beachesl Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 Hanging out with Holger Canada's soccer coach, the plain-spoken German Holger Osieck, says he doesn't miss his homeland And he's no dumb jock: His favourite authours are Goethe and Shakespeare After an exhaustive search, the Canadian Soccer Association selected the tough, no-nonsense Holger Osieck as its World Cup coach and technical director in 1998. He beat out some 100 applicants for the job. Osieck started his playing career with Schalke in the German Bundesliga in 1958 and joined Vancouver Whitecaps of the now-defunct North American Soccer League in 1977. The Star spoke to Osieck in his sparsely furnished office at the Coffee Time Centre in Vaughan where he was spending time on the telephone talking to his European-based players. He finally managed to get the players he wanted for the Gold Cup tournament that begins in the U.S. this weekend. Canada opens against Costa Rica on Saturday. Q What do you miss most about Germany now that you have been here a few years? A Well, actually I don't miss anything about Germany because whatever I want I can get here. I feel very comfortable and enjoy it. So I don't miss Germany at all. Q What was your impression of the game in this country when you first came to play for the Whitecaps? A The NASL started to boom at the time and there were a number of great names from Europe and South America and it was definitely a pleasure to play against them. Q What was it like playing against the likes of Franz Beckenbauer, Johan Cruyff and Pele? A Beckenbauer was a hero in my home country and I was honoured to be on the same field with him and Pele in one of the last games that Pele played. When the New York Cosmos came to Vancouver we were fortunate that day to beat them 5-3. That was a great experience. Q Have you been to watch the Argos, Raptors or the Leafs? A I like hockey so I have been to see the Leafs a couple of times and thoroughly enjoyed it. I also went to a couple of Raptors games, but I haven't watched the Argos yet. Q Apart from soccer, is there another sport you enjoy? A Well, actually it is a game I don't know how to play but which I like very much ... it is golf (bursts into laughter). It is a great challenge and I hope that someday I will hit the ball a bit better. I also like hockey, but did not play the game. The area where I grew up had a moderate climate and there were no indoor facilities and rinks like today. So I concentrated on soccer. Q How did it feel coming from a powerhouse like Germany to coach in Canada? A Well, as I said when I started it was not a decision made by my head but my heart. I thought it was a good challenge to work on the overall structure, the coaching development and youth development. Q Does your job take you out of your office often? A I do a lot of in-country travelling and on top of that we have numerous away games. I can tell you that I have a lot of air miles (loud laughter) as I think I am away more than three months in a year. It is part of the job and I don't mind it. Q If your children were good enough, would you like them to play for Germany or Canada? A Well, I don't know, but the answer is pretty easy. We are not Canadian citizens so they wouldn't be eligible. They play the game for fun. Q Will soccer ever become big-league in Canada? A If you look at the general interest, there are many people who play the game. There are all kinds of opportunities to become a top sport, that is for sure. Q What do you do in your spare time? A I like to talk to people. Reading is definitely one of the favourite occupations that I have. Actually, I like to read some classical stuff, like Goethe, one of Germany's most famous poets and writers. I even read a lot of Shakespeare. I enjoy the King Richard trilogy and how he suffered during his reign; how he was dethroned just because he was a weak king. Don't get the idea that I am some kind of an intellectual. I just seem to enjoy these two authors ... Q Do you read anything that is written about you? A Well, basically I don't read the fan chat sites because people just don't know what is going on and they don't know why some decisions have to be made ... therefore, why should I bother? Of course, it doesn't mean that nobody makes mistakes. That is a different story. People do not know about the struggles one has to go through to put a team together because of injuries, etc. Q Do you get upset about things said about your coaching? A Not in particular. But I do get upset with negative stuff and when people talk about things that aren't true. I don't like it because it happened a lot during my playing days, so I avoided reading papers. Well, I actually read game reports because of the facts. I don't read features or columns by any journalist. Q What would you be doing, if you weren't coaching the national team? A I definitely would not be a golf pro for sure (laugh). Actually, I don't know ... maybe a teacher or a journalist. But I would have been in soccer in some capacity. Q What is or are your most prized possessions? A Well, my wife (Elisabeth), my two kids (Bjorn and Verena) and my dog Daisy (German Shepherd). I think family life is very important as it gives you strength to do your job. The other prized possessions I have are the World Cup medal and a 12-inch replica of the World Cup trophy that was presented to us by the German federation. Q When you go on vacation are you the adventurous type or do you like to relax? A I travel a lot and I like to enjoy myself. But I am not the lazy vacationer. I like to play golf with my wife, but resting in the sense of doing nothing is out. Q You must have found the atmosphere in some of the places you coached pretty intimidating? A It was pretty hot in Marseille. In Turkey you were well protected by police and some places by soldiers as well. We had a situation once in Turkey which was awkward. We played a team that got relegated because of our win and we had to stay in the centre circle as there was no way out. They brought out additional police force to get us to the dressing room and then on to our bus. It was like a siege ... that was tough. Then once when we played Olympique Marseille some hooligans flung some metal stairs at the bus and smashed the windows. We had to lie on the floor with our bags on top of us. That was scary ... for sure. Q When you have a beer, you always ask for a "head" on it? A That's because I come from a country where beer is part of your culture. It needs to be poured like that because through the foam there is a different taste. Therefore, in Canada, I like Guinness most because it always gives you a "head." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattbin Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 We would not know so little about what's going on if we were told a little more about what's going on. Giving the Voyageurs more information would only increase our ability to help advance soccer in this country. Morgan is a spectacular exception from an organization that is too quick to dismiss its biggest fans as ignorant and not worth their time. But then Holger's never going to read this, so I guess it's more preaching to the stupid, ignorant choir here, huh? Allez les Rouges, M@ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 Of course Holger reads this board. Heck, he steals my ideas with great regularity: 4-4-2, Nsaliwa at right back, Hume in for the gold Cup. Now Holger, if you'll only try Klukowski as a Centre back and give Aguiar a look you'll be going back to Germany in 2006 . Seriously though, while I respect that he has to juggle considerations that we might not be in the know about, it would be nice if some of that information could be conveyed to the fans. If the reason that a certain player is not at the game is because the club would not relelase him, then what is the harm of saying that. I can understand that Holger might not want to come out and say "Yeah, player D is crap." But he could say that player A, B & C were unavailable and let us fill in the blanks. And with this post, I now top the 4th Division [8D] (if this seems cryptic, click on members and have a boo). The opinions expressed above are just that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beachesl Posted July 8, 2003 Author Share Posted July 8, 2003 Gordon, you've moved up the rankings faster than Colombia and Cuba, and you deserve it more! Congratualtions on your imminent promotion to the 3rd division, the land where there is no relegation! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimglow Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 Diplomacy isn't Holger's strong point, but I totally agree with the meat of what he is saying. I'd be pretty scared if he looked to us for advice! Oh, and I like "head" as well. Mimglow, Ottawa _________________________ "Pockets of Saddam's regime are still resisting..." Uh-huh. As opposed to "Iraqi citizens fighting against occupation". Cute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beachesl Posted July 8, 2003 Author Share Posted July 8, 2003 Yes, Mimglow, as Marx (Groucho, not Karl) once said about country clubs that wouldn't admit Jews: "I wouldn't join any club that would have me as a member." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 quote:Originally posted by mattbin We would not know so little about what's going on if we were told a little more about what's going on. Giving the Voyageurs more information would only increase our ability to help advance soccer in this country. But really it is the Canadian media's job to be getting more information out to the general public, and for the most part they are not interested in doing so. There are exceptions of course, (Da Costa, Davidson & Sportsnet), and often there are periods when there is nothing really going on with the national team & thus the lack of coverage is expected. But when good coverage is expected, like right at this very moment, the Canadian media as a whole seems to be found wanting. I can't even find an advertisement for the Gold Cup matches on Sportsnet's new website, though there is one for those meaningless European club friendlies that Sportsnet is also showing later in the month. And as far as I am aware, I am (at the moment) the only person in the world to have had a Gold Cup 2003 Preview article published somewhere, even though the tournament starts in just a few days! (And no, Ben Knight's article doesn't really count in my view, that was an attempt to do something else). Even the wolf can learn. Even the sheep can turn. Even the frog can become at last the prince. - Peter Hammill, Over (1977) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimglow Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 Agreed. Where is the coverage? They'd rather follow Paul Tracy around than give a couple minutes to Canada Soccer. I have an idea...let's have Maggie the Macaque predict the results! Mimglow, Ottawa _________________________ "Pockets of Saddam's regime are still resisting..." Uh-huh. As opposed to "Iraqi citizens fighting against occupation". Cute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattbin Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca But really it is the Canadian media's job to be getting more information out to the general public, and for the most part they are not interested in doing so. I think it is important that the CSA come to the same realisation that we did--that the media has to be made to care. I know as well as we all do that it's nigh impossible getting the media to report on soccer (unless Beckham joins the Impact or some similar scenario). But if the CSA made more information available to more people, there would be more to say. Not to steal a political point for trivial use, but