DarnCherry Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Marc One positive from this game - it sort of puts to rest the playing in Vancouver myth. Full of opposing team fans and 6300 attendance. Outdrawn by Kingston of all places. I'm not looking forward to seeing what the stands for the Costa Rica match will be like. Use your frigging head. The game was sold out you idiot at 6,725 ,how the **** are they supposed to put more in there? There were as many Canadian fans in the stadium as there were Guatemalans. The difference? All the Guatemalans were in their colours while a lot of Canadians need to learn that they have to wear Canada colours to these game. Man, you easterners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Free kick Yes, hopefully this will put to rest that myth that you can't play game in toronto because of foreign support and blah blah blah about certain parts of the country being more patriotic therfore is a better place for the MNT's to play in order to ensure a home town support. Yeah, but it strengthems the fact that you are a bunch of whiners. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by kokanne There was only about 500 to 800 of them, in my opinion, it just happened that there were about 80 of them right next to the Voyaguers/Southsiders on the TV view. Even from watching the tape, the Guat fans only had there moments when they scored. The Canadian fans were loud and proud the whole game, even when we were down. Yeah, and we had the cops come and arrest some of our guys and a nearly a good outbreak of violence. Shame that I when I threw somebodies drink at the cops I accidently hit the two southsiders being hauled away instead of the cops. Glad that somebody who was actiually at the game is here speaking the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Metro Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca How is Ruiz to know that he was level? You've never heard of striker trying to time their run? And replays don't clearly show him as being level with the last defender. Next you'll be telling me that the linesman at the South Korea-Spain game was also accurate. It doesn't matter, as we didn't deserve to win the way we played, but anybody who tries to tell me the goal was on-side is just wasting their breath (or in this case, cyber-space). Snapping out of my deep depression for a moment, I have to say that I agree with Gian-Luca; Ruiz was about a quarter-step offside. Very minor yes, but I've seen linesmen call offside with such a small difference many times. The problem with the linesman last night was that if you see the replay of the goal, you'll notice that the linesman was about 3-4 steps behind the play, running as fast as he could to catch up. He was nowhere near in line with the last defender, and therefore viewed the play from a skewed angle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeBestFan Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 Officiating. The ref was totally taken in by the constant diving of the guatemalan players and the little fat linesman on the west touchline was totally incapable of keeping up with play- so he'd never be able to spot a marginal offside anyway. Yes, these salvadorean officials were total oinqueurs, and they let the guatemalan players and coaching staff use skilled cheating to their advantage. On reflection though, it seems that we're stuck with latin american officiating, and we will always have to get past central american teams who are as skilled at diving /cheating/simulation as they are with the ball. There's a major problem here. Our players are predominantly playing anglo-saxon soccer in an anglo-saxon environment . This is no preparation at all for playing latin american players who have no inhibitions when it comes to gamesmanship. The situation is even worse when the offficials are also latin american. This, it seems to me, to be an area of "preparation" that needs work. But I am at a loss as to how Yallop can fix it. Hire an Argentinian assistant maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amacpher Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Metro The problem with the linesman last night was that if you see the replay of the goal, you'll notice that the linesman was about 3-4 steps behind the play, running as fast as he could to catch up. He was nowhere near in line with the last defender, and therefore viewed the play from a skewed angle. The TV camera was also at a skewed angle so nobody will ever know for sure if it was offsides. I think 10 pts will definitely be enough to finish top 2 in the group. And 95 pts will also be enough for Crystal Palace to win the Premier League. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayWay Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by amacpher Well, if he was born in Guatamala he has every right to support Guatamala ahead of Canada. This notion that just because a country is better off economically and, thus, provided a person with a job that said person suddenly has to forget where he originally came from is completely absurd! I don't think so. No one is suggesting that an immigrant should forget where he came from and/or cut all emotional ties to his/her place of birth. We'd just like to see a commitment to the Canadian cause. One of the proported benefits of cultural diversity is the added richness in culture that it brings to a country. With that in mind, let's take a nation like Guatemala, who certainly can boast soccer as a strong part of it's culture and national fabric. If we're to assume then that part of these Guatemalan Canadians contribution to the enrichment of Canadian society is their introduction of a real soccer culture into our society then we should also assume that they would make a conserted effort to actually support the game here. By closing themselves off to mainstream society and neglecting to really help the *Canadian* game fluorish here, they are not helping enrich