Women's Soccer Military Championship

[terpfan68]

Richard,

Why do you attack people who are critical of the CSA? You have your experiences and we (more than just me.) have ours. In my emails to CSA I identified myself as a father of two of the members of the Women's Military Team. Why did you assume I was just another nameless a** h***? I'm certainly not hiding and I think The Ref probably isn't either. Have you ever been critical about the CSA on anything? Perhaps you could cite the postings so I can read them for myself. I started this thread to inform football fans in Canada about a group of young women who are serving their country and at the same time participating in football at the international level. When my daughters joined the Naval Reserve they didn't even know that this team existed. They joined because of the positive experience of their two older brothers. The Military is certainly not using it as a recruiting ploy. The Reserves and Regular forces are understaffed and although I wouldn't recommend enlisting for the sports program, it is nice to know that one is provided for competent athletes. (Competition is available in other team and individual sports.) Perhaps if more young people are aware of it the teams from Canada will also attract National Players like the teams from France and Germany. (I’m damn sure that the CSA would put a stop to THAT.)

[DoyleG]

CFAO 50-3 -- SPORTS

PURPOSE

1. This order prescribes the policy and regulating guidelines governing

the organization and conduct of competitive sports programs for members of

the Canadian Forces (CF).

DIVISION OF THE ORDER

2. This order is comprised of the following sections:

a. Section 1 -- General;

b. Section 2 -- Sport Programs;

c. Section 3 -- Canadian Forces National and International Sports

Competitions;

d. Section 4 -- Logistic and Administrative Support; and

e. Section 5 -- Resources

SECTION 1 -- GENERAL

3. Competitive sports are an integral part of the continuing training and

development of members of the CF. The objectives established for the sports

program are to be met through sport skills instruction, and the conduct of

team and individual sports competitions. However, some competitive sports

such as boxing and hang-gliding, which are not authorized by the CF, do not

form part of this order.

4. Competitions involving motorized vehicles, such as car rallies,

snowmobile races and motor racing, and social games such as darts,

shuffle-board and billiards do not form part of this order, but may be

organized as recreational activities in accordance with 50-2.

OBJECTIVES

5. Comprehensive sports programs, through the demands of training and

competition, contribute to the overall effectiveness of the CF. The primary

objectives of the program are:

a. to develop unit cohesion, team work, morale, pride and identity;

b. to instill a high degree of esprit de corps;

c. to develop individual attributes such as leadership,

self-discipline, self-sacrifice, self-esteem and aggressiveness;

and

d. to promote physical fitness.

6. Secondary objectives of the program are:

a. to provide the opportunity for all members to develop their

physical potential;

b. to provide the opportunity for members to participate in highly

skilled, competitive and organized athletics; and

c. to encourage military athletes and teams to achieve higher

standards of proficiency.

RESPONSIBILITY AND AUTHORITY

7. Commanding officers (COs) are responsible for establishing a

comprehensive competitive sports program in which all members have the

opportunity to compete.

8. The commander of a command may authorize competitions between units or

individuals within the command.

9. Regional commanders are the approving authority for the organization

and conduct of regional sports competitions within their Military Region.

Regional Boundaries are described in Annex A.

10. The Director Physical Education, Recreation and Amenities (NDHQ/DPERA)

is the approving authority for the organization and conduct of CF national

sports championships, CF invitational sports competitions and international

sports competition.

11. The Director General Personnel Services (DGPS) is the approving

authority for the hosting of International Sports Competitions by the CF.

12. DGPS is the Chief of Delegation for the CF with respect to Conseil

International du Sport Militaire (CISM).

13. The conditions and approving authorities for participation in, and

hosting of, sports competitions are found in Annex B.

PENSION COVERAGE

14. A member who suffers a disability, or the surviving spouse of a

deceased member, may be entitled to a pension under the Pension Act

(R.S.C., 1985, C.P-6), if the member or his or her representative can

clearly establish in accordance with Part IV of the said Act, that the

disability or death is the result of an injury or disease, or the

aggravation of an injury or disease, that arose out of or was directly

connected with military service. Pursuant to subsections 21(2) and (3) of

the Pension Act, an injury or disease, or aggravation thereof, resulting in

the disability or death of a member is deemed to have arisen out of or to

have been directly connected with military service if it was incurred in

the course of

(a) any physical training or any sports activity in which the member

was participating that was authorized or organized by a military

authority, or performed in the interests of the service although

not authorized or organized by a military authority;

( any activity incidental to or directly connected with an activity

described in paragraph (a), including the transportation of the

member by any means between the place the member normally

performed his duties and the place of that activity;

Pursuant to paragraph (d) of QR&O 21.47, the report of a summary

investigation or the minutes of proceedings of a board of inquiry into an

injury or death are required to contain a finding as to whether the injury

or death was attributable to military service. In order to support the

finding all available evidence of military control of, and the requirement

to participate in, the activity, including copies of any appropriate

written orders, shall be included. Members who prefer to participate in

sports activities or physical training which are not conducted in

accordance with this order are encouraged to review their disability and

life insurance policies since disability or death which occurs as a result

of such participation may not give rise to a pension entitlement under the

Pension Act.

