Who do I strangle at the CSA?

[Michael Crampton]

I don't know if this has been brought up by others and I apologise if it has but I was so frustrated earlier today that I have to get this off my chest.

Sometimes the people running Canadian soccer just make me want to cry.

Seriously, I had been planning to organize a bus trip from the Burlington/Hamilton area for my friends and I (mostly guys from my rec team plus whoever else wanted to fill out the bus) to see the Canada-Belize match on June 13th. I was pretty pumped about the event being that the MNT hasn't played in Canada in years, the match was actually in Ontario, and there is a lot of fresh new talent that has a chance to break into the team off of that great run at the World Youth Championships. Not to mention that with opposition like Belize we should really be fairly confident of winning so it all sounded like one big party.

I had even gone so far as to get quotes on bus charters and was ready to order the tickets when I thought of one last thing as an after-thought: the Euro 2004 Finals are in June. Surely, the smart people at the CSA must have avoided a bigtime scheduling conflict with this glorious spectacle of international football (generally better viewing than the World Cup IMHO). Lo and behold they didn't. Not just that but in, for me at least, the worst possible way.

WHY THE HELL DID THE CSA SCHEDULE THIS MATCH SO THAT IT DIRECTLY CONFLICTS WITH THE FRANCE-ENGLAND MATCH?

Canada kicks-off at 2pm. From what I can tell from the UEFA website France-England takes place at 7:45pm in Portugal - 2:45pm ET by my reckoning!

WHO IS THE MORON RESPONSIBLE FOR THIS?

Look, I'm an England supporter. Before you go and get all righteous I'm a Canada supporter first. The point is I shouldn't have to be choosing between following one of my teams in a major final and another of my teams as it starts it's World Cup qaulification bid. France-England is one of the three, arguabely the best, glamour ties of the first round of Euro 2004 (Germany-Holland and Spain-Portugal being the others). Anyone who considers themselves a real follower of international football should want to watch this match. It will undoubtabley be on free TV. Why would you want to compete against that?

It's not like the CSA can claim they didn't know about this because the draw and schdule were made up by the end of 2003. How hard is it to realize that if they want to get exposure of the MNT and earn sponsorship money competing against EURO 2004 is not a good idea? It's like they don't want people to see the Canada match. Will Sportsnet even broadcast the match if it has to compete with France-England on TSN? AARRRRGGHH!

Look, June 13th is about one week away from the longest day of the year. You can't tell me that the Canada match couldn't be played in the evening here. It doesn't take a marketing genius to realize that promoting the match as the conclusion to a great day of international soccer (there's another Euro 2004 match earlier in the day before France-England) would be a lot easier than competing with a match this big. Then fans like me (and those who like to watch the big matches regardless of who's in them) could get to Kingston early, party all day at a local pub showing the match AND cheer on Canada after. That sounds like fun. That sounds sensible. THAT SOUNDS LIKE THE OBVIOUS DECISION!

Like I said: if this came up before I'm sorry but this is killing me. In the end I'll probably still go to Kingston and be happy with watching the tale-end of the England match. Please, somebody tell me that I've screwed up these dates though.

Mike.

[Varsity Tyler]

First off, I'm glad that you're still considering Canada's match in light of the Euro tournament that's going on at the same time. I hope that if you do arrange a bus, or even if it's just yourself that's going, that you order your tickets for the general admission side. We can always use more voices to help spur the Voyageurs' section.

I think you're preaching to the wrong group. When it comes down to it this is a Canadian board, and not too many of us are going to coinsider any event other than the match in Kingston. You have to remember that it's been a long haul since November, 2000. That being said, many people will be on the fence just like you indicated. Here's hoping that the conflict will not significantly impact the turnout at the gate. Being that the match is in Kingston, I'm quietly optimistic that the game will sell out the small venue.

What does concern me is the coverage that the match will get. Canada's games have enough difficulty making it into the papers and on the television shows at the best of times. We don't need England-France stealing our thunder.

[Cheeta]

Coverage is a concearn. If it comes down to Canada-Belize or England-France I'll put a couple of loonies on England-France being broadcast live. This isn't ment to be disprespectful to Canada or Belize. It's just that the result to most everyone is a foregone conclusion and the quality just won't compete with England-France.

Three years and change since the last home match or no, I think there are a few Voyageurs who're gonna skip this one for the same reasons. Not because they don't want to attend, or it's cost prohibative but simply because it's pretty hard to get time off work and if they're gonna have to miss one home match this year, it's going to be Canada-Belize.

