brandon Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 I'll wade into this one, i got tickets in section m for two reasons (1) to help out nazz who thankfully sold them all and (2) so that i could be in the same section as Monster. the man led the chants from before kickoff to the final whistle and did a hell of a job! he made the game enjoyable in the second half when the team played like absolute crap. if you didnt care for some of the content tough Shi.te for christs sake this wasnt our national tiddlywinks team playing!! we should applaud people like monster who lead chants at these games not pan them Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bettermirror Posted October 15, 2004 Author Share Posted October 15, 2004 nolando. that wasn't me. i was in row 5. and you are right monster, none of those ticos asked you directly. they shouted it, but were relatively polite about it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footy Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 quote:we should applaud people like monster who lead chants at these games not pan them I totally agree imagine a stadium where thousands of fans are chanting ! If you have been to matches in the UK or many parts of Europe you know what I am talking about ... this type of support (Chanting and singing) is what makes soccer support in this country unique. Go to any Whitecaps or Montreal match ...in Burnaby the Southsiders chant and people naturally migrate to our section to join in or listen we need more Johnnie Monsters ..again great Job ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whither Canada Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Nothing personal against BetterMirror, but too many people like him (assuming a him) are the reason why soccer will never capture the greater public's passion in this country. Too damn straight-laced and uptight -"mustn't offend anyone, mustn't make a fuss, mustn't get carried away, etc, etc". Lighten up, let go. It's a football match, for god's sake. It's like this around the world. If you can't take it, you're better off staying home and watching it on TV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soju Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 I say well on you guys for having the balls to stand up in a stadium in Canada and taunt and jeer and sing, not because of the grief you'll catch from the opposing team's fans (they'll naturally expect it) but because of all the grief you'll catch from other Canadians. Imagine going to a foreign stadium and asking rowdy local supporters to politely sit down, and then being consoled and apologized to by other opposing fans, then imagine something else that's amazing like a flying cat or an Onstad with a shutout, now we're talking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beaver Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Whither Canada Nothing personal against BetterMirror, but too many people like him (assuming a him) are the reason why soccer will never capture the greater public's passion in this country. Too damn straight-laced and uptight -"mustn't offend anyone, mustn't make a fuss, mustn't get carried away, etc, etc". Lighten up, let go. It's a football match, for god's sake. It's like this around the world. If you can't take it, you're better off staying home and watching it on TV. That is absolute bullsh.it, and I suspect you know it. Soccer viewership is not catching on for one very big reason, a very simple one: WE ARE NOT WINNING ENOUGH GAMES!! Once again, look at the women's programs. The U19s who placed 2nd in Edmonton a few years back became instant minor celebrities. Many more people in Canada know who Kara Lang and Christine Sinclair are than they know who Paul Stalteri or Thomas Radzinski are. The fans in Edmonton for the U19 finals were loud and involved. Maybe they weren't hurling racial slurs--some were, I imagine, especially against that freak-show from Brazil--but since when was rabid racism and sexism a symbol of support for one's soccer team? In fact, as we are seeing here, it actually creates division, and we are too damned small a support network to suffer division well. There ARE things we can do to encourage greater support for our teams. They are inclusive strategies, strategies that need not denegrate others. I am not suggesting we ditch entirely some of the playful taunts and good-natured (but barbed) chants. As juvenile as it is, I love shouting "You're going home to a third world nation; We're going home to a first world nation." And you know what, most of the hondurans and costa ricans--those calling us putas, among other things--seemed to be amused by this. All I am saying is that a Canadian supporter is a valid supporter whether they shout and scream, or sit and quietly cheer on the team. If we want to get our crowd involved--beyond us rabid fans--then we need better strategies. I applaud Monster for his efforts--though some were unsavoury--and hope to find ways to employ his strengths to even greater effect in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beaver Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Whither Canada Nothing personal against BetterMirror, but too many people like him (assuming a him) are the reason why soccer will never capture the greater public's passion in this country. Too damn straight-laced and uptight -"mustn't offend anyone, mustn't make a fuss, mustn't get carried away, etc, etc". Lighten up, let go. It's a football match, for god's sake. It's like this around the world. If you can't take it, you're better off staying home and watching it on TV. That is absolute bullsh.it, and I suspect you know it. Soccer viewership is not catching on for one very big reason, a very simple one: WE ARE NOT WINNING ENOUGH GAMES!! Once again, look at the women's programs. The U19s who placed 2nd in Edmonton a few years back became instant minor celebrities. Many more people in Canada know who Kara Lang and Christine Sinclair are than they know who Paul