27, 2011 Share Posted December 27, 2011 Any deviation from the MLS Canadian quota will be refused by the MLS clubs you can be sure of that and without them there is no Voyageurs Cup competition. That quota is negotiated with MLS by the Canadian clubs with the CSA on the side and with very little influence I would wager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted December 27, 2011 Share Posted December 27, 2011 Any deviation from the MLS Canadian quota will be refused by the MLS clubs you can be sure of that and without them there is no Voyageurs Cup competition. That quota is negotiated with MLS by the Canadian clubs with the CSA on the side and with very little influence I would wager. If memory serves me, the MLS sides traditionally use more Canucks in V-Cup games than in their MLS encounters. Adding that the CONCACAF Champions League has value for clubs trying to build a brand - see the positive impact for TFC this year, and Montreal in the past, and Vancouver's stated desire to become one of the top clubs in the world - suggests to me that your wager would be lost were the CSA to go this route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_Gagne Posted December 27, 2011 Share Posted December 27, 2011 ^+1... Given the increased media attention and fan prioritization of the tournament (both from a national pride perspective and the subsequent CCL birth that it represents) I think the CSA would hold the hammer in any negotiations and would be under no obligation to set any quota in line with the MLS's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted December 27, 2011 Share Posted December 27, 2011 If the MLS clubs already have the Canadians on their roster then sure, but there is no way they will sign Canadians just to meet a quota imposed by CSA for the NCC above and beyond who they would sign for the regular MLS season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex D Posted December 27, 2011 Author Share Posted December 27, 2011 ^They all have academies full of young Canadians. Bring them in if you have to. That's the whole point anyway, to push domestic player development. And if your team has to field a couple kids that aren't up to snuff yet, then that's their punishment for not meeting the quota. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alberta white Posted December 28, 2011 Share Posted December 28, 2011 ^They all have academies full of young Canadians. Bring them in if you have to. That's the whole point anyway, to push domestic player development. And if your team has to field a couple kids that aren't up to snuff yet, then that's their punishment for not meeting the quota. But a heck of a learning curve for the academy Lads! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ClaytonA Posted October 19, 2012 Share Posted October 19, 2012 Thought it was worth bumping this thread given Lenarduzzi's comments ( http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2012/10/18/lenarduzzi-canada-what-we%E2%80%99re-doing-isn%E2%80%99t-working ) and the comments on the Whitecaps FC daily podcast on Oct 17 (available on itunes). Should this include a quota during the Voyageurs Cup? Its a different competition than MLS league play and won't make the teams suffer financially since I'd guess they're not making much money on CCL anyway yet. Plus in the early rounds they could be playing reserves anyway due to schedule congestion, opposition, or whatever. Most importantly though by having a requirement that x Cdn players have to be on the roster means those x players get more experience at games that matter in Latin America. I think this is a fair middle ground that works with the clubs and allows the clubs to prove that the academy system works before getting heavy handed saying x Cdn players on roster all competitions period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted October 20, 2012 Share Posted October 20, 2012 It depends as always on whether we want the Voyageurs Cup to be a serious competition to crown the best professional team in Canada, or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 It depends as always on whether we want the Voyageurs Cup to be a serious competition to crown the best professional team in Canada, or not. It is a cup competition, it does not crown the best professional team in Canada any more than the FA Cup does in England. The best team in Canada is the one that does the best in MLS though with the unbalanced schedule that can be hard to judge as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alberta white Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 ^ yet again I haven't clue what happening in the MLS. I'm afraid I had to go to the bathroom last month and got completly lost....again. Sorry.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greatest Cockney Rip Off Posted October 23, 2012 Share Posted October 23, 2012 What about a Voyageur Youth Cup? You would definitely see some Canadians play in that. In fact, I'd be much more interested to see a Toronto U18 v Vancouver U18 match than the bunch of foreigners who play for both teams right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted October 24, 2012 Share Posted October 24, 2012 What about a Voyageur Youth Cup? You would definitely see some Canadians play in that. In fact, I'd be much more interested to see a Toronto U18 v Vancouver U18 match than the bunch of foreigners who play for both teams right now. This. I can't believe TFC and Vancouver haven't even faced each either yet (that i know of) at the youth level and they've both had teams since 2008. TFC sent their U15, U17 and U19 teams to play Columbus back in the spring in Ohio. Now, it's a lot cheaper to bus down to Ohio than fly to Vancouver, but c'mon, they could have done it as part of some youth festival thingy when CBC does their Soccer Day in Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 This. I can't believe TFC and Vancouver haven't even faced each either yet (that i know of) at the youth level and they've both had teams since 2008. TFC sent their U15, U17 and U19 teams to play Columbus back in the spring in Ohio. Now, it's a lot cheaper to bus down to Ohio than fly to Vancouver, but c'mon, they could have done it as part of some youth festival thingy when CBC does their Soccer Day in Canada. Such a thing would be more of interest to the fans than those developing talent. So it would be great, but you can see why it's not a priority for the Whitecaps (U-18 games draw maybe a dozen guys, so a U-18 game against TFC Academy would pull in, what, 50?) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 Such a thing would be more of interest to the fans than those developing talent. So it would be great, but you can see why it's not a priority for the Whitecaps (U-18 games draw maybe a dozen guys, so a U-18 game against TFC Academy would pull in, what, 50?) It wouldn't make economic sense, but it could be something to increase the rivalry between the clubs (including Montreal and FCE). Like I said, make it part of Soccer Day in Canada and have all 4 pro clubs academies face off in a tournament with highlights of the finals as part of the SDC broadcast. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 It wouldn't make economic sense, but it could be something to increase the rivalry between the clubs (including Montreal and FCE). Like I said, make it part of Soccer Day in Canada and have all 4 pro clubs academies face off in a tournament with highlights of the finals as part of the SDC broadcast. But would anyone other than super-nerds like us care? Would there be anyone in Canada who'd want to give that a real broadcasting slot, any of the four teams which would want to splash cash on a decent stadium for the game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greatest Cockney Rip Off Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 any of the four teams which would want to splash cash on a decent stadium for the game? There was an article in the Sun when the TFC training centre opened earlier this year saying that there was going to be 1,000 seat SSS opening on site. But I have yet to see anything on my visits there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpg75 Posted October 25, 2012 Share Posted October 25, 2012 But would anyone other than super-nerds like us care? Would there be anyone in Canada who'd want to give that a real broadcasting slot, any of the four teams which would want to splash cash on a decent stadium for the game? It doesn't need to be much more than your typical youth tournament setup. Play the games on regular training fields and put the final in a 2000 seat stadium or something and setup some cameras (or a camera). I'm sure a lot of the supporters groups (UM02, U-Sector/RPB etc., Southsiders, ESG) would be interested so maybe setup a stream on cbc.ca...it can't cost that much and it adds to that extra element of rivalry and tradition among the clubs, could even say it provides a high profile learning opportunity for the prospects as they'd likely want to win it badly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnipeg Fury Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 Yes, there should be a minimum amount of Canadians for the V-Cup. A team winning the V-Cup with no Canadians in the starting line-up would be a complete disgrace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
john tv Posted October 29, 2012 Share Posted October 29, 2012 It seems that there are not that many Canadian born soccer players who have Canadian born parents.That should be our ultimate aim to get all parents involved in our game and certainly on a competitive level. I don't know why Canadian born parents on the boys side have not accepted our game fully.Does that mean that a very large size of our population is not involved in competitive boys soccer and would that make a great difference in the performances of all our national boys teams and even maybe be an answer why we don't perform that well.Just wondering guys and looking for some recommendations how we all can improve on this very peculior status. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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