Natesta Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 First of all I love Radz and his ability is huge and I feel proud that he has again decided to play for Canada. Radz had not set foot on Canadian soil until 1990 when her was 17 years old, so his footballing knowledge was mostly all given before he even arrived here. He's decided to play soccer for his adopted country, the one he feels strongly about. Fair enough. Yet unlike Bircham I don't here the calls of being 'un canadian' It's selective memory really, and it's annoying. Which brings me to Owen Hargreaves... Owen's parents are both from the U.K. and growing up Owen spent alot of time in the U.K. At the age of 14 he left Canada to go to Germany to learn the finer points of his soccer skills. While over there he spent even more time in England, with an even further growing affinty towards the country. When Canada put together it's youth teams, guess who was snubbed? Now, Hargreaves decided to suit up for his adopted country, the one he feels strongly about. England. Why is he a sell out and Radzinski is not? The double standardssome of the people hold here are laughable at best. I'm happy Radz wants to play for us, I'm happy Birch does to... I do not think you need to be born here to feel Canadian, or represent us, and unless you advocate getting rid of every single player who plays for our team that is not canadian (including our coach,) I seriously think you should re-evaluate your point of view. Just something that's been bothering me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Observer Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 I think the difference is that Radz left Poland at a very young age and bounced around Europe all over the place I believe. I also think that he probably choose to play for Canada more out of the fact he was selected for a youth team, made it and played for it before he ever went to Europe. If he had been in Europe for a few years, it would have been questionable whether he would have committed to Canada as he wasn't born there. Also, his parents located in Canada and were proud that he played for Canada. As for Hargreaves, he was born and raised in Canada, speaks with a Canadian accent and never lived in England. Sure, maybe he spent some time there but so have I in the Ukraine where my mother comes from but I wouldn't say I would commit to play for them. Moreover, he publicly stated that he wanted to play for Canada but first wanted to establish himself in the Bayern's first team. Then, when he got the call from England, he essentially abandoned us and played for them (in spite of the fact that he was born AND raised in Canada, never lived in England and developed his football skills in Canada and Germany). That's why he is a traitor and Radz isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blue and White Army Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 Who cares? Move on.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Can. in UK Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 Radzinski said in an interview last year (The Guardian) that he "owed Canada" (and played for them) because they "gave him a passport when nobody else would". But I am in the 'who cares' group. Nationalism is ridiculous anyways... On the same topic, however... Did anybody see the story of Palestine trying to convince Facundo Sava to play for them in qualifying? Maybe Canada should put in a counter-offer! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Oranje Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 I am thinking that on my next business trip to Brazil, I would wander over to the Morumbi Stadium to watch the Sao Paulo FC youth teams play. I am also thinking maybe one of the better 16 year olds may have an interest in being adopted by a Canadian... lol... Secondly, we need to encourage every middle aged man (women tend to take their children with them) to research their out-of-country dalliances to find out if a talented soccer player may have resulted. Of course, we would want to look at mostly 15-25 age range. Who knows that trip to Paris 20 years ago may have generated a French U-21 player??? Or the wild trip to Carnivale may have remnants playing in the Flamengo youth system. It's time the over 35 males in this country do their part for their country and selectively come clean. Of course, we are only interested in quality talent. Just think... It may be worth the risk??? Ok I need a coffee... lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Observer Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 i don't care either that much but was just explaining the reasons for the difference in approaches to the two situations.