Women's Team in Turmoil?

[terpfan68]

To Richard -- I am not pro Richard or anti Richard. When I disagree I say so and I am as guilty as anyone of having biases. I try to contribute when I have actual Knowledge or am asking questions. I would just like to know the background of some of the other posters to this forum.

To Ed -- If you click on my name (terpfan68) it will give you my real name and location. I am the only resident of Winnipeg with that name so you could actually phone me up and we could talk. (Would you be blocking your caller ID?) I have never hid my identity like some people who like to post.

[Guest Ed]

quote:Originally posted by terpfan68

To Richard -- I am not pro Richard or anti Richard. When I disagree I say so and I am as guilty as anyone of having biases. I try to contribute when I have actual Knowledge or am asking questions. I would just like to know the background of some of the other posters to this forum.

To Ed -- If you click on my name (terpfan68) it will give you my real name and location. I am the only resident of Winnipeg with that name so you could actually phone me up and we could talk. (Would you be blocking your caller ID?) I have never hid my identity like some people who like to post.

I don't post my full name on this forum because I have had some nasty f*kers disturbing my domestic tranquility in the past. Let me just say that showing ID is not a prerequisite for joining in on the debate.

[The Ref]

quote:Originally posted by terpfan68

Although not a supporter of Richard, I find it interesting that he at least posts his name unlike The Ref and fan who do not share with the rest of the forum who they are and allow us to know what their personal biases might be. A basic premise of the British justice system is that a person has a right to face their accuser. Newspapers will not print unsigned letters to the editor for this very reason. It is very easy to hide on the internet.

I have seen your name and I have not had the pleasure to meet you. I assume you don't know me eiher. So I can't see how knowing my name it will allow you to know what my personal biases might be. I believe that through recent postings my bias is clear. I support the 3 players in question.

[Richard]

With a real name and a city it's not hard to find somebody if you really want to make more personal contact. When people hide their identity behind a screen name that is almost impossible, that's the point. Who is 'The Ref, Western Canada' for example? But you can relatively easily track down 'Richard Howes, Vancouver' with a little effort if you think emailing through the board will not do it for you.

[terpfan68]

Some people seem a bit too touchy about this privacy issue. More important than a name it would be nice to know the background of the posters. For example, if you are related to the women involved in the controversy or (less likely) Evan Pelerud then I can see why you don't want people to know that fact. If CSA has made decisions involving you or your friends or relatives they your postings would be suspect. If you are a 9 year olds it would be nice to know that too. Everyone is intitled to their opinion but all opinions are not equivalent in value.

So in the spirit of full disclosure here is where I am coming from.

I am a

61 year old male math teacher who has coached soccer for 18 years (off and on) I have a level III coaching certificate (this might be the old system) and have been a referee in my earlier days. I have 5 adult children 3 females and 2 males. Four of them (3 females and one male) play on a Men's indoor team and two of the females play premier women's soccer in Winnipeg. The two females were on the Manitoba Women's Championship team for the last two years. These two also play with the Canadian Military Women's team and have competed in World Tournaments in the US and the Netherlands. Next year they hope to play at the Military World Games (many sports) in India. It was their presence on this team and CSA's lack of recognitiation of the tournament that caused me to post on this forum in the first place. (Richard and I had our little go around.) Because of the success of my two daughters I am somewhat more interested in the Canadian women's program but I do try to keep an open mind as to issues related to women's soccer and soccer in general. My favourite Soccer team is West Ham United. I am not interested in making anymore friends as I have enough trouble keeping the ones I have. I do like a spirited debate as long as it doesn't descend to name calling (which it has lately). So that's where I'm coming from. I would encourage The Ref. fan and Ed to tell us something about themselves so that their comments can be judged accordingly.

[Guest Ed]

My name is Ed. I have been sober for xxxxx. OOoops, wrong forum.

