oc64 Posted January 25, 2011 Author Share Posted January 25, 2011 Richard Adams is the executive director, not a Board member. Isn't he both? He used to be listed in both the employee register and the board register Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustFixIt Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Isn't he both? He used to be listed in both the employee register and the board register Bylaws, Article 15 - Board of Directors 1. The Business of the Association shall be conducted by a Board of Directors, which shall constitute the elected Directors along with the Past President and the Executive Director. I don't think there is any big conspiracy here, probably more a case of the staff scrambling to get something up on the website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kj52 Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 I just realized after reading the SGM minutes again (I never seem to get tired of reading them), in particular page 92 where EMSA Board member Cathy Droeske speaks, that we have burned the Messiah and his disciples. Surely we shall roast in hell for our misdeeds! :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Ninety-two+ pages of minutes for one soccer AGM - that's a helluva lot of hot air! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustFixIt Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Ninety-two+ pages of minutes for one soccer AGM - that's a helluva lot of hot air! Hey, just be glad the delegates didn't get into a line-by-line analysis of the reasons for dumping the board. They would still be working their way through the events of last June. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFCRegina Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Hey, just be glad the delegates didn't get into a line-by-line analysis of the reasons for dumping the board. They would still be working their way through the events of last June. Which interestingly enough corresponded with a significant growth in views and membership on this forum. Granted, I posted the cansoc.org link on just about every single World Cup and ASA related article on CBC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Posted January 25, 2011 Share Posted January 25, 2011 Which interestingly enough corresponded with a significant growth in views and membership on this forum. Granted, I posted the cansoc.org link on just about every single World Cup and ASA related article on CBC. I'm thinking that the biggest mistake the freshly removed board made was messing with the Tier 4 Provincials. Obviously the problems go back along way, but I think for the most part only those on the inside really cared about it all, and they could have kept going along doing the same things and indulging themselves. Except they thought they could mess with the kids on the feild by cancelling the Tier 4 Provincials and that made two things happen. 1) Media exposure locally in Edmonton in the Journal and on the radio (Dan Barnes talked about it on 1260AM a few times) and 2) the reformalbertasoccer website was created in direct response to the Provincials mess. Maybe it's fitting that the kids ulimately led to thier downfall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acorn44 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Hey, just be glad the delegates didn't get into a line-by-line analysis of the reasons for dumping the board. They would still be working their way through the events of last June. Be very thankful for that because for some of the former board members such as Fred Kern you could have gone back as far as 2007 for what is described on the Reform Alberta Soccer Website. Eliminating InterLeague playdowns after the season had started because a certain Mario claimed that current Provinicial spots earned was not fair to EMSA; so the system wasn't working . What Mario was really complaining about was a certain league consistently beat the EMSA version of tier 1 for the 2 District 8 spots. Also, the board gave no valid reason for taking the U-10 program away from one league. Only reason given was within District 8 that mini soccer belongs excusively to EMSA. Interesting they called it mini soccer when in fact it is small sided developmental soccer. Mini soccer would be 3v3, 4v4 etc. Games such as 7v7 and 8v8 are small sided developmental games not mini. Based on actions for the past few years it appears one of Mario's goals is to get rid of EIYSA so that the organization he runs, controls all soccer involving youth players. With the 2010 issue Mario's group negatively impacted a very wide group of players. All I can say is there has been a pattern of biased decision making for several years. I do not doubt for one minute that Mario does what he feels is best for EMSA, IMHO. I really hope now that ASA can now move in a positive direction for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ed Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Not to skew this thread off track, but one positive move by the ASA going forward would be to get rid of some redundancy in the suits area. Edmonton: What exactly is EIYSA? You have EMSA - minor soccer, EDSA - adult soccer. Sounds sufficient to me. Calgary: What is the purpose of CSF? It's members are: CMSA - minor soccer CUSA - adult men's soccer CWSA - adult women's soccer Merge the CUSA and CWSA and drop the uber-org CSF. All other regions have a single organization looking after soccer for the region. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acorn44 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Edmonton: What exactly is EIYSA?. EIYSA = Edmonton Interdistrict Youth Soccer Association (Elite Club Soccer). The way I would look at this league would be, that it deals with Tier 1. ie U-13 T1, U-14 T1 etc. However because of 2 year age brackets the younger age plays tier 2 and the older age tier 1 so the league offers Tier 1 and 2. Programs for U-12 to U-18 (tier 1 and 2) and until 2007 the league used to run a U-10 program. Back in 2007 there was some arbitration which would had Soccer Edmonton which include community soccer and a sub organization call Club Soccer Edmonton something to that effect. After there was a framework negotiated. After leaving the arbitrator the person negotiating on behalf of EMSA claimed they did not have the authority to sign the document and that they would have to take it back to their membership. After taking it back to their membership the document had so many redline changes that document was so one side that it would have crazy for EIYSA to sign on to it. The document before these redline change to my understanding was acceptable to the EIYSA members. I would favour a single league but there should be honest negotiation between the two leagues because there currently is difference in zones/import regulations ie EIYSA currently divides the City into a North and South Zone and only allow 3 imports until U-18. While EMSA has 6 geographical zones and allows U-12 to U14 allows for 6 imports and U16 allows 7 imports. I sure it should be truthful honest negotiation that a framework acceptable to both could be reached. But sadly because of friction between certain individuals I do not think this will happen. Negotiation require a little give and take. Currently one side want to take and not give. Right Mario. Reason for two separate leagues happened way before my time. Something to do with a fight between EMSA and ASA where the club team would not have been eligible for Provincials or National competition. EIYSA was created to allow this club team to compete in Provincials etc. Anyways I do not know any more than what I have heard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kj52 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Not to skew this thread off track, but one positive move by the ASA going forward would be to get rid of some redundancy in the suits area. Edmonton: What exactly is EIYSA? You have EMSA - minor soccer, EDSA - adult soccer. Sounds sufficient to me. Calgary: What is the purpose of CSF? It's members are: CMSA - minor soccer CUSA - adult men's soccer CWSA - adult women's soccer Merge the CUSA and CWSA and drop the uber-org CSF. All other regions have a single organization looking after soccer for the region. The history of EIYSA was posted earlier on this thread Ed. It might be a bit of a task to dig it up seeing how many pages we're at now but it's definitely there. It was explained pretty thoroughly by someone who was around then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Speaking of redundancy Ed, here's what kids in Ontario are paying for: --> OSA (100%) Chief Executive Officer Corporate Service Coordinator Finance Manager Accountant Coordinator Communications Coordinator Play Soccer Help Desk Coordinator Director of Operations Director of Organizational Development Special Projects Coordinator Soccer Development Coordinator – Region 1 Soccer Development Coordinator – Region 4 Program Coordinator, Member Services Program Coordinator, Operations Manager of Competitions & Events Program Coordinator, Competitions Program Coordinator, Competitions Program Coordinator, Futsal Acting Coordinator, Futsal Manager of Information Services Information Services Coordinator Chief Technical Officer Manager of Coach Development Technical Coordinator, Coach Development Technical Coordinator, Coach Development Manager of Player Development Technical Coordinator, Player Devlelopment Regional Coaches - Region 1 Regional Coaches - Region 2 Regional Coaches - Region 3 Regional Coaches - Region 4 Regional Coaches - Region 5 Regional Coaches - Region 6 Regional Coaches - Region 7 Manager of Referee Development Technical Coordinator, Referee Development Technical Coordinator, Referee Development Director of Facilities Operations Manager Booking & Events Manager --> CSA (40%) General Secretary Executive Assistant Deputy General Secretary / Director of Refereeing Manager of Administration Competitions Manager Events Coordinator Referee Program Administrator Systems Coordinator - Registrar Administrative Assistant / Active Start Soccer Coordinator Chief Financial Officer Manager of Finance Accounts Receivable Accounts Payable Director, Business Development Director of Communications Marketing Manager Translator Director of Coaching & Player Development Long-Term Player Development Manager Technical Programs Manager Men's National Team Head Coach Men's National Team Manager Women's National Team Manager Women's National team and Women's U-20 Assistant Coach Women's National team and Women's U-20 Assistant Coach Men's National Team Assistant Coach and Men's Olympic Team Head Coach National Staff Coach Men's National Para Soccer Team Head Coach National Teams Administrative Manager National Teams Administrator Equipment Manager, National Teams Throw in District and League salaries too. Thank God for the kids. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachRich Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 ^ Wow and to think the kids in the USA only pay $2 to the USSF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shield69 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 EIYSA = Edmonton Interdistrict Youth Soccer Association (Elite Club Soccer). The way I would look at this league would be, that it deals with Tier 1. ie U-13 T1, U-14 T1 etc. However because of 2 year age brackets the younger age plays tier 2 and the older age tier 1 so the league offers Tier 1 and 2. Programs for U-12 to U-18 (tier 1 and 2) and until 2007 the league used to run a U-10 program. Back in 2007 there was some arbitration which would had Soccer Edmonton which include community soccer and a sub organization call Club Soccer Edmonton something to that effect. After there was a framework negotiated. After leaving the arbitrator the person negotiating on behalf of EMSA claimed they did not have the authority to sign the document and that they would have to take it back to their membership. After taking it back to their membership the document had so many redline changes that document was so one side that it would have crazy for EIYSA to sign on to it. The document before these redline change to my understanding was acceptable to the EIYSA members. I would favour a single league but there should be honest negotiation between the two leagues because there currently is difference in zones/import regulations ie EIYSA currently divides the City into a North and South Zone and only allow 3 imports until U-18. While EMSA has 6 geographical zones and allows U-12 to U14 allows for 6 imports and U16 allows 7 imports. I sure it should be truthful honest negotiation that a framework acceptable to both could be reached. But sadly because of friction between certain individuals I do not think this will happen. Negotiation require a little give and take. Currently one side want to take and not give. Right Mario. Reason for two separate leagues happened way before my time. Something to do with a fight between EMSA and ASA where the club team would not have been eligible for Provincials or National competition. EIYSA was created to allow this club team to compete in Provincials etc. Anyways I do not know any more than what I have heard. One of the sticking points during the negotiations in 2007 (or whenever that was) was the integration of the community league soccer programs with the club programs. The model EMSA proposed was very Calgary-esque, whereby all teams were tiered based on competitiveness etc. (or at least an attempt thereof). The thought was that kids could work their way up the ladder if they chose, so to speak. EIYSA wanted to maintain club leagues independent of the community leagues. I know this isn't the only sticking point that brought things to a halt, but I am aware from good sources that had EIYSA been willing to move on this point then a lot of the other points would have fallen into place. EIYSA was concerned that a structure proposed by EMSA would lead to the demise of the elite level soccer in Edmonton. I don't know... Calgary seems to do ok integrating all levels of soccer into one unified league. I agree. Now is the time to renew the discussions and come to the table with fresh ideas and fresh PEOPLE! Please Mr. Charpentier, step aside and let the game move forward. One youth soccer organization in District 8. Top 2 teams in the unified league represent the District at Provincials. Let's end the shenanigans (and save considerable money in duplication of services). The blame for this doesn't fall exclusively at Mario's feet. EIYSA needs to come to the table prepared to compromise too... I think compromise is the key word in any negotiation. (Of course, had ASA and/or CSA at the time been a functional governing organization (read: had the balls) where political allegances were not more important than the best decisions for the game this matter would have been settled by some form of competitions committee who would have either facilitated a negotiated outcome or arbitrated an outcome... regardless of whether 'buddies' would vote them back into office next go 'round. i.e. a board of directors without conflicted interests... we can hope.). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Kid Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Does anyone else get the uneasy feeling that things have been a bit too quiet from either CSA or the deposed ASA board members after this SGM???? Maybe it's just me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acorn44 Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Well stated Shield69. I would like to add one additional point that I believe the community player fees should not subsidize any elite club players as the elite club training requirements are higher. Therefore the cost will be more especially during the winter when training facilities must be rented etc. It would be unfair to a community player who might have only 1 or 2 practices a week to have part of their fee subsidize a player that is practicing 3 or more times per week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachRich Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Well stated Shield69. I would like to add one additional point that I believe the community player fees should not subsidize any elite club players as the elite club training requirements are higher. Therefore the cost will be more especially during the winter when training facilities must be rented etc. It would be unfair to a community player who might have only 1 or 2 practices a week to have part of their fee subsidize a player that is practicing 3 or more times per week. Common problem with mon and pops running things. Sort of like the CSA as they won't break out their financials in detail ie the NT expenses by gender. what they paid on employee lawsuite like Nykamp and etc. Good example of how out of touch things can great is Vancouver district subsidized with other district club money/kids their elite district club $20-25K annually. Boards putting hundreds of thousand of dollars aside for clubhouses/capital