League 1 Alberta/Prairies

[Watchmen]

1 hour ago, Cblake said:

No, they are separate organization. Do not think Cavalry has any type of women's setup. 

 

Fair enough, but I think it's a poor look for Cavalry/the CPL: either it supports the women's complaint that the CSB really isn't helping them ("you've put a team in the men's league but couldn't be bothered with the women's"), or it's backlash from the CSB for the women complaining about the CSB.  Or maybe if L1A gets going next year, they'll be more organized and have a team in it.

[toontownman]

Hoping it's temporary branding and we get Saskatchewan and Manitoba involved. It's big and much welcomed news though. Step closer to a cross country L1 system that could naturally progress into creating a D2 east and west.

L1 Maritimes next.

Wonder if this year is the year onesoccer follows through with showing L1 games.

[Cblake]

3 hours ago, toontownman said:

Hoping it's temporary branding and we get Saskatchewan and Manitoba involved. It's big and much welcomed news though. Step closer to a cross country L1 system that could naturally progress into creating a D2 east and west.

L1 Maritimes next.

Wonder if this year is the year onesoccer follows through with showing L1 games.

At this level not sure a bunch of 6-7-8 hour bus rides are really going to make sense. There was talk of Alberta and Saskatchewan going in together but then it appeared the soccer community in Alberta decided to go at it alone. To be honest not really sure how different this league will be at least in the early stages to the existing Alberta Major Soccer League. It will be interesting to see how it progresses. 

[toontownman]

8 hours ago, Cblake said:

At this level not sure a bunch of 6-7-8 hour bus rides are really going to make sense. There was talk of Alberta and Saskatchewan going in together but then it appeared the soccer community in Alberta decided to go at it alone. To be honest not really sure how different this league will be at least in the early stages to the existing Alberta Major Soccer League. It will be interesting to see how it progresses. 

Yep. SK is left further behind again. It's backwards but IF a CPL team happens maybe it will trickle down from above instead of grow from below.

The bus rides are a reality for other sports aren't they? Hockey teams play multiple times a week not once a week like this will be (at best). I think it depends how much interest and hunger there is to make it happen. Likewise financial support.

For a summer series like this it could easily be organized to help travel or play multiple games over a long weekend in on destination. Long term it's likely still a problem as you say. I think the power of AB wanting to do there own thing might have been at play too. Not sure if the interest was there from Manitoba or more than one location in SK. At least it's getting started and that along with the branding is a huge step in the right direction. Imo.

[Kent]

21 hours ago, Cblake said:

At this level not sure a bunch of 6-7-8 hour bus rides are really going to make sense. There was talk of Alberta and Saskatchewan going in together but then it appeared the soccer community in Alberta decided to go at it alone. To be honest not really sure how different this league will be at least in the early stages to the existing Alberta Major Soccer League. It will be interesting to see how it progresses. 

Maybe this is naive, but I hope the branding itself is important. I have no idea if there will be any tangible difference, but if this league ends up with one or more (eventual) Voyageurs Cup spots, and is seen as a pathway to pro soccer at the CPL level, then maybe that can draw more talent or inspire players to keep at it beyond the youth age groups, or to push themselves harder to get to a higher level. Time will tell though. Everyone here is of course rooting for this league to materialize and then flourish.

[Unnamed Trialist]

On 3/11/2023 at 3:14 AM, Watchmen said:

Fair enough, but I think it's a poor look for Cavalry/the CPL: either it supports the women's complaint that the CSB really isn't helping them ("you've put a team in the men's league but couldn't be bothered with the women's"), or it's backlash from the CSB for the women complaining about the CSB.  Or maybe if L1A gets going next year, they'll be more organized and have a team in it.

The only two teams "confirmed" for the Matheson Project 8 women's league are Whitecaps and Foothills. As Cavalry emerged out of Foothills I assumed that was an indirect endorsement from Cavalry. 

