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Windsor CPL Club


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As much as there is all kinds of research saying publicly funded stadiums are a waste of resources that accomplish little, I wonder if the modular construction that we've seen with Bear at Westhills changes this analysis significantly. I feel like you could probably do a 8,000-10,000 seater from scratch for $8-10m. Maybe less. The Wanders Ground apparent cost $3-4 m to get up. Westhills was $5m or so for phase 1. The payback period on this can't be so bad, particularly with low municipal bond rates out there making money almost free.

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2 hours ago, Watchmen said:

I don't think 2019 is a good base line. Any new league/team has an initial wave of interest before seeing a decrease in the following years, unless the team is good. So regardless of the pandemic, I think you would have seen a decrease in attendance for some of those markets in years 2 and 3.

I don't think 2019 was a great baseline either. In Victoria there was stadium construction throughout most of the season which undoubtedly influenced attendance numbers negatively. It was brutal to be honest. Sadly it sounds like construction will once again happen during the next season. By all accounts the pandemic has been a harder hit though

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48 minutes ago, Markoaleks said:

Could playing at University of Windsor football stadium be an option? 
seem to recall this place was renovated and curious from locals if this option is feasible ? 

I have a feeling they will try to go straight into downtown.

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53 minutes ago, Rheo said:

 

8 minutes ago, Rheo said:

Didn't realize until I was out at the store but the news was the lead headline in the Windsor Star https://twitter.com/WhaleyStatic/status/1481024959623438337?s=20

As I was saying, if there's one city that could use some life and an nice project in their downtown core - it's Windsor. I can't see the city being that difficult for this. Frankly, this is a must

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Another point to think about is doesn't a franchise come with a piece of ownership of CSB?(Guessing at the Acronym, something like SUM for MLS). Wouldn't CSB own the selling rights to the Canadian National Team games or something to that effect? That has to be worth more now than originally projected with the way the CMNT is going. 4 straight sellouts(or very close to) and will only improve if we qualify for 2022.

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56 minutes ago, johnyb said:

Another point to think about is doesn't a franchise come with a piece of ownership of CSB?(Guessing at the Acronym, something like SUM for MLS). Wouldn't CSB own the selling rights to the Canadian National Team games or something to that effect? That has to be worth more now than originally projected with the way the CMNT is going. 4 straight sellouts(or very close to) and will only improve if we qualify for 2022.

Yes, you get a piece of CSB, and yes the CSB owns the broadcast rights to the CMNT for now. But they sold them to MediaPro for the next decade already, so it's a ways off before that would pay off for them.

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4 hours ago, Watchmen said:

Yes, you get a piece of CSB, and yes the CSB owns the broadcast rights to the CMNT for now. But they sold them to MediaPro for the next decade already, so it's a ways off before that would pay off for them.

?  Whatduyoumean? 

I'm sure it wasn't a one-off cash and carry deal.  MediaPro will be paying CSB for MNT rights on a results based scale (broadcast success & volume) for the period of the deal and all members of CSB will benefit from that (or not).

I think I've mentioned before how MediaPro monies may be financing the leagues expansion.  That is to say a suitable expansion group may "defer" those broadcast revenues until such time  as an agreed sum is recouped by the existing partners.  Saves an expansion franchise from a capital outlay, keeps cash in hand, and saves the existing CSB members from sharing a piece fo the MediaPro pie until a future date.  No inside knowledge, just speculating. 

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9 hours ago, Markoaleks said:

Could playing at University of Windsor football stadium be an option? 
seem to recall this place was renovated and curious from locals if this option is feasible ? 

The press release mentioned a soccer specific stadium as a requirement so that would suggest it's not. 

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2 hours ago, Cheeta said:

?  Whatduyoumean? 

I'm sure it wasn't a one-off cash and carry deal.  MediaPro will be paying CSB for MNT rights on a results based scale (broadcast success & volume) for the period of the deal and all members of CSB will benefit from that (or not).