CASUALTY REPORTING

15. Reporting of injuries or death arising from programs conducted under

the auspices of this order shall be in accordance with 21-9, CFAO 24-1,

CFAO 24-2 and 24-6.

16. The Physical Education and Recreation (PE&R) staff shall maintain

a register of all injuries incurred by members during participation in the

CF sports program and, where applicable, a report shall be completed in

accordance with 24-2.

SUSPENSIONS

17. Members involved in a rules infraction while participating in CF

sports competitions may be subject to suspension from participation in CF

sports for varying lengths of time or numbers of games. In some instances

suspension from participation in all CF sports may be appropriate.

Suspension action will be initiated by the league president or the Base

Physical Education and Recreation Officer (BPERO) in accordance with the

applicable rules of play and shall, if the severity of the infraction

warrants, be referred to NDHQ/DPERA through the normal chain of command.

Infractions of a minor nature that result in suspensions comprising a short

period of time or a small number of games can be administered locally.

SECTION 2 -- SPORTS PROGRAMS

SPORTS TRAINING

18. Many members lack the skills necessary to permit their safe, effective

and enjoyable participation in the sports program. Therefore, the

development or improvement of skills required for playing, coaching and

officiating sports shall be an important and fundamental part of the sports

program. Priority shall be given to providing instruction at the basic or

beginning skills levels.

INTRAMURAL

19. The primary CF level of sport competition for members is the

intramural program. According to local conditions the intramural program

may be defined as inter-section, inter-company or inter-mess. COs are to

give every possible consideration to providing full opportunity for

participation by all members especially the less expert performer. This

level of sport activity shall be given first priority in use of resources.

20. Teams restricted to members of a mess, or military occupation (MOC)

may participate in intramural programs involving other such members and

also in local competitions involving either civilian or military teams, as

part of the unit sports program. Participation by such teams requiring

travel beyond an 80 km radius shall not be considered as part of the

intramural sports program. Participation by such teams requiring travel

beyond an 80 km radius must be considered as part of the extramural

program.

EXTRAMURAL

21. The next level of competition is the extramural sports program. The

ability of individuals and teams of better than average athletic calibre

must be recognized -- such individuals are to be encouraged to develop

their skills so they may advance to higher levels of competition.

Extramural competition is a valuable extention of the intramural program

and an important component in achieving the objectives of the CF sports

program.

22. Extramural sports programs include:

a. competitions against members or teams from other bases, stations

or units;

b. participation against civilian teams or individuals;

c. command competitions;

d. CF regional championships and invitationals;

e. CF national championships; and

f. participation at the elite level in national and international

civilian or military sport competitions.

REGIONAL PROGRAMS

23. The CF is divided into six regions for sports competitions, which are

organized and conducted under the authority of responsible formations as

described in Annex A.

24. Regional competitions provide frequent opportunity for activity in the

widest variety, and must be conducted with the most economical use of

resources. As an approved extension of base level sports programs, regional

competitions are to be conducted with public resources including the

provision of rations, quarters and transportation.

25. Regional programs shall be arranged to ensure that:

a. competitions are organized in all sports where sufficient

interest is shown by a majority of bases and stations within the

region;

b. equitable competition opportunities are available for all sizes

of bases, stations and units; and

c. a fair and effective method is designed to select regional

representatives for national championships.

26. The responsibilities of the Regional Sports Director (RSD) are

described in Annex C.

NATIONAL PROGRAMS

27. Sports competitions to be conducted as CF national championships will

be determined at the national RSD annual meeting based on the relative

participation at the regional level. The RSDs, along with NDHQ/DPERA, will

set the rules for such championships, including eligibility and team

composition. The responsibility for arrangements in support of a national

championship will be assigned to a selected base by NDHQ in conjunction

with the base's parent command headquarters (CHQ). The responsibilities of

the host base are described in Annex D.

INTERNATIONAL COMPETITIONS

28. International competitions will be conducted as an extension of the CF

national program:

a. Entry of individuals or teams into international military

competitions shall be authorized as outlined in Annex B.

b. The CISM is an international military sports organization founded

at the end of World War ll. Its aim is to encourage physical

activity and military sport and to enhance friendly relations

between armed forces of the member nations. The responsibilities

for governing Canada's participation in CISM are described in

Annex J. Members will be permitted to train for, attend, and

participate in activities sponsored by CISM. Elite athletes may

also be selected to attend CISM events on an individual basis.

The development of sports for CISM will come from normal training

activities which have a military impact or form part of the

ongoing CF sports program. Units are to support individual

athlete development and maintain records of their achievements.

