Do We Need A Voyageurs Trust/Endowment?

[youllneverwalkalone]

There's a lot of disappointment right now, which will likely lead to a lot of negativity and "Sack the CSA" type posts. Much of the sack the CSA discussion I find is dominated by those involved in youth soccer who want to see really sweeping reforms across the organization. I don't really have a position in this regard other than I really just want the end result which is to see us qualify for the World Cup. I realize this is somewhat short-sighted, but the point is more that the issue of youth development is so contentious and politically fueled that I really don't see an obvious solution other than simplifying the issue: The Men's National Team requires more funding and this cannot come from children's fees.

There has to be another way other than having the kids pay for it. Of course we'd all love a benevolent Kerfoot type to come in and save the day. But to date this hasn't happened and I'm not holding my breath. I feel one reason for the lack of "corporate" support is that nobody has created a trustworthy vehicle whereby resources can flow into the team.

As noted in another thread, Canadian businessman Brett Wilson -of the CBC show The Dragon's Den- purchased a controlling share in Derby County Football Club. This prompted many Voyageurs to ask why not invest in Canadian Soccer? Of course this is not a new question, as we've been asking it of someone like Frank Stronach for many years.

Having watched Mr. Wilson and his fellow dragons quite closely on their venture capital show, I believe this is a good question that has not been posed properly.

Anyone who walks into the den and says give me $100,000 for my venture that has $nil sales is, I believe rightly so, laughed out the door. It's not that sales of $25k, or $50K, or $100k are overly impressive in-and-of-themselves, but rather it shows the entrepreneur to have some self-starting initiative which is going to be important for success.

When the Voyageurs post a thread saying Brett Wilson, contribute to Canadian Soccer, we are essentially asking for money without showing any type of vision, commitment, or willingness to participate in the process beyond buying our scarves and tickets.

And we see in our own lives that there's a huge difference between buying a few boxes of girl guide cookies and becoming treasurer of one of their branches (as a friend once was, hence the example). If we had the cookies, Brett would buy a lot. Hell, he gave $250k to the most unprofessional whacko street performer I've ever seen. She made the average Voyageur look polished. Frank would buy some too, and so would many other Canadians -rich and poor- who have an interest in Canadian Soccer.

As the girl guides have cornered the market on cookies, my suggestion is that the existing Voyageurs need to show some fund raising initiative. Not for the benefit of ourselves in terms of tickets/sections, flights/hotels, or merchandise, but toward the goal of funding the Men's National Team at an acceptable level, without dependence on children's registration fees.

Obviously, we cannot come up with an annual budget of $5-10m. I don't want anyone to think that this is what I'm proposing. I'm not a lunatic. I'm a very sane, rational Chartered Accountant. What I want to suggest rather is that we can use our passion for the game in this country to start something. To get that first $100k in sales (figuratively speaking) to impress the Dragons (figuratively speaking) to buy some cookies (figurative speaking).

Actually, $100k is my literal target. And here I need to be clear. $100k will buy jack squat. Especially in the context of an endowment or trust. Because the concept of the endowment or trust is the capital of the fund remains intact, while the interest is what is actually used to whatever particular end is set out in the Organization's mandate/charter.

I know we've had many debates about "organizing" the Vs. This isn't really another one of those. At least not in isolation. I'm not suggesting the board or any of our other activities undergo fundamental change. What I'm proposing is that we do a fund raiser amongst ourselves and those in our respective networks to donate to a fund whose mandate is to get the MNT to the World Cup.

Hypothetically speaking, let's say we could get 1,000 people to donate $100. First of all, although they would be surrendering this money forever, it would not be gone with one flush of the toilet. Rather, it would sit in endowment or trust where the annual proceeds could be used.

