Joe05 Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 So after such a successful tournament, who makes the big squad if not now, but in the future? I think Hume should be in the World Cup squad effective immediately. A couple of years down the road I think Asante and Arango are good prospects (judging by today's game - apart from the last goal), as well as Matondo and Hutchinson. Josh Simpson came from off my personal radar screen...does he have what it takes to make the step up? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettermirror Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 all of those boys will be included - simpson needs to find a pro club and matondo needs to leave the a-league - it's obvious he's already beyond montreal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe05 Posted December 12, 2003 Author Share Posted December 12, 2003 The spain players were really giving Matondo a lot of respect when he was running at them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 quote:Originally posted by bettermirror all of those boys will be included - simpson needs to find a pro club and matondo needs to leave the a-league - it's obvious he's already beyond montreal. I think Matondo needs another season in the A-League from what we've seen all year in Montreal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Joe05 So after such a successful tournament, who makes the big squad if not now, but in the future? I think Hume should be in the World Cup squad effective immediately. A couple of years down the road I think Asante and Arango are good prospects (judging by today's game - apart from the last goal), as well as Matondo and Hutchinson. Josh Simpson came from off my personal radar screen...does he have what it takes to make the step up? What is wrong with Simpson in your view? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe05 Posted December 12, 2003 Author Share Posted December 12, 2003 Nothing.I've only seen him play the 1 game against Spain. I'm just looking for opinions from peope who have seen him play in other matches. He did seem to get tired near the end of the match, but if he joins a pro club his fitness will improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Hume & Atiba have already played with the nats, and for the moment I don't expect any others on this team to make the jump to the senior team immediately - but we'll see what happens with any club signings by the time the qualifiers start. Down the road its difficult to say, as its so far away, and there are a lot of U23 players who haven't yet had room made for them on the senior team who are probably next in line. For the Olympic team, Hume, Hutchinson, Matondo & Karim could all be with the team in February. Perhaps Marshall, Harmse or Arango as well. Not so sure about Simpson, as we already have Canizalez & Placentino who can patrol the left side of midfield. The other U20 strikers are all possiblities as well, but not likely as starters but perhaps coming off the bench. Difficult to say since we didn't see Godfrey or Belotte play in this match or in any of the highlights Sportsnet has shown. Outside of Hutchinson, that's probably about it for midfield, as Euro-based players like Dunfield & Masciantonio likely wouldn't even start if De Guzman, Nsaliwa, and Klukowski are there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bob Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Hume should be there now, if only as a substitute behind our more established veterans. Karim should also be there with the big boys behind Hirschfeld, to gain experience with the established veterans. He should definately see some action in friendlies where possible, he's got all the physical attributes needed to be a superb keeper. Once he develops his skills a bit, he could be our next Craig Forrest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayWay Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 Karim has NOT earned a sport in front of Kenny Snuffalufagus or Pat Onstad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettermirror Posted December 12, 2003 Share Posted December 12, 2003 i agree with that karim assessment. he may become our number 1 within the next three years. but right now, he's certainly not #2. probably 5 or 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 Hume is WC team material for sure Hutchinson would also be a good addition to our senior squad Matondo, Assante, Simpson and Di Tullio are potential candidate in the long run. But they all play in the wrong league. They need to find clubs in Europe if they want to improve. As for Karim, I was impress by his play today and Helm suggested at the beggining of the game that Karim was the main reason why Canada was in the 1/4. I don't think that he's ready to be our #1 but I think he has a bright future ahead. I think that he should be considered at least as an MLS prospect with his play at this tournament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaku_bert Posted December 13, 2003 Share Posted December 13, 2003 "kenny snufalufagus" BWAhahahaha you know, i've never seen him play. Is he as good as thunder dan. Hey, now all you haters, don't post anything rash! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 I personally would not want to rely on any of these players right now for the senior nats. Sorry. But I said rely. Obviously Hume could do some nice things for us, probably on the right side attacking where he usually is at Tranmere. He is still not as intelligent on the field as Pesch, though his shooting is damn impressive. Probably I am not in agreement with most in saying that Atiba does not strictly speaking impress me. He just does not. I recognize that he is capable, does well, has grown in his game. But I cannot see how he could add to our play right now on the senior side. Simpson is quite mature for an NCAA player, and has fine physical conditions. And a good mentality. But let's face it, you can't expect to just push it by your guy and outrun him on a pro level, the defender will start to give you space and you have to start thinking more; and you have to have more skills if you are going to be a winger. He can still grow in this regard, his passing was actually quite decent. Nice prospect. Arango. I hope we can fit him into our Olympic team so we can help him develop. Has fine potential in a spot where we need some future prospects. Karim. Well he's a mystery, I have been such a Thunder supporter and have felt that Karim had to be our no. 3 or 4 at this level, but the kid has performed well in a tough tournament vs. some of the best teams in the world. 6 GA in 5 games, two shutouts, two penalties stopped. Don't think he made errors on any of the goals. Not sure what his future will be (in NCAA or making the leap to pro) but since he needs to play maybe he could combine (can kids in NCAA combine with semi-pro squads? I am wondering after the probs with those kids with college scholarships also playing for Hamilton think it was). Still have a sense that Srdjan in Serbia is going to go further than Karim and we'll end up looking at him for our national program again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew W Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Good post. I think the only leagues in which an NCAA player can play and not jeopardize his eligibility is in the USL's Premier Development League or a strictly "amateur" league such as the PCSL where Josh Simpson (Vic Utd.)and some other NCAA players have played. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Andrew W Good post. I think the only leagues in which an NCAA player can play and not jeopardize his eligibility is in the USL's Premier Development League or a strictly "amateur" league such as the PCSL where Josh Simpson (Vic Utd.)and some other NCAA players have played. You're right, the only league where NCAA players can play is the PDL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matthew Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 I agree with Jeffrey. I think Atiba and Hume will one day be part of our national starting XI and I think Arango definitely has the potential. After that I'm not sure. I liked what I saw of Simpson, but he's got a lot of work to do. Karim is the same. I still don't rate Taty too highly. His speed can make him dangerous, but try as he might, Ben Johnson was a crap footballer. I hope Taty can round out his game, but I can't see how he's beyond Montreal. He was only good enough to get five starts for Montreal this past year. I'm not saying he shouldn't grab onto a Euro offer, but I think the A-League still has a lot of benefit for these guys (though I feel for Arango being stuck behind Gervais and Pizzolitto). Anyway I don't want to rip on any of the guys, I think there's potential there for sure and they played so hard and so well Friday, but realistically we only have a couple guys you *know* will be part of the national team setup one day, the rest are all wildcards or longshots. I hope for the best for all of them though. The funny thing is that I think a lot of the bench guys have more potential. Maybe I'll be proven wrong, but I think Ledgerwood has more potential than either of our strating outside backs Friday. I think Harmse might turn out to be the best midfielder on the team. Then there's young David Edgar. We'll see, but I don't think this was the most supremely talented U20 team we've ever had, but they had a lot of spirit and played incredibly well together. There's no doubt they were the best youth team we've ever had. Anyway I hope we start to hear some good news for all of the guys soon and hopefully that can help out in Olympic qualifying. cheers, matthew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Keeper Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 This whole squad bodes well for our future, even the lads who where on the bench. I think that Ian Hume, should be called upon regularily, he would complement Radz and DeRosario/Pesch very well upfront. He can not only score goals well,and is a decent free kicker, he can provide excellent service to other-on running attacters. Hutchison and Simpson, Matondo and Arango will be of ones to watch. Lemire possibly as well. Alim Karim is a very impressive shot stopper. I agree, he should get a full squad try out. Nicholas Ledgerwodd, may not have been emergent, how ever he could be very good down the wings in the future. Hopefully many of these boys will boost our u-23's also. Go Canada Go Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 I wouldn't be surprised to see Arango play somewhere else than Montréal in 2004. He played 10 (!!!!!) minutes in 2 games last year. He is around 6th-7th on the depth chart (Pizzolito, Gervais, François, Fronimadis, Di Tullio, Barker). Maybe he'll be the "future considerations" for Ali, which would put him back in his hometown of TO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Oranje Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 I find some of these comments a little strange, yet, very Canadian. It appears we can't see ourselves as being good or having potential. Look at the facts. First, this team scored 4 times, played against two teams in the semi-finals, beat a European side and an African side. This wasn't a team that got lucky in one game. Second, we are talking about 18-20 year olds here.. The fact is both Hutchinson and Hume have already played with the MNT. Finally, I have to say I would put my money on the U-20 Brazil side