Debutants under herdman

[Bigandy]

I have been thinking about the Farsi debacle and I like to think it was herdmans honest feedback about his likelihood to play that got him off the list. I would love to make a list of herdman debutants and how hes treated them. Its also cool to see how the programs evolved.  

Bold are duals
Debuts
2018-david, millar, cornelius, spoony, ZBG, busti, tabla, godhino
2019- staq, miller, fraser, laryea
2020 - okello, didic, nelson , shome, bair, shaffelburg, Brym, borges, bassong
2021- Ugbo, corbeanu, johnston, buchanan, sturing, ferreira, kennedy akinola ,pasher, st clair 
2022 - Kone, mcnaughton, waterman
2023- heibert, 

Call ups without debuts
zator, loturi, mcgill, Koleosho

Most of the duals are either not good enough for canada (let alone the other nation) or are consistently called up and being given a role you would expect. Ugbo could make the argument he deserves more of a chance. Corbeanu could also make a case that he should make the squad more often. However, im sure neither are so naïve to think they automatically walk into our squad. 

Key takeaways:
-Herdman has brought in a lot of new players
-Herdman treats duals very fair.
-We add a new piece to the squad almost yearly.  
-15 of our WC squad were given debuts by herdman
-David to the USA is the only dual that would see both the player and national team improve their status...debatably (Staq wouldnt be a starter for portugal, romania is not a step up for corbeanu etc.) 

[Obinna]

Good post and interesting topic, but....

I still think Farsi is mostly/entirely a case of not wanting to come because Algeria is on the horizon for him, not because Herdman was telling him that he wouldn't have many minutes.

Could it be a combination of both? Yeah sure, but if this guy wanted to play for Canada he'd be happy to come in and prove himself to Herdman. I think he just doesn't want to get locked down yet (best case). Playing in NL locks him down. 

Interestingly, Koleosho is named and we can only presume nothing has changed in that he isn't willing to be locked down - yet Herdman still named him. This makes me think it was Farsi giving a hard no, or maybe he doesn't have the luxury to come in and train like Luca does?

As you can see, I still have so many questions...

[BrennanFan]

If I'm Farsi and I look at that right side and I see Johnston, Laryea and Buchanan ahead of me... yeah I'd think twice about my international career with Canada.  Farsi will be in much the same position as a guy like Raheem Edwards.  Talented enough but just can't bump anyone off the team.

 

 

[Gian-Luca]

I think Cristian Gutierrez has been called up twice but never played either time (and is still uncapped). I seem to recall him joining in the goal celebrations in Hamilton against the US.

[Obinna]

Posted this about Farsi in the dual national thread:

So it's been said that Buchanan, Johnston, and Laryea are all ahead of him (at least), thus he's could be looking at Canada and thinking perhaps he should go elsewhere for his international football.

Well, I am no Algeria expert, but I went to check out there roster to see what kind of players he may be up against:

Mehdi Leris is a 24/25 year old winger fullback playing for Sampdoria in Serie A. His TM value is 2.5 M

Den Kirkhof plays in Ligue 2 for Bastia. He's a 27 y/o right back. TM value is 1.5 M

Ait-Nouri plays with Wolves. He's a left wing/mid, so maybe not comparable? TM is a whopping 20 M 

Atal is 26 with Nice. Sounds more of a Farsi comparable position-wise. TM is 10 M (same as Eustaquio)

..........

I am going to just stop there. Someone else can pick it up if they'd like. Again, I have not watched these guys, but on paper this isn't obviously easier than getting into our team.

Club Brugge (12M), Celtic (6M), Nottingham Forest (2.5M)....or.......Nice (10M), Sampdoria (2.5M), Bastia (1.5M)? Maybe slightly harder to get into our team? Maybe? Not convinced that's the primary consideration, though I was open to that before I started digging in....

[Bigandy]

17 hours ago, Obinna said:

Good post and interesting topic, but....

I still think Farsi is mostly/entirely a case of not wanting to come because Algeria is on the horizon for him, not because Herdman was telling him that he wouldn't have many minutes.

Could it be a combination of both? Yeah sure, but if this guy wanted to play for Canada he'd be happy to come in and prove himself to Herdman. I think he just doesn't want to get locked down yet (best case). Playing in NL locks him down. 

Interestingly, Koleosho is named and we can only presume nothing has changed in that he isn't willing to be locked down - yet Herdman still named him. This makes me think it was Farsi giving a hard no, or maybe he doesn't have the luxury to come in and train like Luca does?

As you can see, I still have so many questions...

Ive seen comments that maybe herdman left him off the roster so we don't panic algeria into making a cynical move. 

Koleosho is in a tug of war already so its not like we would suddenly alert the USA to him by naming him. 

[Kadenge]

Unless Tajon & AJ are doubtful, I don't see how Farsi would get mins in NL given we have Laryea as well.  JH hasn't cynically capped anyone as far as I know. 

[Bigandy]

12 minutes ago, Kadenge said:

Unless Tajon & AJ are doubtful, I don't see how Farsi would get mins in NL given we have Laryea as well.  JH hasn't cynically capped anyone as far as I know. 

Add in ZBG as a guy with more experience (maybe not better or higher ceiling) and Sigur and farsi has a tall task ahead of him.

[sebdeserio]

26 minutes ago, Bigandy said:

Add in ZBG as a guy with more experience (maybe not better or higher ceiling) and Sigur and farsi has a tall task ahead of him.

I'd take Farsi over ZBG no questions asked right now, without taking into account he's a dual nat.