Stalteri or Thomas Radzinski are. The fans in Edmonton for the U19 finals were loud and involved. Maybe they weren't hurling racial slurs--some were, I imagine, especially against that freak-show from Brazil--but since when was rabid racism and sexism a symbol of support for one's soccer team? In fact, as we are seeing here, it actually creates division, and we are too damned small a support network to suffer division well. There ARE things we can do to encourage greater support for our teams. They are inclusive strategies, strategies that need not denegrate others. I am not suggesting we ditch entirely some of the playful taunts and good-natured (but barbed) chants. As juvenile as it is, I love shouting "You're going home to a third world nation; We're going home to a first world nation." And you know what, most of the hondurans and costa ricans--those calling us putas, among other things--seemed to be amused by this. All I am saying is that a Canadian supporter is a valid supporter whether they shout and scream, or sit and quietly cheer on the team. If we want to get our crowd involved--beyond us rabid fans--then we need better strategies. I applaud Monster for his efforts--though some were unsavoury--and hope to find ways to employ his strengths to even greater effect in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Nobody has quoted any of the apparently "offensive" chants. For anyone not at the game it is pretty hard to form an opinion on the matter without knowing exactly what was sung. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footy Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by Whither Canada Nothing personal against BetterMirror, but too many people like him (assuming a him) are the reason why soccer will never capture the greater public's passion in this country. Too damn straight-laced and uptight -"mustn't offend anyone, mustn't make a fuss, mustn't get carried away, etc, etc". Lighten up, let go. It's a football match, for god's sake. It's like this around the world. If you can't take it, you're better off staying home and watching it on TV. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Well I agree with this though its not the only problem but for me I guess I would slot soccer in as one of my passions (besides my wife) I get wound up yell and scream when Canada or my Club team the Whitecaps win or lose. I chant I sing I wear my colors and will defend my right to support my club in a vocal manner. I guess what Whither Canada is saying we need more call us what you will HardCore Vocal animate fans who will stand up and chant for their team this way of supporting is only done in soccer and I have never experienced it at any other sport not at a Canucks Hockey game not CFL Football ..just soccer. We need more fans who want to chant, sing and share their passion for thier team national or club side ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Champ Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Johnnie Monster "Can you hear the Mirror sing?" "Nooo-oo! Nooo-oo!" * * * * * With all due respect to the handful of Voyageurs who I've met over the past few months in Vancouver, this chat board really burns my ass at times. There's a few reasons why I rarely post here. I'm always amazed by the extent to which some "fans" on here take it upon themselves to play the role of the online morality police. As the final whistle blows, they can hardly wait to climb on top of the proverbial soapbox to distance themselves from those "horrid, horrid fans" who apparently disgrace our country and ruin the games for everyone else. Seems like they're dying to get behind the keyboard and stroke their egos about how well behaved they are. Sweet Christ - sometimes there's more strokin' at this board than the movie theatre where Pee Wee Herman got busted. When I read posts like this one ("I'm soooo shocked! I'm soooo offended! Racism! Sexism!") it really makes me want to gag. Over the line? Gone too far? Last I checked I still had the right to sing and chant as I please - Ticos, Guanos and the CRTC be damned. Seems a lot of Voyageurs also get wrapped up in the delusion that they are Canada's international ambassadors of sport. They think they're "representing" the nation in some regard. Horses.h.i.t.e. Hate to break it to ya, but nobody outside of Canada gives a rat's arse about the Voyageurs, or how they behave at Swangard when the Costa Retards are lobbing cups of beer into our section(yes, they tossed their share!). The only ones "representing" Canada are the guys on the pitch. End story. The rest of us are just there to be exploited at the box office. As for Mirror's claims that some of the Ticos "asked" me to sit down, that's a total fabrication. Not a single one of those gutless buggers opened their gob to me (not in English, anyway), so I don't know what he's talking about. Doesn't matter anyway. Anyone who's been to a game with me knows damn well the response I'd send to anyone trying to give me a lesson on how to be a courteous spectator. As for racism claims, get bent: as suggested in an earlier reply, I actualy DID shake hands with some Ticos after the match... you know, the match where I was proudly standing side by side with white guys, brown guys, yellow guys and the Israeli from England? I'm sure posts like mine only drive the wedge between Southsiders and Voyageurs even further. I just don't feel like this collective represents me as a fan in any way . Sad but true - but as far as fans go, there is indeed a wide, chalky line dividing the pitch... I'm on one side, singing my guts out, leading the lads and cat-calling the RCMP with taser chants... Mirror's on the other, silently sitting on his hands with the Tico soccer moms who won't attend another match in Canada for at least four years. Done ranting now. Let the piss and vinegar begin! A + !!!!! Elequently said! I've tried not to let the racism **** burn me, but I'm really sick of it. I would not have even tried to sit here and figure out who was what race at the tailgate party if you ***** dicks hadn't brought it up. All i know is that malwa and pedram and krammerhead and Iain and Nazz and my old buddy redhat are CANADIAN!!! I can say I got roughed up by a Black cop, a White cop, a Chinese cop, and a slovakian security guard. To the people calling US SOUTHSIDERS racists... how many mixed race friends do YOU have? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beaver Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Grizzly Nobody has quoted any of the apparently "offensive" chants. For anyone not at the game it is pretty hard to form an opinion on the matter without knowing exactly what was sung. I was there, and yes, I could easily see how some of the chants were offensive and over-the-line. Do we need to actually provide said chants here? I thought this forum didn't allow that. I think this entire issue has grown much larger than it deserves, and this is simply because we are/were all freakin pissed off at the damned result. Angry people do not make the best decisions or arguments. CurrentChamp, buddy, I am pleased to hear you are in decently good shape. Glad you could find some weed for the ride home (not like finding weed around here is tough. Some guy on Granville last night asked if I wanted any of the "Cheech and Chong", that I should just ask him. I assumed he was talking about skunk, but he was sordid enough looking that he may have been providing something else entirely.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Champ Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Here is some of the chants. Can You Hear the GUANO Sing? Nooo Nooo Can You hear the Guano sing? Nooo Nooo Can You hear the Guano sing? I CAN'T HEAR A ****ING THING!!! Shhhhhhhhh!!! We're going home to a first world country! We're going home to a first world country! You're going home in a BIG WHITE AMBULANCE!! We went to Costa Rica in '86 and what did we see? ABSOULTELY NOTHING!!! Red and Blue and **** all over!!! Red and Blue and **** all over!!! Some slag offs to poorer countries, but that has nothing to do with race. We could yell about first world countries to the Americans. In Edmonton I was trying lead some racey chant's (didn't work as well) and the Hondurans started chanting (if my spanish is any good) **** - HOUSE **** - MOUTH I laughed and actually joined in (I hate the ESKS). I even danced with those guys for a while. I've been to soccer games in other countries and Canadian fans, for the most part are all a bunch of ... uh... not as excited as they should be people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 quote:I was there, and yes, I could easily see how some of the chants were offensive and over-the-line. Do we need to actually provide said chants here? I thought this forum didn't allow that. What this forum doesn't allow is people calling each other offensive names or expressing offensive opinions. If an offensive term has a part in telling a factual story I don't think anyone would have a problem in someone posting it. I don't think it is fair to accuse people of being racist, sexist and offensive and not to give any evidence backing this claim. I don't find the chants listed by Current Champ offensive particularly in the context of soccer chants. If this is as strong as the chants got I don't think there is any basis to the allegations. If there were more offensive chants than the people making the accusations should post them or stop making unsupported accusations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beaver Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Grizzly What this forum doesn't allow is people calling each other offensive names or expressing offensive opinions. If an offensive term has a part in telling a factual story I don't think anyone would have a problem in someone posting it. I don't think it is fair to accuse people of being racist, sexist and offensive and not to give any evidence backing this claim. I don't find the chants listed by Current Champ offensive particularly in the context of soccer chants. If this is as strong as the chants got I don't think there is any basis to the allegations. If there were more offensive chants than the people making the accusations should post them or stop making unsupported accusations. yes, there were more offensive chants, but who the hell are you to demand that bettermirror or anybody else must PROVE themselves or validate their claims through this medium? Give me a break. Like I said, this issue has been overblown--despite some important points made on several fronts--and I think we'd be best served by letting it die now. [8)] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grizzly Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Let me pose your question in another manner. Who are bettermirror or anyone else to make accusations on this board without providing any substantial evidence? This is completely unfair to those they are accusing. They have publicized accusations to a large number of board members (in fact originally bettermirror accused the whole Voyageurs group of being offensive) without providing any evidence whatsoever. None of these chants were audible on the tv broadcast. I sang and chanted in Kingston and we may have had a few spicy chants but nothing I or most soccer fans would consider offensive. Did the Vancouver group go far beyond anything sung in Kingston or were there just oversensitive PC types in attendence? If people don't want to back up their opinions or claims then don't post them on the board. What I personally find offensive at the moment is people accusing Monster, Krammerhead, Current Champ, etc. and not providing any evidence and then in addition trying to claim that I or other board members are not entitled to demand this evidence be presented to the board. I am demanding that they prove and validate their claims through this medium because this is the medium which they chose to make their claims on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Champ Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 I think Beaver and grizzly aren't too far apart. If you were a racist, you sure wouldn't cheer for Canada's soccer team (Occean, Radzinski, ect ect ect ect ect sorry I'm tired) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
