John Pugh & Ottawa Fury

[MuirtonPark]

There is a piece in the new issue of Financial Post Magazine, under the heading "Labours of Love", about John Pugh and his plans for developing young Canadian soccer talent, building on the Fury platforms. The full article is about a number of people who are in it for making a difference, rather than making money.

http://www.nationalpost.com/Labours+Love/3327336/story.html

[Macksam]

I will plan to do the same thing once I'm in my 30s. Do something like VP maybe.

[Ottawa MLS Fan]

Interesting link, thanks for posting.

[Ottawa MLS Fan]

John Pugh and Neil Malhotra both talking to NASL about formalizing[url=http://www.metronews.ca/toronto/blog/post/589838] their application for 2012

http://www.metronews.ca/toronto/blog/post/589838

[Macksam]

They are competing against each other apparently.

[BuzzAndSting]

From what I understand John Pugh is grouped with Jeff Hunt who owns the 67s and the new CFL team coming to Ottawa. Neil Malhotra last I heard wanted to put a team at the Ottawa baseball stadium which will never work. So my moneys on Hunt and Pugh. Hunt has turned the 67s into very succesful junior team financially and has the backing of three of the largest real estate developers in Ottawa. As a rabib soccer fan and Ottawa resident I'd be hesistant to support a team playing on a baseball fields as opposed to a team playing at a newly redovelped Lansdowne park.

[Ottawa MLS Fan]

I will buy season tickets to either of these groups, but I have real doubts that either will succeed with their current stadium plans. The concerns with the baseball stadium are obvious, but I don't think a 24,000 seat CFL venue will be much better in terms of atmosphere.

[tovan1]

Soccer backer gets in Lansdowne game

Pugh fifth partner in group working on redevelopment plan

BY RICHARD STARNES, THE OTTAWA CITIZEN SEPTEMBER 28, 2010

John Pugh, the man behind the Ottawa Fury soccer organization, has become the fifth partner in the group leading the redevelopment of Lansdowne Park.

Pugh becomes a financially committed member of Ottawa Sports and Entertainment Group, joining Roger Greenberg, John Ruddy, Bill Shenkman and Jeff Hunt as they work with the city on the Lansdowne Transformation Plan.

However, it is the development of soccer that is foremost in the mind of the man who ran Carleton University's School of Computer Science for eight years before building a multi-national high-tech company, The Object People.

When he sold that company, he turned his attention to the sport he loves.

"I am honoured to be able to participate," Pugh said Monday. "Asking me to join shows clearly the group's commitment to soccer and, hopefully, it will bring to fruition my hopes for a pro soccer franchise here in the city.

"The next step is to lead the thrust to acquire a professional franchise. Once that is achieved, we will begin the whole process of putting together staff and making sure we hit the field running, successful right out of the gate."

That Pugh has joined the group does not come as a surprise.

Pugh and OSEG joined forces a year ago to look toward a franchise in a reconstituted North American Soccer League. Once Lansdowne redevelopment is complete and there is a place to play, it is widely expected that a franchise will be granted.

Pugh has his sights set on the 2013 season, the same year as a prospective Canadian Football League franchise would make its debut.

"Having hockey -- the 67's -- football and soccer out of the same facility brings enormous benefits to the organization and to the city," he said.

The latest development almost certainly puts to an end any thoughts Ottawa Senators' owner Eugene Melnyk might have had for a soccer franchise playing out of a facility to be developed adjacent to Scotiabank Place in Kanata.

Out of the blue, in September 2008, Melnyk launched a proposal to bring Major League Soccer to Ottawa. Part of the plan involved building a stadium on city land.

At the same time, what was then the Lansdowne Live group was working on a Lansdowne Park development deal that would include renovation of Frank Clair Stadium for a Canadian Football League franchise and, possibly, a professional soccer team.

When the city opted to work with Lansdowne Live -- now OSEG -- Melnyk decided to go silent on his soccer plans, and he has remained that way since.

There is no indication he will revive any those plans.

Also, Montreal has been granted a franchise for what will become the third MLS team in Canada following those in Toronto and Vancouver.

