CPL wants FC Edmonton to get rid of their Academy

[rydermike]

 

Didn't see this posted. Sorry if it was and I missed it

[narduch]

Why would CPL do this?

Aren't Sigma and Foothills defacto academy teams for Forge and Cavalry respectively?

[Big_M]

gotta know the whole situation to understand better..do players pay to be in the academy? in which league do they play? what is their relation or link to local clubs? ....

[narduch]

4 minutes ago, Big_M said:

gotta know the whole situation to understand better..do players pay to be in the academy? in which league do they play? what is their relation or link to local clubs? ....

I wonder if they are simply cutting costs and blaming the league.

[rydermike]

On reddit, a couple of posters said that the Vancouver Whitecaps have been operating the FCEd academy for a while now, so it might simply become a Whitecaps academy.

I hadn't heard that before and the only thing I can find online is this - https://albertasoccer.com/vancouver-whitecaps-fc-partner-with-alberta-soccer-association/ which says that FC Edmonton and VWFC have a relationship and send some FCEd prospects to the Whitecaps residency program.

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

 

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

 

[Watchmen]

But, it's not like there's a L1 Alberta/Prairies yet for them to put players in to.  The CPL isn't the same structure as single entity MLS, but this does seem to be overly regulated by the league.

[mtlsab]

To be honnest, Im really disappointed about that, I firmly believe that academies are helpful to developp players

https://culturesoccer.com/2020/06/04/d-cameron-des-academies-pour-developper-le-soccer-au-canada/

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

Some FCE fans appear to have a different take:

 

Not convinced a Whitecaps tie in is the huge issue given the Whitecaps were the first club announced  for L1 BC and have an affiliated team in one of the lower divisions of L1O now in London, Ont. alongside the TFC aligned team in the top division. Given most crowds at Clarke Stadium appear to be in the 400-1000 range at the moment cutting costs shouldn't come as a huge surprise.

Edited October 25, 2021 by Ozzie_the_parrot

[Aird25]

It rubs me the wrong way that the league is interfering in club matters again, regardless of whether or not it's good for player development

[Bison44]

This just seems weird, why would the league pressure them to close the academy??  Unless it was an ultimatum to put the focus on the big club, so you are still in business next year. Priorities............

[yellowsweatygorilla]

27 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

This just seems weird, why would the league pressure them to close the academy??  Unless it was an ultimatum to put the focus on the big club, so you are still in business next year. Priorities............

Well here is Clanachan's reasoning 55:40 ... 
He claims that MLS academies have not produced any talents (err.. Davies, Marshall-Rutty, Adekugbe, Crepeau ..half our CPL rosters?) .... and then tries to point to Brentford eliminating their academy (without mentioning that the new development rules in England allows for pouching of talent by bigger clubs, and that Brentford can do that since their strategy is to pick up castoffs from the dozens and dozens of academies that remain...)

Now, don't get me wrong - L1O/PLSQ is a pretty good strategy for Ontario teams (and any incoming Quebec teams) .. but where does that leave parts of the country without that infrastructure. I'll be a lot more comfortable when the Canadian National League formally launches, but until then..

 

Edited October 25, 2021 by yellowsweatygorilla

[toontownman]

Maybe to do with next year's D2/D3? Whatever that is will essentially fill a big gap in the prairies. Whole thing stinks a bit though and the root of the problem might not be the cpl on this one. 

In Paulus we trust for the solid take.

 

[Kent]

I don't like when the league hands a "How to build a club" handbook to all the teams, or maybe I should say "How you are allowed to build a club". If Edmonton wants an academy, let them have their academy. I don't even think any of @Big_M's questions are relevant to be honest. I used to think that all MLS teams should have free to play academies and I was OK if that was mandated. But I'm over that now. If the best thing for the club is to have a pay-to-play academy, let them do that. If the best thing for the club is to have a free-to-play academy? Let them do that. If the best thing is for them to just scoop up the best players from local leagues to play for the first team, let them do that.

Clanachan in that interview linked above had the numbers for how many CPL players have played in L1O (around 50). I wonder what the number is for how many CPL players played in an MLS academy at some point.

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

17 minutes ago, Kent said:

...If the best thing for the club is to have a pay-to-play academy, let them do that...

How do you think Barron Trump wound up with DC United?

[yellowsweatygorilla]

1 hour ago, Kent said:

 

Clanachan in that interview linked above had the numbers for how many CPL players have played in L1O (around 50). I wonder what the number is for how many CPL players played in an MLS academy at some point.

I made roster out of each mls academy, l1o, and plsq. MLS academies way exceeded L1O in terms of contributing players. Albeit this was for the 2020 season, I doubt it's too different for 2021.

[yellowsweatygorilla]

1 hour ago, Kent said:

I don't like when the league hands a "How to build a club" handbook to all the teams, or maybe I should say "How you are allowed to build a club". If Edmonton wants an academy, let them have their academy. I don't even think any of @Big_M's questions are relevant to be honest. I used to think that all MLS teams should have free to play academies and I was OK if that was mandated. But I'm over that now. If the best thing for the club is to have a pay-to-play academy, let them do that. If the best thing for the club is to have a free-to-play academy? Let them do that. If the best thing is for them to just scoop up the best players from local leagues to play for the first team, let them do that.

Clanachan in that interview linked above had the numbers for how many CPL players have played in L1O (around 50). I wonder what the number is for how many CPL players played in an MLS academy at some point.