Don't know how to interpret this though. As is, not a single CPL club has a women's team.

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

On 3/11/2023 at 4:29 AM, toontownman said:

Hoping it's temporary branding and we get Saskatchewan and Manitoba involved...

The L1 leagues are sanctioned by provincial soccer associations. Joe Belan was pushing for a D2 that would have been sanctioned by the CSA with a conference operating all across western Canada. The branding probably isn't temporary.

 

 

Edited March 12, 2023 by Ozzie_the_parrot

[Unnamed Trialist]

2 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

The L1 leagues are sanctioned by provincial soccer associations. Joe Belan was pushing for a D2 that would have been sanctioned by the CSA with a conference operating all across western Canada. The branding probably isn't temporary.

 

 

That's true, and usually you have provincial jurisdictions and federal. So the natural and legal way to set up a league is within a provincial domain. It may be easier for the ASA to do just that. The model, unfortunately, favours the provinces with more population and clubs.

There is nothing stopping provinces to align though, only you need multiple boards to work together and a couple provincial presidents, not just one of each.

If the can do this in the Maritimes the "advantage" is that distances aren't so great, assuming NFLD clubs would likely refuse for cost reasons. Longest trip might be Fredericton to North Sydney, 7 hours. The longest road trip in Alberta would be under 5.

[Kent]

For what it's worth, PLSQ has had Ontario teams (or at least one?) in it. I believe Ottawa Fury had a reserve team in there, not sure if there was others. It might be a bit more difficult, but I would think it would make sense for provinces like Saskatchewan and Manitoba to work together on something like this.

[EnigMattic1]

On 3/10/2023 at 11:37 PM, Cblake said:

1. Calgary Foothills - USL League 2
2. Edmonton Scottish - AMSL
3. St. Albert Impact - AMSL
4. BTB Soccer - ?
5. Cavalry FC - AMSL

Three of the five teams on the men's sides also plays in the AMSL. The AMSL men's division has 9 teams listed for 2023. I will be curious to see if the AMSL eventually just becomes L1 Alberta if most of the teams make the move and thus what is really different moving forward than what they have now. L1BC is kind of sitting on the fence right now in making itself something more than the Vancouver Metro Soccer League and the other leagues in the province with its short season etc. Looking forward to seeing how this plays out. 

Alberta Soccer Association - Alberta Major Soccer League (AMSL) : Website by RAMP InterActive

One would assume that, as the AMSL has already been set for this year, it will be the last season and then it will become L1 Alberta. Especially when 3 of the teams confirmed are AMSL teams.

[rydermike]

4 hours ago, Kent said:

For what it's worth, PLSQ has had Ontario teams (or at least one?) in it. I believe Ottawa Fury had a reserve team in there, not sure if there was others. It might be a bit more difficult, but I would think it would make sense for provinces like Saskatchewan and Manitoba to work together on something like this.

PLSQ has had two. It had Ottawa Fury Academy in 2015 and 2016. Currently, it has Ottawa South United since 2020

[toontownman]

On 3/12/2023 at 12:31 PM, Kent said:

For what it's worth, PLSQ has had Ontario teams (or at least one?) in it. I believe Ottawa Fury had a reserve team in there, not sure if there was others. It might be a bit more difficult, but I would think it would make sense for provinces like Saskatchewan and Manitoba to work together on something like this.

Very hard to see anything growing quickly outside of being involved with the AB teams. SK is left far behind the rest again with this move. 

What is the incentive for FC Manitoba to leave USL II? To form a MB/SK Prairie League they would be leaving a stable and competitive league to join one with maybe one or two other competitive team on their level.

I believe there is very high interest from one perspective club in Saskatchewan but outside of that 🤷‍♂️ There is neither the infrastructure of financial backing given the size of the communities outside of Saskatoon and Regina. Beyond FC Manitoba is there any scope for more Manitoba teams to take part? Brandon will be in the same boat as places like Prince Albert, Swift Current, Battlefords or Yorkton. Is there interest, funding and backing? I don't know but I find it very hard to believe. The travel for this type of league would be higher than other L1's wouldn't it? Could be very wrong there!

