CPL 2022 Season Attendance

[Cicero]

10 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Maybe the pay what you want promotion still worked better than I thought it did last week then. In the match thread there's a clip of the first goal of the Forge game where you can see almost the entire lower bowl on the side where most of the fans usually are. If anything 3688 looks on the generously announced side from that although it's still early in the game.

Do they have to play a home game on the same day so close to a TFC home game timing? There's probably significant overlap in support between the two clubs even if that's not how Bob Young & Co prefer to frame things. Think York eventually moved away from doing that to make it easier for people who first and foremost love the sport to do both.

Even on weekends, it takes a while for people to filter in. 3688 seems about right once everyone was in their seats. Still disappointing. It's like I've written before, there are a core group who show up to every game, but that core obviously isn't growing right now. No post-Covid restrictions boost apparently. But I'm not surprised, the people who show up never seemed to care too much about Covid protocols. Maybe there are some people who still refuse to go to crowd events, but I doubt that's a big number. Judging by the demographics at the game, it's not older people who are staying away. But that would mesh with my general experience, a lot of young people seem more worried about it than older people. Totally irrational, but an interesting reflection of generational characteristics.

[Pottsy3]

11 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Maybe the pay what you want promotion still worked better than I thought it did last week then. In the match thread there's a clip of the first goal of the Forge game where you can see almost the entire lower bowl on the side where most of the fans usually are. If anything 3688 looks on the generously announced side from that although it's still early in the game.

Honestly, the stand felt generally full to me asides from section 117 (which I believe they often sell to youth teams, groups, etc. during the summer months. 118 was pretty well packed. The TFC match likely created some obstacle, but I know some people who were able to attend both yesterday.

[narduch]

On 4/15/2022 at 6:53 PM, CDNFootballer said:

Just a reminder for this thread, the norm in pro sports is to announce tickets distributed numbers for attendance not butts in the seats.

TFC have said they announce turnstile counts, not tickets distributed. 

[Bison44]

And I told my wife I was working on my taxes and not watching the TFC2 game this afternoon....

[narduch]

2,420 for Pacific v Valour

[wwahl11]

I did a count of the people in the stands again (no one was in the north side bleachers) and came up with 236 at the April 15th game. It looked awful to be in the stands, Canadian or not.

Provisos: 1) people in the stands do not reflect ticket sales, 2) does not include a count of the people in the west stands (sections 109, 110, 111; cameras are on the west side) which include the super fans

Without actual club produced numbers, I am going to continue to use my counts. At least it will provide some trending information. Let me know if I should stop putting this in the thread. Based on a brief shot of the benches which showed a small portion of section 110, I estimate that there are an additional 120 people on the west side.

Edited April 18, 2022 by wwahl11
spelling

[Bison44]

10 hours ago, wwahl11 said:

Without actual club produced numbers, I am going to continue to use my counts. At least it will provide some trending information. Let me know if I should stop putting this in the thread. Based on a brief shot of the benches which showed a small portion of section 110, I estimate that there are an additional 120 people on the west side.

Kudos to you for doing the work and trying to be as accurate and fair as possible.    Maybe just ask yourself, do we really want to be quibbling over a couple hundred fans every weekend??  Is it 300, could it be 500....does it matter very much in the big scheme of things, that small a difference??  We'll all be able to tell if it gets into the 1000's eh??  You sound like your hearts in the right place but some people like to focus on attendance (mostly low) to throw shade on the league and ignore the attendance of every other league.  Its a work in progress.....lets all get out and see a few games this summer eh??  

[CDNFootballer]

On 4/17/2022 at 2:51 PM, narduch said:

2,420 for Pacific v Valour

Didn't see the figure on the website, where did you see this?

Seemed like nice weather but with it being Easter Sunday and also hearing of many in the lower mainland who traveled to the US for the long weekend (4 hour border waits at the peace arch crossing on the mainland) not totally surprised at the sparse turnout.

[narduch]

14 minutes ago, CDNFootballer said:

Didn't see the figure on the website, where did you see this?

Seemed like nice weather but with it being Easter Sunday and also hearing of many in the lower mainland who traveled to the US for the long weekend (4 hour border waits at the peace arch crossing on the mainland) not totally surprised at the sparse turnout.

 

[ted]

44 minutes ago, CDNFootballer said:

Didn't see the figure on the website, where did you see this?

Seemed like nice weather but with it being Easter Sunday and also hearing of many in the lower mainland who traveled to the US for the long weekend (4 hour border waits at the peace arch crossing on the mainland) not totally surprised at the sparse turnout.