against our own MNT to win 7 times out of 10. My point really is that we seem to be discounting the magnitude of this acheivement. There are some very good players in this Canadian side and I think there may be some surprises as to who is in Europe in the near future. quote:Originally posted by matthew I agree with Jeffrey. I think Atiba and Hume will one day be part of our national starting XI and I think Arango definitely has the potential. After that I'm not sure. I liked what I saw of Simpson, but he's got a lot of work to do. Karim is the same. I still don't rate Taty too highly. His speed can make him dangerous, but try as he might, Ben Johnson was a crap footballer. I hope Taty can round out his game, but I can't see how he's beyond Montreal. He was only good enough to get five starts for Montreal this past year. I'm not saying he shouldn't grab onto a Euro offer, but I think the A-League still has a lot of benefit for these guys (though I feel for Arango being stuck behind Gervais and Pizzolitto). Anyway I don't want to rip on any of the guys, I think there's potential there for sure and they played so hard and so well Friday, but realistically we only have a couple guys you *know* will be part of the national team setup one day, the rest are all wildcards or longshots. I hope for the best for all of them though. The funny thing is that I think a lot of the bench guys have more potential. Maybe I'll be proven wrong, but I think Ledgerwood has more potential than either of our strating outside backs Friday. I think Harmse might turn out to be the best midfielder on the team. Then there's young David Edgar. We'll see, but I don't think this was the most supremely talented U20 team we've ever had, but they had a lot of spirit and played incredibly well together. There's no doubt they were the best youth team we've ever had. Anyway I hope we start to hear some good news for all of the guys soon and hopefully that can help out in Olympic qualifying. cheers, matthew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Canuck Oranje I find some of these comments a little strange, yet, very Canadian. It appears we can't see ourselves as being good or having potential. Look at the facts. First, this team scored 4 times, played against two teams in the semi-finals, beat a European side and an African side. This wasn't a team that got lucky in one game. Second, we are talking about 18-20 year olds here.. The fact is both Hutchinson and Hume have already played with the MNT. Finally, I have to say I would put my money on the U-20 Brazil side against our own MNT to win 7 times out of 10. My point really is that we seem to be discounting the magnitude of this acheivement. There are some very good players in this Canadian side and I think there may be some surprises as to who is in Europe in the near future. Echo that, amongst other things. First time I've seen Karim. Two things. 1st; Shave. 2nd; Holy crap, nice outing, man. With some experience in a professional atmosphere and a little training up, Lars will be looking over his shoulder at the big man in no time. Hume and Hutchison almost everbody agree on, blah, blah, blah. Di Tullio, may have a role with the big boys in the very near future too. But I can't find a body out there which would make the starting 11, excepting a rash of untimely injuries. Quit certain we're going to see some of those faces on the senior's bench. There'll be a lot of games to come in 2005 for WCQ. And what a difference a year or two can make for players this age. With the display at this tourny, we've all got resonable hopes for a lot of the fellows who were out there to improve to the next level at the least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Well, if any national team has to "rely" on 2 20 year olds to succeed they are probably in trouble, but the fact is both Hume & Hutchinson can help our national team right away, even if they aren't first-choice starters for a while. I do think that Hume is capable of scoring against Concacaf opposition in the upcoming World Cup Qualifiers, even if he wouldn't start ahead of the top 3 strikers on the nats at the moment (Radz, De Ro, Pesch). Re: Matondo the 18 year old, while I think its a while still before he would become a national team regular, John Helm described him as the type of player who "terrifies defenders". How many Canadian soccer players have you heard described as such by un-biased reputable sources? The guy blew past Spanish defenders with ease on 3 separate occasions, taking the ball with him. He needs to improve his shooting, for sure, but the guy is still young. Hopefully he will catch on in somewhere like Belgium where they can hone his skills. I don't think in the A-league, where the fields are much smaller & there is less room to move, that Matondo's prime skills (running into space & running past players with the ball) suits his needs at all. Get out Matondo, get out as fast as you can! Helm said Hutchinson was "outstanding" against Burkina Faso and I'll take his word for it. He can be a very good defender & frankly with our troubles at the back & our depth in midfield we don't have anything to lose by trying out Atiba back there with the senior team. I think its as dangerous to write off any of the other players as it would have been to have written off Imhof (say that 10 times ) because he wasn't on the U23 team in 2000 (but then became a regular starter for the nats later that same year). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca Well, if any national team has to "rely" on 2 20 year olds to succeed they are probably in trouble... I think its as dangerous to write off any of the other players as it would have been to have written off Imhof (say that 10 times ) because he wasn't on the U23 team in 2000 (but then became a regular starter for the nats later that same year). Well I guess Spain is in trouble, as the senior nats rely on two players who could have been in UAE but were exempted, Reyes and Fernando Torres. In contrast, I think that of all the Spain players we may only see Iniesta as a future national team player, I did not see any others even close yet, not for a good three years. BTW, think England has had u-20 year olds around in striking slots for a while now too, Owen a few years back and now Rooney. It is okay to rely on the odd kid now and then. I don't think I am writing off anyone from this group, but if you look at Radz, De Ro, and Pesch, then add Hume, our "star" we have a similar profile of player in all four. Relatively short, not classic strikers but mobile and occasionally effective (Radz is missing a lot in league play this year, the Ireland game was his current form personified). None will hit a lot of headers in, none can hold up with a defender on his back, none are the kind that turn a defender in the box and get a shot away. All need a bit of space to be effective. Which is why Hume does not really add a lot to the pot. And no, I am not calling for the return of Kusch , gotta love him though. The other spot we are really in doubt right now with the seniors is in centre back. With de Vos back in I feel more comfortable, but it would be nice to have some cover. I don't know if Reda could help (we need to take a look), but none of these kids at UAE are ready in that role yet for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Well it depends on how you see the term "rely", a very flexible term. By "relying" it sounded to me more in the spirit of basing one's team around the player or relying on its success on the constant use of these players. Bergomi was used as an 18 year old in the World Cup final in 1982, and was certainly relied upon to mark his man well, but not to lead the team to victory. In that sense, if you're saying we can't "rely" on Hume to come off the bench & get a goal against Concacaf opposition then I respectuflly disagree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Jeffrey S. Which is why Hume does not really add a lot to the pot. And no, I am not calling for the return of Kusch , gotta love him though. Hume has something that neither Pesch nor De Ro has, and you can probably include Radzinski as well: its an intangible that seperates the very good - Radzinski - from the great. The ability to score goals. He has scored some crackers in the UAE and, of the six goals he scored for Tranmere last year, five made the list of the six top goals of the year for the club. He has a tremendous amount to learn, but the players who can make something of very little are special and I think Hume will be a special player when all is said and done. If he can learn to play the game as smart as Radzinski, he will be prolific in his scoring. I say his education should be starting now, as a regualr sub and an automatic choice for the senior team. Pesch and DeRo are probably better partners for Radzinski at this stage, but I would not hesitate to start Hume whenever Radzinski is away. You have opportunity to see a tremndous amount of high quality football, Jeffrey, and it is obvious that you take advantage of it, so I am somewhat surprised on your thoughts re: Hutchinson. I am taking your comments to heart, and tempering somewhat my enthusiasm for Atiba. I do think he has very good instincts for the game. Clearly he is still young, with much to learn, but he almost always takes the best option available to him which is something that the vast majority of player his age do not do. He stood out on a poor team in a decent second tier European league, scored some goals and played very well in the U-20 tournament. Even on the golden goal, he made a smart play shoulder charging the eventual scorer after the ball was past him, hard enough to throw him off stride, but not so hard as to draw a penalty. He gave Asante the chance to clear. Very good football there I think. Observer said that he did not give the ball away against Australia, and he did very well in this regard against Spain as well. One muffed clearance that could have been trouble was really the only flaw in his game. I see him as a fixture for Canada, with more upside as a defensive mid than anyone we currently have. Indeed, I use the term defensive mid loosely, because he clearly does have some offensive prowess as well. Time will tell, and your lack of enthusiasm does carry some weight with me, Jeffrey. I hope to be able to mock you for this in the years to come Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted December 14, 2003 Share Posted December 14, 2003 Oh, I think Radz. can turn a defender or two. Seem to recall more than one raking goal from the man cutting back into the middle, distressed defender in tow. But no, definately not a holding target man. Fair enough pointing out Pesch., Radz., and Hume are more comfortable in the more open spaces towards the touch line. And sure, Radz. and Hume have the advantage of some throttle, especially Radz., but I'll happily settle for greyhounds who can finish, rather than greyhounds who can cross if I had to choose. P.S. Everton is a shambles. Everyone in the EPL knows it, though they're starting to maybe pull together somewhat of late. We'll see. Maybe Radz. can spare some energy for finishing rather than running his guts out chasing crap balls or trying to get space off the defenders who're targeting him like he was bin Laden if he gets a little more help. P.S.S. Just saw Gordon's post. What he said. Works nicely for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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