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JayWay Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 We need to get on this immidiately - Let's start churning out some WW2 style propaganda posters. quote:Originally posted by Canuck Oranje Secondly, we need to encourage every middle aged man (women tend to take their children with them) to research their out-of-country dalliances to find out if a talented soccer player may have resulted. Of course, we would want to look at mostly 15-25 age range. Who knows that trip to Paris 20 years ago may have generated a French U-21 player??? Or the wild trip to Carnivale may have remnants playing in the Flamengo youth system. It's time the over 35 males in this country do their part for their country and selectively come clean. Of course, we are only interested in quality talent. Just think... It may be worth the risk??? Ok I need a coffee... lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beachesl Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Canuck Oranje Secondly, we need to encourage every middle aged man (women tend to take their children with them) to research their out-of-country dalliances to find out if a talented soccer player may have resulted. Of course, we would want to look at mostly 15-25 age range. Who knows that trip to Paris 20 years ago may have generated a French U-21 player??? Or the wild trip to Carnivale may have remnants playing in the Flamengo youth system. It's time the over 35 males in this country do their part for their country and selectively come clean. Of course, we are only interested in quality talent. Just think... It may be worth the risk??? Ok I need a coffee... lol ..or a real cold shower![] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Dave Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 quote:Originally posted by JayWay We need to get on this immidiately - Let's start churning out some WW2 style propaganda posters. I say let's look to the future... like WC 2026! I'll book a trip to several countries in Eastern Europe immediately. Who's with me? [8D] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 On top of being received as an immigrant (he didn't emigrate for soccer), he made his pro debut here in the CSL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ted Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 To answer the original query, "Hargreaves decided to suit up for his adopted country, the one he feels strongly about. England." Except your assumption is wrong. At the time he chose to play for the English Team he was living in Germany. He grew up in Canada, spending no significant time living in England. He learned to play in Canada and prospered under a German-born coach. Since he joined the England team he has lived in Germany and to my knowledge spends holidays with his family in Canada. He shows no evidence that he feels strongly about England. He simply chose to play for a better team that is better supported and that, by pure chance, will enhance is earning potential and avoid long flights to play home games which might jeopordize his place at his club. Now, be that as it may I will be the first admit that Mr Whoregreaves had a right to choose to play for England but, and this is a very big but, before he had settled in Germany he gave an interview on Canadian Television that stated he would play for Canada. Not that me might or that he was weighing his options but that it was going to happen. Then he played for England. So, instead of being gently ribbed for being a "traitor" but also acknowledged for making a top level team, he betrayed us when we were desparate for any top quality players and thus if ever he plays a game in Canada that I can attend he will be heaped with scorn and all the verbal abuse reserved for true traitors to Canadian soccer. As for Radzinksi, he lived here in a real adopted country. He plays for Canada and never said he would play anywhere else. No comparison at all. To recap: Whore: Canada then Germany his home, promised to play for Canada, played for England. Radz: Canada his home, played for Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beachesl Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 Don't forget that in between he was supposed to play for Wales. He's jilted almost as many teams as CO has jilted ladies in Brazil! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beachesl Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 However, Natesta, I think all of us respect that you have a valid opinion, even those who vehemently disagree. Thanks for sharing what's bothering you. By and large, I also believe in more freedom for the individual player choosing which country to play for. Given the endorsement money involved, I might have done the same in his multicoloured shoes. It's just that Hargeaves hurts a lot of us here. Cheers! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattbin Posted February 12, 2004 Share Posted February 12, 2004 Just to add something to this -- Radz spends vacations in Canada, and is well known to the Polish soccer community in the Toronto area. A friend of mine was telling me that Radz came out to see matches when he was around and he donated a signed jersey to them for their awards banquet door prize or some such thing. Point is, that sounds like an immigrant who has adopted a new country. That doesn't sound like an opportunist or a traitor. And I have to respect him for it, although his behaviour leading up to GC2000 still bothers me a bit. Allez les Rouges, M@ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Radz. good. Hargreaves not so bad. Desperate, witless, Canadian media awful. So Hargreaves, who's parents raised him as a good Englishman whilst working in Calgary said he'd play for Canada and then changed his mind. If that's the worst thing he's done as a young man, as much as I think it sucks and he made the wrong choice, that realy isn't so bad. The man isn't hurting anybody but himself. Maybe he dosen't realise it just yet but he's turned his back on the greatest honour I