They announced the attendance over the loudspeakers at the game. It was pretty disappointing I have to say but at least the atmosphere in the stadium was pretty good.

[jonovision]

5 minutes ago, ted said:

They announced the attendance over the loudspeakers at the game. It was pretty disappointing I have to say but at least the atmosphere in the stadium was pretty good.

If I squint while watching the games, it really seems as though a Pacific game is a good time. Almost impossible to tell from the camera position though. Is there really no better solution?

[narduch]

31 minutes ago, jonovision said:

If I squint while watching the games, it really seems as though a Pacific game is a good time. Almost impossible to tell from the camera position though. Is there really no better solution?

Apparently it will be fixed by next season.

Edit: reading a few articles and apparently no timelines are given. Only that the project is approved 

Edited April 19, 2022 by narduch

[shorty]

I'm actually impressed we got 2500 on Easter Sunday, given that many will have family obligations on that day.

As for the camera position -- if you've never been to Westhills/Starlight, there are seats on the three sides you can see on the broadcasts.  On the camera side, there are no seats:  just some areas that used to be beer tent areas last season, plus the team benches maybe 2 yards from the touch line, and the ~10ft high platform for the camera right behind that which is right under the offending hydro pole.  From touchline to Langford Parkway is probably only about 30m I would guess, with the hydro pole halfway, plus a new even bigger cell tower pole that went up last year, although that's tight to the road.  (One defensive clearance yesterday actually landed over the chain link fence on Langford Parkway, which I'm sure was a huge surprise for some driver....)

If they are indeed moving the pole as they say they are and erecting stands on that side, the camera will surely go at the top somewhere.  In the meantime you could potentially put a camera on the roof of the main south stand to gain some height, but half the time it would look like a high school game with almost no fans except some exuberant supporters group on aluminum bleachers.  Not ideal for production.  Kind of like what York looks like on the broadcasts.

I actually hope that if they do build the fourth side that they get cameras on top of both north and south for reverse angles and so you can see the new stands too.

Also, apparently they will be filling in the corners, which would be great.

Edited April 19, 2022 by shorty

[Watchmen]

4 hours ago, CDNFootballer said:

Didn't see the figure on the website, where did you see this?

Seemed like nice weather but with it being Easter Sunday and also hearing of many in the lower mainland who traveled to the US for the long weekend (4 hour border waits at the peace arch crossing on the mainland) not totally surprised at the sparse turnout.

I would not factor in lower mainlanders going to the US as a reason for the sparse turnout at the game.  I'm not saying no one goes, but it's essentially negligible for most games.

[grasshopper1917]

7 hours ago, Watchmen said:

I would not factor in lower mainlanders going to the US as a reason for the sparse turnout at the game.  I'm not saying no one goes, but it's essentially negligible for most games.

It seems like there is always a list of excuses when a game is poorly attended. Bad start time, TFC was playing, bad weather, traffic jam, weeknight..... at the end of the day at some point the league is going to have to start drawing some decent crowds. 

 

[Haligonian#1]

4 hours ago, grasshopper1917 said:

It seems like there is always a list of excuses when a game is poorly attended. Bad start time, TFC was playing, bad weather, traffic jam, weeknight..... at the end of the day at some point the league is going to have to start drawing some decent crowds. 

 

I guess we in Halifax are able to consistently pull in attendances in the 6,000 range at every match because all of our game days have plenty of sunshine, 21-26 degree heat, no traffic, nothing else going on (of course, that's a given since we are unsophisticated when compared to Ontario, Manitoba, Alberta, and BC 🙄), the best of dates and times, etc.

[jonovision]

The one advantage Halifax has over other CPL cities (aside from Victoria, I guess) is that the Wanderers are the only local professional team that is part of a national league. That said, they must be doing something right to continue to pull these attendance numbers, because the product on the field over three years hasn't been too exciting.

[narduch]

Just now, jonovision said:

The one advantage Halifax has over other CPL cities (aside from Victoria, I guess) is that the Wanderers are the only local professional team that is part of a national league. That said, they must be doing something right to continue to pull these attendance numbers, because the product on the field over three years hasn't been too exciting.

They remind me of early TFC 

[m-g-williams]

2 minutes ago, jonovision said:

The one advantage Halifax has over other CPL cities (aside from Victoria, I guess) is that the Wanderers are the only local professional team that is part of a national league. That said, they must be doing something right to continue to pull these attendance numbers, because the product on the field over three years hasn't been too exciting.

