NY Times Article on Yallop and MNT

[beachesl]

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/10/04/sports/soccer/04soccer.html

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In Canada, It's Wait for the Next Cycle

By JACK BELL

Published: October 4, 2005

When Frank Yallop looks south, he sees that the United States and Mexico have qualified for another World Cup. Minnows like Costa Rica, Guatemala and Trinidad and Tobago are still in contention. And Yallop, the coach of Canada's national team, is at home outside Vancouver, British Columbia, driving his children to school and watching the world go by.

"It is not easy watching it and seeing the fourth spot in our region just hanging around," Yallop said in a telephone interview late last week. "Yes, it's frustrating at times."

Three teams from the Concacaf region automatically qualify for the World Cup, which is in Germany next year. Costa Rica is third, with two matches to play over the next eight days. The fourth-place team will play a home-and-away series with Uzbekistan or Bahrain.

Yallop took over Canada's national team in December 2003, leaving Major League Soccer and the San Jose Earthquakes. In M.L.S., he won coach of the year honors after taking an Earthquakes team that had the worst record in 2000 and helping turn it into the league champion in 2001. But his country called, and Yallop, who played in England for Ipswich Town, accepted the challenge of taking Canada back to the World Cup for the first time since 1986.

It has not gone as planned.

Without a first division national league, some of the top Canadian players are forced to go overseas (Tomasz Radzinski at Fulham in England and Lars Hirschfeld at Tromso in Norway), play in M.L.S. (Will Johnson in Chicago and Dwayne De Rosario in San Jose) or play in the United Soccer Leagues First Division for one of three Canadian teams.

Canada was once a regional power, but is now No. 84 in the latest FIFA rankings, between Algeria and North Korea, two spots up from Albania.

Canada was ousted from qualifying, leaving Yallop, who has a contract through the next qualifying cycle, trying to regroup and plan for an uncertain future.

"I'm at the top of the pyramid in Canada and people look at results," he said. "But I need the players. We got a good result in Spain last month, losing, 2-1. But now I won't see the players until a few days before our next game, against Luxembourg next month. We've got a slight problem there. When I took the job, I knew about this, but I just didn't realize how much time there would be without the players."

As Canada has struggled on the field and off (a plan to build a stadium in Toronto for the 2007 under-17 world championships and for a possible M.L.S. team is far from a done deal), Yallop is always mentioned when a coaching position opens in M.L.S.

"I keep hearing a lot of rumors; it's flattering, but no one has made contact with me," Yallop said. "People from the press keep phoning me up to ask. I left M.L.S. two years ago, and these rumors start when you lose a few games. I can't stop the rumors."

[Guest Ed]

"Without a first division national league, some of the top Canadian players are forced to go overseas".

Cry me a river. Forced to make a real good living in Europe? When they could make chump change in a new national league or a minimal salary in MLS?

I'm tired of this excuse. Five years ago we were crying out for the lack of players in the top flight in Europe. Now we have them, we need to work with that. Five six years ago Cdn supporters were excited about Radzinski playing for some obscure Belgian club. Now we have many more players playing in good leagues. Work with it. It should be looked at as strength, not a weakness.

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by Ed

I'm tired of this excuse. Five years ago we were crying out for the lack of players in the top flight in Europe. Now we have them, we need to work with that. Five six years ago Cdn supporters were excited about Radzinski playing for some obscure Belgian club. Now we have many more players playing in good leagues. Work with it. It should be looked at as strength, not a weakness.

Perhaps but, you could make a good case that instead of having MANY players playing in good leagues, we have SOME players playing in good leagues. As for Radzinski, at that time he was scoring goals for Anderlecht in the Champions league and facing sides ( in group stage ) such as Man U and Lazio. So I wouldn't call that obscure. For strictly comparative purposes, we only have one this year playing in CL and he happens to be injured and will likely miss the entire campaign.

