2017 Voyageurs Cup Format and Timeframe

[spinrack]

Do we know what the format and timeframe is for this year's Canadian Championship?

It seems the situation has become complicated with league changes.  Can Ottawa even compete for the Voyageurs Cup, now that they are an affiliate of Montreal Impact?  Not sure about the situation for Edmonton.

Also haven't seen any information on when the games will be played.   Has this been decided yet?

[Gopherbashi]

Haven't heard anything.  Don't know if they're going with 4 teams, 5 teams, or 7 teams.  They could even surprise us by throwing a couple D3 teams in there if they're expanding it to the USL sides (wouldn't count on it this year though)

[Zem]

It's going to be at least 5, although Montopoli previously said they were looking to include D3 semi-pro clubs in 2018 or 2019, so I'm guessing it'll be the same as the last few years.

Yes Ottawa is obviously still eligible to play in the VC, an affiliation agreement doesn't change that in any way. Besides the fact this type of deal happens literally everywhere and they're only loaning in 4 or 5 players, the deal doesn't influence Ottawa or Montreal's operations in any way, shape or form. Ottawa gets first pick to bring players from a select group in on loan at any time and gets to host a friendly with Montreal. That's literally the entire deal, which is obviously nothing like the AHL-style affiliation agreements everyone is imagining, where the parent club chooses and controls the affiliate club's entire roster and staff.

[Dub Narcotic]

Thank you, @Zem. Vancouver had these USL affiliation deals as far back as their second or third year in the league with Charleston, as did Toronto with the late, lamented Wilmington Hammerheads. Both teams were eligible for the U.S. Open Cup, played or not played the loaned players as it fit their needs and there has been no controversy at all over this very useful program. 

The USL teams get good players without incurring as much in the way of scouting and salary costs while the MLS teams got playing time for their youngsters in a competitive environment. When the partnership was announced there was talk about the MLS clubs sharing marketing and operational expertise but I'm not sure how far that ever went. USL does a lot of stuff centrally now, including web presence and television broadcasting so I'm not sure how useful that would be in any case.

[Kent]

16 hours ago, Gopherbashi said:

Don't know if they're going with 4 teams, 5 teams, or 7 teams

Zem already addressed Ottawa, but your question of 7 teams I assume is referring to VWFC2 and TFC2. They won't be in the tournament. Them not being in the tournament in previous years was never about the league they were playing in, but rather that they are not the top team for their club.

That being said, I really wish they would give us definitive word on when they will expand it to L1O/PLSQ teams, and how that will work (just champions? Or everybody? Or just a certain number that can qualify?)

[Gopherbashi]

On 1/19/2017 at 10:18 AM, Kent said:

Zem already addressed Ottawa, but your question of 7 teams I assume is referring to VWFC2 and TFC2. They won't be in the tournament. Them not being in the tournament in previous years was never about the league they were playing in, but rather that they are not the top team for their club.

That being said, I really wish they would give us definitive word on when they will expand it to L1O/PLSQ teams, and how that will work (just champions? Or everybody? Or just a certain number that can qualify?)

I expect they'll expand it to L1O & PLSQ (& BCRT3?) when the CPL finally launches - easiest just to do it all at once rather than messing with the format before then.  I wouldn't expect an announcement before that league launches.

My gut says they'll try to limit D3 participation to maintain its image as a high-level tournament, but I could be surprised.  The purist in me would love to see this combined with the cup tournaments that L1O & PLSQ currently run as part of their seasons, but I'm not holding my breath.

As for how many teams D3 teams qualify... it may depend on how many pro teams are involved.  If they can make a nice format with one D3 team, they'll do that.  If it takes three, they'll do that instead.  The format may be fluid if the CPL goes through a few expansions in the first few years, and we could see D3 participation go up or down as a result.

The only two expectations I have for format are
1) the three MLS sides and one CPL side (ie. last year's champion) are seeded for direct entry into the quarter-finals (where they will be joined by 4 other teams from previous rounds), and
2) they'll want the D3 sides to face at least one pro opponent before meeting the MLS sides.

Point 1 because you won't have enough quality for a useful round of 16, and point 2 because there's no point in having Vaughan Azzurri face Toronto FC in the opening round of said round of 16.

It would be cool to see the PDL teams have a route in (especially in those provinces who don't have a D3 league), but I figure that's less likely if BC has a league in competition to it.

[Kent]

27 minutes ago, Gopherbashi said:

I expect they'll expand it to L1O & PLSQ (& BCRT3?) when the CPL finally launches - easiest just to do it all at once rather than messing with the format before then.  I wouldn't expect an announcement before that league launches.

My gut says they'll try to limit D3 participation to maintain its image as a high-level tournament, but I could be surprised.  The purist in me would love to see this combined with the cup tournaments that L1O & PLSQ currently run as part of their seasons, but I'm not holding my breath.

As for how many teams D3 teams qualify... it may depend on how many pro teams are involved.  If they can make a nice format with one D3 team, they'll do that.  If it takes three, they'll do that instead.  The format may be fluid if the CPL goes through a few expansions in the first few years, and we could see D3 participation go up or down as a result.

The only two expectations I have for format are
1) the three MLS sides and one CPL side (ie. last year's champion) are seeded for direct entry into the quarter-finals (where they will be joined by 4 other teams from previous rounds), and
2) they'll want the D3 sides to face at least one pro opponent before meeting the MLS sides.

Point 1 because you won't have enough quality for a useful round of 16, and point 2 because there's no point in having Vaughan Azzurri face Toronto FC in the opening round of said round of 16.

It would be cool to see the PDL teams have a route in (especially in those provinces who don't have a D3 league), but I figure that's less likely if BC has a league in competition to it.

To your point number 1, I really hope that doesn't happen. D3 teams, NASL teams, and USL teams can come in earlier than MLS/CPL teams for all I care, but I hope that whatever round MLS teams come in, the CPL teams come in that round too, and no earlier. All signs point to the CPL being branded as a D1 league in Canada, but if they came in at an earlier round than MLS that does 2 things.

1. It effectively labels them D2.
and
2. It gives them a slightly lower chance of winning the tournament.

I would think it would be best for the CPL, and the CSA, and in the long run the CanMNT, if CPL could win this tournament. So it doesn't make sense for the CSA to put them at a disadvantage. Another thing that would help the CPL's odds a little bit is a random draw. I would like to see that, but won't be as disappointed if they don't do that.

[Gopherbashi]

2 minutes ago, Kent said:

To your point number 1, I really hope that doesn't happen. D3 teams, NASL teams, and USL teams can come in earlier than MLS/CPL teams for all I care, but I hope that whatever round MLS teams come in, the CPL teams come in that round too, and no earlier. All signs point to the CPL being branded as a D1 league in Canada, but if they came in at an earlier round than MLS that does 2 things.

1. It effectively labels them D2.
and
2. It gives them a slightly lower chance of winning the tournament.

I would think it would be best for the CPL, and the CSA, and in the long run the CanMNT, if CPL could win this tournament. So it doesn't make sense for the CSA to put them at a disadvantage. Another thing that would help the CPL's odds a little bit is a random draw. I would like to see that, but won't be as disappointed if they don't do that.

Fair point; random draw is the other way to do it - it's what I'd expect for matchups in the pre-QF round.  I suppose MLS could be included in that and the draw could be extended for any bye positions as well.