youllneverwalkalone Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 I believe the reason nobody is posting evidence is because nobody can actually remember the more cutting edge material. Probably because it was not used often. My most vivid memory was: "They don't have no education, they don't have no gun control, Hey! Ticos! Make your way back home!" Maybe not that funny in retrospect, but definitely appreciated at the time and pretty reflective of the general tone. No big deal I say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Beaver Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 quote:Originally posted by Current Champ I think Beaver and grizzly aren't too far apart. If you were a racist, you sure wouldn't cheer for Canada's soccer team (Occean, Radzinski, ect ect ect ect ect sorry I'm tired) Yes, I agree--and to that end will let this die the death it deserves. Current Champ, get some chicken soup into you and have a nice snooze. Are you at work? If so, cut out early and find a soft bed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadasBest Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 I captured a bunch of good pictures, but I kind of regret not having a camcorder to record some of the sights and sounds. I think for the next home game i'll bring a digital camcorder too and capture some of the chants. Does anybody remember how the balls and Davies street chant went? Or the Tico Women and Commercial drive? I remember the chant, but can't remember how it went. I also thought the "We'll meet you at the border..." chant was quite funny, particularly because the Costa Rican's sitting beside us were Canadian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted October 16, 2004 Share Posted October 16, 2004 quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone My most vivid memory was: "They don't have no education, they don't have no gun control, Hey! Ticos! Make your way back home!" Which is what the Southsiders sing when the Sounders and Timbers are in town facing the Whitecaps, with "Seattle" and "Portland" in place of "Ticos". No complaints from the Timbers Army and Seatle Pod supporters in attendance, certainly no complaints of racism. Of course only people desperately trying to find racism where it's not will complain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gloucester in FLA Posted October 16, 2004 Share Posted October 16, 2004 Speaking of being uncivilized....I guess next time we should rise up to the Central American standards and load up on urine bags! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snake Posted October 16, 2004 Share Posted October 16, 2004 quote:Originally posted by youllneverwalkalone I believe the reason nobody is posting evidence is because nobody can actually remember the more cutting edge material. Probably because it was not used often. My most vivid memory was: "They don't have no education, they don't have no gun control, Hey! Ticos! Make your way back home!" Maybe not that funny in retrospect, but definitely appreciated at the time and pretty reflective of the general tone. No big deal I say. the verse i liked was"you don't have no education" "you don't have no birth control".even the ticos busted a gut on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vancouver Fan Posted October 16, 2004 Share Posted October 16, 2004 I didn't want to be the one to bring this one up but...maybe the chant that does cross the line is "We'll be shagging Ticos mother till she c.ms(repeated twice),When she begs for 69 we'll give 8 6"...and so on. All the others are ok.I think anyones mom is off limits.Actually,one of the people that helped me out by purchasing a ticket was a kind older lady from my work.She is a church going mother of 3.I warned her that it gets pretty rowdy in our section but she really wanted to help out when she found out that I fell a bit short of my sales goals.She's also a big fan of Canadian sports.I think I might have to apolagise to her on Monday.Anyway,usually the chant is meant for the opposing teams keeper.I'm not sure which Ticos mom we were meant to have shagged. I'm not even sure if shagged is a word that is allowed on this board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarnCherry Posted October 16, 2004 Share Posted October 16, 2004 I don't see what is wrong with that. Nobody's mother is singled out in that chant, and it certainly is not racist or sexist (for those who beg to differ go check out the term sexist in your dictionaries). I'd sing it in front of my mother if she was at the game (she's 68) and it wouldn't offend her, and if it did, she'd not complain because she's well aware that at a soccer event in the supporters section coarse language and certain vulgarities are expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Former Champ Posted October 16, 2004 Share Posted October 16, 2004 Thanks Nazz! I was trying to remember the really good ones. I just couldn't remember them. Maybe it was the head damage, or the ... uh what's that about short term memory loss. We did get a little over the top, and Johnny was getting a little silly toward the end (but we had been drinkinhard beer in the sun all afternoon). I appologize for raising my voice to that nice old lady, but she wasn't standing up when the National Anthems were playing, and she didn't seem to understand what I was saying when I first mentioned to her to stand. It was already pretty nuts by then and it was hard to hear the music. I'll send her some flowers (or really strong beer) if it will help. Hopefully she got a kick out of seeing me stomped into the track. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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