I'd say the biggest things the Wanderers have done right are nailing their location and marketing. The Wanderers Grounds are a stone's throw from plenty of good pubs and shops downtown, and in an open area Haligonians are used to visiting for events anyway (I think the 2011 Canada Winter Games and the introduction of the Oval really helped with this). And they've really worked to position themselves not just as a team trying to appeal to the community, but to actually be *part* of the community. Goodwill visits to ships leaving for/returning from deployment down at HMC dockyard, partnering with different home-grown businesses and charities, building great relations with the Mooseheads and Thunderbirds . . . it's perfect. 

When the team embraces the community, the community embraces the team. 

[shorty]

15 minutes ago, m-g-williams said:

I'd say the biggest things the Wanderers have done right are nailing their location and marketing. The Wanderers Grounds are a stone's throw from plenty of good pubs and shops downtown, and in an open area Haligonians are used to visiting for events anyway

While I do like the stadium in Langford, I'm still sad that they couldn't have swung a deal for Royal Athletic Park in Victoria.  Selfish reasons, yes, in part, because I could walk to games, but similar reasons to the above.  Also, driving to Langford for games is a slog, and parking will be a disaster after they build the fourth side.

Edited April 19, 2022 by shorty

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

5 hours ago, grasshopper1917 said:

It seems like there is always a list of excuses when a game is poorly attended. Bad start time, TFC was playing, bad weather, traffic jam, weeknight..... at the end of the day at some point the league is going to have to start drawing some decent crowds.

...or adjust its business model to better fit the crowds they are actually drawing. 2500 actually isn't that bad for this sort of level of pro soccer especially in a location like Langford IMO. So far this year we are seeing more of the same on crowds from last year so people have had to come up with a new set of excuses because they can't blame it all on COVID-19 this time around.

Edited April 19, 2022 by Ozzie_the_parrot

[Haligonian#1]

13 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

...or adjust its business model to better fit the crowds they are actually drawing. 2500 actually isn't that bad for this sort of level of pro soccer especially in a location like Langford IMO. So far this year we are seeing more of the same on crowds from last year so people have had to come up with a new set of excuses and can't blame it all on COVID-19 this time around.

I think that it is a bit of both. In some markets, CPL teams could attract more fans with better marketing and a better stadium location and or setup. In other markets, the interest may not be that strong for a league like the CPL, or pro soccer in general.

[gator]

This past weekend our local news radio station totally ignored Forge in their sports segment after the hourly news, they talked about the Jays, Leafs and Raptors of course and locally promoted upcoming matches and past scores from the Bulldogs and the Toronto Rock, yes the Toronto Rock are a team that plays lacrosse in  Hamilton no mention of Forge! I don't know who to blame here, I have personally contacted the sports director twice who assured me this would never happen again, maybe the media people from the team should take a bigger responsibility for this? Attendance is not going to improve if the team is not promoted, I find this disappointing!

[Cicero]

17 minutes ago, gator said:

This past weekend our local news radio station totally ignored Forge in their sports segment after the hourly news, they talked about the Jays, Leafs and Raptors of course and locally promoted upcoming matches and past scores from the Bulldogs and the Toronto Rock, yes the Toronto Rock are a team that plays lacrosse in  Hamilton no mention of Forge! I don't know who to blame here, I have personally contacted the sports director twice who assured me this would never happen again, maybe the media people from the team should take a bigger responsibility for this? Attendance is not going to improve if the team is not promoted, I find this disappointing!

I don't listen to much local news radio, but I rarely hear about them on Y108, which is the only local station I ever listen to. I would say the Spec's coverage has improved over the last year. Was pretty minimal at the beginning. They've only got two sports reporters, and I don't think Radley is full time on sports, so I can't complain. Even though the Bulldogs are having their best season ever (as an OHL team anyway), I've heard or read almost nothing about them.

Hamilton's in a weird spot media-wise. It's a distinct city from Toronto, but the local media has been shrivelling away over the last couple decades and we just get lumped in with the GTA or ignored. CHCH has no sports at all on their website. I don't watch nightly news, so don't know if they cover local teams. I think Halifax has an advantage that way, it's a small city, but due to its relative isolation it has a pretty healthy local media.

My impression is that there has been some reduction in Forge's sales and marketing budget this year, but I don't know that for sure. 

Edited April 19, 2022 by Cicero

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

Losing the TSN sports radio station can't have helped either in a Hamilton context.