After two games under Mitchell, what do we know?

[gkhs]

I am wrong in thinking that we might not have another home match until the WCQ starts in June?

It doesn't seem like either October date will happen. And, November (2 dates), February (1) and March (1) are all iffy weather-wise.

What is the over-under on how many matches we get total before June, maybe 2.5?

[Cheeta]

quote:Originally posted by Aljarov

I didn't like Mitchell's 4-5-1 for the U20s and I can't say I care for it now.

I'm not Canadian, so I don't know that I have a voice on it or not. Only reason I can accept it is that midfield is clearly Canada's strongest position, but i'd be tempted to play DE RO as a withdrawn #2 striker than put hium on the left. Especially with Jazic, Brennan and Peters (potentially in the future) who can all do a job there.

It's a very fluid midfield with plenty of freedom allowed throughout. There is tons of positional movement dependent on the moment and need. A real strength from that sort of formation which we are lucky enough, given our available 1st team players, to capitalise on.

Big fan of allowing fullbacks the occasional attack. It just throws another spanner into the defenders gears and we've got the lads with an eye enough to take advantage of these runs so why not? But I think this crop of midfielders is intelligent enough to effectively play with that in mind rather than altering the managers currently preferred formation.

[Bxl Boy]

That 4-5-1 didn't convince me neither

We created much too few opportunities, regarding our midfield players and our domination

The lone winger has too few help from the second line

We have a pretty strong squad though.

[villus]

I think we should work JB or Kluka in at center back with the other at left back. I love Friends flicks and holding up the ball etc, but he looks sheepish around goal and if he can get over that great but if not Gerba or Ocean will have to do the job. Obviously JDG2 on the right side would make easily the best midfield in Concacaf as right now we have argueably the best midfield in Concacaf.

Serioux looked good but I am worried about his compusure, he wins balls well but in the past has been mistake prone. Our midfield is not only great going forward but defend really well to such a treat to have Deguz and Hutch who can play the whole pitch. Would like to see Tam in Bernier's spot but what is going on with him not playing for us??? this does'nt make anysense to me as he is cap tied and getting a euro passport should have nothing to do with this no???

Overall I love our squad, we have depth it seems in almost every position which is great for qualifying as except for the core group of 4 or 5 players we don't miss much with the 2nd or even 3rd choice and also in the next couple years you will see guys like Peeters and the Geordie pushing through the ranks.

[BigBird]

I don’t like it, primary reason is by the time World Cup qualifying rounds take place surely Canada will be one of the oldest team in those qualifying rounds, this does not impress me. Mitchell has to go out on the limb and start to call up young players in these exhibition game or Friendly games and call up at minimum 5 to 8 players every start and stop wanting to try to win today and then only managing ties or a loss, for the sake of his job tomorrow. He must start using these players smartly and efficiently so that they can show him and the Canadian people what they can do or not do. When you compare teams like Germany who virtually got rid of the older timers several years ago and put a lot of energy and money into their young players things happen for them and quickly if I may say moving up 25 places in raking after the previous World Cup is a serious improvement and now rank 5th. They will be a serious World Cup Contenders in 2010. I known some of you guys are going to say the numbers are not there to do it. How can you compare us to Germany, bull**** you never know unless you try. If Mitchell does not starting using these players now, it’s because he does not want to take risk so that he can protect his job tomorrow because the only thing Mitchell has is experience of older players to keep his job and in check and tell the Canadian people what they want him to say "see I tied the game Costa Rica a game we should have won but unfortunate this and that" I'm not hear for ties and listen to excuses you should have won that game specially CR down to 10 men.

A couple of fresh young legs in there would have helped trust me. Cr was sleeping the last minutes they had nothing left.

So no I was not happy with the lineup and nor Mr. Mitchell roster, and nor the result not good enough. I want to win not tie..

It really funny when you compare Canada with most others looking at 80% of their men’s team with ages between 23 to 25 and 20 % of the them older tops maybe 4 or 5 guys over the age of 26 we are at the bottom of the table.

