WCQ: Third Round - Window 2 (October 7-13, 2021)

[EJsens1]

12 minutes ago, Floortom said:

I would be more than pleased with 4 points from this window. That would keep us right on track for qualification. Obviously 6 would be amazing but the match at Mexico is realistically a write off and at Jamaica won’t be easy.

I disagree with Mexico is a write off.  I’m not suggesting we’ll just roll in and out with 3 points.  However, we’ve played the US twice the last 6 weeks on their soil, tough loss that we maybe didn’t deserve and a draw last Sunday.  We also lost a heartbreaker to Mexico which was essentially a home game for them.  I’m sure you know all this but my point is we are showing up on their turfs and giving them a game.  I think a result is not unrealistic at Azteca.  Difficult?  Hell yes but I think we have a shot 

[Free kick]

1 minute ago, EJsens1 said:

I’m sure you know all this but my point is we are showing up on their turfs and giving them a game.  I think a result is not unrealistic at Azteca.  Difficult?  Hell yes but I think we have a shot 

Its not the opponent that is the biggest hurdle in Mexico city.  Its the altitude.  
 

Kingston Jam - 9 metres above sea level

Toronto - 76 metres above sea level

Mexico city - 2250 metres above sea level

[dyslexic nam]

All I know is that this is going to be one hella long month while we wait for this next window. I could really get used to this kind of game frequency for the Nats.  

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

As it stands UK-based players - ?Arfield, Wotherspoon, Hoilett, ?Corbeanu etc would still have a problem after visiting Mexico on the 8th (UK-time).  They need to stay out of the UK until the 18th or face 10-day quarantine still.  The Saturday after is the 16th.

Things are changing though.  The other lists are being eliminated but red list remains.  Jamaica still has a chance of being added to it.

Edited September 11, 2021 by WestHamCanadianinOxford

[CanadianSoccerFan]

21 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said:

All I know is that this is going to be one hella long month while we wait for this next window. I could really get used to this kind of game frequency for the Nats.  

Amazing that we will play 19 competitive games this year.  Number feels unreal

[Approve My Account Pls]

Yeah I think for this window 4 is acceptable, 5+ we're happy

[Floortom]

43 minutes ago, EJsens1 said:

I disagree with Mexico is a write off.  I’m not suggesting we’ll just roll in and out with 3 points.  However, we’ve played the US twice the last 6 weeks on their soil, tough loss that we maybe didn’t deserve and a draw last Sunday.  We also lost a heartbreaker to Mexico which was essentially a home game for them.  I’m sure you know all this but my point is we are showing up on their turfs and giving them a game.  I think a result is not unrealistic at Azteca.  Difficult?  Hell yes but I think we have a shot 

In their last 20 Hex home matches Mexico is 15W-4D-1L. Getting anything from that match will be a huge challenge. Impossible ? No. But I would worry about throwing too many resources into that type of situation if it detracts from our ability to take points from two much more important and winnable matches right after that. Just my opinion. We’ll see what Herdman thinks

[davey_twelve]

Jamaica doesn't have an easy window:

@US, hosting us and @Honduras. 

If they can't get a point against the US then things will look pretty bleak for them compared to everyone else. I imagine that will influence their tactical approach for the game against us.

It'd be nice to see ZBG in the camp this time around, we need at least one extra player that can play as a wingback.

[jtpc]

I think the primary focus needs to be on the Jamaica and Panama matches. I'd be very satisfied with a draw in Jamaica and a win at home against Panama. I think 4 points is a successful window. 6 points would be fantastic.

If we have a chance at a result in Mexico late in the match, then go for it, but I don't want us to start guns blazing and sacrifice anyone's fitness for the 2 matches with better points-earning potential that come after.

It feels like Panama has punched above their weight in the first window (compared to where the FIFA rankings would have them). The US plays away in Panama on October 10th. They could do us a favour with another away result like they got in Honduras.

Edited September 11, 2021 by jtpc

[Shway]

42 minutes ago, davey_twelve said:

Jamaica doesn't have an easy window:

@US, hosting us and @Honduras. 

If they can't get a point against the US then things will look pretty bleak for them compared to everyone else. I imagine that will influence their tactical approach for the game against us.

It'd be nice to see ZBG in the camp this time around, we need at least one extra player that can play as a wingback.

Jamaica should be a lot better next window as well, and won’t have the restrictions they did in window 1 that affected their preparations.

I think this window coming is the toughest of all, considering the schedule for each of our opponents. So if we got 5pts last …I’m expecting at least 4 pts for this one. A draw in Jamaica will be a massive point, but I think their result in the prior game against USA will determine a lot. Meaning I’m hoping for a Jamaica win against the USA.

[dyslexic nam]

1 hour ago, jtpc said:

I think the primary focus needs to be on the Jamaica and Panama matches. I'd be very satisfied with a draw in Jamaica and a win at home against Panama. I think 4 points is a successful window. 6 points would be fantastic.

If we have a chance at a result in Mexico late in the match, then go for it, but I don't want us to start guns blazing and sacrifice anyone's fitness for the 2 matches with better points-earning potential that come after.

It feels like Panama has punched above their weight in the first window (compared to where the FIFA rankings would have them). The US plays away in Panama on October 10th. They could do us a favour with another away result like they got in Honduras.

Honestly, I think my expectations are higher.  4 points is the bare minimum I expect from this window.  After dropping points to Honduras, winning our home games except Mexico and possibly the US may no longer enough.   And yes I know we can beat the US, but I would prefer not to bank on it.  Getting away points in places like Jamaica is pretty crucial - preferably 3 but definitely at least 1.  

