Canada's Octo Schedule

[Free kick]

My assessment of venue options based on personal experience and other observations:

the good (in no order of preferance)

Vancouver:

Organization & Atmosphere:  The  suporters section was large and it felt like i was at a soccer world cup qualifier when i was there for the match versus Honduras.   And, i cant say that about alot places in Canada.  The crowd understands the game and the meaning of the event.  The overall vibe was that there was no pretense at all; it was all about soccer.  Atmosphere and crowd size was good, support for canada was good,  the crowd was involved and the emotion coming from the crowd reflected what was happening in the game.  Pregame options was good as the location is walking distance to some good areas. 

Venue

It felt like it was a big event and the venue was suited for it.  The artifical surface is a bit of a negative.   BC place also doesnt have the good sightlines that BMO has with its steeper inclined stands.   
 

Toronto:

Organization & Atmosphere:  just like Vancouver. No issues.   People who are putting on the event, seem to know what their doing and know what the event is.   The crowd has never or seldom been poor.  Even for meaninless friendlies,   they can get 10-15k.  The supporters section can leverage from the TFC groups who take up the south end.   Some people like to spread the false notion that the visiting support outnumbers local support but thats all it is, a false notion and smear attempt.  This problem of vocal foreign supporters from Central america has been a problem (if not worst) in other areas of canada even in those places elsewhere who get pleasure at throwing stones at TO over this.  

Venue:  No issues that i can tell. Capacity of 31k,  superb sightlines,  among the best surface in the world according to the FIFA evaluation.  Its location in the city is not as good as BC place.  

The NOT Good (in no order of preference)

Montreal: 

Organization and Atmosphere:  i am from there (and have lived in other parts of Quebec) and still spend time there so it pains me to say this but, its not the amongst the best options.  I was there for a WCQ versus Honduras (Saputo) and for a Friendly versus Jamaica (CCR).  The crowd was good and supportive in the match versus Jamaica at CCR but not for the WCQ versus Honduras, whereby the Impact fans scalped their tickets to out of town honduran  supporters.  The problem with Montreal and Quebec is that its the only place in Canada where waving a maple leaf is viewed as making a political statement.  If you are a local you understand this and even i would have to tone down my colours if i were out in public commuting to the WCQ match.   But international soccer is alot about national fervour and pride.    Their Suporters groups strike me as a mixed bag of those who want to support national team but may be timid to do so.  Or those who dont seem to connect or want to connect with other supporters groups (or associate with the national teams) as their loyalties lie strictly to the local club.  

Venue:   Its a decent to good venue for soccer.  Surface is grass.  Overall,  Its not to the level of BMO field.  Nor BC place. Location is less than ideal for pregame activities.   Montreal may be a good place to play matches versus Jamaica. 

Edmonton: 

Organization & atmosphere:  Our best player is from there, so that has to count for something.  The local V’s group was first class when we were there for the Honduras WCQ game where we were robbed by the ref.  Everything was good until you get to teh stadium whereby I cant think of any positives from that point.  Starting with the local organization with respect to ticket pickup queue.  Then the notion of sticking the supporters groups from opposing side right next to each other.  Then the fact that outside the supporters section, the cnds in the crowd seemed disinterested and disengaged.   The absolute worst part (what bugged me the most):  we had been sold the idea that Edmonton was the best venue for ensuring a canada crowd.  THAT WAS NOT THE CASE.   Visiting support was every bit as present (if not moreso) and made themselves heard more than at any other canadian venue except the WCQ in Montreal.  The Cnd support was commited (travelled in from Sask and BC) and loud but it was very small compared to what you’ll get at BMO or even BC place.  It may have been even smaller than what kingston got a WCQ versus Belize.  The word and vibes you’ll here from there is that the town is some sort hotbed of soccer support in canada and they’ll selectively point to some u17 womens WC match or some mens friendly versus Brazil.  But look closely at several other events like the mens u20 in 2007 etc. or even the local pro game,  turnout has been spotty.  Bottom line, if its a big game,  the crowds will come and that applies in Edmonton or anwhere else.  My sense has always been that locals (include civic authorities)  like these soccer events because its puts them on the map (and economic spinoffs) not because of genuine interest in the game.