we have to take a page from Jello Biafra's book and become the media. Most of us, I would say, are soccer evangelists; we tell our families and friends about upcoming games, we take them to see the games, we monopolize the TV when the games are on, whether in bars or at home. We also take an active role in getting the word out there--the Voyageurs Cup being one initiative, but I know that a lot of us are doing unpaid journalist work in our sites (Elaine's a great example of this) and our writing (many Voyageur articles in WFP, ISM, etc). Now that's because we're paying attention. What if the CSA made information available to us more often, or more directly? What if there were newsworthy press releases coming out all the time, and we started jumping on them when Da Costa, Knight, and Davidson couldn't? (Plus the half-dozen or so good writers who report on soccer only rarely--Jeremy Loome for example). We're a group that works hard to put the good word about soccer out there. The more we have to work with, the more we can say. There's no reason that many of the revelations in Neil's last article couldn't have been included in one or more press releases, or at least made available on the CSA site. It wouldn't be fair to re-publish Neil's work in a different form; it would be fair to do so if they were provided for everyone directly from the CSA. Maybe it's a question of funding and resources at the CSA, I don't know. But here's a whole red and white army of volunteers ready to help. I fail to see why the CSA hasn't tried to partner with us, other than the fact that this group is somewhat incoherent and has no clear leader, structure, or membership. But I think the CSA (with one notable exception) takes a rather patronizing attitude towards the fans in this country. Otherwise, I'd be interested to know what the CSA would like to see from a fan club that we're missing. Anyhow, a long-winded answer to a valid comment. I think I've made my point clear to those who were interested though (shut up M@). Allez les Rouges, M@ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
torontosupport Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 Damn straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimglow Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 Very interesting. I've actually been thinking we need some sort of structure. But how do we go about electing a leader? Mimglow, Ottawa _________________________ "Pockets of Saddam's regime are still resisting..." Uh-huh. As opposed to "Iraqi citizens fighting against occupation". Cute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ref Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 Anybody here old enough to remember the old Canadian TV program called Front Page Challenge? Right after we qualified for the WC in 86 the program had two hidden guests, George Pekos and if my memory serves me well, Tony Waiters. The highly regarded panelist had to guess what sport the guests represented. Well... they never did, many sports were mentioned, but not soccer. I felt quite embarrazed at the time and felt pity for our player and coach who had accomplished a first for Canadian soccer at the time, and none of the four journalists and writers had the foggiest idea. Have things changed in 17 years, don't think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJT Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Mimglow Very interesting. I've actually been thinking we need some sort of structure. But how do we go about electing a leader? We discussed this a while back (end of 2001 or beginning of 2002) and the majority decided that we should keep things the way they are, without a formal structure. But perhaps it's time to raise the issue again? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 quote: Not to steal a political point for trivial use, but we have to take a page from Jello Biafra's book and become the media. Most of us, I would say, are soccer evangelists; we tell our families and friends about upcoming games, we take them to see the games, we monopolize the TV when the games are on, whether in bars or at home. We also take an active role in getting the word out there--the Voyageurs Cup being one initiative, but I know that a lot of us are doing unpaid journalist work in our sites (Elaine's a great example of this) and our writing (many Voyageur articles in WFP, ISM, etc). Now that's because we're paying attention. What if the CSA made information available to us more often, or more directly? My vision for this site is that when the new format comes in (which what I suppose is what we are waiting for) there is no reason why we can't go back to posting news stories on the front page. The moment a site starts writing and presenting original material as news and comment it IS the press. And once press, we would have reps at press conferences, have folks calling the CSA for info. This is perfectly legitimate, and if anyone tried to delegitimate us there are enough of us here who work professionally in journalism (I do, for example) who would have every right to complain about being snubbed (if that were the case, which I am not sure it would be). I think we have to get to the point where we can complement the mainstream and even specialized press right here, on this site, and that would help a bit in stopping the constant criticism of the faults of the press. Is this part of the vision of the leaders of this site? Make the ball run, so you don't have to. -Johan Cruyff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mattbin Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 quote:Originally posted by DJT We discussed this a while back (end of 2001 or beginning of 2002) and the majority decided that we should keep things the way they are, without a formal structure. But perhaps it's time to raise the issue again? Yeah, well, I know this is a contentious