Granted, the assumed interest proceeds of $4,000 per year in isolation will not get us to the World Cup. But $4,000 is not useless either. For example, it could buy some advertising for the fund. As the real point here is not for the Voyageurs to lead the movement. The leaders would need to be people like Kerfoot who not only have some money, but have some vision of how the game should progress. The first $100k is just that opportunity to show potential contributors that this is a serious venture so that partners with real pockets could take it to the next level.

I think the Voyageurs Cup is the best analogy. We could never have arranged that tournament ourselves, but yet it was very much an outcome of our vision and the trophy was the symbol of that vision. If we could raise the first $100k, I really think this type of fund could catch on to the point where we could accomplish some of the things that we need to qualify: hiring a good manager, making home matches both numerous and profitable, and ultimately removing the influence of CSA grassroots politics over the MNT.

Without boring anyone with too many details of a trust structure, one interesting point is that a trust (unlike an endowment) can only exist for 21 years. However, unlike most endowments, the capital of the trust can be paid out to a beneficiary. If the Voyageurs could raise $100k, the first thing we could do is make a partnership with well known, well respected not-for-profit organization who is flexible enough in their own mandate to contribute to the settling of the trust in exchange for becoming the beneficiary at the end of the 21 years. So, for example, the Canadian Sports Hall of Fame contributes $100k to the settlement of the trust, and they receive $200k in 21 years. (Which is only about a 3.5% return for them, but the present value details can be negotiated.) If we pick the right partner at this stage, we could achieve a lot at the first hurdle in terms of resources and legitimacy.

On the other side, the whole point is to raise the capital in the fund to actually get to a level whereby some real tangible change could be funded. And we probably wouldn't want this to disappear in 21 years. While trusts can be also cumbersome in terms of donating new capital. So the endowment fund might be the way to go. I haven't really thought it through. The point is that both structures provide a way to donate money to a cause and to ensure that the capital portion of this money cannot just be wasted on one particular over zealous project.

There are many issues with this type of proposal. Most of which, I haven't addressed. Right now the interest level is probably quite low as people are depressed, and I may not be explaining myself clearly due to my own depressed state over the game right now. Still, I'm curious as to the general interest level of trying to put some [more] money where our mouths are?

[CanadasBest]

It's an interesting concept for sure. I have to say I don't know a lot about trusts or endowments. My concern would be to have such a venture the V's would need to be much better organized than our current ad hoc structure.

I wonder too if our efforts wouldn't be better placed if we were to push the CSA to find new advertising partners. Many countries have advertising partners paying head coach salaries. That should be the first step, and the money saved in the budget should be put towards other areas. I think we need to be more critical of the job that the CSA marketing and advertising people are doing.

[Guest speedmonk42]

We need a much more focused and clear vision.

Financially, we need two kinds of money.

1. The kind endowment/trust you are talking about. This will allow us to build very long term strategic partnerships with a variety of organizations.

2. Operating capital that can purchase 5000 tickets at a time and resell them back to our own people under our own conditions.

Now is just too soon, but I am thinking of calling for a meeting in January. A meeting in which we plan to plan, if that makes any sense.

We are it. We are the way forward, no more complaining about the CSA.

[youllneverwalkalone]

It would be nice to have a meeting of Vs to discuss the future. Hopefully the fall out from this campaign isn't that we can counts us all on two hands again. Although that will make the reservation easier.

[Trident]

If I knew and had control of where my money was going, I would help.

I have to say I wouldn't give money to the V's in a general way because recently we spent a lot of V's money on fabricated banners, while a fraction of that could have bought much more hand made flags.

I do not want my money to be wasted that way.

[Cheeta]

quote:Originally posted by speedmonk42

We need a much more focused and clear vision.

Financially, we need two kinds of money.

1. The kind endowment/trust you are talking about. This will allow us to build very long term strategic partnerships with a variety of organizations.

2. Operating capital that can purchase 5000 tickets at a time and resell them back to our own people under our own conditions.

Now is just too soon, but I am thinking of calling for a meeting in January. A meeting in which we plan to plan, if that makes any sense.