Venue:   Commonwealth stadium doesnt have grass anymore.   It use to be the only venue in canada (of a decent size) that did.    Its the worst of the four venues but I am sure, the CSA will still put matches in Edmonton.  I hope its not a decisive or critical match.  Perhaps Panama.

*******

I will leave out Kingston and Hamilton (was there for the Pan am games).  

 

Edited June 17, 2021 by Free kick

[SthMelbRed]

I suspect that this idea that the players only want to play in Toronto is a leftover sentiment from when our players were more interested in hosting parties in TO nightclubs to play the big man for their former high school classmates than actually qualifying for the World Cup. I'm willing to bet that the current team doesn't hold anything like that extreme attitude of Toronto-or-we'll-cry-in-the-media. The games will be played in Toronto, and Vancouver, and Edmonton, and we won't hear a single word of complaint about travel, facilities, playing surface, or anything else from the players or coaches. That won't stop a lot of people on here complaining about all of those things on the players behalf for no real reason.

Now, if I'm calling the shots, I'm waiting until the very last minute to announce the September venues...at least until after the USA locks in their venue for our away game. If they stick us somewhere in the west, we should play both Honduras and El Salvador at BC Place. If they go with anywhere east of the Rockies, I'd play both of our home games in Toronto. The Yanks are playing us at home sandwiched between their away games in El Salvador and Honduras, so you can bet on Texas for our away match against them.

October should definitely be in Toronto, after the team has just played away matches in Mexico and Jamaica. November is your chance to go to Edmonton, but I wouldn't have any issue with playing the games in 2 different venues out east. Maybe Halifax for Costa Rica, then Toronto for Mexico (unless the CSA has visions of 50,000 at BC Place dancing in their heads). January has to be on the West Coast, just because you can't take the chance with weather anywhere else in the country.

Jamaica for the last home game is a tricky one. If we play in Toronto, we have to worry about too many away fans harshing the vibe for the home supporters. But, the game being sandwiched between away games in Costa Rica and Panama, TO seems like the most logical venue.

[kacbru]

Lots of over thinking going on here. The key question is which venue in Florida will we host games. 

[nolbertos]

If Canada plays El Salvador or Mexico in BC Place, expect the the same like in 2017 WCQ where 65% or 60% were Mexican fans while the entire Southside was all Canadian with Southsiders and Voyageurs there, making noise/. Same with El Salvador.  There’s probably at least 20K salvadoreans immigrants in the Lower Mainland plus a huge contingent in Seattle and LA.  Once the borders open up, I expect a caravan of cars to come up here to watch them play against Canada and make Canadians feel like a minority.  The US has gotten used to be a minority at some of there stadiums and I expect the CDN team to feel like that too.

[apbsmith]

19 hours ago, dyslexic nam said:

Yes.   Wanderers grounds would be awesome - and the fans would absolutely rock it.  

Just curious, how's the wind in the stadium? 

Are there alot of flights from Europe-Halifax direct? 

Logistically we could potentially make it difficult on some countries Re: extra travel

Edited June 17, 2021 by apbsmith

[apbsmith]

1 hour ago, nolbertos said:

If Canada plays El Salvador or Mexico in BC Place, expect the the same like in 2017 WCQ where 65% or 60% were Mexican fans while the entire Southside was all Canadian with Southsiders and Voyageurs there, making noise/. Same with El Salvador.  There’s probably at least 20K salvadoreans immigrants in the Lower Mainland plus a huge contingent in Seattle and LA.  Once the borders open up, I expect a caravan of cars to come up here to watch them play against Canada and make Canadians feel like a minority.  The US has gotten used to be a minority at some of there stadiums and I expect the CDN team to feel like that too.

Good post. 

The supporter section at BC place vs Mexico was great but I still remember watching that Mexico vs Canada game with my dad and his quote: 

" I didn't know Mexico had a turf a field"... 