can imagine, and there is no 2nd chance. You'll notice I've become quite forgiving on the subject. Yes, I still think he acted mercenary but if he wasn't raised a proper proud Canadian he likely didn't realise his mistake (at his age) and is going to pay for it the rest of his like. Now the dumn ass media in Canada who keep insisting someone who wears another nations kit and learned their craft overseas is Canada's greatest ever footie export could get it into their little bitty heads to maybe do a fu'king ounce of research they'd have plenty else to talk about (Diesel, RADZINSKI, De Rosario, Pesch., and De Guzman) and could leave poor Owen to his fate. And Radz., who immigrated to Canada with his parents, calls himself without hesitation Canadian, and went through some pretty awful times with the MNT (along with the rest of us. Our darkest days for those who's memmories are a little foggier than mine) has had a few ups and downs but has served his post GC2000 ban (good call Mattbin) and rejoined our WC squad. Now the WC is a pretty big insentive but man's pride knows no limit. That Radz. rejoined the MNT under Holger, the manager who was none to shy to call Radz. a rat for the way he treated his nation teammates with that no-show said to me something favorable about Thomasz Toffee. And isn't that funny. Holger gets Radz. back on board but gets axed because Watson, Bircham, and other footballers down at the Age and Opportunity Center aren't happy. Pretty funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhat Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Yes! Radzinski is Canadian. Any player who sacrifices personal gain to represent OUR country is Canadian. To me he is as Canadian as Craig Forrest, Daniel Igali, Julian De Guzman, Steve Nash, or Gianluca. The OH situation is a sensitive issue because he stated in several publications that he would like to play for Canada, but in the end,did not. That in my books makes you a liar at the very least. I can understand why many would see it differently, but let's not make the mistake of comparing the two. Radzinski is definitely in a different class, in ability and integrity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ryan Keay Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Cheeta And isn't that funny. Holger gets Radz. back on board but gets axed because Watson, Bircham, and other footballers down at the Age and Opportunity Center aren't happy. Pretty funny. Hate to go off topic but that had a lot less to do with Holger getting sacked than these: Canada 0 - Cuba 2 Canada 1 - Estonia 2 Canada 1 - Scotland 3 Canada 0 - USA 4 Canada 1 - Malta 2 Canada 0 - Japan 3 Canada 0 - Egypt 3 Canada 0 - T & T 4 As Holger's tenure went on, the results got uglier, and they did get pretty ugly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peschfan Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Canada has many Canadians Born Abroad... Heres a few... England Marc Bircham Paul Fenwick Nial Thompson Frank Yallop Scotland Iain Hume Colin Miller Iain Fraser Poland Tomasz Radzinski Chris Pozniak Portugal Fernando Aguiar Switzerland Daniel Imhoff Guyana Alex Bunbury Lyndon Hooper Trinidad Randy Samuel Jamaica Kevin Holness West Indies Carl Fletcher Angola Edgar Bartholmeau Malawi Tam Nsaliwa El Salvador Maycoll Canizalwz Austria Mike Klukaowski Netherlands Marcel De Jong Greece Kenny Stamatopolous There are probably more and there are loads who were Canadian born but elidgible for other countries too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Man, this is kinda off-topic, but that Malta loss SUCKED massive loads of ass! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canuck Oranje Posted February 13, 2004 Share Posted February 13, 2004 Marcel De Jong was born in Newmarket Ontario... to Dutch born parents who happened to live in Canada for about 20 years. De Jong and his parents chose to return to the Netherland when Marcel was under 5.. That is how I understand his situation.. Quite frankly where a Canadian is born is irrelevant. If they meet Fifa rules and they are good enough, let's take advantage. quote:Originally posted by Peschfan Canada has many Canadians Born Abroad... Heres a few... England Marc Bircham Paul Fenwick Nial Thompson Frank Yallop Scotland Iain Hume Colin Miller Iain Fraser Poland Tomasz Radzinski Chris Pozniak Portugal Fernando Aguiar Switzerland Daniel Imhoff Guyana Alex Bunbury Lyndon Hooper Trinidad Randy Samuel Jamaica Kevin Holness West Indies Carl Fletcher Angola Edgar Bartholmeau Malawi Tam Nsaliwa El Salvador Maycoll Canizalwz Austria Mike Klukaowski Netherlands Marcel De Jong Greece Kenny Stamatopolous There are probably more and there are loads who were Canadian born but elidgible for other countries too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eastcoaster Posted February 14, 2004 Share Posted February 14, 2004 When it comes to Canadians, where they are born is irrelevant. We are a country of immigrants. Myself and half of my friends were all born outside of Canada, but we are all 100% Canadians. There are always going a be a number of top athletes who are not born in Canada. We should never question how Canadian they really are. Just for the record, Steve Nash who gives everything to the national team to the detriment of his pro career, was born in South Africa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.