Today, Pugh is delighted with the development, indicating that an NASL franchise would fit extremely well with his Ottawa Fury.

The U.S. Soccer Federation has been working on guidelines and regulations on what a new NASL would look like.

"One of these standards is a requirement that each team will commit to the development of players at the youth level," Pugh said. "The Fury is a ready-made solution for this.

"When I started eight years ago, there were two elements to my vision. One was to make sure young players in our region got the same opportunities as kids from larger cities. That has been achieved. Some have reached international status, some have signed with pro clubs, and 65 plus have gone on to full (college) scholarships in the U.S.

"The second element has always been to provide the highest level of soccer for spectators. This will be a massive opportunity to build to that."

© Copyright © The Ottawa Citizen

Read more: http://www.ottawacitizen.com/sports/Soccer+backer+gets+Lansdowne+game/3588698/story.html#ixzz10qQrRdU4

[Guest Ed]

Christ. I think I knew him back in the day. Good luck on the NASL front.

[jloome]

He'll need it. Footy lines are never an easy sell. Putting them in the same facility is not going to help his cause.

[Grizzly]

He'll need it. Footy lines are never an easy sell. Putting them in the same facility is not going to help his cause.

Do we know for sure that the stadium is going to have permanent football lines? Although the CFL team is the intended primary tenant, there has been a plan for a soccer team as well as hosting individual events of various sports since the beginning. It seems likely that this would have been taken into consideration in determing the pitch of the stadium before construction.

[Richard]

Nowadays no FieldTurf pitch needs to have permanent lines of any sort. It's only done on community fields because it is cheaper and easier for local authorities who call the shots for amateur sports. Just as any natural grass pitch needs to be re-lined before any major match, so can a FieldTurf pitch be lined. The temporary Empire Bowl facility shared by the Whitecaps and BC Lions does not have permanent lines, neither will BC Place. This is a non-issue.

[jloome]

Nowadays no FieldTurf pitch needs to have permanent lines of any sort. It's only done on community fields because it is cheaper and easier for local authorities who call the shots for amateur sports. Just as any natural grass pitch needs to be re-lined before any major match, so can a FieldTurf pitch be lined. The temporary Empire Bowl facility shared by the Whitecaps and BC Lions does not have permanent lines, neither will BC Place. This is a non-issue.

Yeah, OK, field turf is a non-issue. Maybe at NASL level, but Seattle fans hate it, Toronto fans hated it so much they removed it, and every club fanbase in MLS hates it, to the point where its now only on three fields.

But it's a non-issue.

Look, obviously it's not the issue it used to be, but declaring it a non-issue when fans have been complaining about the stuff for the better part of the last five years in the top soccer league on the continent is a bit shortsighted.

Is it the deal breaker? Probably not. Will it keep diehard fans away? Yes, because it will be part of how they judge the professionalism and commitment to tradition of the whole club. That has been the case in other cities, so why you don't expect it to be an issue in Ottawa is a little perplexing.

[Mr.Impact]

Nowadays no FieldTurf pitch needs to have permanent lines of any sort. It's only done on community fields because it is cheaper and easier for local authorities who call the shots for amateur sports. Just as any natural grass pitch needs to be re-lined before any major match, so can a FieldTurf pitch be lined. The temporary Empire Bowl facility shared by the Whitecaps and BC Lions does not have permanent lines, neither will BC Place. This is a non-issue.

It depends on the seriousness of the Ottawa group I suppose. Will they follow in the footsteps of current NASL/USL franchises, or will they realize that a proper playing surface adds to the overall fan experience?

[Richard]

Yeah, OK, field turf is a non-issue. Maybe at NASL level, but Seattle fans hate it, Toronto fans hated it so much they removed it, and every club fanbase in MLS hates it, to the point where its now only on three fields.

But it's a non-issue.

Look, obviously it's not the issue it used to be, but declaring it a non-issue when fans have been complaining about the stuff for the better part of the last five years in the top soccer league on the continent is a bit shortsighted.

Is it the deal breaker? Probably not. Will it keep diehard fans away? Yes, because it will be part of how they judge the professionalism and commitment to tradition of the whole club. That has been the case in other cities, so why you don't expect it to be an issue in Ottawa is a little perplexing.

