loyola Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 quote:Originally posted by Gordon I have a lot of sympathy for a guy who is fighting for a position with a new club or his spot on a team period. I have a lot of sympathy for a guy who in the twighlight of his career opts to retire from international football and maybe prolong his career a year or two. But anyone who considers themselves as part of the set up, who wants to play in the next World Cup effort, and who is well stablished at their club, sorry, don't have a lot of sympathy. Maybe Dwayne doesn't see himself as part fo the next cycle, in which case he should just announce his retirement from international play. I don't know if this is a reference to Lars absence but I hope you understand Josh Wagenaar is attending the GC and missing a big part of preaseason with his club and his manager is looking to sign another keeper now that Josh is on international duty. I have a lot more respect for Josh who took the chance of coming to the GC while maybe losing his spot with his club than Lars who decided not to come as soon as he signed with Cottbus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Hombre Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 quote:Originally posted by nolando How about Friend missing two consecutive tournaments? (Yes, I realise the first was for a wedding, but I still stand by my comments - many v's plan their lives around such games - certainly Gerrard, to give just one example, wouldn't be off the hook for missing an entire Euro for his wedding) Just a quick note: I'm pretty sure that Rob is still recovering from season-ending surgery. (Also, a bunch of thieves broke into his house recently, so I'm sure he's hunting them down Van Damme style. ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Rollins1555362254 Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 quote: What gets me are these kid gloves that get given to DDR - why not even a reaction from the media or a hard question thrown his way. We weren't interviewing DeRo. I suppose we could have asked Hart what he thought about the TFC players staying away, but other than that I'm not sure how we could have asked hard questions of DeRo.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Duane Rollins1555362254 Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone That's a half truth at best. Nolando doesn't hate Toronto. He's a Canada supporter first, like myself and Loyola. It's you and Duane who both openly admit that TFC is your new true love. When somebody bashes TFC for its own sake I usually call them out, as do others. But you two just feed the fire by feeling the need to constantly justify the club/players should others perceived that their interests are in conflict with the National Team. Other than Grizzly, there is not one single poster in this thread who is a TFC basher. And I tend to give Grizzly a pass because, for his many faults (), I don't think he places his own club before Canada. I'm talking about DeRo here, not TFC. I suspect he's getting special treatment from some because he's with TFC, but that doesn't change my opinion that letting all our older players sit this one out is best for everyone -- regardless of who they play for. And what I’ve said in the past is that I now have a greater appreciation of the divided loyalty of club versus country. I no longer judge those that are ambivalent about their club team’s players getting called up for national team duty outside of World Cup qualifying. I suspect other Vs that closely follow clubs other than Toronto will come around to that thinking when their teams are more affected by international call-ups. Not that any will admit it now, or even believe that it will happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ed Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 ^ Nolando, why the Rob Friend bashing? He had surgery towards the end of the season so his absence is legitimate unless I hear otherwise. And he did not miss 2 whole GC tournaments. He played in the last GC but left after the group round. Not quite the scenario you lay out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RS Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone That's a half truth at best. Nolando doesn't hate Toronto. He's a Canada supporter first, like myself and Loyola. It's you and Duane who both openly admit that TFC is your new true love. When somebody bashes TFC for its own sake I usually call them out, as do others. But you two just feed the fire by feeling the need to constantly justify the club/players should others perceived that their interests are in conflict with the National Team. Other than Grizzly, there is not one single poster in this thread who is a TFC basher. And I tend to give Grizzly a pass because, for his many faults (), I don't think he places his own club before Canada. You've got me all wrong. I put Canada above all else. Always will, and I've never stated otherwise. That said, I don't take this "you're either with us or you're against us" attitude to the national team that many here seem to do. DeRo has taken off tons of time from his club career over the years to play for Canada, yet people seem to conveniently forget that now that he has chosen not to play in this (superfluous) edition of the Gold Cup. As much as I'll cheer on Canada in this Gold Cup and I always want them to win whenever they play, I don't even think the GC should even be taking place right now. That's why I'm not too fussed about players skipping it, it's a pointless tourney in 2009. The 2011 GC is far more important, for a number of reasons. And don't try to tell me that the fact that he now plays for big, bad Toronto doesn't make it easier for some here to bash him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redhat Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Maybe we worry too much about the few that aren't there, as opposed to the important ones that are there. Personally I have no problem with De Rosario, Lars , David Edgar, or even Asmir for declining the invite for the various legitimate club/family reasons. I'm just glad that the ones that are there are the ones that I'd WANT to be there: JDG, Diesel, Big Kev, Jakovic, Atiba, Ali, Simpson, De Jong, Klukowski, et. al. I'm just sick of reports always pointing out the loss of, let's say, Brennan, whose role in my opinion has been overshadowed by a solid back of Klukowski, Jakovic, McKenna, and Stalteri, so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolando Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 quote:Originally posted by El Hombre Just a quick note: I'm pretty sure that Rob is still recovering from season-ending surgery. (Also, a bunch of thieves broke into his house recently, so I'm sure he's hunting them down Van Damme style. ) my bad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VPjr Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 Do we know for certain that Edgar declined an invite? DeRo, Lars and Asmir certainly did. Edgar, I'm not