My response: " That's actually BC". 

It's unfortunate camera didn't show supporter section more but I'm glad CSA made some $ off that game. 

[apbsmith]

I personally don't think Canada will allow 5,000+ fans anywhere before 2022. Honestly should just distribute tickets to players family and the V's, wherever it is, cause we will make noise and 100% home support :). 

The #1 priority for me is going to be logistics to give us the best preparation possible. 

After watching how efficient the logistics of the last window and cycle was organized. I put my trust in the meticulous planning that will be done again this time around, which actually gives us a nice edge both physically and psychologically.

Edited June 17, 2021 by apbsmith

[mrstepp817]

23 minutes ago, apbsmith said:

I personally don't think Canada will allow 5,000+ fans anywhere before 2022. Honestly should just distribute tickets to players family and the V's, wherever it is, cause we will make noise and 100% home support :). 

The #1 priority for me is going to be logistics to give us the best preparation possible. 

After watching how efficient the logistics of the last window and cycle was organized. I put my trust in the meticulous planning that will be done again this time around, which actually gives us a nice edge both physically and psychologically.

I mean Quebec is allowing 3500 for the hockey game tomorrow...and thats indoors...so you've got to think by Sept and with an outdoor event at minimum Quebec would allow decent sized crowds

[dyslexic nam]

34 minutes ago, apbsmith said:

Just curious, how's the wind in the stadium? 

Are there alot of flights from Europe-Halifax direct? 

Logistically we could potentially make it difficult on some countries Re: extra travel

 Not an expert as I have only made the trip a few times to see the Wanderers, but from what I remember it can be fairly windy there.  

As for flights, Halifax does have an international airport.  Not sure how frequently there are direct European flights - especially these days.  

[apbsmith]

11 minutes ago, mrstepp817 said:

I mean Quebec is allowing 3500 for the hockey game tomorrow...and thats indoors...so you've got to think by Sept and with an outdoor event at minimum Quebec would allow decent sized crowds

Good point. Thanks,

I appear to be suffering a bit of covid pessimism still. 

Hopefully 5000 fans in Canada is a worse case scenario :). 

[WestHamCanadianinOxford]

Checking in with my mom, it seems Alberta wants to have lifted most restrictions by next month.  Whether it will happen probably relies on variants. 

That being said, I didn't enjoy playing sports outside in November in central Alberta and I am from there.  I understand the concerns, the pitch being a big one (which galls me a bit) but it would be nice get a game in Edmonton, even if I can't be there. 

[TGAA_Star]

14 hours ago, Yoginess said:

Just looking at these dates for the Home Games

Honduras: has to be at BMO (or Saputo?) for Euro players. 3 games in a window, not going to fly another 4 hours to Vancouver for no reason

El Salvador: can be anywhere since away to US is close anyways in that second match of the window. Montreal? Vancouver? Moncton? 

Panama: 4 hour flight from Jamaica to Toronto vs 7 for Vancouver, gotta think this is BMO

Costa Rica: first game of the window, I'd guess BMO but can't recall if November is too risky for weather (maybe that's our advantage)

Mexico:  Same as above. My photo is from the last WCQ against Mexico in Vancouver. It was a pre-COVID world but I'd say about 20,000 Mexico fans came out (a lot were locals too). Maybe let's just throw a November game in Edmonton, Davies trained in snow up there ya? haha

USA: Got to be an indoor match for this one. Can't see it being anything other than BC Place. 

Jamaica: These 3 game windows have so much back and fourth. Similar to the panama game, it would add about 3-4 hours over 2 legs to do this one the west coast vs Toronto or Montreal. 

Or another list you could go with as far as venues for home games for Canada

Honduras- Montreal- Saputo Stadium

El Salvador- Montreal- Saputo Stadium

Panama- Toronto- BMO Field

Costa Rica- Edmonton- Commonwealth Stadium 

Mexico- Edmonton- Commonwealth Stadium 

USA- Vancouver- BC Place 

Jamaica- Toronto- BMO Field

 

Helps with travel and is much more realistic especially during a pandemic in terms of staying in 1 city for a stretch of games before you move on to the next 

[narduch]

With respect to hosting matches in Ontario, we will get an idea of where things are headed based on Forge's Concacaf League game against FAS of El Salvador

That match is supposed to take place Aug 3-5.