Its true that we have more players in top flight than ever before but that hasn't translated into better results in World Cup qualifying. In fact, our best WCQ campaign in the past 25 years has been when we have had to rely very little ( if at all ) on Euro based players. More and more its become apparant to me that our adverse results correlate very well with our reliance on Euro based players. Yet talentwise, we are getting stronger and stronger. So what could it be? It must be the travel/displacement/familiarity factor. Also why is it that our domestic based players ( eg.: DD)score at the same pace than a Bundeliga or EPL player while playing for canada?

Five years ago it made sense to clamour for more players in top flight and that shouldn't change. But as we learned, relying ENTIRELY on Eurobased players is not the answer. Moreso when we are counting on some players from overseass whose competitive level of play is comparable to what would or should be available in North america. Seems to me that many of our regional rivals relied on few Euro-based players and did quite well.

[Guest Ed]

Regarding Radzinksi, I guess I meant a couple of years earlier, when he was with Germinal Ekeren. If you compare our player pool when Holger was just coming on board to that today, there is no doubt we have MANY more players playing at a high level than back then.

You have to go with your best players. Our best players are overseas. You can't argue otherwise. That's the situation. We have to deal with it and find a way to make it work. South American, African, Australian and other teams do well with European based players. The problem lies with how we are going about our preparation, not with the fact that our players are ovrseas.

I don't think for a minute that we could survive with domestic players only. This was sadly shown last summer when we augmented some Euro players with our best domestics. The results were atrocious.

You said "Seems to me that many of our regional rivals relied on few Euro-based players and did quite well." That may be true. The fact remains though that they played their "best players" and our best players are overseas except for max 3-4 players.

[David C.]

quote:"Without a first division national league, some of the top Canadian players are forced to go overseas..."

I agree with Ed here. Despite longing for a national league someday (for other reasons), I really don't think such a league will improve our national program. For what it's worth, we currently have a 3-team league, whose schedule is filled out by playing against comparable American teams.

Would adding three more squads (say Calgary, Edmonton, Ottawa) really improve our national situation? I seriously doubt it, especially since our top players will still be jumping to Europe for bigger salaries, higher cometition and longer seasons anyway.

The whole "without a national league" excuse has grown tired.

quote:"When I took the job, I knew about this, but I just didn't realize how much time there would be without the players."

This kinda scares me. Of all people to know what he was getting into, it should have been Frank.

quote:"I keep hearing a lot of rumors; it's flattering, but no one has made contact with me..."

Sounds as if contact was to be made, he might consider it. Hmm...

[Guest Ed]

Just more on that.

Here is the USA lineup for their big game against Mexico last spring, their toughest match in the hex and obviously very important. The lineup is very similar to their first one vs T&T.

USA

18. KELLER Kasey

3. BERHALTER Gregg

7. LEWIS Eddie

9. JOHNSON Ed

10. REYNA Claudio

13. NOONAN Pat

14. RALSTON Steve

17. BEASLEY DaMarcus

20. MC BRIDE Brian

21. DONOVAN Landon

22. ONYEWU Oguchi

Bench

USA

24. BUSCH Jonathan

2. DEMPSEY Clint

4. BOCANEGRA Carlos

6. CHERUNDOLO Steve

12. GIBBS Cory

16. WOLFF Josh

25. MASTROENI Pablo

The majority of the lineup is European based. The recent all MLS rosters are only experimentation now that the US has clinched a spot in Germany.

[canso]

MLS is a false hope. The best are in Europe and none of them will return while they are in their prime (except Donovan, that putz). Domestic based talent will improve the depth chart but will never form the core of the MNT.

Accept it Frank and get on with it.

If he does take the Galaxy job, would Tricky Dicky not love to run the team with Dale Mitchell by his side?

