Cheeta Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Haven't watched the tape yet and I'll admit I was pretty cut by half time but I think I'm going to keep my feet in the "Should have had that one" camp. Disclaimer. Think it was Onstads best match in memmory. And he's likely our best keeper option. A Few Kind Words. Saved everything else he should have. Even had to move his feet there a couple of times to make a save. Nice to see that out of Pat. His kicking was even good. Think I saw only one or two balls go hopelessly over the touch line. Gathered in a couple of corners. All and all a good match. Except for.... And Now the Darts Too tentative for the most parts. Manys the ball the Ticos sent running forward on that realy fast FieldTurf where I was yelling "Keep! Keep!" but the keep was nowhere to be seen. Needed to look further back towards his line to find him. There's a nice camera shot of Watson looking like he's saying something vulgar and frustrated in his head on one of those plays. And the goal. Nice hit, Wanchope. Had a barn door to shoot at, but well placed anyway. Where Pat thought he was I don't know. Why he was cheating to his right hand post when there was no way Wanchope could get a left footer around Hutch (?), as I saw it anyway, I have no idea. At least you tried to get to it. Even if you had, likely would have spilled a nice juicy rebound into the center of the box. Which is why at those angles guys try those sleepers ALL THE TIME. At least in the EPL. Scotland even. Apparently though, not in MLS. And so, as I rant to myself, isn't that typical Onstad? Even when he has a good night, or even mostly good night, he blows one and it almost always proves fatal. Poor bugger. P.S. Oy. My spelling sucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Jarrek If you rely on luck you'll lose all your games. Um, yeah, but we didn't rely on luck. I said that we played well and with a little luck (which means a little luck on top of everything else) we could have won. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leekoo Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Jarrek Of course the only downside to that is that there are immediate accounting and legal fees associated with running a non profit organization year to year. And usually on average we're talking $800-$1300. Cheapo Non-Profit Option (no stinking lawyer) incorporate (federal) online for a wee $300 buckaroos ... GOTO http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/epic/internet/incd-dgc.nsf/vwGeneratedInterE/h_cs0 Cheapo Accounting Option (no stinking accountant) buy quickbooks at staples for less than $200 ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
massimo Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by matthew Jesus you guys are biased. Onstad played great tonight. Hutchinson gets muscled off a ball in the air by one of the best strikers ever to come out of the region, eight seconds into the half and he one-times a volley off the post and it's Onstad's fault because he was two steps too far towards the near post. Name me a Canadian keeper who would have stopped that shot? Craig Forrest might have. Anyone else I say no way. And of course Watson gets abuse for not getting over there instaneously. It's plan and simple we were flat. I've sh!t like that happen too many times. Christ I've seen the Canadian Women do exactly the same play. But the point is the second half had begun and the canadian players looked un-prepared for it. Hutch, should have tried to protect the ball with his body, instead of going up for the header. As Hutch was flat footed and Wanchope had a running start. It's only obvious Wanchope is going to get it, and it doesn't take a world class striker to win the ball that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
massimo Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Winnipeg Fury [brOnstad was world-class tonight. I agree he did make lots of stops, but as all of you know in this game it's the one that you don't stop that will kill you. I'm not trying to knock the guy. I'm just making a point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolando Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Hutch is clearly the man to blame for the goal, not Onstad, you haters!! It helps when you have a backline man marking the best strikers in the game who weighs more than a buck fifty so that he doesn't get bowled over like a pilon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vancouver Fan Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Why does it seem that it is always our best players that are injured or suspended or not chosen.Why is Watson never injured or suspended or not chosen.Not only are we an underprepared team but we also have rotten luck.If only 2 of the following were in the lineup tonight then I believe we would have been looking at a different result. De Vos,Stalteri,McKenna,Brennan,Menezes,Reda,Serioux.Even Bent and Nsaliwa would have been good off the bench tonight. I didn't really notice Sandro Grande out there.Craig and Gerry thought he played great.I'm not sure about that.Did anyone really play great?De Guzman and Hume at least looked like they were trying. At times it looked like we were wilting in the humidity.Maybe Sigma can describe that for us.That field seemed like the Canadians had a hard time controlling the ball because of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolando Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 I agree with you Nazz, and prefer to see Grande's role last night as that of another invisible defensive midefielder, as I mentioned in another reply. Those are the guys that often shouldn't get much attention if they are shutting down offense as a team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
massimo Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Vancouver Fan I didn't really notice Sandro Grande out there.Craig and Gerry thought he played great.I'm not sure about that.Did anyone really play great?De Guzman and Hume at least looked like they were trying. Grande was playing a defensive midfield position, I think he played pretty well. It's hard to notice guys in that position, because they don't get the glamour, but run like hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarrek Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Cheapo Accounting Option (no stinking accountant) buy quickbooks at staples for less than $200 ... I'm aware of this option, however at the end of the year you still have to hire a chartered accountant to sign off on your paperwork. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhat Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Jarrek Well, I suggested that some time ago, but unfortunately a lot of people opposed the idea. The problem with our current structure now is that we're not any sort of legal entity. If we establish ourselves as a non-profit organization then we will have the ability to write off some of our costs in running the website, creating merchendise and raising money. Of course the only downside to that is that there are immediate accounting and legal fees associated with running a non profit organization year to year. And usually on average we're talking $800-$1300. The good news is that our current expenses are really low. The server costs around $15/month CDN, and we've recently enrolled in the Google AdSense Program which will bring in around $25-$30/month and hence pay for the server. We're also looking at upgrading because we're running out of space and there are some issues with the current server (ie; Service Unavailable) ... We should seriously pursue this after the next home game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G-Man Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Vancouver Fan I At times it looked like we were wilting in the humidity.Maybe Sigma can describe that for us.That field seemed like the Canadians had a hard time controlling the ball because of it. Let's not blame the feildturf for our lack of control on the ball. Having played on it and seen our women's national team play on it several times, I can say that feildturf does not affect ones first touch or does it affect the pace the ball travels on anymore so than long grass or short grass. And at the end of the day- both teams have to play on the same pitch. We simply have to be aware of the fact that at this level skill is important- (especially agaist central American teams) and that our boys play in leagues where skill is secondary to pace. We need to get the majority of National team players playing in top leagues, not in secondary leagues like the english 2nd division or anywhere in Scotland. And instead of dreaming of a Canadian Pro League maybe we should be paying the top clubs to train our top 20 youth players. It would produce more top elite players capable of playing with the best, than providing summer employment for 150 locals who can't trap a ball or move a ball at high speeds under pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gardencity Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 I've got to hand it to you guys, your dedication to our MNT is admirable. Love is blind I suppose, but in the end, it's the same old result. A loss, and we are out very early. Our chances of making it to the next round virtually evaporated about 12 minutes into Game 1 in Vancouver. Hauntingly familiar to our opening game in Edmonton 4 years ago against T&T. Like the Ticos goal 9 seconds into last nights game, our team was woefully unprepared for that first game in Vancouver and it really killed us. You can sugar coat things, but we're on the outside looking in....again. Here's my 5 wishes for our MNT, I think they are modest: 1) I'd like to see us be able to score an away goal during WCQ. 2) I'd like to see us be able to come back from a one goal deficit (I think the last time that happened was against Mexico in Gold Cup play...and before that, probably against Australia about 10 years ago). 3) I'd like to see a midfielder with vision and creativity. 4) I'd like to see us get lucky and steal a win here and there, our only luck tends to be of the negative variety. 5) I'd like to see some depth in our pool of players....that may be the closest to realization on my modest list. Cheers, Gardencity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 By the way Sigma, they showed you on tv during the Canadian anthem a couple of times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fza Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by redhat Of course the only downside to that is that there are immediate accounting and legal fees associated with running a non profit organization year to year. And usually on average we're talking $800-$1300. The good news is that our current expenses are really low. The server costs around $15/month CDN, and we've recently enrolled in the Google AdSense Program which will bring in around $25-$30/month and hence pay for the server. We're also looking at upgrading because we're running out of space and there are some issues with the current server (ie; Service Unavailable) ... Sounds like a an excellent idea, about the legal fees at the most it would cost around $109 extra per month and if you add to that how much it costs to run the website, it`ll come to around $140 fixed costs. Maybe even less if you follow Leekoo`s idea, but it`s just give everyone an idea. We have so many members, I`m not too sure about the exact number of voyageurs, lets say we`re around 60 that are constantly visiting the site and posting threads for instance Mimglow, Redhat, TheRef, Mattbin, Jayway, Jarrek, Strobez, Gianluca, Nolando, MikeD, TheBeaver, beachesl, Nolando, fza, etc, etc, etc..I could on and on. I think we`d all be able to donate money monthly to this organzation by becoming members as long as we know what the money is being used for and if we run this non-profit organization as seriously as possible. We could be able to raise an important amount of funds to do a lot of activities to build the "Voyageurs" brand and position it not only in Canada but around the world as well. I`d love to be a part of this organization not just as a member. I think we have a lot of professionals, including myself, here willing to do something with this community. About the server, my brother lives in Vancouver and works for an amazing Web hosting company (Superb.net) and he`s a web developer, I`m going to talk to him to see if there`s a possiblity they could help us out. Cheers, fza Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River City Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Have you guys thought about building from the ground up rather than expecting wholesale changes to miraculously happen at the CSA? If the Voyageurs established themselves in each province by running soccer teams, getting on the boards of the local Associations as well as the Provincial Associations, as an organization, you'd have way more pull in creating the changes every Canadian Soccer fan wants. As long as they regard the Voyageurs as outsiders, you will be continually fighting an uphill battle. Just a thought.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sstackho Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Our second half was really bad. We could have played another 90 minutes out there, and I don't think we would have scored. Radz had one decent chance in the second half, but he was under a lot of pressure. Onstad played well overall, but is partially at fault on the goal, but less so than Hutchison. I thought Grande was certainly involved a lot, although passed the ball to the other team on occasion. Then again, many of our players did that. Depressingly, what it comes down to is the fact that our player pool is just not that good. We have a handful of quality players, but lack any depth. But that's just the nature of the beast with soccer in this country. Hopefully with the improvements in the youth programs (that I've read about), we will develop more quality players in the future. There is no quick-fix solution. I apologize for my most depressing post ever on this board. I don't know how to fix things, but luckily it's not my job to do so. I'm a supporter, so that's what I'll keep doing. And until we are mathematically eliminated, I'll keep hoping. And even after we are eliminated, I'll keep cheering. Just not right now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