INVITATIONAL COMPETITION

29. CF invitational competitions involving individuals or teams from two

or more units within the same region may be considered as part of the

regional activity for the purpose of authorizing travel and transportation.

Whenever practicable, such events should be planned in conjunction with the

region's semiannual program of activities.

30. CF invitational competitions involving individuals or teams from more

than one region require NDHQ/DGPS approval, and normally will be subject to

the condition that the number of participants or teams per region must be

limited. Applications will normally be staffed through the RSD and reviewed

at the annual RSD meeting for inclusion in the CF National Sport Program.

CIVILIAN COMPETITIONS

31. Entry of individuals into civilian competitions shall be authorized

only when such participation may be expected to bring credit to the CF. The

conditions and approving authorities for participation in civilian

competitions are in Annex B; applications for approval shall be submitted

in accordance with Appendix 1 to Annex B. In no case should participation

in civilian competition take priority over the development of base programs

or conflict with participation in CF regional or national championships.

COMMAND COMPETITIONS

32. The CF is divided into Commands. Command competitions provide

opportunities for activity in the widest variety of sports, and must be

conducted with the most economical use of manpower and transportation

resources. Command competitions will not take priority over the CF National

Sport Program.

BRANCH AND MILITARY OCCUPATION COMPETITIONS

33. The CF is divided into branches and military occupations. Competitions

within branches and military occupations provide the opportunity for

activity in the widest variety of sports, and must be conducted with the

most economical use of manpower and transportation resources. These

competitions must not take priority over the CF National Sport Program.

Application for approval must be submitted with Branch Advisors

Recommendation to ADM(Per) (Assistant Deputy Minister (Personnel)) through

DGPS.

SECTION 3 -- CANADIAN FORCES NATIONAL AND INTERNATIONAL SPORTS COMPETITIONS

34. Normally, CF sports competitions and championships shall be conducted

in accordance with the accepted Canadian amateur sport principles and

current rules of play of the appropriate sports governing body. As

required, NDHQ will negotiate agreements with appropriate Canadian amateur

sports governing bodies.

ELIGIBILITY

35. To be eligible for competition, a participant must be:

a. a member of the CF Regular Force, on strength of or attached

posted to the competing base, station or unit and in the case of

the latter, the member must be on strength at least 90 days prior

to the regional competition;

b. a member of the CF Reserve Force currently on Class "B" or Class

"C" Reserve Service who has completed, immediately prior to the

event in question, a minimum of 90 days continuous service;

c. a member of a foreign force who is attached to or on exchange

duty with the CF Regular Force; or

d. a member of a foreign force who is serving with his or her unit

at a CF base.

36. Where a base, station or unit entry is comprised of members of a

foreign force, the following conditions apply:

a. Team Sports

(1) in accordance with regional regulations; and

(2) to be eligible for national competition, a team is

restricted to the following maximum number of members of a

foreign force --

(a) teams over 12 players -- three per team, and

( teams of 12 players or less -- two per team.

b. Individual Sports. To be eligible for national competition, a

regional team is restricted to a maximum of 20 per cent (rounded

off to the next lowest whole number) of members of a foreign

force.

37. To be eligible for a CISM competition, the participant must conform to

the current CISM eligibility rules.

38. Members on retirement leave or Regular Officer Training Plan (ROTP)

students attending military colleges are not eligible to participate in CF

national sports championships unless invited to participate for the purpose

of making a CISM team. Students on subsidized university training plans may

be eligible if their application for exceptional status is approved by

NDHQ/DPERA on the recommendation of Director Professional Education and

Development (DPED) prior to the start of the sports season.

39. Where a member lives and works on or near a base other than the one of

which the member is on strength, the member may make application to NDHQ

through the appropriate RSD for authority to compete for that base. The

application must be made before the start of the season's play.

40. A member being posted from one region to another who wishes to qualify

for the national championship may make application to NDHQ/DPERA, through

normal channels, for authority to compete in the elimination of the region

for which the member will be eligible at the time of the national

championships. The application must reach NDHQ six weeks before the date of

the national championships. If a member is posted after the playoffs have

commenced, the member is eligible to play for the new base effective the

member's change of strength (COS) date.

41. Where a member of a team that has won its regional playdown is posted

prior to the national championship, the loosing unit, after obtaining

concurrence from the individual and the gaining unit, may request approval

from NDHQ/DPERA for the member's services through the loosing unit's RSD.

If approved the member will be considered as part of the original team's

roster.

42. Where a question of eligibility is not specifically covered in the

rules, it is the responsibility of the participating team or individual to

submit the circumstances of the case to the RSD through the local BPERO.

The RSD shall decide the case or, if appropriate, request a decision from

NDHQ/DPERA.

43. The rules regarding team eligibility and composition apply only to

those sports progressing to national championships. For those sports in

which there is no CF national championship, RSDs may, in consultation with

the bases within their region, establish rules to meet their special

circumstances and which contribute to meeting the objectives as outlined in

paragraphs 5 and 6.

