Ivanovski94 Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Anyone see it? What ya'll think? For those who didnt I'll sum up... the CONCACAF is more shameless and corrupt then we ever imagined. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Here are the results. Not the most exotic or exciting group for the Impact with another MLS team, San Jose, but certainly a winnable group. Impact will definitely be the favourite to advance from this group: GROUPS Group 1: Arabe Unido, Houston Dynamo, Direct TV W Conection Group 2 Olimpia, Sporting Kansas City, Real Steli Group 3: Herediano, Cruz Azul, Valencia Group 4: America, Alajuelense, Sporting san Miguelito Group 5: San Jose Earthquakes, Montreal Impact, Guatemala 2nd (TBD) Group 6: CSD Comunicaciones, Toluca, Caledonia Group 7: Club Tijuana,Club Deportivo Victoria, CD Luis Angel Firpo Group 8: LA Galaxy, Metapan, Club Sport Cartaginés Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbailey62 Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Ya I agree Grizzly, you guys should be able to get through. It is unfortunate SJ is in your group from the standpoint of "yawn" but at least you know your competition. Here are the results. Not the most exotic or exciting group for the Impact with another MLS team, San Jose, but certainly a winnable group. Impact will definitely be the favourite to advance from this group: GROUPS Group 1: Arabe Unido, Houston Dynamo, Direct TV W Conection Group 2 Olimpia, Sporting Kansas City, Real Steli Group 3: Herediano, Cruz Azul, Valencia Group 4: America, Alajuelense, Sporting san Miguelito Group 5: San Jose Earthquakes, Montreal Impact, Guatemala 2nd (TBD) Group 6: CSD Comunicaciones, Toluca, Caledonia Group 7: Club Tijuana,Club Deportivo Victoria, CD Luis Angel Firpo Group 8: LA Galaxy, Metapan, Club Sport Cartaginés Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raven Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I like the draw, Impact avoid a Mexican team and now have a chance to win the group. IF they move to the next round....bring on the club Mexico! I thoroughly enjoyed 2008, lets hope for the same!! (or better) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shermanator Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Gift of a draw for the Impact. They should be able to get to the quarterfinals handily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivanovski94 Posted June 4, 2013 Author Share Posted June 4, 2013 from the Impact's perspective it was an awesome draw. but in terms of honour and principles there was none Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 from the Impact's perspective it was an awesome draw. but in terms of honour and principles there was none I didn't watch the draw so what do you mean about there being no honour or principles? Did it looked fixed? I know they had some strict rules about who can end up in the same group but there is some sense behind them in order to avoid either too easy or difficult groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdude Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I didn't watch the draw so what do you mean about there being no honour or principles? Did it looked fixed? I know they had some strict rules about who can end up in the same group but there is some sense behind them in order to avoid either too easy or difficult groups. CONCACAF did the draw while forgetting that US and Mexican teams couldn't be in the same group and they didn't see that and it took time for them to change it. I think that Houston and Tijuana were in Group 7 initially and Galaxy was with Cruz Azul in Group 8. Until they redrew those groups (1,3,7,8) It looked beyond amateurism from CONCACAF. They should watch Champions League draw to know how it doesn't happen that stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 CONCACAF did the draw while forgetting that US and Mexican teams couldn't be in the same group and they didn't see that and it took time for them to change it. I think that Houston and Tijuana were in Group 7 initially and Galaxy was with Cruz Azul in Group 8. Until they redrew those groups (1,3,7,8) It looked beyond amateurism from CONCACAF. They should watch Champions League draw to know how it doesn't happen that stuff. Yes I know they screwed up the draw and had to do some of it again. It certainly is a big screw up and looks amateur. However, Ivanovski is talking about the draw being corrupt and without principles which implies that it was fixed. If anything the way they screwed it up makes it seem that while done in an amateur manner it was not corrupt or fixed. Had they predetermined the draw they would not have drawn teams together that could not be in the same group according to the rules of the draw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdude Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 It could have been avoided, and that is the sad part. If you have ever seen the UEFA Champions' League Group, you know what I'm talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maico Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 Here's a simple idea for CONCACAF - If you can't have Mexican and US teams in the same pool, put them all in the same pot. That way you never have to worry about something like this happening again. Or get rid of the rule because it only makes it appear that you want a US/MEX team to win every