issue, and that a lot of Voyageurs don't want to see it happen (but then a lot of Voyageurs didn't want to see a sign-in forum). I was bringing it up not to re-open that big ol' can of worms, but to offer it as a suggestion as to why the group does not figure more prominently in the soccer scene. But if the can is open... I still think that a group charter, structure, and executive would be a good idea. That's where my figurin' ends though, I don't know what to do about all that. Allez les Rouges, M@ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 One thing I realise about the lack of soccer coverage in this country is that we can't wait for the media to do it. We have to force the A-league clubs and CSA to give us more news. We have to be on their back. At impactsoccer.com, we are trying just that. We have the help of the media director from the Impact and we are trying to put in place a question/answer system on our forum where we would ask questions directly to the team and they would answer on our forum. I'm still waiting for an answer from the team but we'll be on their back until they say yes. The media in Montreal is like everywhere in this country. Today's headline in Montreal is about José Théodore's problems and 3 pages on the Expos when nobody cares...We, the fans want to know and will always try to get the news that nobody sees fit to print. The CSA people and Holger should realise that the day we'll stop caring, they'll probably have to try to get their PGA card to make a living... Cheers to all and good luck to our boys at the Gold Cup! François www.impactsoccer.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimglow Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 quote:Originally posted by François The CSA people and Holger should realise that the day we'll stop caring, they'll probably have to try to get their PGA card to make a living... Francois, I don't think the CSA wants us to stop caring...the gist of what Holger was saying is that he will run the Nats to the best of his abilities, and it doesn't matter if armchair managers (us) don't agree with him. And he's bang on. Mimglow, Ottawa _________________________ "Pockets of Saddam's regime are still resisting..." Uh-huh. As opposed to "Iraqi citizens fighting against occupation". Cute. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Mimglow Francois, I don't think the CSA wants us to stop caring...the gist of what Holger was saying is that he will run the Nats to the best of his abilities, and it doesn't matter if armchair managers (us) don't agree with him. And he's bang on. Mimglow, Ottawa _________________________ "Pockets of Saddam's regime are still resisting..." Uh-huh. As opposed to "Iraqi citizens fighting against occupation". Cute. I guess I just felt frustrated after the lack of coverage soccer is getting in this country. I've been following soccer in Canada since 1981 and somedays I wonder why we still care...He's not reading the fan sites? Please, give me a break. After we've been complaining about the fact that he doesn't care about A-league player, he picks Pizzolitto, Nash and Fletch...He travels a lot in Canada? When is the last time he was seen at CCR in Montreal? Ok enough of this, I'm going for a walk...sorry guys! François www.impactsoccer.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimglow Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 quote:Originally posted by mattbin Yeah, well, I know this is a contentious issue, and that a lot of Voyageurs don't want to see it happen (but then a lot of Voyageurs didn't want to see a sign-in forum). I was bringing it up not to re-open that big ol' can of worms, but to offer it as a suggestion as to why the group does not figure more prominently in the soccer scene. But if the can is open... I still think that a group charter, structure, and executive would be a good idea. That's where my figurin' ends though, I don't know what to do about all that. One thing is for sure. We can't continue this discussion until the other board closes down for good. I never visit there, but it simply would not be fair if we travelled far down this road without their input. We need a unified board. Time has come to bury the old one. When that time comes, we can move ahead with a Charter, determining roles to be played and have elections to fill those roles. Mimglow, Ottawa _________________________ You are the witness of change And to counteract We gotta take the power back -Rage Against The Machine Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
François Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack I can't see why we wouldn't be able to start a journalistic arm of the Voyageurs. I'd be willing to write for it (I would need my writing to be edited though). Personally, I started following soccer in Canada closely in 1999, after watching Canada play Guatemala at Varsity. If it wasn't for the internet, I wouldn't be able to follow Canadian soccer as much as I do. I'm basically trying to say that if the mainstream media won't give us what we want (soccer coverage), maybe its time we become the source of media. ------------------------- "Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery, None but ourselves can free our minds..." Redemption Song - Bob Marley That's what I think. I remember talking to Stéphane Banfi (PR man at the Impact) during the winter and he was telling me that he was taking reporters to dinners to try to convince them to talk more about the team and soccer in general. Well, that doesn't work. You don't have to take us to dinner. They just have to feed us with news and we'll find a way to get it out and tell the fans what is happening... François www.impactsoccer.