44. Eligibility certificates in accordance with the format in Appendix 1

to Annex E are required before entering a CF national sports championship.

They shall be completed and handed to the chairperson of the jury of appeal

at the briefing prior to commencement of the championship.

45. From time to time individuals not eligible for national championships

(paragraph 38), may participate in a national championship that is being

used for selection of a CISM team. Their results will not be part of the

national competition and will be used only for selection for the CISM team.

ENTRY INTO COMPETITION

46. Normally each base and the east and west coast fleets, may enter one

team in the regional elimination competition. However, major bases composed

of distinctly different elements or geographically separate units may,

subject to the capabilities of the host base and with the concurrence of

the RSD, enter more than one team.

47. Where a base enters more than one team in a regional competition, the

players are eligible to play only for the team with which they commenced

play in the regional competition.

48. To enter a regional competition. a base must notify the RSD and the

host base on or before the closing date set for entries.

49. To enter a national championship, a region should have held a regional

championship at least 14 days before the commencement date of the national

championship. If unable to comply with the 14 days provision, a request for

extension may be submitted to NDHQ/DPERA.

50. From time to time individuals, in individual competitions, who are

eligible to compete in national championships, but due to duty requirements

are unable to qualify through normal channels, may be authorized by

NDHQ/DPERA to compete. Such extraordinary cases must be staffed through and

recommended by the unit's BPERO and the RSD.

51. In regional sports leading to a national championship, augmentation of

team rosters with players from other bases, stations or units is permitted

in accordance with the augmentation rules for each sport as outlined in the

CF National Sports Championship Rule Book, E-PD-007-008/JD-001.

52. To be eligible to enter into extramural competition a member must have

successfully met the minimum physical fitness requirements of 50-1.

JURY OF APPEAL

53. A jury of appeal for each CF national championship will be appointed

by NDHQ/DPERA. Duties and responsibilities of the jury are outlined in

Annex E.

DRESS

54. Members attending a formal banquet or official function in conjunction

with a national or international military sporting event shall wear

appropriate military uniform.

SECTION 4 -- LOGISTIC AND ADMINISTRATIVE SUPPORT

TRAVEL AND TRANSPORTATION

55. CF championships at the command, regional and national levels are an

extension of the base sports program, therefore travel and transportation

shall be authorized. All travel and temporary duty costs are chargeable to

the parent unit of the individual or team concerned. All participants must

travel in military uniform when on Service flights. Priority 2 travel on

Service aircraft is authorized for participation in regional, national,

international and NDHQ approved CF invitational command, branch/trade or

civilian championships.

56. The use of motor transport in support of the CF sports training

program could be authorized in accordance with orders relating to the use

of motor transport for all other military training.

57. The use of motor transport in support of sports programs, competitions

and championships must not:

a. prejudice military training or operations;

b. prejudice higher priority administrative functions;

c. be combined with any recreational use;

d. cause undue depreciation to vehicles or equipment; or

e. result in excessive driver overtime.

58. Travel and temporary duty is authorized from present unit funds under

this order for the following CISM activities:

a. CISM General Assembly Meeting;

b. CISM Regional Meetings;

c. CISM World Competitions;

d. CISM Regional Competitions and tournaments;

e. CISM Academy Meetings;

f. CF Training Camps and courses; and

g. Out-Service Training Schools and Clinics.

LOGISTIC SUPPORT

59. CISM competitions are held in various locations throughout the world.

On occasion, logistic support for CF CISM teams will be required from CF

units located in close proximity or en route to these competition sites.

Tasking for rations and quarters (R&O), transport, supplies, etc. will

be made through NDHQ by the appropriate sponsoring command.

TROPHIES AND AWARDS

60. The CF National Sports Championship Rule Book E-PD-007-008/JD-001

details the individual and team awards.

61. Trophies and awards for national championships will be procured and

administered by NDHQ/DPERA, who will maintain property records in

accordance with CF non-public fund (NPF) accounting instructions.

62. NDHQ/DPERA is responsible for:

a. care and maintenance of perpetual trophies; and

b. dispatch of the trophy to arrive at NDHQ/DPERA or host base of a

national, 30 days prior to commencement of the national

championship.

63. Perpetual trophies and individual awards provided for command,

regional, and national championships shall be obtained from NPF sources or

private donations. They shall not be accepted from commercial organizations

or other sources seeking to advertise for personal gain. Perpetual trophies

shall be accounted for in accordance with the CF accounting instructions

applicable to the holder.

FINANCES

64. The funds required to purchase trophies and awards and to help defray

entertainment and other special costs incurred by the host base shall be

provided from NPF resources.

65. For national or CISM championships, funds may be obtained from an

annual grant from the CF Central Fund which is administered by NDHQ/DGPS,

or from fees assessed against competing units, or a combination of both.

The entry fees for national championships will be determined by NDHQ/DPERA

in consultation with RSDs.