I have been posting here from day 1 and was involved with the Voyageurs supporting our players abroad for about 8 or 9 years now I guess. I am originally from Ottawa, played against a very young Lyndon Hooper, but have no connection to his well-known sister. I have written about the ladies on occasion and consider all 3 of the 'rebels' to be role models for young Cdn girls. I cannot say the same for Even Pellerud. In anything involving the CSA, provincial or municipal associations, I will take the side of a disgruntled player 99 times out of a 100, having seen first hand the absurd lengths many of the clowns in these associations go to protect their little positions of power.

BTW, when you have wingnuts phoning your home, your boss and threatening you and your livelihood, the privacy issue can't get 'too touchy'.

[The Ref]

Ok fair is fair. I am a male retired at 65 and wondering how I made it this far. Unrelated profession to soccer. Been involved with soccer since my teen years when I played a bit myself. Currently I do some refereeing Class 3 and coached for decades. Have a C license from old system. I am not related to any of the national players or coaching staff, although I have met some of them but just on passing. I have two sons who in their better years did represent B.C. at one time. I love soccer and have volunteered for many administrative positions in soccer associations over the years. I like to express my opinion when I see injustices. During my coaching years I always tried to treat every player, good or bad, with respect and tried to accommodate their needs over mine.

[john tv]

This is great to read and realize how lucky we are to have these very experienced and guys with great knowledge and great honesty on this board.You just about put me to shame. Thanks guys,keep up your fantastic work,it's marvelous!

Your opinion is also greatly appreciated and in context of your background very valuable.

[terpfan68]

Thanks guys. Now we just have to hear from fan.

[Richard]

Anybody who wants to know a bit more about me should simply visit...

http://www.bcsoccerweb.com/about.htm

To supplement what is there, my two sons and daughter all played soccer but are now adult. For various reasons all have retired from playing the game although I don't seem to be able to let go :-). The two boys both represented Ontario in all-star teams during their teenage years when we lived in Ottawa. My youngest son also represented BC a few times after we moved here and enjoys having been a member of national championship winning all-star teams for both provinces. He was a carded member of the Canadian U-20 and Olympic player pool for several years and played a few times for Canada. He was a scholar athlete at Simon Fraser University having chosen not to accept any of the several scholarship offers he was bombarded with from US universities. He was a four year starter with the SFU team, playing in every game in his four years there while completing a double degree and is now a Chartered Accountant. I was always involved with all the programs in which my children participated, in one support or administrative capacity or another but I have never coached, neither do I aspire to :-)

[fan]

Its already a "no win" situation situation for us and the team.Pellerud ,Kerfoot and the CSA blew it.

This just isnt how you handle this type of scenario.And you dont treat people like Charmaine who should of ended up being a corner stone and wonderful rep for womens soccer in Canada in the future like that.

This is unfortunately just one of the issues I am just disgusted by.

When will this type of foolishness end?

We spend our time in here discussing this crappy behavior and end up doing nothing except alienating each other.

I dont mind debate and I enjoy humorous banter in here and other boards but the amount of crap we have had to deal with from the CSA on down is unacceptable and nauseating.

No wonder we dont have a positive attitude and a even halfway Canadian united soccer community when its fostered and looked after by such a derisive, negative, incompetent group who have been running the CSA for the last twenty years.

Success are you kidding were lucky we have survival.

I have dealt with too many people at the CSA and other provincial levels who are just too obviously selfish and overly egotistical to be thinking about anyone else or anything else except personal gain.They dont think in terms of "we" or "us". They converse that way but they dont think that way. They have possesive attitudes and limited or no foresight because they think that way.

They have demonstrated nothing that justifies the considerable effort it would take to communicate with them.

I see this attitude repeatedly in non profit, charity, and amateur sports leagues.

Yes I have been in several of these organizations and know all to well the pettiness and anger you must endure from the membership but I understood my position as one of a shepherd and guardian. In most cases I was voted in and I excepted I would have to make decisions on behalf of the membership.When I made my decisions it was after considering or gathering opinion from the membership. I considered the membership as a wealth of knowledge that was my largest resource.

If I utilized the members who demonstrated skills in areas I needed the organization would prosper wonderfully.

I dont witness this attitude at all with the CSA and its provincial associations and their behaviour have left me disgusted and emabarassed for Canadian soccer.