Permanent lines or otherwise on FieldTurf is the non-issue. FieldTurf versus natural grass is a whole different matter and not what was being discussed.

[Alex D]

Is it the deal breaker? Probably not. Will it keep diehard fans away? Yes, because it will be part of how they judge the professionalism and commitment to tradition of the whole club. That has been the case in other cities, so why you don't expect it to be an issue in Ottawa is a little perplexing.

Like it kept the fans away in Toronto and Seattle? and will keep them away in Vancouver in Portland? Fans prefer grass, but in the end they won't sell any fewer tickets because of it. Turf in Ottawa is a non-issue.

[Richard]

If the choice is FieldTurf or no stadium or pro team I think I can guess which way the vast majority of fans will vote, even if some of them grumble a bit about the surface.

[Grizzly]

Yeah, OK, field turf is a non-issue. Maybe at NASL level, but Seattle fans hate it, Toronto fans hated it so much they removed it, and every club fanbase in MLS hates it, to the point where its now only on three fields.

But it's a non-issue.

Look, obviously it's not the issue it used to be, but declaring it a non-issue when fans have been complaining about the stuff for the better part of the last five years in the top soccer league on the continent is a bit shortsighted.

Is it the deal breaker? Probably not. Will it keep diehard fans away? Yes, because it will be part of how they judge the professionalism and commitment to tradition of the whole club. That has been the case in other cities, so why you don't expect it to be an issue in Ottawa is a little perplexing.

Fans don't hate Fieldturf, fans by and large can't tell the difference between Fieldturf and natural grass unless they are very close to it. I think if most fans watched a home game of Spartak Moscow they would have no idea it was on Fieldturf unless they were told. Many players do not like Fieldturf and while I am hesitant to criticize people who play every day and also feel the turf much more than I do, I suspect this dislike has as much to do with the reputation of artificial turf as to the difference between it and real turf. For example, the same Spartak Moscow does not seem to have the same problem signing top players that TFC did, in the off-season they signed one of Celtic's top players even though he had a history of knee problems (Aiden McGeady). I suspect players are mostly reluctant to play on Fieldturf in a league where there are stringent salary restrictions and various other conditions that make it less attractive than playing in Europe. Now if you have a manager that blames his inability to sign good players on Fieldturf and a few prominent players who criticize it, then the fans of said team will probably complain about it not because they hate it but because of the perception that players hate it and don't want to play for their team. At the NASL level most players are happy to play for a decent paycheck on a stable team. If Ottawa provides this I doubt they will have any problem attracting players whatever their turf is. It might be a problem if they went MLS but at NASL level it definitely won't be a problem.

Fans do definitely care about football lines as unlike Fieldturf they ruin the visual aspect of the game. Up until now I have not heard that the new Landsdowne will have permanent football lines although I have also not heard the opposite either.

[Richard]

^ Well said.

[jloome]

Fans don't hate Fieldturf, fans by and large can't tell the difference between Fieldturf and natural grass unless they are very close to it. I think if most fans watched a home game of Spartak Moscow they would have no idea it was on Fieldturf unless they were told. Many players do not like Fieldturf and while I am hesitant to criticize people who play every day and also feel the turf much more than I do, I suspect this dislike has as much to do with the reputation of artificial turf as to the difference between it and real turf. For example, the same Spartak Moscow does not seem to have the same problem signing top players that TFC did, in the off-season they signed one of Celtic's top players even though he had a history of knee problems (Aiden McGeady). I suspect players are mostly reluctant to play on Fieldturf in a league where there are stringent salary restrictions and various other conditions that make it less attractive than playing in Europe. Now if you have a manager that blames his inability to sign good players on Fieldturf and a few prominent players who criticize it, then the fans of said team will probably complain about it not because they hate it but because of the perception that players hate it and don't want to play for their team. At the NASL level most players are happy to play for a decent paycheck on a stable team. If Ottawa provides this I doubt they will have any problem attracting players whatever their turf is. It might be a problem if they went MLS but at NASL level it definitely won't be a problem.