66. Funds for regional championships may be obtained from entry fees or

from per capita assessment of units within the region. The amount of

assessment or entry fees for regional competitions shall be determined by

RSDs in consultation with bases and stations in the region.

SPECIALTY INTEREST FACILITIES -- OUT OF POCKET EXPENSES

67. The following procedure will be used to obtain public funds for out of

pocket expenses incurred in support of authorized sports championships. A

CF 52 General Allowance Claim shall be prepared and submitted by the NPF

entity concerned, quoting this CFAO and the applicable NDHQ message

authorizing the competition as the authority, supported by appropriate

receipts or other documentation verifying the entitlement, to the NPFAO.

The NPFAO will take action in accordance with paragraph 5 of

A-FN-105-001/A6-000 Chapter 49 and pass the claim to the accounting officer

for settlement in accordance with instruction issued by NDHQ/DPS. The host

unit is responsible for budgeting public funds to support this entitlement

for any reasonable costs.

GRANTS

68. Details covering grants provided under QR&O 210.37 and 210.375 for

the provision and maintenance of physical fitness and sports equipment are

contained in 210-20. These grants must be expended on equipment which

is for the benefit and use of the majority of members, and which is

complementary to that included in authorized scales of issue.

69. Funds are allocated for CF participation in the CISM program. The CF

National Office for CISM NDHQ/ DPERA is the controlling agency for these

funds.

70. Non-public funds may also be used for the procurement of necessary

sports equipment in support of sports programs conducted in accordance with

this order.

CHANNELS OF COMMUNICATION AND PROMULGATION OF INFORMATION

71. Direct communications on all matters pertaining to the conduct of

championship is authorized:

a. between bases and the applicable RSDs;

b. between RSDs and NDHQ/DPERA; and

c. between a base hosting a national championship and all RSDs, all

bases participating in the championship and NDHQ.

72. Communications on all matters pertaining to CISM competitions is

authorized as follows:

a. DGPS/DPERA is the only authorized agency that may deal directly

with the CISM Secretary General, CISM Academy, hosting nations,

and CISM liaison offices;

b. commands may deal directly with bases and stations in other

commands when coordinating team training matters; and

c. training sites must communicate through their commands unless

otherwise authorized.

73. A calendar of approved CF national sports championships and the host

base for each will be published annually in CFSOs.

74. RSDs shall forward particulars of their planned regional championships

and playoffs for national championships to NDHQ, other RSDs, each CHQ, and

to bases within their region.

75. Copies of minutes of regional meetings, reports of competitions,

calendars of activities, and any policy letters or instructions shall be

sent to NDHQ/DPERA and to all RSDs.

PUBLICITY

76. Publicizing individual and group achievement at all levels of sport

within the CF is an important and integral element of conducting a sports

competition. Individuals approved for competition and event organizers as

stated in Annexes B, D, G and J are to incorporate the various public

affairs and media tools described in A-AD-292-001/AG-001. Assistance may

also be obtained from regional information officers or through NDHQ/DG IFO.

SECTION 5 -- RESOURCES

EQUIPMENT

77. Primary equipment required for the conduct of the CF sports program is

authorized for issue in Canadian Forces Scales, Volume 2 (CFS-2).

78. CFS-2 has Forces-wide applications, but is not intended to preclude

COs from recommending the provision of additional equipment on

supplementary scales to meet special training requirements.

79. Teams and/or individuals representing Canada at CISM championships

will receive equipment and uniform support from public resources along with

instruction concerning the care and custody of any such equipment or

uniforms provided.

80. Civilian walking-out attire for CISM competition is the responsibility

of the competitor.

RENTAL OF FACILITIES

81. A unit which lacks adequate sports facilities may make application to

NDHQ/DPERA to rent non-DND owned accommodations at public expense.

Facilities rented under the auspices of this order from public funds shall

be used solely for the sports programs of serving members. Rental of

authorized facilities listed in Chapter 5 of A-PS-110-001/AG-002 shall be

restricted to physical education, recreation, and community services

facilities such as cross-country ski trails, outdoor skating rinks, outdoor

swimming pools, outdoor tennis courts, squash courts and racquetball courts

for approved sports programs, and also apply to all three categories of

facilities when they are required for the selection and preparation of

participants for Regional and National Sports Championships and CISM

competitions, as well as for the staging of such events.

82. The use of public funds to pay for the rental of facilities for

recreational use is not authorized under this order.

83. A fee for an individual or group membership shall not normally be

included in, or form part of, rental paid for training accommodation.

84. Although control of funds for facilities is delegated to unit level

under command arrangements, Deputy Minister approval is required before

funds may be expended for rental of sports training facilities under this

order. No commitment shall be made to any facility owner before receipt of

NDHQ approval.

85. Application for facility rental shall be submitted to CHQ on the form

shown in Annex F. CHQ shall review all requests and submit a consolidated

return to reach NDHQ/DPERA not later than 15 Feb each year.