[john tv]

Does make me wonder who the oldest Voyageur is.I am not 70 yet but awfully close and awfull to think about.

[Richard]

My my, why don't you run for office in your provincial association and use that as a platform for office with the CSA - that's the way it works. The president and board of directors of most provincial associations and the CSA are all entirely volunteer positions. That way you could consult the membership, utilise the members who demonstrate skills in areas you need and the CSA will prosper, and presumably along with it, Canadian soccer. Be pro-active and constructive. You could even chose whomever you wish as executive director. Maybe you would be an excellent prospect to replace Kevan Pipe, then you could make a difference AND get paid to do it. You could of course otherwise just continue badmouthing the CSA, the provincial organisations and all the people associated with them as well as other people on the board here who strive to take a more positive, constructive approach while still acknowledging shortcomings.

[The Ref]

quote:Originally posted by john tv

Does make me wonder who the oldest Voyageur is.I am not 70 yet but awfully close and awfull to think about.

John TV I think you deserve a lifetime membership in the Voyageurs and your name should appear with red font instead of blue to denote your honorable status.

[The Ref]

To fan.

You are correct on what you say about board members in sport organizations. I have witnessed that as well. Members reaching Boards usually come in with the best of intentions but once there, they start acting in isolation and looking at their own agendas. Not everyone of course, but the power of the majority in many cases ends up drowning the best intentions. After a while the fact that they are there to serve the membership and reflect their mandate, just gets too far removed and decisions no longer respond to the aim of the whole. We, the board members, become convinced we know best.

[terpfan68]

To fan and The Ref

While I have no first hand knowlege of the workings of CSA I am familiar with some of the things that have been pulled by Manitoba Soccer Association and although I haven't been current with their undertakings I know that they have acted in a heavy-handed and self-serving manner in the past. I don't even want to talk about district problems and stories I have heard about slashed tires and lawsuits etc. So if the problem with CSA is sytemic then it needs to be addressed. I just don't know who it is that could do an impartial investigation. Perhaps we need a Royal Commission but I don't think it is too high on the things to do list of the Harper government.

[john tv]

It is so funny that we are one way or another looking after a competitive world.This stuff on the fields does not stop in these boeardrooms.I have been on many committes and generally speaking it is all about likes or dislikes as well as that competive thing and of course knowledge and commitment. I always tried to stay away from that stuff,but I must confess i had my portion of disenters.I always took the attituse that soccer is much bigger than my ego and that helped me a lot.I do know that the commitment of eveyone is second to none and if we ever had to pay salaries for all that work etc we woulf be very bankrupt. Hey all these guys and girls come for free and helping the powers to be in their efforts. It is really mindboggling.I think that the OSA and CSA boards and other provincial Associations or even administrations are to far removed from the real inner workings of the districts etc. It is to big to know or to handle.King size stuff and from what I have seen in some very good hands.I trully believe that it is all moving in the right direction and I just hope that these volunteers don't get burned out to fast and even in this very deamnding society were it is a problem to do your soccer thing while working for some one else.I have met some outstanding individuals who have greatly contributed to soccer at no cost at all.This I saw very much in the Robbie tournament.Anyway here is to all these amazing and so devoted guys and women and hopefully the powers to be in the various provincial organizations will continue to recognize how much they are contributing at zilch cost it is truly amazing and so much devotion and knowledge, I also became to realize that the guys in Scarborough were very exceptional and it shows big time in results.

Back to the girls or those wondefull women. Well it seesm that the jury will decide. the question is how many women will be on this thing. Only kidding. It seems that emotions became the driving force and some cool heads will have to prevail.

[fan]

I like your attitude Johntv and you are an excellent motivational agent and media liason who demonstrates clearly your opinion and passion for the game.

Your post Richard is an exact repensentation of the selfish rhetoric and lack of foresight I mentioned.

Linford has all the signs of being a proper guardian however untill I see his actions play out I will reserve judgement on his integrity.Unfortunately too many organizations and leaders have become experts at usurpia to be granted trust or commitment easily.