And yes, you'd think any event organizer worth their weight would be fully aware of the EURO schedule. Would try to use that schedule to their promotional advantage and avoid any conflicts which may result. For whatever reasons this hasn't happened. There may be good reasons. But we don't know.

[Gian-Luca]

Coverage of the match itself won't be a concern (or shouldn't be), because Canada vs. Belize will be on Sportsnet & Euro2004 should be on TSN (who always broadcast the European cup matches). I doubt that Sportsnet will refrain from showing Canada's matches simply because another station is showing European soccer.

Let's keep in mind that the CSA must hold this match sometime on this weekend, because FIFA & Concacaf require them to - that's the way the World Cup draw went, and that is the effect of the International Calendar. They don't have much choice in the matter. Let's also keep in mind that I think the CSA are expecting a lot of out of towners from Toronto, Ottawa, Montreal etc. to make the trip into Kingston - there are already buses & car loads planned from each of these cities. Holding the matches in the evening is going to mean that people will be forced to either drive back tired in the middle of the night or grab a hotel, and considering the expense or inconvenience involved in both I could see a lot of people not really wanting to bother - I would make the effort, but I know that several people that planning on coming with me to this very match scheduled at 2pm wouldn't. Especially if the match is going to be on tv (and there's no reason to think it shouldn't be). I think the CSA has to take that into account & scheduling the match during the day at a time when it is perfectly convenient to drive for a couple of hours in the morning, attend the match during the day & drive back at night makes a lot of sense to me. If Euro 2004 is going on the whole weekend it isn't likely they would be able to avoid any potential conflicts unless they schedule the matches in the evening - and once again, you have the same problems mentioned above. I think as an event organizer you want to first take into account the convenience of people actually attending the match, and then worry about what else is on the tv dial.

[Gian-Luca]

Of course, there is something that could come in the way of live TV coverage, that being the Toronto Blue Jays, who are owned by Rogers (who also own Sportsnet). But if that happens yet again I doubt that tv coverage of Euro 2004 on another station will have anything to do with it.

[François]

I agree with Tyler, it's Canada first on this board and we haven't seen «les rouges» in such a long time. Would you rather watch France beat England on TV or watch our boys live in Kingston in the Voyageurs section. For me, their is no contest. I'm heading to Kingston!

I will be watching the France-England game on tape when I get home in Montreal. It's gonna be a great day!!!

[jonovision]

I think this is pretty typical. Afternoon games are better than night games for soccer, particularly considering the facilities we have. The dates themselves, I think, are chosen by CONCACAF so the CSA is off the hook in that department. I remember when I was at the Canada-Cuba match at the Winnipeg Soccer Complex back in 2000 there was a gaggle of German fans beside me talking about the Germany match (Euro 2000) that they were missing to attend that decidedly lacklustre game in progress.

[canadiankick97]

Guys, the game is at 4:30!!! It says so on my ticket and on the CSA's website!!!!

[torontosupport]

I seem to recall it starting at 2:00pm or something. Did we all have the same collective hallucination?

In regards to the CSA, I'm more upset that there has been no announcement as to whether the game is actually happening or not, re: Belize suspension. I know everyone here is confident that it'll go ahead, but I'd like to hear that from our national soccer governing body.

I got tickets anyway, wah-hey!

[mattbin]

Um, guys, aren't you forgetting that there's a great Canadian player playing for England too?

Anyone? Hello?

Signed,

The mainstream Canadian media

[mattbin]

Um, guys, aren't you forgetting that there's a great Canadian player playing for England too?

Anyone? Hello?

Signed,

The mainstream Canadian media

[Bxl Boy]

I didn't read the whole thread, just the first message and I totally agree.

What could the CSA have done ???

Let's think... one second

Spent money (yes) to put a giant screen in the stadium, if they expect a lot of people.

Brodcast France - England (and, why not, the other Euro game before)

And the, give the kick off of the Canada game

The tickets would maybe have been a little more expansive, and they would have made some great soccer party

And win a lot of money on beers and other drinks (if they are able to organize that in a decent way, I doubt, but I'm too optimistic... Am I ?)

[Bxl Boy]

I didn't read the whole thread, just the first message and I totally agree.

What could the CSA have done ???

Let's think... one second

Spent money (yes) to put a giant screen in the stadium, if they expect a lot of people.

Brodcast France - England (and, why not, the other Euro game before)

And the, give the kick off of the Canada game

The tickets would maybe have been a little more expansive, and they would have made some great soccer party

And win a lot of money on beers and other drinks (if they are able to organize that in a decent way, I doubt, but I'm too optimistic... Am I ?)

