SABuffalo786 Posted October 3, 2003 Share Posted October 3, 2003 quote:Originally posted by trueviking sabuffalo...i agree, the soccer players certainly are not as bad. i guess i tend to paint them with the same brush as other american athletes. i often listen to the comments of the players and coach and interpret them as arrogance. This might be because i have a tainted perspective from athletes in other sports however. Understandable. Bruce can come off as a little cocky from time to time, but that's just NYC swagger, I suppose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amacpher Posted October 3, 2003 Share Posted October 3, 2003 quote:Originally posted by trueviking i agree FIFA's rankings are bogus. that's another argument completely. however...The U.S. was top eight in the world cup only one year ago. a goal away from top four. cant argue with those results. a lot of teams that we all believe are better than them are ranked lower and did not reach the same level that they did on the biggest stage of all. thats two pretty solid reasons for my statement that they are better than most countries in the world. seems like it cant be true eh? Well, I guess our debate is going in circles a bit. Because I already handed-it to the USMNT that they had 2 good games in the '02 WC (surrounded by 100 years plus 16 months of sucking). The WC is just such a short tournament that there are always gonna be a few surprises. Last year it happened to be Korea and the US. In '98 it was Croatia. NExt WC it will be someone else. But these teams are not among the best unless they can prove that it wasn't just a one-time fluke! Based on the USA's Confed Cup and Gold Cup performances, it certainly looks like their run was a fluke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SABuffalo786 Posted October 3, 2003 Share Posted October 3, 2003 quote:Originally posted by amacpher Not to be defensive, but I think it's too early to pass judgement on whether 2002 was a fluke or not. We didn't bring our A Squads to either tournament and had to rely on the fledgling leadership of the likes of Donovan, Beasley, Bocanegra, Martino, Twellman, etc.... We NEVER do well on European soil, and France even more. All three of our games, though admitedly dissapointing, were fairly close affairs, all of them being 1 goal differences. The Gold Cup was more of a dissapointment, but we did manage to medal, and we went out to Brazil (yes I know it was their U-23's, but WHAT a U-23 team!) in overtime which is definitley no disgrace. Besides, did you expect anyone BUT Mexico to win that tournament, having the final in Azteca and all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted October 3, 2003 Share Posted October 3, 2003 I am grateful for the success of the US, Mexico & Costa Rica in the last World Cup. I guess that is the closest I can say to "supporting" them. I also wish the US the best of success for the relatives I have in the US and nice US fans I have met over the years. I can't say the same thing for the other Concacaf nations. I hate Mexico with a passion and always will, could never cheer for them under any circumstances, not even if my life depended on it. I've had too many battles in the stands with Mexican fans in World Cup qualifiers to think otherwise. I hate Jamaica due to their fans (not all of them, but enough of them that I have met to my personal distaste, including those at Varsity Stadium who decided to hurl racial insults at Dwayne De Rosario for some unknown & unprovoked reason, I hate T&T due to Jack Warner (chiefly, but there are other reasons, I hate El Salvador, Honduras & Guatemala for the conduct of their players (who often cheat like there is no tomorrow) and their fans. Costa Rican fans & American fans aren't so bad. However, because I hate Steve Sampson's guts (and he hates Canada seemingly, with all of his anti-Canadian comments I've heard over the years) I have to say I hate Costa Rican with a passion now too. I mean "hate" in the nicest possible way of course. Reasons to dislike the US? Here's one - US telecasts! I've heard for the past 20 years US broadcasters overrate the talents & importance of the US team (the US is good, but they way some of these guys go on about the US team, if you were to believe them you be shocked to discover the US hasn't actually won the past 5 World Cups with ease). But the main reason why I can't really "support" the US is because in my eyes, the US is Canada's main rival (even if not the other way round), and how can I support our main rivals? Its like Holland cheering for the Belgians, or vice versa. I'll be grateful for the more qualifying spots the US can get for Concacaf, but you're still Canada's main (and historic) rival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJT Posted October 4, 2003 Share Posted October 4, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca I hate Mexico with a passion and always will, could never cheer for them under any circumstances, not even if my life depended on it. Okay, "not even if my life depended on it" is just something you say (at least I hope it's just something you say ), but how about this scenario: it's the last game of the hex and Canada needs Mexico to beat, say, Costa Rica in order for us to qualify for the World Cup --- do you cheer for Mexico then? Under those circumstances with the US in place of Mexico I would cheer for the US, but there aren't very many other scenarios where I would cheer for the US. As for the rest of CONCACAF apart from the US, a few people have said a few things that are in line with the way I feel, but overall I relate best to PaulV's comments: essentially, I feel no connection to other CONCACAF countries. I may or may not cheer for them, it would all depend on the specific game. Like trueviking, I can't get into the "the better they do, the better it is for Canada" rationale since the effect on Canada is so small and so indirect that it just doesn't mean much to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nedvedfan Posted October 4, 2003 Share Posted October 4, 2003 IT is Canada all the way of course. but for me it is Mexico. ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY ARE AT HOME. In frontof 120,000 at the the azteca. Anyone in Concacaf that beats the Americans they are my Favorite at least for the day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy_Yank Posted October 4, 2003 Author Share Posted October 4, 2003 quote:Originally posted by amacpher Errr... the U.S. is a LOOOOONNG way from being "better than almost everyone in the world" in soccer. Sucking in the sport for 100 years, having 2 good games and then sucking for another 16 months doesn't make them "better than almost everyone in the world" in soccer. To put it bluntly, I think the above post is pure ignorance. If participating in the last 4 world cup, advancing to the 2nd round and quarter finals during the past 9 years, and having over 100 Americans in Europe constitutes sucking then I suppose 90% of all countries suck at soccer. I don't feel the US deserves the #9 world ranking, but to say they suck is pure prejudice and bias on your part. A lot of countries wish they "sucked" as bad as the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy_Yank Posted October 4, 2003 Author Share Posted October 4, 2003 quote:Originally posted by trueviking geez...now i feel bad...i was just reading the posts on other topics from the american's on this board ...they all seem like really nice guys. sorry....nothing personal. you guys have an excellent highway system. Don't feel bad about it. You weren't disrespectfull in any way and didn't say anything that was untrue. I'm very left wing and I depise our Government. I can understand why a lot of people dislike America. If I was a different nationality I'd probably dislike America. It makes me feel bad that so many people hate my country due to a few idiots. American soccer players suffer from a lack of respect from the home front, and then dislike from the international community due to their nationality. I do disagree about American soccer players being arrogant though. That couldn't be further from the truth. With the very rare exception the majority of them are very humble and really go out of their way to show their appreciation to the fans. A big reason why you're seeing more yanks going to Europe is because they have a reputation of being class professionals, and extremely hard workers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy_Yank Posted October 4, 2003 Author Share Posted October 4, 2003 quote:Originally posted by SABuffalo786 Agree 100%. Bruce used experimental lineups for both tournaments, using them as to give chances to younger players and broaden the player pool. He knows world cup qualifying is what is important. It would have been nice to win the CC and Gold Cup, but not at the expense of preparing the team for qualifying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mimglow Posted October 4, 2003 Share Posted October 4, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Gian-Luca But the main reason why I can't really "support" the US is because in my eyes, the US is Canada's main rival (even if not the other way round), and how can I support our main rivals? Its like Holland cheering for the Belgians, or vice versa. The Dutch would tell you that their main rivals are Germany. They view the Belgians as inferior cousins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trueviking Posted October 4, 2003 Share Posted October 4, 2003 one last point regarding the american national team being considered one of the best in the world, regardless of their FIFA ranking or World Cup performance...lets look at the results. i mentioned this a few months ago... in the last 70 matches that the american team has played they have beaten only 3 teams ranked in the top 20. excluding mexico, who they seem to play every month and beat about half the time, they have only managed one win against ireland (14th) and one win against portugal (15th). those are the best results they have had in 70 matches (almost 5 years!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gian-Luca Posted October 4, 2003 Share Posted October 4, 2003 quote:Originally posted by Mimglow The Dutch would tell you that their main rivals are Germany. They view the Belgians as inferior cousins. The Belgians I know of course would say otherwise, and certainly view the Dutch as their main rivals. Which would, in some ways, also parallel the US - Canada soccer relationship (as most Yanks would say Mexico, not Canada, are their main rivals). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Jeffery S. Posted October 4, 2003 Share Posted October 4, 2003 In most sports I have to say I am anti-US. I do not support their MNT at all. I like to see the US lose in pretty well everything, in team sports. And men, I really don't care what happens with the ladies. Of course it depends who they are playing. I thought the Portugal match in the WC was monumental, a fantastic performance. Maybe I was inspired by the fact that a certain Figo plays for Lusitania. I cheered for the US in that game and in quarters in fact, but was thankful they were stopped by the Germans in the end. If they had made semis it would have been unbearable. Individual sport it is totally different. I am a big supporter of certain tennis players, boxers, and admire certain athletes that have proved their worth over the years (like Edwin Moses). Let me just say that I am not necessarily anti-American at all, in fact I find myself defending a lot about the US here in Spain. Have relatives and plenty of friends in the States as well. But for me they are Canada's true rival, and especially in soccer. Sorry to our US posters. In contrast I have a certain empathy for Mexico -in spite of the Mexican fans I know here, who are damn arrogant- and some Central American teams, like Costa Rica. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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