Strider Posted December 24, 2010 Share Posted December 24, 2010 Mariner emerges as candidate for Toronto FC job; ex New England assistant and Plymouth manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nolando Posted December 24, 2010 Share Posted December 24, 2010 Hmmmm...haven't you had your fill of lower-tier England types in Toronto, yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted December 24, 2010 Share Posted December 24, 2010 He was very much upper tier as a player and the Revolution seem to have taken a step back since he left. Think he is as good as TFC can reasonably expect right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BugerKing Posted December 24, 2010 Share Posted December 24, 2010 He ticks alot of boxes, MLS experience, played at a high level, managed in Europe, managed at the NCAA level. He would be an interesting fit. Just wonder if he'll fit into Klinsmann's search of a soccer culture for Toronto? Also can't blame Mariner for trying to jump off the literal and metaphorical sinking ship that is Plymouth Argyle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted December 24, 2010 Share Posted December 24, 2010 Hmmmm...haven't you had your fill of lower-tier England types in Toronto, yet? He was with Nicol for a good few years there and as I think Steve Nicol is a more than decent manager maybe he isn't such a strange pick for Klinsmann & co. Think Jurgen's job would be made easier if TFC had a bit more cash to splash around but I don't think Trader Mo had left too much allocation money in the kitty before he got the chop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted December 24, 2010 Share Posted December 24, 2010 Allocation money has an expiry date so it is very much a case of use it or lose it, for what it's worth, regardless of who is GM. At one point everything with TFC was down to the fieldturf according to some, then it was Mo, eventually people are probably going to have to come to terms with the fact that following an MLS team will lead to more disappointments than triumphs because it isn't possible to simply buy success the way teams can over in Europe. Jurgen Klinsmann's arrival is nothing more than a holding pattern in PR terms before that reality leads to a lot of fairweather types jumping off the bandwagon unless of course there is a miraculous turnaround over the next 12 months. More realistic to give whoever comes in a full two seasons to build their roster as they see fit but as long as the agenda is being set by the crazy mood swings on fangroup messageboards (mainly RPB) that is no sure thing as Preki found out the hard way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted December 24, 2010 Share Posted December 24, 2010 Allocation money has an expiry date so it is very much a case of use it or lose it, for what it's worth, regardless of who is GM. At one point everything with TFC was down to the fieldturf according to some, then it was Mo, eventually people are probably going to have to come to terms with the fact that following an MLS team will lead to more disappointments than triumphs because it isn't possible to simply buy success the way teams can over in Europe. Jurgen Klinsmann's arrival is nothing more than a holding pattern in PR terms before that reality leads to a lot of fairweather types jumping off the bandwagon unless of course there is a miraculous turnaround over the next 12 months. More realistic to give whoever comes in a full two seasons to build their roster as they see fit but as long as the agenda is being set by the crazy mood swings on fangroup messageboards (mainly RPB) that is no sure thing as Preki found out the hard way. I am certainly no fan of RPB but I think their percentage of the blame for the completely incompetent way in which Preki went about his job at TFC or even at the sport management failures of the club in general is 0%. In Mo and Preki, MLSE hired two idiots to run the club and that has nothing to do with the fans. That is like blaming Leafs fans for all the idiotic decisions made by Harold Ballard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Posted December 24, 2010 Share Posted December 24, 2010 As far as Toronto FC's search for a new head coach is concerned, beggars can't be choosers. They can only choose from those who are interested in the job, mostly coaches who were fired from their last job for incompetence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted December 25, 2010 Share Posted December 25, 2010 I am certainly no fan of RPB but I think their percentage of the blame for the completely incompetent way in which Preki went about his job at TFC.... This is a strawman argument to a certain extent given what I wrote was based more on the messageboard than the fan group. Beyond that we will never know what Preki could have achieved if he had been given the two full seasons to turn things around that Sigi Schmid was given at Columbus. I suspect that lack of patience has made the hunt for a new head coach significantly more difficult because many potential candidates for the job can see that being connected with TFC is a potential career killer right now given the gap between the reality of the situation and the expectation level of what should be routinely achievable amongst the fanbase and MLSE's focus on doing whatever will boost ticket and merchandise sales in the short term due to a complete lack of soccer knowledge at the corporate level. Paul Mariner is as good an option as can reasonably be expected and I'd be more than happy to see him appointed even though I still would prefer Colin Clarke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Posted December 25, 2010 Author Share Posted December 25, 2010 I was watching Gerry Dobson's interview of Jürgen Klinsmann yesterday and he seemed to indicate a knowledge of MLS was vital in any new coach due to the convoluted nature of MLS rules. He was very much upper tier as a player and the Revolution seem to have taken a step back since he left. Think he is as good as TFC can reasonably expect right now. Likely at this point many New England Revolution fans would trade Steve Nicol straight up for Paul Mariner: the mind behind the man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ag futbol Posted December 26, 2010 Share Posted December 26, 2010 I'll say that if Mariner is "the best we can get right now" and all we are getting, I'm disappointed. MLS is changing, what worked in the past will probably not work in the future. It's not enough anymore to take a roster of under-talented players and grind them to a pulp playing a rigid defensive system. The best result that ever produced for our former coach was a first round playoff loss in any case. Teams are making serious investments in their staff to gain a competitive advantage and I don't think the hiring of Paul Mariner (without a GM to boot) really has us keeping up with what other teams have done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted December 26, 2010 Share Posted December 26, 2010 ...I don't think the hiring of Paul Mariner (without a GM to boot) really has us keeping up with what other teams have done. You mean like Gary Smith being hired by the Colorado Rapids or Schellas Hyndman being hired by FC Dallas? After what was done to Preki (judged a failure before he had time to put the roster he wanted together) why would the top candidates in MLS experience terms want to come to