[Free kick]

Well I have a feeling that if we go into WCQ 2010 with 100% reliance on Euro based players, the end result will be the same. Note that I said 100%. I just can't see the MNT building some cohesions and familiarity by assbling a backline consisting of one player from the English first div, one from sweden, one from Russia and one from the EPL. This may work in Argentina but thats because their rivals in SA face the same circumstances. Plus Argentina is Argentina, their players are much more talent. Australia hasn't accomplished squat and Africa sides are not a good comparaison since they don't have to travel the same distances move accross the same time zones. Plus there are far more philosophical familarities in terms of style with say, Camaroonian players than there with a side like canada where we have players developed in diferent countries provinces etc etc.

No, you won't win if you exclude talented players from the squad based on the fact that they play overseas. But I believe we need have an established core thats domesestic based and playing at a reasonably competitive level. Then you could integrate a handfull of eurobased ones to augment your squad with without comprimising playing systems, familiarity and style.

that was the idea that the CSA had in the 80's with the NASL's Manic. In principle it would have worked IMO, but the league folded.

[Guest Ed]

Well Bradly was just fired by the Metrostars today. I suspect Lalas is on the phone with Yallop.

[David C.]

quote:Originally posted by Free kick

Well I have a feeling that if we go into WCQ 2010 with 100% reliance on Euro based players, the end result will be the same...

This is very possible. Lack of familiarity and long flights from Europe are two real obstacles that must be addressed over the next few years.

However, I believe that there are ways of tackling both. For one, I would suggest that we start scheduling double-headers (avail. in international schedules) a few times a year, inviting our top 25 (or so) A-roster for each one. Secondly, I would suggest that one of these double-headers (per year) be to Central America and the Carribean, to better evaluate and prepare our A-roster for the WC qualifying conditions that lie ahead.

On the flip side, Frank tried the "local and familiar" route, by fielding half of the Impact's lineup for the Gold Cup and the results were not any better.

Just some thoughts...

[David C.]

quote:Originally posted by Free kick

Well I have a feeling that if we go into WCQ 2010 with 100% reliance on Euro based players, the end result will be the same...

This is very possible. Lack of familiarity and long flights from Europe are two real obstacles that must be addressed over the next few years.

However, I believe that there are ways of tackling both. For one, I would suggest that we start scheduling double-headers (avail. in international schedules) a few times a year, inviting our top 25 (or so) A-roster for each one. Secondly, I would suggest that one of these double-headers (per year) be to Central America and the Carribean, to better evaluate and prepare our A-roster for the WC qualifying conditions that lie ahead.

On the flip side, Frank tried the "local and familiar" route, by fielding half of the Impact's lineup for the Gold Cup and the results were not any better.

Just some thoughts...

[Grizzly]

I think the biggest point is that we had far more players than previously in good Europe leagues during WCQ but Yallop chose to leave many of them off the WCQ roster.

[Daniel]

Calgary or Edmonton for one year won't do anything, but look at what a crap team like Toronto has done for the national team over 8 years.

A few years with a domestic league would give a LOT more Canadian players a chance and we'd discover more diamonds in the rough which could then be exported to improve.

[Free kick]

Just to be clear, when I mention high calibre domestic I mean MLS.

[Guest Ed]

Out in left field here I know, but I suggest we use our best players. Period. This is not a discussion about the advantages of an MLS team or a domestic league. I'm not arguing that. This is about the absurd point of view voiced by the clowns at the CSA and now reiterated by the NY Times author that having more players in Europe is BAD for our team. Bulltweet. It's something we have to learn to deal with.

[Daniel]

But the whole question against Guatemala (among other games) was are our best players more effective than our more familiar together and in-shape lesser-skilled players at a given time?

[Guest Ed]

quote:Originally posted by Daniel

But the whole question against Guatemala (among other games) was are our best players more effective than our more familiar together and in-shape lesser-skilled players at a given time?

That's down the coach and the CSA for poor prep. The easy excuse is 'oh our players are in Europe boo hoo. We need to develop a Cdn based team'. That's fine if you want to lose to Cuba and Guatemala and the rest. I think we have better players than those nations and we just have to find a much better way to prepare them for North American games because those same better players by and large make a living in Europe.