[DJT]

quote:Originally posted by torontosupport

In regards to the CSA, I'm more upset that there has been no announcement as to whether the game is actually happening or not, re: Belize suspension. I know everyone here is confident that it'll go ahead, but I'd like to hear that from our national soccer governing body.

There is nothing for the CSA to say because Belize has not been suspended by FIFA/CONCACAF, so the game is still on.

The talk of suspension amongst fans and media stems from two facts: the Belizean government has interfered with the Football Federation of Belize, and this type of interference often results in suspension. So really it's all speculation right now. I think CONCACAF and/or FIFA have sent people to Belize in order to investigate the situation, but I don't think there has been any official statement from these organizations yet.

[Gian-Luca]

Sorry, but I don't think the Giant Screen idea is feasible nor desirable in the slightest. Why would the CSA bother spending the money (which they don't even have) putting up a giant screen at Richardson Stadium (which I think would be very expensive, considering the venue) when you are going to get a sell-out of the 10,000 seat venue for the Canada match without doing so anyway? Spend the money on some badly needed friendlies instead.

And frankly I'm not sure I'd want to have any Euro2004 match on a big screen (even ones involving Italy) when the game is on, or even before it while the players are training. I'd rather watch the players (& cheer them on) practising before the match than have everybody ignore them. If the Euro matches are broadcast early enough that they take place before the players even get on to the field to practice, nobody will be in the stands anyway, which would defeat the purpose of spending the money on the giant screen.

Sorry to shoot down the idea, but it just isn't realistic.

[Mimglow]

My three cents:

I am really disappointed that the France - England match is happening on the same date. That was the key matchup of the first round for most Canadians, considering France and England are the founding nations of this great country.

Having said that, there isn't much the CSA could have done, and it just goes to show how quick people on this board attack the governing body.

[Michael Crampton]

Okay, it appears that I may have got some info that would let the CSA of the hook. Someone has told me that the time difference between Ontario and Portugal is 4 hours not 5 (even though my atlas seemed to say differently). From the the UEFA website the kickoff for France-England is 7:45pm local time so if the time difference is 4 hours and not 5 then kickoff our time would be 3:45 meening that if I run from the game to a bar I'll only miss the first part of the first half... still kinda screws my bus plans though so maybe I'll still end up taping the game instead. So does anyone know for sure what the time difference is?

Mike.

[drewsome]

On the Same thought, Is there any way the Lynx could bump their start time to 7:30? All people to have a Day of the World's Game? A difference of 90 minutes isn't that much.

[Michael Crampton]

Now for some replies.

quote:I think you're preaching to the wrong group. When it comes down to it this is a Canadian board, and not too many of us are going to coinsider any event other than the match in Kingston. You have to remember that it's been a long haul since November, 2000. That being said, many people will be on the fence just like you indicated. Here's hoping that the conflict will not significantly impact the turnout at the gate. Being that the match is in Kingston, I'm quietly optimistic that the game will sell out the small venue.

Oh, I'm sure there's enough people in Kingston who will barely even be aware that EURO 2004 is happening to fill the stadium. The thing is it's still a real poke in the eye for fanatics like myself who like to watch all the big games AND support Canada. As for fence-sitters I would go even farther and say that there is a large group of people, many of my friends among them, who would only barely consider watching Canada at the best of times who would laugh in your face if you suggested that they skip France-England to watch Canada. Voyageurs may not like it but I seem to meet a lot more of these people - more and more of them native born I should point out - who think that real soccer is something you watch on TV on Saturday mornings than I ever do Canada supporters, A-League fans, or CPSL fans. With the growth of satelite TV soccer they're a giant market that you have to reach out to.

quote:What does concern me is the coverage that the match will get. Canada's games have enough difficulty making it into the papers and on the television shows at the best of times. We don't need England-France stealing our thunder.

Exactly, before England-France is Croatia-Switzerland. The kickoff for that match is either 12pm or 1pm (depending on what the time difference is). Why would the CSA want to compete with these games? Canada is full of Croatians and a growing legion of soccer fanatics who will now be less likely to tune in. I know the CSA didn't set the date but they do control the time.

quote:I think as an event organizer you want to first take into account the convenience of people actually attending the match, and then worry about what else is on the tv dial.

A very noble sentiment to be sure but unfortunately that's not how modern sports works. The NHL is the weakest major sports league in North America precisely because it followed that sort of strategy from the 60's to the 80's. The NFL on the other hand, nearly from its inception, has catered to the needs of TV. The result is that the NFL is now more popular than baseball and has become a Sunday afternoon cultural institution in the US.