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rivaldo Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca And as far as I am aware, I am (at the moment) the only person in the world to have had a Gold Cup 2003 Preview article published somewhere, even though the tournament starts in just a few days Where was it published? I'd like to read it. It's not the SoccerAge.com article that Massive Attacked posted http://www.soccerage.com/en/13/o6086.html, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Rivaldo Where was it published? I'd like to read it. It's not the SoccerAge.com article that Massive Attacked posted http://www.soccerage.com/en/13/o6086.html, is it? I believe G-L said it was in the World Football Pages. I have been eagerly awaiting my copy. The opinions expressed above are just that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 quote:Originally posted by François That's what I think. I remember talking to Stéphane Banfi (PR man at the Impact) during the winter and he was telling me that he was taking reporters to dinners to try to convince them to talk more about the team and soccer in general. Well, that doesn't work. You don't have to take us to dinner. They just have to feed us with news and we'll find a way to get it out and tell the fans what is happening... François www.impactsoccer.com Electronic fanzine. Yeah! We have a few lads doing an awfull lot of work keeping this site going so it seems there a willingness out there to contribute to the benefit of us all (thanks by the way, guys. It's a Canadian footballing wilderness out there beyond this forum). I've gotten the impression this board is populated by, well, the upper educated branch of the Canadian family tree to a large degree so I'd guess that there'd be volunteers enough with the skills necessary to make a more media style fanzine website possible. This idea I like and dought it's the first time it's come up somehow. Guess it all comes down to finding someone with the know-how to sort of make it work and keep it running. By the way. Bet you there are plenty of professional media people in Canada who'd volunteer bits and pieces here or there just because they know they would never get published by their employers. "Minority of one" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wfp Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 "The only person in the world to have had a Gold Cup 2003 Preview article published somewhere." "Where was it published? I'd like to read it. It's not the SoccerAge.com article that Massive Attacked posted" Hello I've noticed and objected in the past to what I think is a peculiar reality here in Voyageurville...Many of you fellas repeatedly quote/reprint articles from the major dailies, while word for word, generally ignore the little football publications across Canada starving for your attention, and support. I've wondered why we always find the Herald, The Star and Sun and Province, and online soccer sources quoted here, but not the little printed guys. Chances seem pretty good that the chief source of quotes and reprints is from anywhere that publishes text articles on line. Of course pubs like ISM, WFP, ICF and others may offer a wee teaser online, but the guts and glory is only in print. Answer me please - are we witnessing here a readership that is almost exclusive to that which can be found on the web? This would be a shame. I'm not about to debate the benefits of paper over binary or visa versa but I can tell you there's a marvelous world of footy tales being weaved by many a small pub from east to west, that many at this board appear to be missing. Gian-Lucas declaration of Gold Cup journalistic singularity led a responder to ask if it was an article appearing online! I rest my case!! I am honestly curious because we need you to pay attention. And I don't think there's much argument that the big papers could do a damned site more to tease all our pallets.GL's tidy history and group preview and other eclectic nonesense was as stated, from the current issue of World Football Pages, who by the way, do print the Voyageurs Cup releases. Give it a shot gentlemen - get your asses off your keyboards and give glorious, textile and sexy paper a chance! Cheers cjvg This public service announcement was brought to you by Hey, We're Over Here Incorporated. Thank you. I plead: 'A pretty move, for the love of God.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cheeta Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 Have never ever seen a WFP anywhere. That's not to say it isn't out there. Maybe just well hidden. A very exclusive rag. The only reason I knew it existed was because of this site and with a little help from Mad Cap Mac was able to get it through a home subscription (cheap, cheap. Well worth the price). So I guess it's easy to see why the complaint with media on this board focus' on the popular sports media. The one I'm certain the vast majority of Canadians know of, and out of habit access. And football's (some call it soccer) poor representation in that media tends to tweek most of us the wrong way. So we bitch about this unfair treatment because we feel that all those kids playing soccer must mean that there's an interest in the game in general. The internet is sorta free and with a little practice most anyone can learn to surf about a bit, bagging bits of info here and there and so there you have it. Dose take a lot of panning to find a little bit of gold though, dosen't it? Wouldn't it be sweet to find a nice inclusive Canadian footy site run by a bunch of dedicated or at least enthusiastic, unpaid, no-nothings easily accessable to anyone with a computer? The more I think on it, the more I like it. By the way, thoroughly enjoy your exclusive rag and well continue to subcribe as long as you can keep it afloat. Even if it is largely a BC-Whitecaps directed paper. It would be hard to fill 20 pages covering the national teams. "Minority of one" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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