pool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivanovski94 Posted June 4, 2013 Author Share Posted June 4, 2013 Yes I know they screwed up the draw and had to do some of it again. It certainly is a big screw up and looks amateur. However, Ivanovski is talking about the draw being corrupt and without principles which implies that it was fixed. If anything the way they screwed it up makes it seem that while done in an amateur manner it was not corrupt or fixed. Had they predetermined the draw they would not have drawn teams together that could not be in the same group according to the rules of the draw. What i mean is that if mexican and american teams cant be put in the same group then why are they in different pots.its understandable if it was 2 yankee teams in the same group or 2 mexican teams but it was one from each. CONCACAF want all the groups to have one american or one mexican in each group so the quarterfinals are usa vs mexico. is tht what international competition is about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 What i mean is that if mexican and american teams cant be put in the same group then why are they in different pots.its understandable if it was 2 yankee teams in the same group or 2 mexican teams but it was one from each. CONCACAF want all the groups to have one american or one mexican in each group so the quarterfinals are usa vs mexico. is tht what international competition is about? CONCACAF may be seeding like they do for financial reasons just like in the Gold Cup and probably they do prefer a US-Mexico final. However, the results since the Champions League format started do not support any other procedure than having the MLS/Mexican club as the first seeds and having one such team in each group. Even the strongest Central American teams are a step down from the level of MLS and Mexican clubs. They rarely make it out of the group stage and when they do are eliminated in the quarter finals. The only non-MLS teams to make it to the semis are Saprissa one time and Puerto Rico Islanders once. In reality the top teams like Saprissa and Olimpia are the level of good NASL teams. When the Impact last played in Champions League in our NASL days I think we got lucky a bit against the Mexican teams who were clearly better than us but Olimpia was absolutely at NASL level and probably not a championship team in NASL. The Impact victory in San Pedro Sula (in one of the most intense and intimidating stadium atmosphere's I have ever seen) was not luck, we were simply a better team. I agree that they should arrange the pots of the draw differently and they certainly could learn from UEFA in how to run the draw more competently. On the other hand the CONCACAF system did manage to draw 8 evenly matched groups while UEFA usually has some very unbalanced groupings that often make the Champions League competition extremely unfair. When I look at the groupings of both competitions, I am actually more inclined to say UEFA should follow CONCACAFs lead than the other way around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canadianfoot Posted June 4, 2013 Share Posted June 4, 2013 I don't follow CCL too much especially in TFC years. But what made CONCACAF do the switch from 4teams per Group to 3? Too crowded schedules? You can still have 24teams in a "real" draw with 4teams per group. 6groups of 4 and the 2Best RUNNER Up and have a determining Tie-Breaker. I think it would be more of a real competition in that way. But that's just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 I don't follow CCL too much especially in TFC years. But what made CONCACAF do the switch from 4teams per Group to 3? Too crowded schedules? You can still have 24teams in a "real" draw with 4teams per group. 6groups of 4 and the 2Best RUNNER Up and have a determining Tie-Breaker. I think it would be more of a real competition in that way. But that's just my opinion. My guess is that there were too many unprofitable group stage games under the old format. The current system pretty much makes every game important. The CONCACAF draw was a joke. Its nice to see them try, but it was a failure. As for UEFA, let's not give them too much credit, the system they use is designed to favour traditional powers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canucklefan Posted June 5, 2013 Share Posted June 5, 2013 It would be unfair to find Barcelona, Real Madrid, AC Milan and Bayern in the same group stage too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmonte Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 I love watching CONCACAF Champions League. I find Mexican soccer very appealing, especially in Mexico, with their fans. I'm sort of disappointed at the Liga MX teams involved this go around, I prefer watching Monterrey, Santos Laguna and Guadalajara, I don't know a lot about Toluca and Tijuana. I've been addicted to firstrow watching free games from around the world, and I keep coming back to Liga MX...love it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 I love watching CONCACAF Champions League. I find Mexican soccer very appealing, especially in Mexico, with their fans. I'm sort of disappointed at the Liga MX teams involved this go around, I prefer watching Monterrey, Santos Laguna and Guadalajara, I don't know a lot about Toluca and Tijuana. I've been addicted to firstrow watching free games from around the world, and I keep coming back