Out of curiosity, not including those that only played in MLS II team squads, I count 59 this season who spent time in a MLS academy. And remember, the L1O 50 count also includes TFC academy players ... which amount to 20+ players.

[Watchmen]

2 hours ago, Kent said:

I don't like when the league hands a "How to build a club" handbook to all the teams, or maybe I should say "How you are allowed to build a club". If Edmonton wants an academy, let them have their academy. I don't even think any of @Big_M's questions are relevant to be honest. I used to think that all MLS teams should have free to play academies and I was OK if that was mandated. But I'm over that now. If the best thing for the club is to have a pay-to-play academy, let them do that. If the best thing for the club is to have a free-to-play academy? Let them do that. If the best thing is for them to just scoop up the best players from local leagues to play for the first team, let them do that.

Clanachan in that interview linked above had the numbers for how many CPL players have played in L1O (around 50). I wonder what the number is for how many CPL players played in an MLS academy at some point.

I'll sort of go back to - it's strange because at this stage there's not even a reasonable alternative in that part of the country. There's no L1 that the academy would be taking players away from. So what it's doing is reducing the number of opportunities for developing players to both learn and showcase themselves. Which is the opposite of what the CPL should be doing.

[Bison44]

Clanahan is really talking out his ass here, even though that clip is a year and a half old.  Just be honest eh?? Dont shit on the academy system and then sit back and let all those kids flow into your league.  CPL cant pay for academies.....and if there is an influx of cash it will prob be spent on things like better salaries or just keeping the league afloat.  But let the teams do what they want.  Even if we get a L10 version up and running in BC/West it still doesnt address the younger kids.  We need more teams, more leagues, more coaches and kids getting good coaching younger, not the other way around.  

[Unnamed Trialist]

It is odd Clanachan can get away with this, which goes against the spirit of player development and against the spirit of CPL, because the CSA is so passive about intervening in benefit of competitive youth soccer. You could even argue it ia pressure move, to get the CSA and provinces to pick up the slack.

Ideally, between MLS and CPL you have 10+ areas covered, then those pro clubs would be the ideal setting for youth development. They have the coaching, the standard, the respect of the community, and then they provide the direct inspirations in the form of local late teens breaking into the pro squads. Add the potential academies of the L10 equivalents.

You could argue that if the "corporation" running CPL were doing its job it would go find a sponsor or sponsors for academy structures for every CPL club, under a unified concept. Let their u19s play in the provincial L10s. And CPL would be looking for incentives for clubs bringing up their own "homegrowns", such as allowing roster flexibility. As is, many CPL clubs already are looking to MLS academy products to round out rosters, Pacific being an example with the Caps' castoffs.

It is all rather ironical: neither the provincial SAs are doing their job as they should (setting up pro-releg competitive leagues for all clubs, and annullng the worst part of the pay for play bogus academies), neither the CSA is showing leadership, and the CPL has decided they won't help--apart from their u-21 minutes rule. Some of the MLS clubs are screwing around and seem to have disinvested, which in the Whitecaps case is outrageous (let's not talk about possible underlying corruption) considering the benefits having an academy has given them. 

The L10 or equivalent cannot fill the gap, as they are, first, not direct feeder leagues, and then, not youth leagues. They are adult leagues that even compete against the CPL clubs in the Voyageurs Cup. And the model has not been properly implanted across the country, we are still missing word from the Prairies and the Maritimes. 

Finally: the depth and future of the CPL depends on diversity, not homogenization. You try all kinds of models, in terms of location, stadiums, fan bases, player selection, how to deal with salary caps, etc, and then you start comparing and learning from those doing it right, and those failing. After 3 years, I'd say it is still too early, and anyways, the worst teams in the league are only 3-4 wins out of the playoffs, the league spread after 25 games show balance. Meaning: we can't make conclusions as yet. Which is why we should not be panicking yet, and even less so dictating something so fundamental to a club as taking its pro model and using it develop local talent. Like all the greatest clubs in history have done and still do. 

Edited October 27, 2021 by Unnamed Trialist

[Kent]

12 hours ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

Finally: the depth and future of the CPL depends on diversity, not homogenization. You try all kinds of models, in terms of location, stadiums, fan bases, player selection, how to deal with salary caps, etc, and then you start comparing and learning from those doing it right, and those failing.

This. If England had the same kind of dictatorship model as the CPL, then Brentford or Bradford or whoever they are would probably have been forced to have an academy and they wouldn't have inspired Clanachan to come up with his "no academies" policy. He seems to have gotten his idea from a club going against the norm, and then doesn't want the clubs in his league to ever go against the norm. You might learn something new Clanachan if you let them try things. Or you might even learn the age old addage, "different strokes for different folks".

[Ansem]

FC Edmonton could use the cash to get better infrastructure/move and generate some buzz to grow their base.

Status quo is not working...I see why the league is wondering if spending $ there isnthe best use of limited funds right now...

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

55 minutes ago, Kent said:

This. If England had the same kind of dictatorship model as the CPL, then Brentford or Bradford or whoever they are would probably have been forced to have an academy and they wouldn't have inspired Clanachan to come up with his "no academies" policy...

I seriously doubt Clanachan is making any of the key decisions. Fully funded academies are very expensive to operate. Look no further than that and how elite youth clubs that are a source of possible group sales are alienated by them taking away their best players for why CanPL are leaving it to the three Canadian MLS franchises to do the heavy lifting on this.

[Kent]

Does anybody know for sure if their academy is free to play? Or are players paying registration fees? I think most of us are assuming free to play, but it would be nice to have confirmation of that from someone that knows this.