sure that is the case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strisce Posted July 7, 2009 Share Posted July 7, 2009 quote:Originally posted by MediaGuy No, it's possible to have two views on this. This is a meaningless Gold Cup. Lots of top players for lots of nations have been left behind. Why should DeRo be expected to make a greater sacrifice than, say Amado Guevara or Landon Donovan? DeRo has done a lot for Canada through the years. S hiting on him for choosing to focus on the club side of things now is insane. I wonder, if he were in Europe and the decision to hold him back to focus on his club were made, if you would have the same reaction? I also wonder if your attitude on this subject will soften when international call-ups have a bigger impact on the Whitecaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 quote:Originally posted by loyola I don't know if this is a reference to Lars absence but I hope you understand Josh Wagenaar is attending the GC and missing a big part of preaseason with his club and his manager is looking to sign another keeper now that Josh is on international duty. I have a lot more respect for Josh who took the chance of coming to the GC while maybe losing his spot with his club than Lars who decided not to come as soon as he signed with Cottbus. It wasn't a reference specifically about Lars or anyone else for that matter - and there have been others. There are certain realities that players in Europe, and even North America for that matter can face and there may be times when attending a tournament like the Gold Cup comes with a price that is too high to pay in terms of loss of livlihood. Good on Wagenaar for attending. Showing up for Canada is never something you'll hear me criticize. I am just saying that if Josh decided that coming to the Gold Cup might Jeapordize his spot at Yoevil then you'd not hear me harping on his non-attendance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 quote:Originally posted by Rudi Simple. DeRo plays for TFC, and it's en vogue to bash Toronto. I've come to accept this from this board. It used to make me very angry, now I just roll with it and sometimes incite it myself for a laugh. I'll always come to this board for national team news and discussion, but whenever the subject of club football comes up, I treat it like I'm posting on BigSoccer's MLS: Fan Rivalries board. That's a seriously big chip you are carrying there Rudi. Every player who ever declined a call up in similar circumstances to DeRo has been savaged on this board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strisce Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 quote:Originally posted by Its Called Football Julian DeGuzman confirms Toronto FC have offered him a 'lucrative' contract and gives indications he'll have a decision for them within the week. He also lets on that his brother has considered a move to Toronto FC and gives a frank assessment of Dale Mitchell's tenure. Stephen Hart discusses the upcoming Canadian match against El Salvador in Gold Cup action, Portsmouth keeper Asmir Bergovic's intentions to play for Canada and what his own future with the national team might include. Watch it all here: http://www.metronews.ca/toronto/blog/post/25764 Subscribe to the It's Called Football show on iTunes here: http://itunes.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/viewPodcast?id=301350624 Cheers Ben It's BEGovic... not BERGovic (you called him that too). Perhaps I'm being picky, but at least get his name right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 quote:Originally posted by Gordon It wasn't a reference specifically about Lars or anyone else for that matter - and there have been others. There are certain realities that players in Europe, and even North America for that matter can face and there may be times when attending a tournament like the Gold Cup comes with a price that is too high to pay in terms of loss of livlihood. Good on Wagenaar for attending. Showing up for Canada is never something you'll hear me criticize. I am just saying that if Josh decided that coming to the Gold Cup might Jeapordize his spot at Yoevil then you'd not hear me harping on his non-attendance. I think you are being terribly unfair if you are going to criticize DeRo but not Lars for their decision. Maybe that's why these criticism comes up as being anti-To stuff for some posters? Lars season hasn't even started but he's free to miss the GC while DeRo is in season but we should blame him? As far as I know Lars club isn't struggling at the moment with their roster, Lars is also projected as a clear number one from what I've read. So, just because he's arriving to a new club we should feel comfortable with his decision? My guess is that Cottbus management made a deal with Lars when they signed him about him missing the GC. I can understand that. It's fair. But if TFC had a similar deal with DeRo when they offered him a contract (you know something along the line "You know Dwayne, we're always losing a lot of players during the summer, could you please skip this summer GC that would help the club? We're promising to you we'll bring real grass if you do that for us ), shouldn't we understanding the situation he is facing? Like I've said, it's unfair to blame DeRo for this. We can start finding little difference between players situation with their club to justify or criticize their decisions but at the end of the day some of our veterans have decided not to show up and I think their justifications are very similar and we shouldn't be criticizing them for a tough choice they had to make unless their justifications is frivolous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 quote:Originally posted by loyola I think you are being terribly unfair if you are going to criticize DeRo but not Lars for their decision. Maybe that's why these criticism comes up as being anti-To stuff for some posters? I think I have laid out my criteria for what I criticize and what I forgive pretty clearly. If you think its terribly unfair, I'll guess just have to live with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loyola Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 quote:Originally posted by Gordon I think I have laid out my criteria for what I criticize and what I forgive pretty clearly. If you think its terribly unfair, I'll guess just have to live with it. I can't live with double standard... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted July 8, 2009 Share Posted July 8, 2009 Worth bearing in mind that the CSA could actually have insisted that players show up given the Gold Cup is part of FIFA's International Calendar. The flexibility shown by the CSA may be a sign that they prefer to prioritize every second Gold Cup when Confederations Cup qualification is at stake and are actually quite comfortable with the idea of using a number of younger fringe players this time around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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