[dyslexic nam]

The last thing I will say about the away Jamaica fixture  (well, probably not) is that I am a bit more confident of getting a win down there, than I will be of beating the States when they visit us in January.  That is why I think it is a key away game.  There are 4 away games where we have the best chance of stealing some points - Jamaica  Panama, CR and ES.  I see the next window as the first chance to make serious headway in our push to qualify.  

[Craig11rm]

From what I saw Jamaica looked pretty horrible with all their new players. I watched most of the Panama game and they weren’t really creating much. 

[SpursFlu]

26 minutes ago, Craig11rm said:

From what I saw Jamaica looked pretty horrible with all their new players. I watched most of the Panama game and they weren’t really creating much. 

I thought they looked pretty good in the 2nd half of the Costa Rica game

[SpecialK]

Mexico doesn’t look that good. We should go in best on best and beat the hell out them. Let shock the football world !!! 

[Sal333]

2 hours ago, SpecialK said:

Mexico doesn’t look that good. We should go in best on best and beat the hell out them. Let shock the football world !!! 

They're either playing down to their opponents or as you say they don't look all that good.

[Bene11]

The boys will be fired up to take on Mexico again after what happened at GC. I doubt we go into it without looking for a result. 

[A_Gagne]

8 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

I thought they looked pretty good in the 2nd half of the Costa Rica game

That's because it was a completely different team against Costa Rica.

Most of their new players couldn't play in Costa Rica.

Take away for me, regardless of how skilled a group looks on paper you can't just throw a bunch of guys together and expect them to preform anywhere near their potential, and especially at this stage what club level guys are playing at matters a lot less than you'd think.

[Shway]

1 hour ago, A_Gagne said:

That's because it was a completely different team against Costa Rica.

Most of their new players couldn't play in Costa Rica.

Take away for me, regardless of how skilled a group looks on paper you can't just throw a bunch of guys together and expect them to preform anywhere near their potential, and especially at this stage what club level guys are playing at matters a lot less than you'd think.

I think a lot of you guys are missing the point that personnel (coaching) decisions were horrible in the Panama game for Jamaica. 

I repeat they had way too many attackers. Deploying 4 natural strikers, 2 attacking mids is a recipe for disaster for any team. They were setup as a FIFA ultimate team.

Yes chemistry is one thing, training together is another, but playing guys completely out of position just to get them on the field due to the restrictions placed on them was absolutely a horrible decision. 

The second team was just better balanced specially in the midfield.

I think now that guys are fully onboard, and their next few games aren’t in red list countries. Their team and preparations will be completely different….I think.

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

I repeat they had way too many attackers. Deploying 4 natural strikers, 2 attacking mids is a recipe for disaster for any team. They were setup as a FIFA ultimate team.

Yes chemistry is one thing, training together is another, but playing guys completely out of position just to get them on the field due to the restrictions placed on them was absolutely a horrible decision. 

The second team was just better balanced specially in the midfield.

It was basically a more extreme and therefore worse version of what we tried against Honduras - blow a team away with offensive power and talent. 

Covid still has a role to play in this next window depending on where the UK places Jamaica in the next update and the situation on the ground there.  I think their training was disrupted somewhat if I remember; there were no fans at least.

They obviously still have a ton of potential if they keep those guys interesting after that shambolic situation combined  with some training and common sense. Bur we still need to look for three points there, I think, whatever the restrictions. 

[mrstepp817]

The order as was said earlier makes Oct a tricky window...Mexico at altitude really presents a challenge then you turn around and go to a tropical environment in Kingston...I'd favor the cautious approach in Azteca and then go for it the last two games...that being said I favored a cautious approach vs the US from a Canadian perspective and Canada probably deserved three pts in Nashville 

[apbsmith]

Provided covid restrictions are not a limitation...

I'd love to see a midfield 3(alphabetic) of the following vs Mexico:

Arfield - he will come to ball and prove his worth to the squad and the flag.

Eustaquio - baller + show to all those Cruz Azul fans and management what they gave up. 

Kaye - showed well last window plus altitude acclimatized being in Colorado.

More importantly, I think it still gives us lots of strength for the following 2 matches and strong enough to get a result in Mexico.

Edited September 12, 2021 by apbsmith

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

Is Scott Arfield doing that well with Rangers at the moment? Haven't been following closely but my understanding is that he is usually a sub these days. He's almost 33 so people need to bear in mind that he may have lost a step or two of pace from being the player they remember a couple of seasons ago now in CMNT terms.

[narduch]

7 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Is Scott Arfield doing that well with Rangers at the moment? Haven't been following closely but my understanding is that he is usually a sub these days. He's almost 33 so people need to bear in mind that he may have lost a step or two of pace from being the player they remember a couple of seasons ago now in CMNT terms.

He's basically a sub in SPL and a starter in Europe 

[Kadenge]

Perhaps window 1 was an anomaly and we should not project results into window 2, but  I think most were surprised with how things turned out including our results, but here goes:

1. There is more parity among the 8 teams than we thought

2. Mexico may not be the power team of years gone by.. CNL/GC.  They are still getting results but are not dominating teams as in the past. Conversely I dont envy teams that will  play the USA as they will be pumped after their massive come from behind  win in arguably the most intimidating away fixture at SPS

3. Will Jamaica with their new EPL players perform or are they another Suriname and did Panama over perform last window

4. game 3 in any window will greatly favour the team with quality depth regardless of home/away

5. With our tie vs USA away and our GC performances vs them, Mexicao and CR, Herdman is not going to throw any points away with a weak lineup in any game and that includes at Azteca. The USA away tie was a huge boost for our team and John will want another statement game from the lads

5. We absolutely need to go with 26 players in this window, with solid back ups for every position (esp RCB).  Piette and Spoony only saw the field when we were up 3-0 to ES and Fraser nada. We are not going to have that luxury this window.