We are it. We are the way forward, no more complaining about the CSA.

That scheme has been in my mind for some time. And is something we as amateur part-timers could pull off. Many of the "official" supporter groups overseas are responsible for purchasing and reselling their own tickets (as well as complying with the conditions attached to such purchases AND enjoying some PROFIT benefit).

And it doesn't have to happen over night, the pyramids weren't built in a day either. Chisel away here and there and before you know it we've got walking, talking, money which will buy us a supporters section deserving of Canada football.

Only two problems I see. Funding for 5,000 is too many (I had a 1,000 in mind which even at todays rates is $20K) and when money on that scale are involved you need "securities". Clear checks, safeguards, and a decision making/control apparatus which those participating in the scheme can live within.

[Guest speedmonk42]

Yes, we need everything you mention. We have to become an official organization, and if people can't agree on that form a new one with a different name that just handles the back end stuff and people can keep doing what they do with the V's.

We have to assure people that the creation of an organization will not 'mechanize' things or exclude anyone.

We need a section that is completely our own for security purposes. End zone stands at the bank and Cheesebowl.

Lots of variables, depends on game ect..

Anyway, now is not the time. Lets wait, chill out for a while ect...

[youllneverwalkalone]

quote:Originally posted by Trident

If I knew and had control of where my money was going, I would help.

I have to say I wouldn't give money to the V's in a general way because recently we spent a lot of V's money on fabricated banners, while a fraction of that could have bought much more hand made flags.

I do not want my money to be wasted that way.

With a trust or endowment, if you gave $100, the maximum waste in a given year would be limited to the return on that money -say, $4.

But I'm not really proposing funding the supporters group any way. The idea is provide an economic gift for the benefit of the MNT. No matter what reforms succeed or fail at the CSA, funding will always be an issue. Right now there is so much bad blood, I can't imagine sponsorship revenue going up any time soon. Perhaps if there was a separate fund raising entity, the past failures and controversies wouldn't impact future sponsorship efforts as much?

Anyway, it is too soon. Nobody is happy about how the players performed and I don't want anybody to think this post is a response to DeRo's public complaints about lack of funding. I don't want the Vs to pick up the tab for any late nights on Saint Laurent.

I do want to suggest that we could help in a small way to provide a better future for the next generation of Canadian Internationals. Kids like Ethan Gage who came out after the USL title match last night and shook hands with all of the supporters on the pitch.

[The Ref]

I always supported us becoming a formal and registered organization. I am sorry to say this, but alike the CSA we talk a lot and never get it done. I had hopes the CSF in its own merits would accomplish something tangible, but that too seems to have fizzle away, at least, so far.

[BrennanFan]

We raised $4000 in 3 weeks this past summer.

Completely realistically, we can raise 10K over any given year, no doubt.

[Cheeta]

quote:Originally posted by BrennanFan

We raised $4000 in 3 weeks this past summer.

Completely realistically, we can raise 10K over any given year, no doubt.

Non WC years may make for leaner fund-raising. That being said however, there are other revenue avenues which we haven't opened yet. This really would be uncharted territory.

But like speedmonk42 wrote, not just yet. But very soon.

Of course that doesn't mean I haven't already starting taking down names...

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone

There are many issues with this type of proposal. Most of which, I haven't addressed. Right now the interest level is probably quite low as people are depressed, and I may not be explaining myself clearly due to my own depressed state over the game right now. Still, I'm curious as to the general interest level of trying to put some [more] money where our mouths are?

I am interested and think that there is some merit to this concept. I have a general idea of the objectives but, obviously more details are needed in the area of aims.

Moreso given: I have a funny feeling that with all the **** that's going to be hitting the fan regarding the CSA in the next while or so, what could end up after all the dust settles is some major changes that will kill the Men's teams even more than now. You just need to look at those Sack the CSA discussions that you are alluding to.

[Blue and White Army]

Yes.