Stalteri likely suspended for Honduras, CR matches

[sstackho]

As announced on SoccerCentral, Stalteri has been suspended for (likely) two matches for the water-bottle throwing incident.

It is under appeal.

[Blue and White Army]

Eh? What happened?

[sstackho]

Watch your DivX of the Honduras match, right after the disallowed Occean goal.

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by sstackho

As announced on SoccerCentral, Stalteri has been suspended for (likely) two matches for the water-bottle throwing incident.

It is under appeal.

Was it mentioned whether the two game suspension is retroactive? Stalteri missed the costa Rica game following the red card. so if he were to miss the Honduras and CRC matche, that would make it a three game suspension.

[sstackho]

Two matches in addition to the Costa Rica match...

[Grizzly]

Pretty hefty suspension particularly considering the circumstances of two absolutely disgraceful calls. If this stands and Canada is out of contention after the next two matches, I think we should send a very young developmental team to the match against Guatemala and do our best to put through the team that beat us fair and square (and hopefully eliminating Honduras in the process).

[Gian-Luca]

So the aftermath of the total incompetence of the officials in the Honduras match is that the official in question is rewarded further with another officiating assisgnment in this round while Canada is punished futher by having one of its best players suspended 3 games in total for dissent on the horrific, incompetent call.

What a joke and what a disgrace.

[Grizzly]

I think it is no coincidence that the suspension is for the games against Costa Rica and Honduras, the teams that CONCACAF officials would prefer to have advance. I think the Guatemalan fans can be upset as well as the Canadian fans. Corrupt referreeing followed by corrupt CONCACAF officials.

[DJT]

Originally posted by SS2006 - 09/25/2004 : 21:55:29</u>

can soemone remind me hwy he didnt play an world cup qualifers yet?

or did he?

summarize please?

thanks

[ditty]

quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca

So the aftermath of the total incompetence of the officials in the Honduras match is that the official in question is rewarded further with another officiating assisgnment in this round while Canada is punished futher by having one of its best players suspended 3 games in total for dissent on the horrific, incompetent call.

What a joke and what a disgrace.

A couple points:

The extent of those mistakes by the ref in the Honduras game were always going to bring out an ugly reaction but for me there is still no excuse for what Stalteri did. I may have done exactly the same thing but throwing an object in the direction of an official (correct me if this wasn't the case) constitutes alot more than dissent. If Stalteri had acutally hit the guy, he'd be looking at a lot more than 3 games.

Of course, if the ref had not made two massive mistakes which robbed Canada of 3 points, none of this would have happened. The problem is that the FIFA discipline committee likely do not take into account the circumstance behind the behaviour, especially when it involves something like this on an official.

[Daniel]

If Stalteri's on my team and he throws a bottle on the field during the game, he's an idiot to me.

Players should NEVER take a card for dissent, even less a red. This isn't a 2-minute fighting penalty to pump up the team. It was a stupid move on his part.

[BC supporter]

As much as I like Stalteri, and understand the emotion involved in his display, it was an ill-disciplined action by someone who HAS to know better. That we're deprived of his talents for 3 games is truly regrettable, but the responsibility is his, and not CONCACAF's.

[Grizzly]

quote: the responsibility is his, and not CONCACAF's

The responsibility for throwing the water bottle is Stalteri's but it is the responsibility of CONCACAF to ensure that games are reffed by competent, unbiased referrees. The fact that this referree has been assigned another game when in fact he should have been brought before a disciplinary committee shows that CONCACAF officials are either absolutely negligent in their duties or more likely, just as corrupt as the Mexican referree. I would actually be more convinced that the Stalteri suspension was not an attempt to fix the qualification round to the desired outcome if he was suspended for the Guatemala game as well. It is my opinion that the CONCACAF officials don't want Guatemala to qualify any more than they want us to qualify and I fully expect that there will be a few suspicious calls against Guatemala in the next few matches if they are in the lead.