Please do not get me wrong I want to make myself clear, I’m suggesting in any way shape of form that these older players are not good enough they are very talented but unfortunately that’s a simple fact of life. A Coach like Mitchell should realize that the speed and energy required to play this sport has changed, the ball moves so fast and all directions make a single mistake or a one step behind your opponent and you pay the price and this is an unfortunate situation for some to quick for some, and not all there for others. It is too bad I may feel this way especially with some that have given us so much in the past, but reality is what it is.

[SCF08]

______________________Hirschfield___________________________

_Stalteri_________McKenna_______Edgar____________De Jong___

______________________Hutchinson____________________________

_______Jonathan de Guzman__________Julian de Guzman__________

Hume____________________Occean______________DeRosario_____

Jonathan de Guzman is celebrating his birthday today btw. He is 20 years old now...[)]

[gkhs]

quote:Originally posted by BigBird

A couple of fresh young legs in there would have helped trust me. Cr was sleeping the last minutes they had nothing left.

I think Peters and Johnson took themselves out of the running at u-20. Prior to that I think they were both likely to be called.

Begovic and Edgar are the only really young players who seem to have escaped unscathed.

[BigBird]

quote:Originally posted by gkhs

I think Peters and Johnson took themselves out of the running at u-20. Prior to that I think they were both likely to be called.

Begovic and Edgar are the only really young players who seem to have escaped unscathed.

I think there is many more then u suggested or mention and so what if they had a bad outing. The next could mean al lot different.

but I'm sure there are at least 20 to kids out there that can be looked at in fact if I was Mitchell I would hold a camp of just players between the age of 20 to 25 years of age.. with some experience players in Europe thus making it easier for the Europe players to attend a 10 camp let say!....

[Massive Attack]

BigBird, I think you are wrong about your assertion of youth. Just take a look at the old players Italy just called for their last 2 games. Most players were between 27-34 years old, with the exception of Aquilani. I'm sure this isn't very different for most of the better nations.

We can not be calling young, unproven players who play in low leagues. That will be an absolute disaster. Those players will get eaten alive. We've already seen what happened when Yallop used Peters in '04.

I have no problem blooding a few young players at a time. But a total youth movement would be a total mess and would only set the program back. Our current awesome midfield of DeRo, DeGuzman, Atiba, Bernier is still fairly young.

We need to be calling the best players who are playing in the best leagues possible. End of story. When those younger players rise up to the same level as the current core, then they will deserve call ups as well.

[VPjr]

quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

BigBird, I think you are wrong about your assertion of youth. Just take a look at the old players Italy just called for their last 2 games. Most players were between 27-34 years old, with the exception of Aquilani. I'm sure this isn't very different for most of the better nations.

We can not be calling young, unproven players who play in low leagues. That will be an absolute disaster. Those players will get eaten alive. We've already seen what happened when Yallop used Peters in '04.

I have no problem blooding a few young players at a time. But a total youth movement would be a total mess and would only set the program back. Our current awesome midfield of DeRo, DeGuzman, Atiba, Bernier is still fairly young.

We need to be calling the best players who are playing in the best leagues possible. End of story. When those younger players rise up to the same level as the current core, then they will deserve call ups as well.

Here Here....We need our main pool of 25-26 players to play as much as possible together in preperation for WCQ in 2008-09. we don't need some kid playing for a reserve team in Holland at this time. Those guys will have a chance in the lead up to 2014 qualifying, if they progress.

I do think it can't hurt to run some U-23 camps (maybe 1 in Florida and 1 in Europe) just so the MNT coaches can get a feel for the quality of the youngsters toiling in the lower levels of pro-soccer in North America and Europe. It's always good to know who you have coming up that are under the age of 23 but they are not part of the immediate future (for the most part).