I would not make that assumption at all. They weren't exactly approaching the negotiations from a position of strength. But, assuming CSB has clauses for profit sharing, it certainly would be after MediaPro has made back all their money first and taken a cut for themselves. I would not assume that the CSB is making that much off Canada games.

 

Edited by Watchmen
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2 hours ago, Cheeta said:

I think I've mentioned before how MediaPro monies may be financing the leagues expansion.  That is to say a suitable expansion group may "defer" those broadcast revenues until such time  as an agreed sum is recouped by the existing partners.  Saves an expansion franchise from a capital outlay, keeps cash in hand, and saves the existing CSB members from sharing a piece fo the MediaPro pie until a future date.  No inside knowledge, just speculating. 

I don't think I agree with this either, because I don't think MediaPro is paying that much in cash so I don't think there's that much to defer.  I think the agreement is likely mostly services, so there's nothing to defer.

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There's nothing obvious in the Valour accounts that appear online every year courtesy of the Blue Bombers that would suggest CSB is a significant asset for its partners financially at this point.

I'm wary about making any assumptions about why David Clanachan stepped down as things will become a lot clearer once we see what happens on the league replacing him and whether anything solid actually happens on securing an SSS in Windsor, but if the league is now potentially facing a low seven figure loss on operating FCE this season a possible explanation is that costs were cut elsewhere to offset that a bit. The rights for a Windsor team angle would camoflague that and help to spin things in a more positive way.

Winding things back to stadium locations, the University of Windsor is beside the highway leading up to the Ambassador Bridge and is not really downtown. Major downsides to the Lancers stadium would be that it has a running track and permamently marked fieldturf. Have seen it claimed that the league actively wants to avoid sharing with U-sports gridiron teams. Y9 was only supposed to be a stopgap solution initially.

The Windsor stadium that was mentioned on an earlier page has more of a southern outer fringes of traditional downtown sort of location but could be problematic from an access and parking sort of angle with large crowds. There's probably a reason why it is near derelict at the moment in other words.

The Spitfires are out in the outer burbs nowadays nearer to Tecumseh with significantly easier road access than that location. Not convinced the traditional downtown is the place to be in Windsor because it is not central to the wider Windsor area being up against the river and the 401 and other major roads are quite distant from it.

Edited by Ozzie_the_parrot
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17 hours ago, Markoaleks said:

Could playing at University of Windsor football stadium be an option? 
seem to recall this place was renovated and curious from locals if this option is feasible ? 

It’s not ideal certainly. Only 2000 seat stadium and its artificial turf with football lines as has been mentioned. St Clair college also just built a stadium but they have the same problems, and only 1500 capacity. There really isn’t anything currently that’s soccer specific with even close to the capacity that is needed if we’re talking about having 5000+ spectators. 

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17 hours ago, Markoaleks said:

Could playing at University of Windsor football stadium be an option? 
seem to recall this place was renovated and curious from locals if this option is feasible ? 

Alumni Field... Similar to York Lions stadium before the removal of the track.

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I'm really souring on all these recent CPL announcements - Lower Valley, Sask, Windsor. Hope I'm wrong but seems to be all political plays to either put pressure on municipalities to fund stadiums either now or down the road.  #HateThat

 

Am I wrong?

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11 minutes ago, zeelaw said:

I'm really souring on all these recent CPL announcements - Lower Valley, Sask, Windsor. Hope I'm wrong but seems to be all political plays to either put pressure on municipalities to fund stadiums either now or down the road.  #HateThat

 

Am I wrong?

I definitely wish they waited until they were further along on the process to make an announcement. Almost like an announcement of interest, more than anything of substance. 

 

I think I'll stay optimistic, but I hope that updates start rolling out to the public more frequently about these groups' plans. The lack of formalities since the Sask announcement is the one giving me doubts.