While in light of the suspension it is regretable that Stalteri didn't exercise more restraint, we Canadians are so used to taking such bull**** without reaction that I find it refreshing that one of our players is willing to express his disgust openly. Sure it would have been preferable if it had been an occasional sub rather than a key player on the squad. Had two such calls gone against Honduras you can be sure their whole squad would have mobbed the referree and no suspensions would have resulted. If I were coach, I would rather have a squad of passionate players willing to stand up for themselves even at the risk of the odd suspension than a group of dispassionate players who accept corupt referreeing. I personally think that our players (and fans) have to intimidate the refs in CONCACAF a lot more to give them some fear that if they are going to be biased this may not be without consequences. This can be done in a smart way that does not result in penalties and is practiced all the time by central American squads and their fans.

[Cheeta]

I'm with Paul on this one. His reaction forces the issue of the ref'ing at the Commonwealth match to not be ignored, no matter what face a disiplinary committee puts on it. If he's suspended for three matchs or one match, that's the risk he took. It's a calculated gamble.

Not to say I'm of the opinion it was a move brought on by anything other than a weeks worth of frustrations on top of that horrible five minutes, but I'm pretty certain my man Diesel was thinking "fu'k it. Let them tell me with a straight face I shouldn't be outraged. Just let them fu'king tell me."

Two-three matchs is pretty standard for this sort of thing isn't it? Big stick. Abusing the 4th official, so on, so forth. Was kinda hoping it would be just a match or two from the CONCACAF Clown Court. Hoping for too much I suppose. Guess anything less than a rubber stamped suspension would be a public admission of some sort of responsability on the part of the officiating and that would be expecting the unexpected. That's not to say some sort of private in-house recommendations weren't made and noted though.

That being said, things now being such as they are, I'd be okay seeing more of the same. If Frankie and the CSA aren't going to scream blue bloody murder about some of the crap we're forced to witness from CONCACAF then I guess it'll just have to be left to those who care. It may do no good, turn out to be mostly just barking at the moon, but at least it's something.

This realy stings. Pretty close to our 1st team would have been out for the Honduras and Costa Rica matchs and we need nothing less. And for all the talk about what The Guz brought to the earlier matchs, I know this. With Diesel in the gut you'd see a Hell of a lot better from the wee man once he had a little more something to work with.

[Free kick]

Two games. Or what it really amount to is three games. For what? throwing a bottle on the pitch. Unless I am mistaken you get about the same or less for spitting at someone. Whats the worst of the two infractions?

And to make matters worst the ref makes two ( not one) inacccurate calls in the final 10 minutes that decide the outcome of the game. I might be more sympathetic if it was only one bad call. But two! and at the most crucial time. To make matters worst, the same ref gets additional assignments.

OK, Stalteri erred. But so did the ref. Why not suspend the ref from WCQ? FIFA or Concacaf doesn't even have to make this public, all they have to do is not give him any more assignments. But what did they do instead? Nothing!. Archundia gets to ref Gua-Hon in October.

[Gian-Luca]

And I might add that suspending a player for 3 games out of a round of 6 games in total is quite unbelievably harsh for tossing a water bottle on the pitch. Zidane stomping on a player in the World Cup back in 1998 received a less harsh punishment.

[Reza]

quote:Originally posted by Free kick

OK, Stalteri erred. But so did the ref. Why not suspend the ref from WCQ? FIFA or Concacaf doesn't even have to make this public, all they have to do is not give him any more assignments. But what did they do instead? Nothing!. Archundia gets to ref Gua-Hon in October.

It all sucks, but let's hope he likes Guatemala better than Honduras :-)..Maybe, FIFA figured that way he can redeem himself :-)

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by Reza

It all sucks, but let's hope he likes Guatemala better than Honduras :-)..Maybe, FIFA figured that way he can redeem himself :-)

I have this funny feeling that that won't happen. Another mexican ref ( RODRIGUEZ )was responsible for the CRC-HON game earlier on whereby Honduras won 5-2 and the Tico received 4 yellow cards compared to one yeallow for Honduras. Granted, I never saw that game so its a little hard to make a solid case.