this country. The same goes for any other anyother type of cultural enrichment. quote: Actually alot of people who flee a 3rd-world country and come to Canada end up being worse-off than similar people who flee a 3rd-world country and go to a different 3rd world country. What are you basing this on? Of course, not everyone who comes to this country experiences the prosperity they would desire. But I'd think a lack of direct and entrenched oppression (in the case of many immigrants - refugees specifically) and the very *opportunity* to to thrive makes Canada a more desirable destination than any 3rd World Country. Also, is your comment a knock on Canada specifically, or all Western/immigrant absorbing nations? quote: The majority of Guatamalan supporters at yesterday's match would probably hope that both Canada and Guatamala advance from this group. But Guatamala is their first-pick and rightly so. Hoping means squat when they actively cheer against Canada's efforts. I'm sure alot of non-soccer-supporting Canadians, if asked, "hope" that Canada advances. But that doesn't mean they're doing anything for Canadian soccer. quote: Ironically, I bet many of those Guatamalans cheer harder for Canada when they're not playing Guatamala, than those who pretended to be cheering for Canada at the stadium last night. Again, what are you basing this on? The local game in Canada suffers from a lack of support. A large portion of the potential soccer-supporting fanbase in Canada are immigrants. I'm not laying the blame solely on the shoulders of the immigrant (or even 2nd Gen.) community - the issue goes much deeper than that - but surely, a lack of support from this area of Canadian society has contributed to Canadian soccer's problems. And how were the non-Guats "pretending" to support Canada? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torontosupport Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead Use your frigging head. The game was sold out you idiot at 6,725 ,how the **** are they supposed to put more in there? There were as many Canadian fans in the stadium as there were Guatemalans. The difference? All the Guatemalans were in their colours while a lot of Canadians need to learn that they have to wear Canada colours to these game. Man, you easterners. I prefer "Central Canadian", actually. I was an eastener when I lived in Halifax, for sure. But now I live in the middle of the country. Enough with your West-Coast-Geo-Centric attitude! But let's face one thing here: Swangard was sold out and there was still less people than Kingston. That's my point, anyway. Nice pitch, though. Better than Queen's. I don't care where they put a national stadium as long as it's full of 25,000 fans. Heck, by the time they build the stadium in Toronto I'll probably be living in Vancouver and complaining with the rest of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kokanne Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 I agree with your statement, The attendance for the first Kingston game was good, the second game was less the Van. Edmonton has a good pitch from what I know. I hope they can get more then 10k fans otherwise it wont be as loud as swanguard was. Having watched games there before, the crowd just gets lost in the stadium when you don't have many. The discussion has always been, where o where are our stadiums. Edmonton, Vancouver, Kingston, Montreal with CCR, ST John's. Of those stadiums what is the current capacities. ----- Richardson Stadium 10,258 lousy pitch but sss Swanguard 6800 great pitch, small stadium. CCR officially 8100, but apparently 10k, lousy pitch. St John's 10,000* but doesn't have the proper facilities yet required by FIFA "medical room and proper change rooms". Edmonton 65k, great facility, but its huge and Soccer crowds get lost in its Mammoth size. also its expensive to operate. ----- Any other fields that you know of right now that meets FIFA requirements? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnipeg Fury Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by GeorgeBestFan Officiating. On reflection though, it seems that we're stuck with latin american officiating, and we will always have to get past central american teams who are as skilled at diving /cheating/simulation as they are with the ball. There's a major problem here. Our players are predominantly playing anglo-saxon soccer in an anglo-saxon environment . This is no preparation at all for playing latin american players who have no inhibitions when it comes to gamesmanship. The situation is even worse when the offficials are also latin american. This, it seems to me, to be an area of "preparation" that needs work. But I am at a loss as to how Yallop can fix it. Hire an Argentinian assistant maybe? The answer is to have enough exhibition matches against Latin teams, that our players understand the play-acting and the style. For example, Hume was taken by a flagrant dive vs Belize that resulted in a Red Card. Our players need more preperation than to be thrown together for a couple of days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winnipeg Fury Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by GeorgeBestFan Officiating. On reflection though, it seems that we're stuck with latin american officiating, and we will always have to get past central american teams who are as skilled at diving /cheating/simulation as they are with the ball. There's a major problem here. Our players are predominantly playing anglo-saxon soccer in an anglo-saxon environment . This is no preparation at all for playing latin american players who have no inhibitions when it comes to gamesmanship. The situation is even worse when the offficials are also latin american. This, it seems to me, to be an area of "preparation" that needs work. But I am at a loss as to how Yallop can fix it. Hire an Argentinian assistant maybe? The answer is to have enough exhibition matches against Latin teams, that our players