TFC right now? Beyond that I think people have an unrealistic expectation level of where MLS teams fit into the pecking order internationally. Somebody from one of the larger European or Latin American countries with a career heading in the right direction is unlikely to be interested once you move beyond the Galaxy and RBNY and even with those two it probably stretches credulity. TFC have a fan base that often seem to have an expectation level that they should be able to follow a club that is a clone of Manchester United or Liverpool that people look up to in awe when in reality TFC are really more of an Oldham Athletic or a Tranmere Rovers in terms of where they fit into the pecking order in global terms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien1555362290 Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 BringBackTheBlizzard's comments against the RPB are always going to be biased since he left the group in anger back in May 2008 when the RPB message board changed software. Regarding Mariner, I hope he's hired soon as time is running out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 Tread carefully Damian. I've never spilled the beans on some of the things that happened in the build up to that. My anger was with a very limited number of people not with the entire group. Hence why I have had zero problem standing in 112 since then or visiting Shoeless Joe's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien1555362290 Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 ^ and be careful about placing blame on supporters groups for Toronto FC's front office failures. Nice blog by the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 It's obvious you haven't understood the comment I made above. I wasn't blaming fan groups I was blaming the front office for being overly-influenced by the crazy mood swings of posters on certain messageboards many of them registered users in an RPB context, hence the disclaimer on your messageboard about posts not necessarily representing the views of the fangroup. Wasn't pleased with TFC's failure to stay the course with Preki (Mo's firing I had no problem with), who I think would have got there eventually in terms of playoff success like Sigi Schmid did with Columbus (easier for the Crew to stay the course obviously during bad runs of form because they had almost no hardcore fans at the time), and suspect that lack of patience has made it harder than it otherwise might have been to find a suitable replacement with prior MLS experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien1555362290 Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 ^ Although you're right about them needing to give more time to a coach, Preki and Mo seemed pretty tight so letting them go simultaneously may have been the right decision. Also, I think the decision to fire Preki may have been inspired from complaining team members (likely DeRo and DeGuz, and quite possibly Brennan). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 The other point I've been making, which ties into this, is the lack of soccer knowledge at the corporate level in MLSE. It came down to Preki vs Dasovic. The long term strategic thinking sort of thing to do in that situation is to back the coach at least until the end of the season so it looks like he got a fair shake so other potential coaches don't get a bad impression of TFC as potential employers. The last thing you want to do is appoint an assistant who appears to have just undermined his boss to get him ousted. I suspect they had no clue who was right and who was wrong but read the boards saw a lot of discontent, realized season ticket renewal was imminent and pressed the panic button. What's really needed is somebody like Bob Lenarduzzi to fill Tom Anselmi's role so informed decisions can be made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Damien1555362290 Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 I wonder for the Rogers deal to buy MLSE ever comes to fruition, if Anselmi would stick around. Even if it doesn't will he ever get the axe if TFC continues to fail on the field? Doubt it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BringBackTheBlizzard Posted December 27, 2010 Share Posted December 27, 2010 Best bet maybe is Anselmi takes Peddie's job and they get somebody new in under him to look after TFC. Problem is there are very few qualified people in Canadian soccer to do what Lenarduzzi does in Vancouver. The Klinsmann thing was quite a clever way of dealing with the issue in the short term and hopefully they do realize that something needs to be done on a more permanent basis. Anyhoo, getting very late where I am right now on the other side of the international dateline so over and out on this for the rest of today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Havoc88 Posted December 29, 2010 Share Posted December 29, 2010 Beyond that we will never know what Preki could have achieved if he had been given the two full seasons to turn things around that Sigi Schmid was given at Columbus. Pretty good odds it would have been a first round playoff exit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TFCRegina Posted December 29, 2010 Share Posted December 29, 2010 Pretty good odds it would have been a first round playoff exit. Much win in this comment... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
narduch Posted December 30, 2010 Share Posted December 30, 2010 Pretty good odds it would have been a first round playoff exit. Maybe in 2011. TFC wasn't making the playoff in 2010 even with Preki. They were already too far out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest mianjo Posted December 30, 2010 Share Posted December 30, 2010 Just to let you know a rumour on PASOTI http://www.pasoti.co.uk/talk/viewtopic.php?t=49766 says Mariner has left and is on his way to Toronto. Also he has asked to be released by Argyle http://www.pafc.co.uk/page/NewsDetail/0,,10364~2254326,00.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strider Posted December 30, 2010 Author Share Posted December 30, 2010 It sounds like it was a nightmare over there: "We haven't been paying the guy(breach of contract)"..."with a £9m debt"..."basically moving us towards Administration, so when an Adminstrator is appointed, we have no real assets to sell..."..."...the board who have put us into this position with their gross mismanagement of the club."..."The ground is mortgaged up to the hilt and our other assets are negligible compared to the size of the debt."..."He was curtailed by all sorts of issues right from the start as a manager and it was a crazy idea to have his former boss upstairs creeping around sticking the knife in." Generally, the fans are wishing him well: "Mariner has been dignified throughout this whole sorry mess; he has always had time for the fans and has genuinely done his best for the club. Plus, he is our best ever player. Good luck Paul..." The fact he had time for the fans is hopeful for TFC fans and Plymouth Argyle fans generally wish him well: "I can't do anything else than wish Paul Mariner the best of luck. He deserves that." "Paul Mariner tried his very best & kept his dignity..." "gutted, i liked the man, he wanted to be here too" ...interesting that John Carver was his assistant, though now at Sheffield United. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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