But, consider that in the Hex for WCQ 2002 Honduras was pretty safe and clear to qualifying for the WC at one point ( even in the latter stages of the hex). For a while they really seemed like the most unbeatable side. And, if I recall correctly, Mexico was on shaky ground having troubles with the US. Then at the very end, surprisingly, Honduras implodes and Mexico are the side who benefits the most from the colapse. Now ( this year) we have a situation where Honduras collects 4 of their five points in this round in matches reffed by Mexican refs. In theeir only home match at hoem so far ( reffed by Peter Pendergast of Jamaica), they could do no better than a 2-2 draw versus Guatemala.

maybe its all just circumstantial. But wouldn't be nice if FIFA or Concacaf were proactive in having investigative bodies to look at things that raise red flags. Maybe there are no grounds to incriminate or issue sanctions. But if they were proactive, you can at least ward off the potential for corruption. For example, assign the mexican ref to the matches in the US group.

[The Ref]

I read somewhere that the CSA was appealing the sanction against Stalteri. I wonder if the CSA ever filed a complaint against the referee. Had they done so it would help their case of the appeal. But knowing how the CSA acts I doubt it. I would be interested to read the referee's report of the game and see the reason for the red card to Paul. It must have been a red for violent conduct, but against who? Perhaps a yellow for unsporting behavior would have been more appropriate. There is fault on the fourth official as well in failing to control the bench as I must assume that tempers were already flaring after the penalty kick. It would not surprise me if the referee was paid to fix the result. After all this referee has had experience doing high level games otherwise he would not have been chosen. Therefore he cannot be that incompetent.

[ditty]

Throwing an object AT an official is a much different matter than an infraction directed at an opponent, like spitting or stamping. The bottom line, as harsh as it is, is that any decision by the referee does not excuse throwing an object at the guy. Suggesting that a caution makes sense for throwing something at the ref is frankly ridiculous. No matter what happens, the ref's safety must be guaranteed. Throwing an object in the referee's direction is a straight red, no questions asked.

The CSA should rightly file a complaint regarding preformance and in my opinion this referee's performance did not justify further assignment in this competition. He made the wrong call on the penalty and both Occean and the Honduran were showing studs on the second call, neither of which constituted dangerous play.

The bottom line is that Staleri's actions have really hurt our chances and will do little to address the consequences of the ref's performance. Stally takes the blame on this one, not CONCACAF and not the CSA.

[Guest Ed]

I was right behind the Cdn bench and he certainly did not wind up and throw the bottle at the official. If that was his intent, he certainly made the right choice in picking soccer over baseball or softball. Looked more like a case of deliberate littering than anything else to me. Three games is way too harsh considering the Honduran defender made a Rivaldo-esque meal of the non-contact from Occean, grabbing his face as if he had been struck which was typical Central American 'anything but fair' play on his part. Someone should have put the boots to him on the field and taken three games with his chin up.

[Grizzly]

The fact that this referree is assigned to another Honduras game and specifically the one against the other outsider in our group suggests that the chain of corruption extends much higher than one Mexican referree.

[Free kick]

quote:Originally posted by Grizzly

The fact that this referree is assigned to another Honduras game and specifically the one against the other outsider in our group suggests that the chain of corruption extends much higher than one Mexican referree.

I'd love to dig up that article that someone posted on The voyageurs board ( network 54 I think) in approximately 2003, whereby there were allegations of wrong doing involving Honduras and Mexico in relation to the Hex round for WCQ 2002. It was one of the things that crossed my mind at final whistle on that day at Commonwealth stadium. You have point about Honduras getting another Mexican Ref. In canada's first three games, they have seen refs from: El salvador, Mexico, and T&T. An american will officiate the next game. Whereas Honduras has seen Mexican refs for two of their first three games plus, that other game that you mentioned.

[Grizzly]

Does anyone know the procedure used and officials responsible for determining suspensions in CONCACAF? Are the same people responsible for suspending Stalteri the officials who assign the (very suspicious) referree assignments?

[ditty]

quote:Originally posted by Grizzly

Does anyone know the procedure used and officials responsible for determining suspensions in CONCACAF? Are the same people responsible for suspending Stalteri the officials who assign the (very suspicious) referree assignments?

I don't know things specifically work with CONCACAF but typically the Referees Committee assigns the officials. A Discipline Committee would deal with suspensions. They should be essentially separate bodies.