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On Soccer Today yesterday (bonus pod), they briefly touched on Windsor (starts at 26th minute) Only real news was he's heard there is movement in Windsor for a stadium improvement plan (Windsor Stadium I'd assume) and that it may include this but it's the very early days

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On 1/12/2022 at 11:57 AM, Rheo said:

On Soccer Today yesterday (bonus pod), they briefly touched on Windsor (starts at 26th minute) Only real news was he's heard there is movement in Windsor for a stadium improvement plan (Windsor Stadium I'd assume) and that it may include this but it's the very early days

Do you mean "One Soccer Today"? Where is it? You said pod, is it a podcast? I checked earlier today and they haven't seemed to put any content on the One Soccer subscription for a couple weeks.

I caught an interview between Andi Petrillo and Clanachan on youtube, wasn't sure if there was any other stuff around the announcement.

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On 1/12/2022 at 8:55 AM, zeelaw said:

I'm really souring on all these recent CPL announcements - Lower Valley, Sask, Windsor. Hope I'm wrong but seems to be all political plays to either put pressure on municipalities to fund stadiums either now or down the road.  #HateThat

 

Am I wrong?

Personally I have never put too much stock in those announcements since they didn't come with a firm stadium plan in place. The stadium is the most difficult part, so if you don't have that I'll be in "I'll believe it when I see it" mode. How long has New York City FC been "trying" to get a stadium and failing? York United was originally planning on building a stadium and 3 years later those cursory plans are scrapped. It took Miami years after their original MLS announcement before they actually got a stadium plan and were able to put a team on the field. With NASL 2.0 there were expansion teams announced that never saw the light of day.

So yeah, it's kind of nice to hear there is interest in these markets, but until they have a stadium or at least shovels in the ground, I'm not counting these teams as anything close to a done deal.

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14 hours ago, Kent said:

Do you mean "One Soccer Today"? Where is it? You said pod, is it a podcast? I checked earlier today and they haven't seemed to put any content on the One Soccer subscription for a couple weeks.

I caught an interview between Andi Petrillo and Clanachan on youtube, wasn't sure if there was any other stuff around the announcement.

Soccer Today is Duane Rollins' podcast:

https://podcasts.apple.com/ca/podcast/bonus-episode-mls-superdraft-pulidos-injury-and/id1123104604?i=1000547616726

Edited by chalms04
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22 hours ago, Kent said:

Personally I have never put too much stock in those announcements since they didn't come with a firm stadium plan in place. The stadium is the most difficult part, so if you don't have that I'll be in "I'll believe it when I see it" mode. How long has New York City FC been "trying" to get a stadium and failing? York United was originally planning on building a stadium and 3 years later those cursory plans are scrapped. It took Miami years after their original MLS announcement before they actually got a stadium plan and were able to put a team on the field. With NASL 2.0 there were expansion teams announced that never saw the light of day.

So yeah, it's kind of nice to hear there is interest in these markets, but until they have a stadium or at least shovels in the ground, I'm not counting these teams as anything close to a done deal.

And Miami MLS ended up not even getting a stadium in Miami, they had to settle on Ft Lauderdale after repeated attempts for Miami proper never materialized. Only NASL 2.0 expansion club that was announced but didn't make it was Virginia although its a common misconception others were announced by the league and didn't make it when they weren't.

 

There was a plan talked about around 2015 for Windsor Stadium to be reno'd to a 5-7k seater but that never saw the light of day.

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3 hours ago, CDNFootballer said:

And Miami MLS ended up not even getting a stadium in Miami, they had to settle on Ft Lauderdale after repeated attempts for Miami proper never materialized. Only NASL 2.0 expansion club that was announced but didn't make it was Virginia although its a common misconception others were announced by the league and didn't make it when they weren't.

 

There was a plan talked about around 2015 for Windsor Stadium to be reno'd to a 5-7k seater but that never saw the light of day.

I remembered Virginia, and I have to admit I thought I should double check if there were others, but was too lazy. Thanks for the correction.

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