Furthermore, I would argue that it is really only the hardcore supporters (like those on these boards) who are likely to travel from Toronto, Ottawa, and Montreal. These are the sort of people willing to do what it takes to see their team yet will still likely make up a small percentage of the fans there. I would bet that most 'casual' fans will be from the Kingston area and they would certainly have no problem with an evening kickoff. In the final analysis 10,000 people in the stadium means nothing compared to a nationwide TV audience. It's all about exposure and with the game going up against a match as big as France-England that can't do anything but hurt exposure.

quote:Would you rather watch France beat England on TV or watch our boys live in Kingston in the Voyageurs section. For me, their is no contest. I'm heading to Kingston!

We'll see about that France beating England bit but you've got to remember that realistically we're the minority amongst people who follow soccer in Canada.

quote: I think this is pretty typical. Afternoon games are better than night games for soccer, particularly considering the facilities we have.

Unless you're playing in the middle of July or August. This is a June date so I'll grant you that it's borderline. Now November at night in Edmonton? I'll leave that for the hockey fans.

quote:Having said that, there isn't much the CSA could have done, and it just goes to show how quick people on this board attack the governing body.

They might not set the date but they certainly set the time. Looking at the EURO 2004 schedule doesn't seem like to much to ask. I honestly think that this is a missed opportunity to help >promote< the game. France-England is going to have a lot of viewers. All Sportsnet would have to do is find a way to get them to flip over from TSN after that match ends. That is, if the Canada match was in the evening.

Mike.

[Guest Ed]

Haven't had a home game in over 3 years and you clowns are complaining it conflicts with a Euro 2004 contest.

Stay home and watch your Euro games on TV and give up your spots in Kingston for Cdn supporters.

[sstackho]

quote:Originally posted by BHTC Mike

Okay, it appears that I may have got some info that would let the CSA of the hook. Someone has told me that the time difference between Ontario and Portugal is 4 hours not 5 (even though my atlas seemed to say differently). From the the UEFA website the kickoff for France-England is 7:45pm local time so if the time difference is 4 hours and not 5 then kickoff our time would be 3:45 meening that if I run from the game to a bar I'll only miss the first part of the first half... still kinda screws my bus plans though so maybe I'll still end up taping the game instead. So does anyone know for sure what the time difference is?

Trust your atlas. Portugal is 5 hours ahead of Eastern time. The only exception to this is the occasional week in which Daylight Savings Time kicks in at different times. June is not one of these times.

19:45:00 Sun Jun 13 2004 in Europe/Lisbon converts to

14:45:00 Sun Jun 13 2004 in US/Eastern

The England-France match should end around 4:45pm EDT, and kick-off of Canada-Belize is 4:30pm. Oh well.

[Mimglow]

I guess I'm just a poseur, even though I travelled 9 hours to Boston to support Canada in the Gold Cup, making it my only vacation of last summer.

I guess since I'm just a poseur, I'll give up my seat and let a real fan support Canada.

I guess since I'm just a poseur, I'll drop my organization of a bus from Ottawa for Canada supporters. Maybe I'll try and divert casual fans who I convinced into making the trek with me to Kingston into watching the France-England match in my living room.

I guess since I'm just a poseur, I'll quit the pool I run for the Voyageurs when Canada plays.

NEWS-F*CKING-FLASH:

It's possible to be passionate about Canada AND other soccer being played.

[canadiankick97]

quote:Originally posted by BHTC Mike

Okay, it appears that I may have got some info that would let the CSA of the hook. Someone has told me that the time difference between Ontario and Portugal is 4 hours not 5 (even though my atlas seemed to say differently). From the the UEFA website the kickoff for France-England is 7:45pm local time so if the time difference is 4 hours and not 5 then kickoff our time would be 3:45 meening that if I run from the game to a bar I'll only miss the first part of the first half... still kinda screws my bus plans though so maybe I'll still end up taping the game instead. So does anyone know for sure what the time difference is?

Mike.

Did you hear me say that Canada vs Belize is at 4:30 not 2:30? Read everyone elses post except mine, yeah thanks.

[beachesl]

"Can't we get along......caaaaaan't we all just get along?"

[Cheeta]

Oooohhh.

Hey Mimglow, nice. I'm proud of you there, son. 1st class.

Guy plays hookie one day and everything seems to sound like the shop floor.

Excellent counter, MA. Suck it up! Ever work in the auto industry?

Hey, here's a fav around work everyone's free to borrow. Best delivered through the side of your mouth a-la Jean Chretien. Don't you fu'king worry about it! A little pointing finger complements it nicely I think.

Damn. Gotta go. I miss all the good parties...