[Cheeta]

I'm 100% with Ed on this one. To the letter.

[DoyleG]

The 2000 and 2002 Gold Cups where Canada had the most success was thanks in most part to having players that were in season. Seems that we suffer from having our best players in Europe.

Would an MLS team change that? No

Why? Because any owner would want their team to be competitive right out of the starting blocks.They would already be picking from the existing talent pool that is as thin a sit gets now.

Would a Canadian MLS team be allowed to give up a large number of players to a national team? No.

The need for a domestic league would help expand the existing talent pool for the National team.

[RS]

quote:Originally posted by DoyleG

Would an MLS team change that? No

Would three? Yes.

[DoyleG]

quote:Originally posted by Rudi

Would three? Yes.

No

[Joe Keeper]

This article and the other one, "Oh, Canada?" in the other thread seem to really lack perspective. We may not have MLS, or a league of our own, or most of all competition in the Hex, but these are still exciting times for Canadian soccer.

With WYC 2007, and the stadium news in three cities, we have not had this much cooking since 1985/86. None of us are completly sure just how it will all pan out, but here is better than where we where 3 or 4 years ago.

The way I see it, we may soon have 3 SSS's, an MLS Club(3 if the soccer gods cooperate) for atleast some of our better players and a major world tournament on top of a far deeper talent pool than we had under Osiek and a promising technical director. What supercedes all this is what it could do for our infastructure for the future. With SSS('s) we are looking at more home games, sponsorship, but most of all exposure to the public and to tallented young canadians who will hopefully have somthing professional to shoot for.

Plus, it might just be me, but I have noticed a considerable increase in the quality of our players club situations abroad in the last two years.

I wish the American Press would do a story more pertinent to the matters at hand.

[Jeremy Loome]

I think a major point is being missed in this discussion: the need for a Canadian league is to develop future talent, not fill the team now. The fact is, regardless of the fact that they play in Europe, very few of Canada's top players (Deguzman, Derosario at best, in all likelihood) would even make the U.S men's national team. But developing young talent has turned the U.S. into a major player.

Sure, the current woes can't be explained away by the lack of a league but they are seriously, seriously impact by the lack of revenue a decent domestic league can leverage for a men's national program. It's not for nothing that Nike put $100M into U.S. men's soccer. They had the promise of a league coming off the world cup.

We have the world youth champs coming up in 2007 and it would be the ideal time to get a proper plan, with proper corporate support, in place.

[fan]

I am with you on the proper plan and corporate sponsor front.However given Kevin "broken" Pipe dreams and the CSA past incompetence at the marketing and revenue stream end of it , it doesn't bode well for future gains.

Your right one of the large differences has been the excellent ability of the USA board to garner,promote and acquire revenue streams for their soccer program.

I understand Frank being frustrated by the lack of time european based players can appear but as another poster said he must of been aware of at least this fact.

Most of the other countries in the world have reconized the changing climate in national team competitions and adapted to it.There problems are almost the same as Canada's. However teams like Greece Holland and Japan have stopped relying on occassional drafts of pro players from other leagues in the world.

Now they realize the importance of developing a team spirit ,familiarity and cohesiveness with players who play at home and are not the "superstar pros" available to them.

As we have witnessed first hand even "minoes" as people have referred to them like Cuba and T&T are much superior teams to Canada's "import all star team" because they are just that a spirited, familiar cohesive unit playing together with the same goal every time.

If you play the players you develop through out your youth system on the MNT constantly you not only support your system you also develop a competitive MNT that can play against any nation at any level.

Unfortunately from the top down the CSA has done just the opposite for 20 years and more.The result is clear and will continue to be dismal untill these people are removed and the system I mentioned above is implemented and supported by everyone through out the organization at every level.

At this point you could develop a sponsorship and corporate plan that would excel in creating constant revenue streams all year long.