[BigBird]

quote:Originally posted by Massive Attack

BigBird, I think you are wrong about your assertion of youth. Just take a look at the old players Italy just called for their last 2 games. Most players were between 27-34 years old, with the exception of Aquilani. I'm sure this isn't very different for most of the better nations.

We can not be calling young, unproven players who play in low leagues. That will be an absolute disaster. Those players will get eaten alive. We've already seen what happened when Yallop used Peters in '04.

I have no problem blooding a few young players at a time. But a total youth movement would be a total mess and would only set the program back. Our current awesome midfield of DeRo, DeGuzman, Atiba, Bernier is still fairly young.

We need to be calling the best players who are playing in the best leagues possible. End of story. When those younger players rise up to the same level as the current core, then they will deserve call ups as well.

Massive Italy just managed to get bye. In fact there will be coaching change soon and the mentality will changed they are already talking about gettting rid of the older players for the world cup. and beside italy could be out of the euro the next round due to this problem.....of an over aged team. they are not playing well at all...

[BigBird]

quote:Originally posted by VPjr

Here Here....We need our main pool of 25-26 players to play as much as possible together in preperation for WCQ in 2008-09. we don't need some kid playing for a reserve team in Holland at this time. Those guys will have a chance in the lead up to 2014 qualifying, if they progress.

I do think it can't hurt to run some U-23 camps (maybe 1 in Florida and 1 in Europe) just so the MNT coaches can get a feel for the quality of the youngsters toiling in the lower levels of pro-soccer in North America and Europe. It's always good to know who you have coming up that are under the age of 23 but they are not part of the immediate future (for the most part).

here is a list of players and maybe you can even more but a good start i would think for a camp

Lombardo, Andrea 20 m

Edgar, David 20 d

Begovic, Asmir 20

Giacomi, Roberto 21 g

Hainault, André 21 d

Gyaki, Ryan 21 m

O'Neill, Riley 22 m

Hughes, Dylan 22 f

Ledgerwood, Nikolas 22

Harmse, Kevin 23

Nakajima-Farran, Issey 23

Hume, Iain 23

Simpson, Josh 24

Hutchinson, Atiba 25 m

Placentino, Rocco 25 m

Friend, Rob 27 f

De Rosario, Dwayne 29 m

Stalteri, Paul 29

Bernier, Patrice 28

de Guzman, Julian 26 m

Stamatopoulos, Kenny 28 g

de Jong, Marcel 21 m

Gerba, Ali 25 f

[Gian-Luca]

Unless we're talking about Messi-like prodigies, I think it's a good sign that we can field a strong squad of players between the ages of 24 & 32 without having to resort to using the U20 players before they are ready. It's a sign of gaining some depth.

Outside of Radz & maybe Onstad, when qualifying begins almost every player called is likely going to be between the 24 & 32 age group. Peters is a possibility as well because of the dimension he brings that nobody else can bring to the same extent - unbelievable speed. If we use Johnson, Edgar & Begovic it will likely be because of injuries/suspension or that they will have developed significantly over the coming year with their club teams.

[ken]

quote:Originally posted by gkhs

How are people feeling about our lineup?

Who has established themselves in our first choice side?

IMO:

100% Certain

- DeRo on the left

- de Guzman in the middle

- Hutch in the middle

- Stalteri at RB

85%

- Brennan at LB; as much as I liked Jazic at GC, JB was stellar last night working the overlap with DeRo.

60%

- Bernier in midfield; he wasn't up to the standard of the Big Three, and I don't love his work on set pieces.

- Serioux at CB; I thought he was solid, especially given that he is still recovering from injury.

- Keeper: I think Lars v Onstad is a toss-up, Lars has an edge given his relative lack of grey hair (any hair).

Still Up For Grabs

- Right Side of Midfield: Radz v Hume v Issey. Radz was fine, but notably less a threat than DeRo opposite.

- CB: Hainault looks too mistake prone to be trusted.

- Striker: I like all of our options here, but I'm not sure I see AG as a solo striker.

I agree with the 100%'s.