Fans do definitely care about football lines as unlike Fieldturf they ruin the visual aspect of the game. Up until now I have not heard that the new Landsdowne will have permanent football lines although I have also not heard the opposite either.

True Grizz, but the reality is that the utter rejection of the turf in Toronto by multiple attempted player signings led to the fans demanding grass. It wasn't lines. There were no footie lines at BMO. It was the fact that they repeatedly failed to sign the players necessary to compete because of the turf.

So while you're right, it's less likely to be an issue at NASL level, I'd submit that any league that wants to expand beyond the most die-hard base is going to have to create as professional an atmosphere as possible, and field turf won't help that if it keeps the best players away.

Fans will react to that. AS someone who posts daily on TFC's forum, I can tell you it was most definitely a product of the paranoia over field turf expressed by the players (and exacerbated in Toronto by public use.)

I'd also argue that the contention "At the NASL level most players are happy to play for a decent paycheck on a stable team" will kill any pro league, if true. There are dozens of comparable leagues around the world that may equal to or more than NASL and minimum standards have to be met even at that level.

[Danny Boy]

I think something also needs to be said for the type of stadium. While BMO is a soccer specific stadium, the Ottawa stadium is a multi functional one and with that comes a greater understanding that the turf also needs to be multi-functional. Having real grass doesn't lend to what the OSEG is trying to put forth.

[Grizzly]

True Grizz, but the reality is that the utter rejection of the turf in Toronto by multiple attempted player signings led to the fans demanding grass. It wasn't lines. There were no footie lines at BMO. It was the fact that they repeatedly failed to sign the players necessary to compete because of the turf.

So while you're right, it's less likely to be an issue at NASL level, I'd submit that any league that wants to expand beyond the most die-hard base is going to have to create as professional an atmosphere as possible, and field turf won't help that if it keeps the best players away.

Fans will react to that. AS someone who posts daily on TFC's forum, I can tell you it was most definitely a product of the paranoia over field turf expressed by the players (and exacerbated in Toronto by public use.)

I'd also argue that the contention "At the NASL level most players are happy to play for a decent paycheck on a stable team" will kill any pro league, if true. There are dozens of comparable leagues around the world that may equal to or more than NASL and minimum standards have to be met even at that level.

Why would "At the NASL level most players are happy to play for a decent paycheck on a stable team" kill any pro league? Having a large number of cheap players of decent skill level is good for any league. If you are suggesting that these players are going to sign with other leagues why are they not doing so now? (I would suggest lack of EU passports, work permits and player quotas have a lot to do with it and that is unlikely to change anytime soon) And exactly which leagues are you talking about and how familiar are you with them? I think you would be surprised how many of these leagues have a couple of teams with nice stadiums and a lot of teams with crappy stadiums and pitches including a lot of natural turf pitches that are below the quality of a good artificial turf pitch. If we want to look at a league often compared with NASL, the Finnish top tier Veikkausliiga, 7 of their 13 stadiums seat 5000 or less and their top stadium of their top club HJK Helsinki is a 10770 seater with a Fieldturf pitch.

In regards to the problems TFC had with signing players, this was mostly to do with high priced European players they were trying to bring in. This might be a problem at the MLS level although I think the numerous rules and restrictions of MLS make this a much larger problem than it is for clubs like Spartak Moscow. Nevertheless, the type of player that would not sign because of an artificial turf is not the type of player NASL is trying to sign. It is a 2nd division mostly domestic player league so it is not in the market for high priced European players who have experienced top notch playing conditions throughout their career.

You have a theory that the NASL is not going to survive. There are various difficulties in running a 2nd division league in North America that could lead to this league collapsing. However, it seems to me that you go out of your way to find every thing that you could possibly use as proof of your predicition and a lot of them I don't find particularly valid. I don't see how Ottawa building a stadium that is going to be top notch by division 1 standards let alone division 2 and planning to put a team there is going to be negative as long as their are no permanent football lines. The only possible negative I see is that the stadium may be on the large side for NASL attendance but the old Landsdowne was always fairly intimate even with small crowds and those involved in the bid all are quite expert at marketing teams and getting good attendance.