expenditures that the members don't even get a vote on. Some clubs like Richmond Girls, BC dont' even allow the members or parents to vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ed Posted January 26, 2011 Share Posted January 26, 2011 Well stated Shield69. I would like to add one additional point that I believe the community player fees should not subsidize any elite club players as the elite club training requirements are higher. Therefore the cost will be more especially during the winter when training facilities must be rented etc. It would be unfair to a community player who might have only 1 or 2 practices a week to have part of their fee subsidize a player that is practicing 3 or more times per week. Surely it is the responsibility of member clubs in an organization (Calgary or Edmonton), not the overseeing organization, to establish fees. In my club, elite players pay extra fees. Why would it need to be addressed at the overseeing organization level? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acorn44 Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Surely it is the responsibility of member clubs in an organization (Calgary or Edmonton), not the overseeing organization, to establish fees. In my club, elite players pay extra fees. Why would it need to be addressed at the overseeing organization level? I did not mean to imply that this is the responsibility of an overseeing organization because it is not. I should have indicated that my comment was more or less directed some elite/select programs that are only charging slightly more than their community program. For argument sake lets say anywhere from $20 to $65 dollar more because they are using their community program to subsidize their select/elite program. Yes it is each individual club which choses the fee and that is how it should be. The overseeing organization should be looking at the bigger picture. A friend e-mailed me tonight regarding a report from Ontario. After reading this report I feel Alberta should have been looking at something like this too. I have attached the report. It appears Ontario is trying to look at the big picture something I have yet to see Alberta do. It must be all the money being given to Lawyers etc. 2009.06.09 Elite Youth Development League.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachRich Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Not sure if Mario's Jan 25th response to Ben's radio interview has been posted so here it is - http://www.cbc.ca/edmontonam/2011/01/25/soccer-fight---response/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Acorn44 Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 It was interesting to hear the response. I fail to see how having professionals on the CSA would have a negative impact on grass root community programs. Is the thinking that the CSA is going to ask for every increasing fees from the community players. ie $10/head to $20/head increasing to $40/head etc. I personally think the professionals are needed to seek and attract sponsorship dollars the national program so desperately needs. What sponsorship dollars have the Provincial Presidents brought in? IMHO the community programs will continue to run regardless of what is happening with the National program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustFixIt Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Not sure if Mario's Jan 25th response to Ben's radio interview has been posted so here it is - http://www.cbc.ca/edmontonam/2011/01/25/soccer-fight---response/ All I know is I've been trying to keep an open mind about this whole dispute, but it's making my brain hurt. It does seem to me, if you check Reform Alberta Soccer, that Mr. Charpentier's story changes every time. Now he is against reform because it would change Canadian soccer into a marketing business. Last time, he was against reform because they sprung it on him at the meeting without any advance notice. The time before that, he was against reform but he wouldn't say why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kj52 Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 All I know is I've been trying to keep an open mind about this whole dispute, but it's making my brain hurt. It does seem to me, if you check Reform Alberta Soccer, that Mr. Charpentier's story changes every time. Now he is against reform because it would change Canadian soccer into a marketing business. Last time, he was against reform because they sprung it on him at the meeting without any advance notice. The time before that, he was against reform but he wouldn't say why. If Mario thinks that something will benefit Mario, he's for it. If he doesn't see anything in it for himself, he's against it. Pretty simple really, he just has a hard time figuring out if it's good for him or not. You may have noticed over all this that he's not the sharpest knife in the drawer (although pretty good at back-stabbing come to think). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 I would like to add one additional point that I believe the community player fees should not subsidize any elite club players as the elite club training requirements are higher. Then how do you feel about them supporting 9 national teams, dozens of provincial teams, 30 full-time salaries in Ottawa, more in the provinces (i.e. 40 in Ontario), etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
a_coach_in_ab Posted January 27, 2011 Share Posted January 27, 2011 Then how do you feel about them supporting 9 national teams, dozens of provincial teams, 30 full-time salaries in Ottawa, more in the provinces (i.e. 40 in Ontario), etc? lol +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.