Involving Thunder Bay Chill would be great but they are too far for bussing games too. 

[EnigMattic1]

So, League1 Canada is going East to Halifax and Moncton to discuss a potential League1 Atlantic. Guess the Prairies don't matter. Kinda funny when they are using #RiseAsOne as their tagline.

[Kent]

7 hours ago, EnigMattic1 said:

So, League1 Canada is going East to Halifax and Moncton to discuss a potential League1 Atlantic. Guess the Prairies don't matter. Kinda funny when they are using #RiseAsOne as their tagline.

I don't understand your logic. If they were going to Saskatchewan or Manitoba to discuss a potential League1 Prairies wouldn't you be able to say "Guess the Atlantic Provinces don't matter. Kinda funny when they are using #RiseAsOne as their tagline."

Rome wasn't built in a day. If they have people to talk to in order to try to get the ball rolling in the East, then they should do that. That is good news, even if there isn't already something in place for Saskatchewan and Manitoba.

Edited March 15, 2023 by Kent
"The" is the preferred spelling of "teh". My change reflects that.

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

If the Alberta Soccer Association wants to do its own thing and handles the D3 sanctioning in a similar manner to BC, there's not a lot can be done about this where a wider Prairies format is concerned. In the Maritimes my guess would be that the Nova Scotia provincial association would do the league sanctioning with the other provincial associations granting playing out rights. That sort of approach could also happen in the Prairie provinces but only if Alberta wants it to and maybe they are not keen on the extra travel?

[Kingston]

11 hours ago, Kent said:

Rome wasn't built in a day. If they have people to talk to in order to try to get the ball rolling in the East, then they should do that. That is good news, even if there isn't already something in place for Saskatchewan and Manitoba.

The prairies are always going to be awkward because they only have three cities and those cities are pretty far from everything else.  (Two of them are even far from the third.)

If, in the next couple of years, we end up with L1BC, L1AB, L1O, PLSQ, and L1M that would be great.  We'd have something like 50 D3 teams covering over 90% of the population of the country.  Not perfect but still, wow!

[Bison44]

Yep, not perfect but better and better.  Kudos to MLS (oops I meant CPL, silly me) for helping get this off the ground and working with the provinces to expand the PLSQ and L10 type D3 model to BC and AB and hopefully the maritimes. Its just a matter of time before we have a repeat of L10's success,  with multiple guys on the CMNT team being L1BC, L1AB alums.   

And after all plenty of us prairie boys had to go to AB to find work, the soccer players will do the same.  

Edited March 16, 2023 by Bison44

[P-O]

I also hope they expand the Canadian FA Cup with the 3 MLS, the CPL & soon the 50 D3 clubs.

We might get there before 2030!

[rydermike]

8 hours ago, P-O said:

I also hope they expand the Canadian FA Cup with the 3 MLS, the CPL & soon the 50 D3 clubs.

We might get there before 2030!

It's not feasible at all. These teams just don't have the budget for cross country travel. Plus most of these guys have day jobs. They can't just take off 3-4 days from work for a cross country game. Canada is way bigger than England where even a D10 team can just drive a few hours for a match. 

Plus even if they were to do a bunch of regionalized games first, the D3 schedules are already compressed in a 3-4 month season. Can't just squish an extra 5 or so games in there. 

Edited March 16, 2023 by rydermike

[Cblake]

50 minutes ago, rydermike said:

It's not feasible at all. These teams just don't have the budget for cross country travel. Plus most of these guys have day jobs. They can't just take off 3-4 days from work for a cross country game. Canada is way bigger than England where even a D10 team can just drive a few hours for a match. 