86. Upon receipt of NDHQ approval, agreement forms or rental documentation

provided by the owner shall be signed by the CO on behalf of DND.

87. Payment for the rental of sports accommodation shall be arranged

locally through the appropriate officer of the Department of Supply and

Services.

OUT-SERVICE TRAINING

88. All members of the CF are eligible for selection to attend clinics,

courses, workshops or seminars conducted by recognized civilian sports

agencies to stay abreast of developments in the field and/or obtain

qualifications in officiating, coaching or managing sports activities. The

out-service training provisions of this order shall not be used in support

of educational upgrading described in 9-2.

89. The CO of a unit may approve an application containing information

listed in Annex G for training specified in paragr

[Richard]

quote:Originally posted by terpfan68

Richard,

Why do you attack people who are critical of the CSA? You have your experiences and we (more than just me.) have ours. In my emails to CSA I identified myself as a father of two of the members of the Women's Military Team. Why did you assume I was just another nameless a** h***? I'm certainly not hiding and I think The Ref probably isn't either. Have you ever been critical about the CSA on anything? Perhaps you could cite the postings so I can read them for myself. I started this thread to inform football fans in Canada about a group of young women who are serving their country and at the same time participating in football at the international level. When my daughters joined the Naval Reserve they didn't even know that this team existed. They joined because of the positive experience of their two older brothers. The Military is certainly not using it as a recruiting ploy. The Reserves and Regular forces are understaffed and although I wouldn't recommend enlisting for the sports program, it is nice to know that one is provided for competent athletes. (Competition is available in other team and individual sports.) Perhaps if more young people are aware of it the teams from Canada will also attract National Players like the teams from France and Germany. (I’m damn sure that the CSA would put a stop to THAT.)

I don't 'attack' people who are critical of the CSA though you obviously perceive it as such and I am as critical of the CSA as anybody else when I consider it appropriate. I do try to bring some balance to exchanges as there is invariably more to any one issue than the critics here are willing to concede. Constant harping, bitching and whining negativity achieves nothing except venting for the person concerned and further alienation of the folks at CSA (if they bother to read the forum, not sure I would in their shoes frankly) which is definitely counterproductive.

I assume that when you say you identified yourself to the CSA that you gave your name and address and did not just describe yourself as 'the father of two players'?

Credit to your daughter and sons for taking time out of their civilian careers to join the Reserves. I spent 15 years of my life in military service.

Why do the Canadian Forces PR folks not see fit to give this team and their participation in the international event the publicity you obviously think it deserves. I might add that I ran two stories about the team on www.bcsoccerweb.com but they were the only two stories I could find and they came from the OUA. The sponsoring organisation (Canadian Forces) certainly didn't do much for their team in that regard.

Good for you for starting this thread.

If you want to review my posting history in this forum be my guest but don't expect me to do the work for you.

[Richard]

DoyleG - why was it necessary to cut and paste that entire document into the thread when you were providing a link to it anyway?

[terpfan68]

Gee whiz, thanks for clearing that up Richard. I thought Doyle entered each keystroke one by one. Actually I haven't attacted the CSA. I just pointed out your need to defend at all cost to logic, the inability of the CSA to acknowledge an email. By the way my email address contains my initials and my last name AND if they checked the link I included in the email they would find that the roster contains only two players with the same last name and get this. It's also my last name. AND there is only one family in Winnipeg with the same exact last name. (I was really trying to remain unknown. I am anxiously awaiting how you will manage to make the CSA's failure to respond my fault. I've only only been posting for a little while so please stop saying that I am negative about the CSA. My niece (different last name ) is on the under 20 women's team currently in and Finland and I give them high praise for the overall Women's program.

Thanks for the postings on bcsocceweb.

And I do enjoy your reponses. Thinking up a reply gives me something to do while my wife is at pilates and until my daughters get home from Holland and rejoin their club team. If the win the MSA Cup maybe I will see you in Surrey at the Nationals. (That's right isn't it.)

Doyle

I will print out those regulations and read them. Thanks. It's nice to hear from someone who knows what they are talking about.

[terpfan68]

Recent results from the CISM (French acronym for International Council for Military Sports) World Military Games in Hyderabad, India have the Canadian Men losing to Republic of Ireland 4 - 1 and to Egypt 5 - 1 and the Canadian Women losing to The Netherlands 4 - 0. The Canadian Men beat out the U.S. to qualify from the Americas region along with Brazil. There are 11 participating teams on the men's side (one dropped out). Egypt is the reigning champion. The women's competition of 6 teams includes US, Holland, Germany, France and N. Korea. These world games are held every 4 years with competition in many sports. Military teams from over 100 countries with over 1000 participants.

http://mwg2007.org/index.jsp

This link will direct you to home page and then click on results.