Edited June 17, 2021 by narduch

[TGAA_Star]

16 hours ago, Free kick said:

My assessment of venue options based on personal experience and other observations:

the good (in no order of preferance)

Vancouver:

Organization & Atmosphere:  The  suporters section was large and it felt like i was at a soccer world cup qualifier when i was there for the match versus Honduras.   And, i cant say that about alot places in Canada.  The crowd understands the game and the meaning of the event.  The overall vibe was that there was no pretense at all; it was all about soccer.  Atmosphere and crowd size was good, support for canada was good,  the crowd was involved and the emotion coming from the crowd reflected what was happening in the game.  Pregame options was good as the location is walking distance to some good areas. 

Venue

It felt like it was a big event and the venue was suited for it.  The artifical surface is a bit of a negative.   BC place also doesnt have the good sightlines that BMO has with its steeper inclined stands.   
 

Toronto:

Organization & Atmosphere:  just like Vancouver. No issues.   People who are putting on the event, seem to know what their doing and know what the event is.   The crowd has never or seldom been poor.  Even for meaninless friendlies,   they can get 10-15k.  The supporters section can leverage from the TFC groups who take up the south end.   Some people like to spread the false notion that the visiting support outnumbers local support but thats all it is, a false notion and smear attempt.  This problem of vocal foreign supporters from Central america has been a problem (if not worst) in other areas of canada even in those places elsewhere who get pleasure at throwing stones at TO over this.  

Venue:  No issues that i can tell. 31k,  superbe sightlines,  among the best surface in the world according to the FIFA evaluation.  Its location in the city is not as good as BC place.  

The NOT Good (in no order of preference)

Montreal: 

Organization and Atmosphere:  i am from there (and have lived in other parts of Quebec) and still spend time there so it pains me to say this but, its not the amongst the best options.  I was there for a WCQ versus Honduras (Saputo) and for a Friendly versus Jamaica (CCR).  The crowd was good and supportive in the match versus Jamaica at CCR but not for the WCQ versus Honduras, whereby the Impact fans scalped their tickets to out of town honduran  supporters.  The problem with Montreal and Quebec is that its the only place in Canada where waving a maple leaf is viewed as making a political statement.  If you are a local you understand this and even i would have to tone down my colours if i were out in public commuting to the WCQ match.   But international soccer is alot about national fervour and pride.    Their Suporters groups strike me as a mixed bag of those who want to support national team but may be timid to do so.  Or those who dont seem to connect or want to connect with other supporters groups (or associate with the national teams) as their loyalties lie strictly to the local club.  

Venue:   Its a decent to good venue for soccer.  Surface is grass.  Overall,  Its not to the level of BMO field.  Nor BC place. Location is less than ideal for pregame activities.   Montreal may be a good place to play matches versus Jamaica. 

Edmonton: 

Organization & atmosphere:  Our best player is from there, so that has to count for something.  The local V’s group was first class when we were there for the Honduras WCQ game where we were robbed by the ref.  Everything was good until you get to teh stadium whereby I cant think of any positives from that point.  Starting with the local organization with respect to ticket pickup queue.  Then the notion of sticking the supporters groups from opposing side right next to each other.  Then the fact that outside the supporters section, the cnds in the crowd seemed disinterested and disengaged.   The absolute worst part (what bugged me the most):  we had been sold the idea that Edmonton was the best venue for ensuring a canada crowd.  THAT WAS NOT THE CASE.   Visiting support was every bit as present (if not moreso) and made themselves heard more than at any other canadian venue except the WCQ in Montreal.  The Cnd support was commited (travelled in from Sask and BC) and loud but it was very small compared to what you’ll get at BMO or even BC place.  It may have been even smaller than what kingston got a WCQ versus Belize.  The word and vibes you’ll here from there is that the town is some sort hotbed of soccer support in canada and they’ll selectively point to some u17 womens WC match or some mens friendly versus Brazil.  But look closely at several other events like the mens u20 in 2007 etc. or even the local pro game,  turnout has been spotty.  Bottom line, if its a big game,  the crowds will come and that applies in Edmonton or anwhere else.  My sense has always been that locals (include civic authorities)  like these soccer events because its puts them on the map (and economic spinoffs) not because of genuine interest in the game.

