Bill Spiers Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 (Moderators: Not sure where this really belongs – we don’t have a general CSA administration section. However, feel free to move it if you feel a different section is more appropriate). I must have missed this while following the Alberta soap opera. However, the CSA governance reform proposals are now posted on the CSA web site. They consist of proposed By-Law changes based on the May 2010 governance reform proposals and two separate sets of By-Law changes based on the compromise proposal for implementation in 2011 or 2012. You can access the various documents by clicking on the links below. With the proposed By-Law changes, you need to page through the entire document to see the changes – highlighted in red. Agenda and Motions for Feb 5 2011 SGM 2010 AGM Framework Compromise Framework for 2011 Implementation Compromise Framework for 2012 Implementation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Think there's a problem with the links format, for what it's worth. The 2012 link is as follows: http://www.canadasoccer.com/documents/20110113_Compromise_Framework_2012_EN.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Spiers Posted January 21, 2011 Author Share Posted January 21, 2011 Think there's a problem with the links format, for what it's worth. The 2012 link is as follows: http://www.canadasoccer.com/documents/20110113_Compromise_Framework_2012_EN.pdf The links should all be working now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 I was glad to see Ontario sticking to their guns and insisting on the original reforms. From the interview with Billings he also doesn't like the watered down version. I hope enough people have seen what some of the CSA executive are doing against Alberta and punt those losers. Then maybe we can get back to the original reforms that sparked so much hope. Like I said last year when the original proposals came out this could be THE turning point for Canadian soccer. If we miss this we will not get another chance for another decade. The current bunch of CSA executives working against soccer reform are just hoping and praying that they can survive long enough to claim credit for the 3 clubs developing enough talent to get us back to the World Cup. Stick to your guns Ontario, help in on the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 I was glad to see Ontario sticking to their guns and insisting on the original reforms. From the interview with Billings he also doesn't like the watered down version. I hope enough people have seen what some of the CSA executive are doing against Alberta and punt those losers. Then maybe we can get back to the original reforms that sparked so much hope. Like I said last year when the original proposals came out this could be THE turning point for Canadian soccer. If we miss this we will not get another chance for another decade. The current bunch of CSA executives working against soccer reform are just hoping and praying that they can survive long enough to claim credit for the 3 clubs developing enough talent to get us back to the World Cup. Stick to your guns Ontario, help in on the way. We need Alberta, Quebec, and BC as well as Ontario onside with the original reforms to push them through. Although it won't be Billings, I hope the Alberta Reformers are out in force and in their rightful place running the ASA soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-collins Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Do we need Quebec? Not meaning to be exclusionary, but can they block it all on their own? I was under the impression that the others (Man/Sask/NB/NS/PEI) were more or less on board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Do we need Quebec? Not meaning to be exclusionary, but can they block it all on their own? I was under the impression that the others (Man/Sask/NB/NS/PEI) were more or less on board. I mostly want Quebec onside for solidarity purposes, the big four provinces going after reform together would signal a true changing of the guard across the nation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmcmurph Posted January 21, 2011 Share Posted January 21, 2011 Do we need Quebec? Not meaning to be exclusionary, but can they block it all on their own? I was under the impression that the others (Man/Sask/NB/NS/PEI) were more or less on board. No they can't block it on their own and hopefully they will come around to the same thinking that the others have. It is better for them to focus on Quebec and feeding players up to the soon to be MLS Montreal academies. In the end they know you can't serve 2 masters and I have more hope for them changing their position than MC in Alberta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoachRich Posted January 22, 2011 Share Posted January 22, 2011 MOD's can you start a separate section called Reform. It would be great to have so we can focus. Reform votes by PSO's need to be asked now to see how many have spoken to their PSO members. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill Spiers Posted January 24, 2011 Author Share Posted January 24, 2011 Read comments from Jason de Vos: Change on the horizon for Canadian Soccer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettermirror Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 MOD's can you start a separate section called Reform. It would be great to have so we can focus. Reform votes by PSO's need to be asked now to see how many have spoken to their PSO members. Just start a new thread Rich and you can set it up and edit the first post as you get the info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-collins Posted January 24, 2011 Share Posted January 24, 2011 Read comments from Jason de Vos: Change on the horizon for Canadian Soccer An interesting take, for sure. I'm surprised that he doesn't see the compromise as much of a change to the reform package. His rationale that provincial reps will soon tire of being on the board needs clarification. Just how will the board be prevented from addressing issues of provincial interest? I hope he answers your comment question, Bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trillium Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 I mostly want Quebec onside for solidarity purposes, the big four provinces going after reform together would signal a true changing of the guard across the nation. Solidarity accross the nation ? .... Please remember Quebec is its own nation, the FSQ, will be moving more and more away from the CSA... it was only recently Quebec held back fees from the CSA.... and the folks in the CSA presidents office looked the other way. The FSQ only makes decisions to its own benefit not for the greater good of soccer accross Canada, its focus is only inward and when it does anything external in Canada it is only done from the view of accomodating Quebec. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trillium Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Do all provinces pay their fair share of fees ? As part of reform are proposals to charge a fixed rate to each province not a per player fee. The problem is provinces like Manitoba do not register or pay for all the players playing ... for example they hide ... mini players and do not pay the eight dollar per player fee to the CSA for national teams. As long as presidents from Provinces .. hide players and avoid the fair payment of fees and the CSA lets them do it we will not have reform in Canadian Soccer. Real reform is... every club in Canada votes for CSA executive with direct elections. Every club in Canada pays its fee to the CSA for players registered. Anything less in not democratic sport reform. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kj52 Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Do all provinces pay their fair share of fees ? As part of reform are proposals to charge a fixed rate to each province not a per player fee. The problem is provinces like Manitoba do not register or pay for all the players playing ... for example they hide ... mini players and do not pay the eight dollar per player fee to the CSA for national teams. As long as presidents from Provinces .. hide players and avoid the fair payment of fees and the CSA lets them do it we will not have reform in Canadian Soccer. Real reform is... every club in Canada votes for CSA executive with direct elections. Every club in Canada pays its fee to the CSA for players registered. Anything less in not democratic sport reform. Calgary Minor Soccer Association also hides minis, a bone of contention for quite a while in Alberta. No one really knows how many across the province aren't paying fees to ASA/CSA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Unwillingness to pay these fees is a stark illustration of the abject failure of the provincial and national bodies to deliver perceived value for the monies paid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trillium Posted January 30, 2011 Share Posted January 30, 2011 Unwillingness to pay these fees is a stark illustration of the abject failure of the provincial and national bodies to deliver perceived value for the monies paid. No Richard its the abject failure of officials in who charge a mini player 175.00 and dont send eight dollars to the CSA your tacit approval of it ... puts you just about where I have always felt you are ... another one who claims to be in it for the kids ... but in never ever doing things to support the game. Its a horrible attitude you are displaying you really really need to check out your moral compass on this one and get your direction to change. Simple question Richard.... should every player in Canada be a registered player and pay his or her fee ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 I beg your pardon - so you are 100% behind the provincial associations and the CSA as they are now and the value they provide for the money they receive from youth and senior players across the country? Yes, every player should pay an appropriate fee of course for which they deserve value in return but there comes a time when enough is enough (as we are seeing in Tunisia and Egypt right now). I was merely expressing some sympathy for those who share similar attitudes to others who are disaffected with their leaders. I have to wonder just whose moral compass is defective after that post of yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-collins Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 That's it, blame the CSA. Do you withold federal taxes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 No, because I see reasonable value in return for my taxes for the most part so I have no objection to paying them and if I didn't feel that way I have a democratic option to cast my vote elsewhere at election time. Can't do that with the CSA as it is now constituted. And yes, I do blame the CSA. Isn't that why there is a CSA reform movement underway right now... if it wasn't broken it would not require fixing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trillium Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 I beg your pardon - so you are 100% behind the provincial associations and the CSA as they are now and the value they provide for the money they receive from youth and senior players across the country? Yes, every player should pay an appropriate fee of course for which they deserve value in return but there comes a time when enough is enough (as we are seeing in Tunisia and Egypt right now). I was merely expressing some sympathy for those who share similar attitudes to others who are disaffected with their leaders. I have to wonder just whose moral compass is defective after that post of yours. I have never said i was 100% behind the provinces and how they run... but I have never ever purported to support the game and not pay the appropriate fees, you apparently see value in running your website as a business but council organisations or at least condone people like Colin Innes in Calagary hiding registrants as noted above. You apparently condone Quebec not paying and Manitoba not registering mini players and paying the eight dollars per player fee. On that basis you bet I think your morally wrong and deficient. Difference is Richard I believe in doing things to improve the game and its governance. Simply question Richard . Do you believe every club in Canada should have a direct vote for CSA board of Directors ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul-collins Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 No, because I see reasonable value in return for my taxes for the most part so I have no objection to paying them and if I didn't feel that way I have a democratic option to cast my vote elsewhere at election time. Can't do that with the CSA as it is now constituted. And yes, I do blame the CSA. Isn't that why there is a CSA reform movement underway right now... if it wasn't broken it would not require fixing? Hang on. We're talking about CMSA here, right? We should be clear that the embodiment of the problem with CSA government is *from* CMSA, so they can't claim a moral reason for witholding. The other thing is, it's not a principled stand if you don't declare that you're doing it and why. It's a fraudulent stand. CMSA isn't witholding, they're hiding revenues. But if you are solid with Colin, declare it and at least we'll know where you stand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vic Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 C'mon guy's, you're three good people who love the game and the country. Don't get caught up in online b.s. Life's too short. There's a lot of graft everywhere in the system. There's also a lot of leanness and efficiency. To reference one of my favourites: It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness, it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity, it was the season of Light, it was the season of Darkness, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair, we had everything before us, we had nothing before us, we were all going direct to heaven, we were all going direct the other way - in short, the period was so far like the present period, that some of its noisiest authorities insisted on its being received, for good or for evil, in the superlative degree of comparison only. Hopefully one day we can streamline all this and get everyone in the same bus and organization so it's not a constant power struggle and petty fiefdoms. We're about as cohesive as the Balkans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterv Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 No Richard its the abject failure of officials in who charge a mini player 175.00 and dont send eight dollars to the CSA your tacit approval of it ... puts you just about where I have always felt you are ... another one who claims to be in it for the kids ... but in never ever doing things to support the game. Its a horrible attitude you are displaying you really really need to check out your moral compass on this one and get your direction to change. Simple question Richard.... should every player in Canada be a registered player and pay his or her fee ? If a Club gets money from minis then the Club should register them and pay the fees to the PSA. In turn the PSA shoulf pay fees for everyone it has registered. Otherwise the poeple who act properly end up paying for the freeloaders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redcoatsforever Posted January 31, 2011 Share Posted January 31, 2011 If a Club gets money from minis then the Club should register them and pay the fees to the PSA. In turn the PSA shoulf pay fees for everyone it has registered. Otherwise the poeple who act properly end up paying for the freeloaders. Yeah, if you really want to play organized soccer and not pay CSA fees, you basically have two "legit" options: 1) start a rogue league and face the wrath of the soccer establishment. 2) start a pick-up league with friends. Everyone else ought to be ponying up their fees to the PSA's and CSA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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