Interestingly six members of the N. Korean Women's team have same last names and first initial of their World Cup Team. There are only a relatively few surnames in Korea so this could be a coincidence but having your players in the military is a good way to provide for their training and living expenses especially where there is no real professional league for the majority of women players. This Korean team beat a U.S. team (last years finalist in the world championship won by Holland) 4 - 1

[vpsoccer]

Many countries have a long tradition of taking internaitonal-caliber athletes into the military as a way of supporting them. They can legitimately serve as coaches and advisors when they are available, and train and compete on behalf of the military and the country. In Avery Brundage days it was a legitimate way to support "amateur" athletes so they could participate in the Olympics.

[Trillium]

Richard ..slags terpfan.. geez and terpfan begins to see how the CSA really does not get it at so so many levels...

I love how a bit of exposure and thought brings a new one along in their thinking..well done terpfan.. and i love how some can only cling to inconsistency... wait was Richard demanding someone name names ?

[terpfan68]

When I first started posting I noticed that Richard did not miss an opportunity to defend the CSA. Gradually though I have noticed a reluctant admission by him that perhaps some of the CSA's actions are not defendable. At least not by anyone with an ounce of brain matter. As an organization they leave a lot to be desired. I find that Richard's arguements are for the most part rational and well thought out. He does not attack just to attack like some posters and I believe he sees ways that the CSA could be improved. I particularly like his suggestions for open elections of half of the CSA Board.

I have 4 children in the Canadian Military. Two of my daughters are on the Canadian Military Women's Soccer team. One is in India competing and one is home with a torn ACL. These young women put a lot of effort in representing their country and it would be nice to see it recognized. The military provides support for this program but I think that the CSA could and should consider all aspects of soccer in Canada. Afterall isn't what their name implies.

[Richard]

I have asked this before here I believe and got no answer... In what way do you want these programs 'recognized' by the CSA any more than the CSA does the CIS or the USL?

[Vic]

It would be interesting to see the budget of Canada's military women's team (full cost including indirect overhead: military flights, equipment, lost salaries of the women while they're training/travelling/playing, coaching fees, physio, meals, etc).

How many women of playing age (18-42) are there in the military? Five thousand? Maybe ten? How many of them play soccer? 250? 350?

How truly strange that we have taxpayer funding for them but we have none for our women's U20 this year.

[terpfan68]

To Richard: Maybe a posting on their website acknowledging their existence. Perhaps the CIS and USL could be included too.

To Vic: The Military is not promoting soccer as such. They are promoting physical fitness, team play and morale. You would probably begrudge the city for providing volleyball nets for the local firstation. Let's put that money into the National Volleyball program.

[The Ref]

quote:Originally posted by terpfan68

When I first started posting I noticed that Richard did not miss an opportunity to defend the CSA. Gradually though I have noticed a reluctant admission by him that perhaps some of the CSA's actions are not defendable. At least not by anyone with an ounce of brain matter. As an organization they leave a lot to be desired. I find that Richard's arguements are for the most part rational and well thought out. He does not attack just to attack like some posters and I believe he sees ways that the CSA could be improved. I particularly like his suggestions for open elections of half of the CSA Board.

I have 4 children in the Canadian Military. Two of my daughters are on the Canadian Military Women's Soccer team. One is in India competing and one is home with a torn ACL. These young women put a lot of effort in representing their country and it would be nice to see it recognized. The military provides support for this program but I think that the CSA could and should consider all aspects of soccer in Canada. Afterall isn't what their name implies.

Congratulations for your family. You have to be a proud father for your children. Two of your daughters in the Military soccer team representing Canada, excellent! Wish a prompt recovery to your injured girl. And I agree with you they deserve recognition from not just the CSA but the media as well.

[Richard]

quote:Originally posted by terpfan68

To Richard: Maybe a posting on their website acknowledging their existence. Perhaps the CIS and USL could be included too.

Interesting viewpoint. During the last international military competition I searched for reports on DND websites about the team's progress and found nothing. Perhaps if DND or even the team personnel helped a bit with PR and sent the odd article to the CSA I suspect it would be published with alacrity. You want to be noticed, you have to do a bit of self promotion in this world, don't just sit back and wait for somebody else to do your work for you then complain when nobody notices you. The CIS and the USL do an excellent job of publicising themselves, they don't really need articles on the CSA website.

Perhaps because the DND focus is on fitness and teamwork not the game itself is why it doesn't provide the exposure you seek.

[Guest Ed]

quote:Originally posted by Vic

It would be interesting to see the budget of Canada's military women's team (full cost including indirect overhead: military flights, equipment, lost salaries of the women while they're training/travelling/playing, coaching fees, physio, meals, etc).

How many women of playing age (18-42) are there in the military? Five thousand? Maybe ten? How many of them play soccer? 250? 350?

How truly strange that we have taxpayer funding for them but we have none for our women's U20 this year.

I suppose you want the hockey equipment returned from Afghanistan as well? Oh hang on, that was mostly donated. Well, at least they should go out on patrol to make up the hours they waste playing shinny on the taxpayer's dime Twat.