understand the play-acting and the style. For example, Hume was taken by a flagrant dive vs Belize that resulted in a Red Card. Our players need more preperation than to be thrown together for a couple of days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sstackho Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by sstackho However, although very close, I do not think the first goal was offside. It was VERY well played. Although it is completely meaningless and irrelevant at this point and probably not worth discussing, it ends up that my understanding of the offside rule may be incorrect. I thought that if any of the attacker's torso was in the same horizontal line as any of the defender's torso, then there is no offside. After a bit of research, I realize I may be mistaken (might be based on the middle of the torso of both players), although I was not able to find the definitive FIFA rule. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuck-fan Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 My understanding of the offside rule is that the referee's assistant is to look at the centre line of the attacker and defender and from that determine whether the attacker is even with or past the defender. The explanation of offside by FIFA's head ref appears to support that interpretation: http://www.thefa.com/TheFA/RulesAndRegulations/FIFALawsOfTheGame/Postings/2002/05/12115.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead Use your frigging head. The game was sold out you idiot at 6,725 ,how the **** are they supposed to put more in there? There were as many Canadian fans in the stadium as there were Guatemalans. The difference? All the Guatemalans were in their colours while a lot of Canadians need to learn that they have to wear Canada colours to these game. Man, you easterners. Fair enough. I was under the impression that Swangard's capacity was 8000. My apologies on that count. I didn't say there were as many Guatemalans, I used the word 'full' to suggest that there were many, which there were. I'm not suggesting it would have been any different in Toronto. Sorry Khead, that point stands. There were ltos of Guats, no matter where the mics were placed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marc Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Krammerhead Yeah, but it strengthems the fact that you are a bunch of whiners. Hey man, it's hard living in your shadow. We can only hope to emulate... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kokanne Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 I have a solution. Mexico, they allow 5 foreign players allowed on the field and 10 on the roster. They pay extremly well and allow players to be close to home and especially close to play friendlies in our region. one of the mexican players is making 100,000US a week. how is that for cash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeBestFan Posted August 19, 2004 Share Posted August 19, 2004 The Voyageurs and Southsiders aside- they did a great job and were very visible and audible before and during the game- I was pretty disappointed with the typical canadian in-the-grandstand fans. What's with our fellow Canadians? Dressed in anything but red, mostly not singing O Canada - grief, you could see the munchkins on the field with the players, singing O Canada at the beginning - so how come the adults couldn't be bothered? The cdn fans were pretty quiet when we did have something to cheer about. Worst of all when we were 2-0 down, and Serioux, Peters et al were running their guts out for the team- I hear canadians in the stands shouting abuse at their own team !!! Jeez. If these are the bums in the seats, I don't think we need them. I saw a similar thing at Canada B vs Milwall - where there's a twit right by the broadcast box shouting "boring" whenever canadian players pass anything other than forward to keep possession. Guess what- the journos pick up on it, even if the players can't hear it. Actually last night I'm sure some of the players COULD hear individual comments from the stand. I'm sure Jaimie Peters heard some of the kids next to me shouting encouragement when we were 2 down and 4 minutes to go. I guess the kids are too naive to be cynical. To give the Guatemalan fans their due, at least they knew who they were cheering for, and I doubt we would have heard them abusing their team if they were down a goal or two. Yes, I was disappointed. No, I can't see how Yallop can make our 18 players into the best team they could be, before the next game, given that the most skilled ones are scattered to the four winds until a couple of days before the game... But I'll not give up hoping for the best, just because of this setback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolando Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 "I saw a similar thing at Canada B vs Milwall - where there's a twit right by the broadcast box shouting "boring" whenever canadian players pass anything other than forward to keep possession. Guess what- the journos pick up on it, even if the players can't hear it. Actually last night I'm sure some of the players COULD hear individual comments from the stand. I'm sure Jaimie Peters heard some of the kids next to me shouting encouragement when we were 2 down and 4 minutes to go. I guess the kids are too naive to be cynical." GBF, Guess what, buddy? That "twit" was me. We were enduring yet another series of backpasses (instigated mostly be Pizzolito I think), right back to the keeper, with no effort whatsoever to create, in this, an exhibition friendly where the object was to exhibit talent, no? Where the actual result mattered not a bit. If you were anywhere near me you would have also heard (which would have been nice to mention) that I started almost all of the cheers in the grandstands. Didn't hear anybody else try and start anything. Are you one of the tried and true golf-clap fans who sits on your hands like you're