Most of the Canadian soccer community is watching very carefully now and I hope the next decisions and events lead to a bonding and prosperous collaboration with the CSA.

[john tv]

Between the Ref and the Fan,i am blushing on my old age. Thanks guys,yes i like that game and yes I believe in this game, that has given me so many wonderfull moments in my lenghty life. I must admit that it sure has not aged me at all. For some crazy reason I still look in my late forties.I guess playing soccer..... never mind,it's a fluke but maybe all that organizational stuff in this sport sure has kept my heart racing like hell and great positive emotion,I don't know, I may look 70 next year,maybe you guys will make sure of that after all.

Again thanks for the compliments and just keep promoting that game,it makes you stay looking young I am the living proof.(sofar)

[Richard]

quote:Originally posted by fan

I like your attitude Johntv and you are an excellent motivational agent and media liason who demonstrates clearly your opinion and passion for the game.

Your post Richard is an exact repensentation of the selfish rhetoric and lack of foresight I mentioned.

Linford has all the signs of being a proper guardian however untill I see his actions play out I will reserve judgement on his integrity.Unfortunately too many organizations and leaders have become experts at usurpia to be granted trust or commitment easily.

Most of the Canadian soccer community is watching very carefully now and I hope the next decisions and events lead to a bonding and prosperous collaboration with the CSA.

Interesting that you should consider a suggestion that you, after some of the most scathing criticism of the CSA expressed in this already highly critical forum, should run for one of the volunteer positions where you would be able to exert some influence in the organisation you should condemn as an exact representation of selfish rhetoric and lack of foresight. Your posts and their twisted logic speak more about your own inadequacies than they do anything about how other people run the CSA. The fact that you are so acerbic in your comments about me personally also suggests an element of jealousy.

[fan]

Thats a funny analogy johntv but you may have something there, soccer the new anti aging treatment.

Its probably just the fine mix of Dutch blood and Irish orange. Anyway keep it up what ever your doing, its so refreshing to see foresight and positive direction. Hopefully Linford and the CSA will follow us into the light.

[john tv]

It's again funny in my drive to promote soccer i even considered trying to determine the average age of a soccer player when he kicks the bucket. I do know that looking at the old teams going back to the 1900 these guys lived to be all in their seventies.I do know that the football players kick that thing at about 57. This was revealed once on the Phil Donahue show.Yes I do drink about 2 or max 3 Spanish red wins only,started that some 25 ears ago. Don't smoke,but have tons of pressures,never mind that soccer stuff. I can assure you that this soccer can be both amazing positive as well as very annoying and hurtfull and you know that as well as I do.

As I told you guys the story on soccer has not really been told yet.

I must say that I am so delighted with the emergence of TFC.The media sofar has been fantastic I guess the cloud works very much. The ticket sales at around 5000 and talking to my British etc soccer guys,they are coming back,meaning they went to see the Blizzard,but no Lynx. This is different and if Mo keeps on popping his face all over the place and keeps that community thing going,well that is fantastic. I am looking forward to that try out next week end.

Anyway back to the subject,ok guys how doe we get a mutual consensus and avoid that personal stuff,unless that's what is wanted.Do keep up that exchange information stuff and keep thinking it is all about our kids,nothing less and certainly nothing more.

[fan]

Long live king billy of orange johntv.

William II of Orange ruler of the United Netherlands, is the refernce I think to why they wear orange.

[WhitecapsFCFan]

quote:Originally posted by fan

Its already a "no win" situation situation for us and the team.Pellerud ,Kerfoot and the CSA blew it.

Perhaps you could explain how Kerfoot "blew it"?

[john tv]

Hey Fan Yes i have heard about that guy. It seems we exported him to England and the s... hit the fan I believe.Don't you remember it hitting you. Nerver mind I have always been curious how it was possible to export a king even more so in these days and the lack of communication etc.I don't believe it was a wise move after all.

I do hope that we can get these girls together and get it all straighten out without to many scars or bruised egos.I do see a problem since it appears that the team took a stand in favour of Pelerud,which makes any agreement very dicy.Team spirit and clicks etc.