[terpfan68]

Richard-- your right of course. DND could do something but I guess they have more important things to think about. Just because DND are not interested in Soccer doesn't mean the Canadian SOCCER Association shouldn't be.

[Richard]

quote:Originally posted by terpfan68

Richard-- your right of course. DND could do something but I guess they have more important things to think about. Just because DND are not interested in Soccer doesn't mean the Canadian SOCCER Association shouldn't be.

Well if soccer is important enough for DND to build into their program and fund to the extent they do then DND obviously considers the soccer program to be important enough. I doubt your daughters are expected to pay their own way on the soccer tours and happily take the paid time off their normal military duties to train, travel and compete.

I am also quite sure the CSA would gladly publish occasional highlight articles sent to them about the DND men's and women's soccer teams and so would www.bcsoccerweb.com. I don't think it unreasonable though for the CSA to leave it to the military or the team members themselves to routinely publicise their own programs, as do the CIS and USL for example. How about it?

Please don't misunderstand me, it is not my intention in this discussion to diminish in any way the DND soccer program or the contribution of the participating players, but sometimes you have to take the initiative to bring your efforts to the attention of others.

[Vic]

quote:

I suppose you want the hockey equipment returned from Afghanistan as well? Oh hang on, that was mostly donated. Well, at least they should go out on patrol to make up the hours they waste playing shinny on the taxpayer's dime Twat.

Yeah, that's right, I'm slagging the military, firemen, little Jimmy who donated his goalie pads, Grandma Sally in St. John's who wears red every Friday, and I piss on the Maple Leaf every Sunday. You got it all figured out. Except for the part about reading and understanding, but throw that out and you're doing great.

[loyola]

quote:Originally posted by Richard

Well if soccer is important enough for DND to build into their program and fund to the extent they do then DND obviously considers the soccer program to be important enough. I doubt your daughters are expected to pay their own way on the soccer tours and happily take the paid time off their normal military duties to train, travel and compete.

I am also quite sure the CSA would gladly publish occasional highlight articles sent to them about the DND men's and women's soccer teams and so would www.bcsoccerweb.com. I don't think it unreasonable though for the CSA to leave it to the military or the team members themselves to routinely publicise their own programs, as do the CIS and USL for example. How about it?

Please don't misunderstand me, it is not my intention in this discussion to diminish in any way the DND soccer program or the contribution of the participating players, but sometimes you have to take the initiative to bring your efforts to the attention of others.

I'm not sure I understand some of the comments here but are some people suggesting the CSA should take care of our military team? Do guys knows that we also have teams competing in a Lawyers world cup and Police/Firemen world cup as well (I'm pretty sure i'm missing a few). Should the CSA give publicity to those teams as well?

[Richard]

The CSA priority must be it's own teams and as we all know they struggle enough to publicise them and their activities never mind other (lesser) teams, leagues and tournaments that have their own organisations behind them that ought to be providing the publicity.

[The Ref]

quote:Originally posted by Richard

The CSA priority must be it's own teams and as we all know they struggle enough to publicise them and their activities never mind other (lesser) teams, leagues and tournaments that have their own organisations behind them that ought to be providing the publicity.

I know it is highly rare, but it does happen once in a blue moon that I agree with what old man Richard says. I think I am going to go out and buy myself a Lotto ticket, maybe the planets are lined up right.

[loyola]

quote:Originally posted by Richard

The CSA priority must be it's own teams and as we all know they struggle enough to publicise them and their activities never mind other (lesser) teams, leagues and tournaments that have their own organisations behind them that ought to be providing the publicity.

I agree. I just couldn't imagine that some people are asking for the CSA to promote teams outside of their organization like the military. What will be next, the Canadian Gay soccer team that attends the Gay Games?

[Richard]

So you do occasionally see sense yourself even eh Ref

[Richard]

quote:Originally posted by loyola

I agree. I just couldn't imagine that some people are asking for the CSA to promote teams outside of their organization like the military. What will be next, the Canadian Gay soccer team that attends the Gay Games?

I suspect the DND budget for fitness and sport and especially public relations is many orders of magnitude larger than the CSA's entire budget.

[terpfan68]

Wow, this all started because a year and a half ago I emailed the CSA with the pertinent information thinking perhaps naively that they might be interested in a group of young women who were representing their country in an international soccer competition. Needless to say I got no response from the CSA or their bulletin board. Then I commented on that fact on this forum and got a lot of excuses from Richard. I never asked them to promote the team, just a mention would have sufficed. Now coming out of the woodwork are those who would begrudge the military of spending any money at all on sport. I have no idea of what DND spends on fitness, sport or other wellness related items for our military but I do know that the members of these teams are actively serving their nation and to suggest that funds for these programs should be turned over to the CSA shows a real meanspirtedness.

For those who care. Canada lost to France 3 - 0 and will play the USA for fifth place on the 18th.