Plus even if they were to do a bunch of regionalized games first, the D3 schedules are already compressed in a 3-4 month season. Can't just squish an extra 5 or so games in there. 

They can do it very regionalized like they do for the US Open Cup. Teams seem to make it work there. The USASA teams seem to sometimes be in better shape than say the USL L2/NPSL because they are mot along the lines of being a senior men's team than a college summer teams. When the start of the US Open was pushed up it was some USL L2 teams that pulled out because they simply did not have access to players. 

[rydermike]

2 hours ago, Cblake said:

They can do it very regionalized like they do for the US Open Cup. Teams seem to make it work there. The USASA teams seem to sometimes be in better shape than say the USL L2/NPSL because they are mot along the lines of being a senior men's team than a college summer teams. When the start of the US Open was pushed up it was some USL L2 teams that pulled out because they simply did not have access to players. 

They don't let every USL2 team in. There's 10 USAA teams and 18 USL2/Npsl teams. Basically the winners of each division. Exactly like we have here. We just have only 3 regional divisions. 

After round 1, they all face a pro team. We don't have enough pro teams for that, nor the geographical distribution of teams for it to be possible anyways. So we'd need multiple rounds of D3 and below teams in an already conjested schedule. I'd love for it to be possible, but it's just not feasible with our population centres and distance between them. 

Edited March 17, 2023 by rydermike

[Watchmen]

3 hours ago, rydermike said:

They don't let every USL2 team in. There's 10 USAA teams and 18 USL2/Npsl teams. Basically the winners of each division. Exactly like we have here. We just have only 3 regional divisions. 

After round 1, they all face a pro team. We don't have enough pro teams for that, nor the geographical distribution of teams for it to be possible anyways. So we'd need multiple rounds of D3 and below teams in an already conjested schedule. I'd love for it to be possible, but it's just not feasible with our population centres and distance between them. 

You can let as many D3 teams in as you want, with the knowledge that they'll be starting the rounds earlier.  Up to them if they choose to enter.  Because yes, not all D3 teams want to enter.  Further, I wouldn't be letting in any D3 teams that are reserve/academy teams for any of the MLS or CPL sides.

[Kingston]

21 hours ago, P-O said:

I also hope they expand the Canadian FA Cup with the 3 MLS, the CPL & soon the 50 D3 clubs.

All the D3 clubs already do participate in the Canadian Championship insofar as the D3 league winners earn a spot.  I don't see a need (nor do I see it as economically viable) to have a bunch of extra games among D3 teams as some sort of early round of the Canadian Championship.

[Kent]

On 3/17/2023 at 8:09 AM, Kingston said:

All the D3 clubs already do participate in the Canadian Championship insofar as the D3 league winners earn a spot.  I don't see a need (nor do I see it as economically viable) to have a bunch of extra games among D3 teams as some sort of early round of the Canadian Championship.

Agreed. If there is ever a day where we include all D3 teams, I think there has to be some sort of inter-league aspect to it. No real point in having a playoff to determine a team or two when the previous season already does this.

[Watchmen]

On 3/17/2023 at 5:09 AM, Kingston said:

All the D3 clubs already do participate in the Canadian Championship insofar as the D3 league winners earn a spot.  I don't see a need (nor do I see it as economically viable) to have a bunch of extra games among D3 teams as some sort of early round of the Canadian Championship.

 

On 3/19/2023 at 9:34 AM, Kent said:

Agreed. If there is ever a day where we include all D3 teams, I think there has to be some sort of inter-league aspect to it. No real point in having a playoff to determine a team or two when the previous season already does this.

I disagree. I think there's a difference between a club saying "we could be in the Voyageurs Cup (if we win the league)" and "we do participate in the Voyageurs Cup (even if it's preliminary rounds)".  I'm not saying we're at that stage yet (the L1s themselves are still developing), but I think there's value in allowing every club at this level that wants to be part of it to participate.