to Liga MX...love it! Toluca is a classic Mexican league team and one of the most successful just like America and Cruz Azul. These are good teams with great fans and will be just as exciting as the teams you mention. Tijuana is a newer team with some big money backing who won their first title with the 2012 Apertura though they were not as good in the 2013 clausura. They just completed a transfer from Santos Laguna for US national team player Hercules Gomez who has scored a lot of goals in Champions League especially against MLS competition: http://www.mlssoccer.com/news/article/2013/06/04/american-exports-herculez-gomez-reportedly-signing-club-tijuana I think the Mexican representative will be equally as exciting as the previous ones. From a travelling fans' point of view these cities are also a lot safer than Torreon (Santos Laguna) or Monterrey. The first three cities are in Mexico City or near it. Tijuana was pretty dangerous a few years ago and while still not a safe city it has calmed down a lot since the Sinoloa Cartel won the cartel conflict in the area. I loved the experience at Torreon a few years ago (not the nicest city but were really well treated by Santos Laguna and the fans and atmosphere was great) and we went to Monterrey which is a really great city. However, both were in the drug war zone and the military was out in force in masks carrying machine guns and it was not that safe. Since then both cities have become key points in the war between the Gulf cartel and the absolutely brutal Zetas and have gotten about 10 times more dangerous than they were when we were there. Torreon was rated the 5th most dangerous city in the world last year. Indeed things are so bad that authorities are considering making a deal with the Sinoloa cartel to get rid of the Zetas. I would go love to go back but I wouldn't recommend it to anyone at the moment. It is too bad for us North American Champions League fans that there are so many great and interesting places to visit in CONCACAF yet so many of them are very dangerous and have been getting worse in recent years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 My guess is that there were too many unprofitable group stage games under the old format. The current system pretty much makes every game important. The CONCACAF draw was a joke. Its nice to see them try, but it was a failure. As for UEFA, let's not give them too much credit, the system they use is designed to favour traditional powers. I agree that the process was very amateur and incompetent. Nevertheless, all 8 groups are pretty fair and well balanced which is not the usual result in many of the more professionally run draws we see in other federations. Each group has one top team and either two middle teams or a middle and a weak team. To some extent the Canadian entry is the one that gets screwed by the process in that we will end up either with a Mexican team or another MLS team in the group unlike the American teams but we were lucky this year to get a fairly weak MLS team. They obviously need to improve the execution but the rules of the draw are producing balanced groups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yohan Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 There was a redraw because us teams arent suppose to face mexican teams in group stage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 There was a redraw because us teams arent suppose to face mexican teams in group stage. That's been established. CONCACAF looks amateurish because they didn't set the draw up properly in the first place. Having to 'redraw' could have been easily avoided. There is a number of ways to achieve that in a draw. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madmonte Posted June 6, 2013 Share Posted June 6, 2013 Toluca is a classic Mexican league team and one of the most successful just like America and Cruz Azul. No sure that's cool...my point was I haven't seen them play as much as those other teams, not that they weren't as good, or were bad representative cities. They qualified, they deserve to be there, nuff said. I guess if I follow CCL closely this year, I'll certainly get my chance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdude Posted June 17, 2013 Share Posted June 17, 2013 Guatemala 2 will be a club side named Heredia Jaguares. I wonder if they'll play at their home stadium. It looks like a beauty, but I'm not sure and people tell me that even the club said that they don't know where they'll play CCL. http://elportaldepeten.com/nuevo/images/stories/Asi%20lucia%20el%20julian%20tesucun_.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coppercanuck Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 That is a beauty stadium for Heredia Jaguares. I wonder about the roof top camera guy; extra pay and does it come with a safety harness? CONCACAF just needs to be transparent. Draw based on financials, just say it. Ranking of countries? Who knows? CFU can't even get the champs from each of their members to enter the competition. Belize? Hello? The "Stadium" is good enough for a FIFA qualifier but not the CCL? Really? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackdude Posted June 19, 2013 Share Posted June 19, 2013 They will play at the Mateo Flores, where Municipal plays their home game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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