massimo Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by River City Have you guys thought about building from the ground up rather than expecting wholesale changes to miraculously happen at the CSA? If the Voyageurs established themselves in each province by running soccer teams, getting on the boards of the local Associations as well as the Provincial Associations, as an organization, you'd have way more pull in creating the changes every Canadian Soccer fan wants. As long as they regard the Voyageurs as outsiders, you will be continually fighting an uphill battle. Just a thought.... Come on, you're asking us to do more than just, send our rants into cyber space. That's isn't very Canadian. I think it could be a good idea but, before that happens, we need to be an official organization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sstackho Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 OK, so you run a soccer team, get on to the board of the local assocation as well as the provincial association..... and then what?? Tell the players to become better footballers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattbin Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 I was with Jarrek the last time the organization idea was floated, and it looks like we'll have a lot of time to discuss it while the hex is going on. : ) Anyhow, I'd like to suggest that we move this to another thread. I almost didn't read this thread as I thought it would be too depressing... Incidentally, I know a lawyer who might be able to help us out, and might even do the incorporation for free. Maybe others have connections or resources that could contribute to the cause? M@ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
River City Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 By being an ACTIVE member of the Soccer hierarchy in this country and working within the system you 1)lose your 'outsider' status. The people that have worked their way up to the top in the CSA, provincial and local associations fear change, threats to their power base and seeing everything they've accomplished taken for granted by 'critics', 'complainers' and 'cranks'. You would feel the same way too if you had a run a mediocre club for years, worked hard to get into one of the boards, worked hard to stay on the board and have strangers criticise you for not doing enough. If your critics aren't strangers though, but active members of the association, there's a lot more legitimacy attached to your arguments. I'm not saying it's right, but that's the way it is with most associations whether business or sport. 2)have a direct say in how programs are administered. Whether starting your own programs at the team level, or implementing/changing current programs at the Association level, you are the one that becomes responsible for improving the level of soccer within your sphere of influence. 3)have access to greater resources. At the provincial Association level, your programs and directives are implemented by full time staff with financial support from the soccer fee paying members of the respective Association, not necessarily volunteers with limited time and money. 4)increase status. By having an easy identifiable project (soccer team), member mobilization, fundraising and other projects become easier. So does increasing the number of Voyageurs and the overall clout of the group. 5)don't have to tell the players to become better football players. Because you are building the infrastructure/organization they need to develop their talent. Because you are developing a more professional presence which will attract and retain higher standards of coaching to nurture that talent. Because you are assisting in providing options for players to pursue. Running a team is time intensive but not rocket science. Getting results on the other hand is different, but don't sell yourselves short... The majority of soccer teams in your local leagues are run by soccer loving volunteers who for lack of overall direction do their own thing rather than pool their efforts. This option would definitely require hard work, but not necessarily more effort or more money than the Voyageurs currently do. For crying out loud, you took the bull by the horns and started the Voyageurs Cup! Why didn't the CSA come up with that? You can organize Voyageur/Canadian soccer fan gatherings wherever the NTM play better than any of the Associations could. Most fans gave up hope on the CSA a long time ago. Whether you like it or not, you are the next best organized national body that fans can relate to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big fan Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Winnipeg Fury Man of the Match for Canada - DeGuzman. Are you serious? You are clueless Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big fan Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big fan Posted September 9, 2004 Share Posted September 9, 2004 quote:Originally posted by massimo Grande was playing a defensive midfield position, I think he played pretty well. It's hard to notice guys in that position, because they don't get the glamour, but run like hell. Thank you Massimo, at least someone know's the game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marktci Posted September 10, 2004 Share Posted September 10, 2004 quote:Originally posted by mattbin I was with Jarrek the last time the organization idea was floated, and it looks like we'll have a lot of time to discuss it while the hex is going on. : ) Anyhow, I'd like to suggest that we move this to another thread. I almost didn't read this thread as I thought it would be too depressing... Incidentally, I know a lawyer who might be able to help us out, and might even do the incorporation for free. Maybe others have connections or resources that could contribute to the cause? M@ For what it's worth, I know my debits from my credits. I wouldn't promise any miracles, but would volunteer to help out on the accounting side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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