Venue:   Commonwealth stadium doesnt have grass anymore.   It use to be the only venue in canada (of a decent size) that did.    Its the worst of the four venues but I am sure, the CSA will still put matches in Edmonton.  I hope its not a decisive or critical match.  Perhaps Panama.

*******

I will leave out Kingston and Hamilton (was there for the Pan am games).  

 

Perfect analysis 

[nfitz]

36 minutes ago, narduch said:

With respect to hosting matches in Ontario, we will get an idea of where things are headed based on Forge's Concacaf League game against FAS of El Salvador

That match is supposed to take place Aug 3-5.

Though Hamilton isn't Toronto. Toronto's ban on big outdoor events extends through September 6. I suppose they could always played closed-door ... but why not take the matches to somewhere that's going to allow fans in the stands. Maybe the Maritimes will be more more likely by then.

[narduch]

27 minutes ago, nfitz said:

Though Hamilton isn't Toronto. Toronto's ban on big outdoor events extends through September 6. I suppose they could always played closed-door ... but why not take the matches to somewhere that's going to allow fans in the stands. Maybe the Maritimes will be more more likely by then.

I think they clarified that it wasn't for professional sports.

We'll see if they let TFC, Blue Jays and Argos play.

Edited June 17, 2021 by narduch

[nfitz]

34 minutes ago, narduch said:

I think they clarified that it wasn't for professional sports.

We'll see if they let TFC, Blue Jays and Argos play.

I didn't think it stopped professional sports from playing. But that it stopped fans in the stands. At least at BMO place - Rogers Centre isn't a city-owned facility. So that's a Toronto Public Health and Ontario issue.

I hadn't realised that Argos had a schedule already. Winnipeg playing Argos in Toronto on August 21. We'll see what happens there. Though I don't think TFC have announced a location for the June 26 game either ... though that seems unlikely.

[Watchmen]

15 hours ago, nolbertos said:

If Canada plays El Salvador or Mexico in BC Place, expect the the same like in 2017 WCQ where 65% or 60% were Mexican fans while the entire Southside was all Canadian with Southsiders and Voyageurs there, making noise/. Same with El Salvador.  There’s probably at least 20K salvadoreans immigrants in the Lower Mainland plus a huge contingent in Seattle and LA.  Once the borders open up, I expect a caravan of cars to come up here to watch them play against Canada and make Canadians feel like a minority.  The US has gotten used to be a minority at some of there stadiums and I expect the CDN team to feel like that too.

It was not "60 to 65% Mexican" in the crowd. It was closer to 25%. Once it was clear this was going to be "an event" the locals came out. Now, if you want to make the argument that the Mexican contingent was louder, I'll listen to that.

[Watchmen]

I think I say it every time we're discussing venues, and the new location I'd like see a game in is Ottawa. Good size stadium and city, reasonable distance from Toronto and Montreal for traveling fans.

[Ansem]

12 hours ago, TGAA_Star said:

Or another list you could go with as far as venues for home games for Canada

Honduras- Montreal- Saputo Stadium

El Salvador- Montreal- Saputo Stadium

Panama- Toronto- BMO Field

Costa Rica- Edmonton- Commonwealth Stadium 

Mexico- Edmonton- Commonwealth Stadium 

USA- Vancouver- BC Place 

Jamaica- Toronto- BMO Field

 

Helps with travel and is much more realistic especially during a pandemic in terms of staying in 1 city for a stretch of games before you move on to the next 

Honduras and El Salvador in Montreal? Hell no, the visitors would get a strong support. For me this is good for Halifax (grass)

Panama at BMO = good

Costa Rica and Mexico in Edmonton in January? I'd prefer Calgary 

USA at BC place = Good

Jamaica at BMO? Montréal makes more sense

*For those worrying about "ticket sales"... wake up. Do you want to sell tickets or do you want to get to Qatar?