As to the 85%'s while I like Brennan and felt his absence in WCQ '06 was one of the bigest marks against FY, I wouldn't put him this high, I still think that this spot is between Jazic and Klukowski. I didn't find Brennan's crosses, usually his strong point up to his usual quality last night. I might put McKenna in at the 85% level, not because of his prodigeous skill but because he is the best of a rather middling lot.

At he 60%'s I would agree with Bernier although I don't think he has ever shown at the national level what he can do, but think, he has started almost every game he has been present for over the last four years, apparantly the coaching staff values him highly.

Wouldn't put Serioux that highly; in the sense that Hume is a sub for a shot of offense, Serioux is a sub to give a shot of toughness - but still more of a sub than starter.

Keeper is the man of mystery spot, Lars? Sutton? Onstad? are all three or even any one of them interested in being #1 as opposed to showing up from time to time and starting. I'd put them at 40, 40 and 20% respectively.

Still up for grabs:

Striker, between Friend, Occean and Gerba, pick one.

One midfield spot, either outside right ( Radz v Hume v Issey v Bernier) or in front of the central backs ( Bernier v Imhof v Tam ).

One centre back, Hainault seems to have the #3 spot locked up but #2 beside McKenna seems to be open.

These rankings are not intended as a slight to others who may, with improvement push their way in such as Simpson and Peters, it's just that they are - at present more of spot starters and subs.

In the past few U20 WC's Mitchell seemed to rely on certain players to be leaders, Hume, Hutchinson, Ledgerwood, Gyaki, Hainault, Edgar Johnson and Begovic. While some are already important to the national team, it will be interesting to see how they progress in the Mitchell regime.

[BigBird]

quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca

Unless we're talking about Messi-like prodigies, I think it's a good sign that we can field a strong squad of players between the ages of 24 & 32 without having to resort to using the U20 players before they are ready. It's a sign of gaining some depth.

Outside of Radz & maybe Onstad, when qualifying begins almost every player called is likely going to be between the 24 & 32 age group. Peters is a possibility as well because of the dimension he brings that nobody else can bring to the same extent - unbelievable speed. If we use Johnson, Edgar & Begovic it will likely be because of injuries/suspension or that they will have developed significantly over the coming year with their club teams.

Gian Luca Im not suggesting that this has to be the squad. I believe in order to get exposure and to clean up house you need to get the youth involved at the experience level nessessary sooner the better. Playing higher level, will show first of all, interests and lets the player know that hay we like you and aprreciate your hard work keep it up son, secondly you can get good constructive critizem, thirdly one's experience like Dero and Friend, etc they can give to a younger guy is priceless for the return one can get. One on One knowledge is the satisfying thrill of any young player who wants it, with learning experience goes a long way with Players. But you suggest to Wait for what. At this moment in time your going backwards then forwards, so why not take chances and risks you never know what you find....and never know what you gain unless you put your job on the line.,,.,,,,,,

Of course unless somelse is running it and not Mitchell/

And bsides im not suiggesting either that all under 20 player play im suggesting a camp with the experience ones on my list will help them....re assess, analays, reafirm, their positions on future players past or present... young or not!

Waiting is not a solution here, There are even more players outside that I mentioned that can have a great camp a re-looked at squad since nobody know what they are doing at the CSA someone shold take charge do you not think....why Not" what do you have to loose a game give me a break.....

Buy the way I forgot to mention these 20 years players your talking about will be 23 24 in 2010 that to me is a ripe age.... germany had 3 or 4 of them in there squad playing if im not mistaken in the last cup and today a 22 year old scores

and currently 9 players younger or equal too 1985 thats half a team

http://www.dfb.de/index.php?id=137

some of these guys have 40 caps

I tell you what give me a selection of my 20 players outside the mens team currently on the rooster and trust me they will be praised with a tie or maybe a small loss but the mens will have to work hard to keep out of the nets.

I change my mind after looking at the list of players I know I will be beat them.