watching minisoccer and don't want to hurt someone's feelings? Because if you are then it is precisely YOU and your kind that we don't need filling up seats with your misguided bums. BTW the players can hear us. K-head told me at half time that I was the only guy they could hear from their perch in the southside. And I DID start the positive cheers whenever we were doing something positive. But here's the thing, GBF, should I cheer the Canadians' every move, even when some of their moves are horrible and so historically typical (like the long ball from the back to a lone striker or the fateful backpass when faced with a possible chance for creativity)? I'm not a ten year kid whose Dad pays for his tickets anymore. And so I don't cheer blindly like a ten-year-old kid either, not after watching this team since 1986, and living and dying by their every move from that point on (including on these boards since 1997). I love this game. I love this country. I love this dream. It is precisely because my heart IS in it that I do take the time to jeer amongst all those cheers. Perhaps you are one of those classic fans that think the boobirds are too hard on the poor multimillionaire stars. Boo, friggin' hoo, I say. If I pay 33 bucks to see an exhibition of talent, then an effort to exhibit talent is what I expect see. Without us there is no game. If I see something I don't like they will hear from me (and when it is as quiet as the Millwall friendly they CAN hear me- notice that they innane backpasses stopped soon after) but to be fair, at least 99 % of my cheers are positive. Careful who you call a twit next time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GeorgeBestFan Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Nolando The press did pick up on your comment at the Millwall game. It probably didn't help in the effort to get more Canadians to come to national team games. The press is only too willing to report our own fans' criticism of the team. It was what, 89 minutes into a 90 minute game? the pass was to keep possession and led to a switch from one side of the field to the other, so it made sense. It would have made no sense to give up a 1-0 lead, even in a friendly. I apologize for calling you a twit; I don't know who you are. We are supposed to be on the same side, right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettermirror Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 i tried getting my section going and other than this one wicked soccer-mom it was a golf clap section. section b. section c seemed to rock quite a bit tho. from the video on sportsnet the crowd sounded a buzz. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kokanne Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by bettermirror i tried getting my section going and other than this one wicked soccer-mom it was a golf clap section. section b. section c seemed to rock quite a bit tho. from the video on sportsnet the crowd sounded a buzz. Your lucky everytime I stood up to get Canadians going, the Security forced me down in my seat. At one point a few of the fans in Section E started booing the security. I had nobody immediately behind me courtesy of the entrance to the Grandstand. My complaint has been registered with the CSA already. But im still bitter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarrek Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 More Stadiums (Natural Grass) ... Commonwealth Stadium Edmonton 60217 Richardson Stadium Kingston 10258 Claude Robillard Stadium Montreal 8100 Swangard Stadium Burnaby 7200 Centennial Stadium Victoria 6000 Birchmount Stadium Toronto 6000 Royal Athletic Park Victoria 5700 Alumni Stadium Guelph 5100 University Stadium Winnipeg 5000 Canada Games Stadium Saint John 5000 Monarch Park Stadium Toronto 5000 Winnipeg Soccer Complex Winnipeg 5000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kokanne Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Of those stadiums now which ones have a quality pitch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ed Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 quote:Originally posted by GeorgeBestFan Officiating. The ref was totally taken in by the constant diving of the guatemalan players and the little fat linesman on the west touchline was totally incapable of keeping up with play- so he'd never be able to spot a marginal offside anyway. Yes, these salvadorean officials were total oinqueurs, and they let the guatemalan players and coaching staff use skilled cheating to their advantage. On reflection though, it seems that we're stuck with latin american officiating, and we will always have to get past central american teams who are as skilled at diving /cheating/simulation as they are with the ball. There's a major problem here. Our players are predominantly playing anglo-saxon soccer in an anglo-saxon environment . This is no preparation at all for playing latin american players who have no inhibitions when it comes to gamesmanship. The situation is even worse when the offficials are also latin american. This, it seems to me, to be an area of "preparation" that needs work. But I am at a loss as to how Yallop can fix it. Hire an Argentinian assistant maybe? You are right about the difft standards of officiating. And that's where Yallop should have had an edge over Osieck for example. He's been there playing in these qualifiers. And yet we see Hume missing our first qualifier due to reacting to some of the gamesmanship and Simpson getting carded within minutes. Very frustrating. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew W Posted August 20, 2004 Share Posted August 20, 2004 Was it you Ed that said Twamley was doing the pre-scouting on Guatemala? If it was, I understand how they took us completely by surprise and we went in underprepared. That's kind of been his mantra for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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