Get to Qatar and selling tickets afterwards will be much easier with all the friendlies and competitions leading to 2026

[The Beaver 2.0]

16 hours ago, nolbertos said:

If Canada plays El Salvador or Mexico in BC Place, expect the the same like in 2017 WCQ where 65% or 60% were Mexican fans while the entire Southside was all Canadian with Southsiders and Voyageurs there, making noise/. Same with El Salvador.  There’s probably at least 20K salvadoreans immigrants in the Lower Mainland plus a huge contingent in Seattle and LA.  Once the borders open up, I expect a caravan of cars to come up here to watch them play against Canada and make Canadians feel like a minority.  The US has gotten used to be a minority at some of there stadiums and I expect the CDN team to feel like that too.

Mexican fans are everywhere and will travel anywhere to follow their team, and en masse. 60% seems high, especially for El Salvador. Last match we played at BC Place vs. Mexico, the crowd was massive and it was predominantly Canadian, and very loud.

[nolbertos]

18 minutes ago, The Beaver 2.0 said:

Mexican fans are everywhere and will travel anywhere to follow their team, and en masse. 60% seems high, especially for El Salvador. Last match we played at BC Place vs. Mexico, the crowd was massive and it was predominantly Canadian, and very loud.

I just saw on TV and some Southsiders told me thst it was a slightly bigger Mexican contingent.  El Savadoreans are just as passionate for WCQ matches.  I recall when the US played them, almost the entire stadium was El Salvadorean.  Since we last played El Salvador in an Ocho type setting the population of Central Americans in rhe Lower Mainland has tripled, hence why I believe alot of El Salvadoreans here will not support Canada at BC Place.  But the number of Canadian fans has increased significantly too.  Should be a fun match anyways

Edit:  if we want more Canadian support than Central Americans, do what the US does and play then in Columbus or in Canada’s place Winnipeg or Moncton, some very pro-Canadian place.

Edited June 18, 2021 by nolbertos

[Watchmen]

1 hour ago, nolbertos said:

I just saw on TV and some Southsiders told me thst it was a slightly bigger Mexican contingent.  El Savadoreans are just as passionate for WCQ matches.  I recall when the US played them, almost the entire stadium was El Salvadorean.  Since we last played El Salvador in an Ocho type setting the population of Central Americans in rhe Lower Mainland has tripled, hence why I believe alot of El Salvadoreans here will not support Canada at BC Place.  But the number of Canadian fans has increased significantly too.  Should be a fun match anyways

Edit:  if we want more Canadian support than Central Americans, do what the US does and play then in Columbus or in Canada’s place Winnipeg or Moncton, some very pro-Canadian place.

I don't think the population of Central American's in the lower mainland tripling from 1997 matters.  Vancouver hosted Honduras and El Salvador in the last qualifying campaign and I doubt there was any Honduran/El Salvadorean fans who said "never mind, I won't bother with the 2nd round.  I'll hold out for the hex."

In all venues, I'd be more concerned with stadiums being at a more limited capacity and the away fans snapping up the tickets first.  Canadian fans (outside of this forum) I think tend to buy them at a slower pace/game day.

[Cheeta]

The idea of opening this round of WCQ against Honduras at King George V in St John's is really growing on me.

A dumb idea for a lot of very obvious reasons but also, I think, a good idea for a great many others.

[Obinna]

21 minutes ago, Cheeta said:

The idea of opening this round of WCQ against Honduras at King George V in St John's is really growing on me.

A dumb idea for a lot of very obvious reasons but also, I think, a good idea for a great many others.

I was toying with the idea of going home in September, but this would seal the deal.