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WCQ: Canada vs Suriname - Tuesday, June 8th, 9:05pm Eastern/6:05pm Pacific - SeatGeek Stadium, Chicago


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We bring the tactical acumen and intensity that we had against the USA in October 2019 and we win, simple as that. I'm not convinced that this Suriname team is a goal scoring force.. beating Cayman Islands 3-0 at home is pretty pathetic. And we can bemoan our defence all we want but the fact is that this Suriname has never faced a defence even close to the quality we have.

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37 minutes ago, CanadaFan123 said:

 I'm not convinced that this Suriname team is a goal scoring force.. beating Cayman Islands 3-0 at home is pretty pathetic. And we can bemoan our defence all we want but the fact is that this Suriname has never faced a defence even close to the quality we have.

Good point. I think we complain about how bad our defenders are while thinking about teams in the next round, but for this round our defense is clearly one of the best compared to all the other teams in this round. Suriname will not score more than one and we will atleast score one. I know anything can happen but this is why we are favourites. I feel like alot of voyageurs come on here and talk without any confidence so that if the improbable happens they can say see I told you so. The reality is, I don't think anyone on here would bet actual money on us losing. Sure maybe you would bet on a draw, but give your head a shake if you think that we are anything other than strong favourites.

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6 minutes ago, CanadaFan123 said:

We bring the tactical acumen and intensity that we had against the USA in October 2019 and we win, simple as that. I'm not convinced that this Suriname team is a goal scoring force.. beating Cayman Islands 3-0 at home is pretty pathetic. And we can bemoan our defence all we want but the fact is that this Suriname has never faced a defence even close to the quality we have.

I'm with you on that brother. They talk about our defense like their a bunch of scrubs, but let's take a closer look..

Vitoria - We have a 34 year old who played 19 league games for the 8th place team in Portugal, scoring 3 goals. He often wears the armband.

  • If Suriname had a 34 year old center back who captained Sparta Rotterdam (who finished 8th in the Netherlands), they wouldn't shut up about it.
  • Just based on resume, Ramon Leeuwin is probably a good comparison. Likely is a bench player for them, whereas Vitoria is likely a starter for us, but I mean if our likely-starters are their likely-bench guys, the gulf isn't that big. 

Henry - We have a 27 year old center back playing for the 2nd place team in Korea, who when healthy is a starter for them. 

  • I think Suriname fans just roll their eyes at the K-league, they don't factor in that Henry's club are regular participates in the Asian Champions League. 
  • Just based on resume, Myenty Abena is probably a good comparison, who plays with Slovakian giants Sloven Bratislava and just won the league. He played 14 league games for them. Him and Pinas are supposedly fighting for the CB spot next to Donk.
    • Anyhow, similar age to Doneil with a similar transfer value and playing for a club with similar transfer value as Doneil's club, so I don't see the big difference. Henry obviously has more international experience.

Kennedy - We have a 24 year old uncapped center back who started in the DFB Pokal quarter finals against Werder Bremen (and did quite well). He played 22 league games (mostly starts) on a bottom half team in the 2.Bundesliga.

  • I get the impression that Suriname fans see that he plays in a second division league and pay him no mind.
  • The best comparison, albeit not perfect, is Shaquille Pinas, who likely starts ahead of Abena (though there is some debate). He's a year younger than Kennedy and played nearly double the minutes in a better league (Eredivisie). 
    • So I am tempted to say clear advantage here to Suriname in this particular comparison, but ADO Den Haag have a similar squad value to Jahn Regensburg and were just relegated, so in a few months time Pinas will actually be playing at a lesser league than Kennedy. Just goes to show how flawed these comparisons are.

Sturing - We have another 24 year old playing center back (Sturing), who shows promise but plays at a lower level and one the Suirname fans will be familiar with.

  • Fair if Suriname fans don't rate Sturing due to his resume, it's not that impressive and he probably doesn't get in their squad for this game. To be fair to us though, he arguably shouldn't be in ours, since we are missing Miller to injury.
    • He did get picked ahead of Cornelius and Waterman though, who are healthy. Hard to say if Herdman really rates Sturing or if he's saving those two for Gold Cup duty. Perhaps both.
  • The last CB left from Suriname, which there really is no comparison, is Ryan Donk. No need to go further as the Galatasaray captain is certainly the best CB of anyone mentioned on both teams, based on resume.
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Pretty long but its an interesting listen from the Suriname perspective especially as they are not familiar with many of our guys. They do regularly point out our weakness is the defence.

The two guys also seem to rate the midfielders with Suriname higher than ours which I think will come back to bite them in the ass.

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1 minute ago, Obinna said:

I'm with you on that brother. They talk about our defense like their a bunch of scrubs, but let's take a closer look..

Vitoria - We have a 34 year old who played 19 league games for the 8th place team in Portugal, scoring 3 goals. He often wears the armband.

  • If Suriname had a 34 year old center back who captained Sparta Rotterdam (who finished 8th in the Netherlands), they wouldn't shut up about it.
  • Just based on resume, Ramon Leeuwin is probably a good comparison. Likely is a bench player for them, whereas Vitoria is likely a starter for us, but I mean if our likely-starters are their likely-bench guys, the gulf isn't that big. 

Henry - We have a 27 year old center back playing for the 2nd place team in Korea, who when healthy is a starter for them. 

  • I think Suriname fans just roll their eyes at the K-league, they don't factor in that Henry's club are regular participates in the Asian Champions League. 
  • Just based on resume, Myenty Abena is probably a good comparison, who plays with Slovakian giants Sloven Bratislava and just won the league. He played 14 league games for them. Him and Pinas are supposedly fighting for the CB spot next to Donk.
    • Anyhow, similar age to Doneil with a similar transfer value and playing for a club with similar transfer value as Doneil's club, so I don't see the big difference. Henry obviously has more international experience.

Kennedy - We have a 24 year old uncapped center back who started in the DFB Pokal quarter finals against Werder Bremen (and did quite well). He played 22 league games (mostly starts) on a bottom half team in the 2.Bundesliga.

  • I get the impression that Suriname fans see that he plays in a second division league and pay him no mind.
  • The best comparison, albeit not perfect, is Shaquille Pinas, who likely starts ahead of Abena (though there is some debate). He's a year younger than Kennedy and played nearly double the minutes in a better league (Eredivisie). 
    • So I am tempted to say clear advantage here to Suriname in this particular comparison, but ADO Den Haag have a similar squad value to Jahn Regensburg and were just relegated, so in a few months time Pinas will actually be playing at a lesser league than Kennedy. Just goes to show how flawed these comparisons are.

Sturing - We have another 24 year old playing center back (Sturing), who shows promise but plays at a lower level and one the Suirname fans will be familiar with.

  • Fair if Suriname fans don't rate Sturing due to his resume, it's not that impressive and he probably doesn't get in their squad for this game. To be fair to us though, he arguably shouldn't be in ours, since we are missing Miller to injury.
    • He did get picked ahead of Cornelius and Waterman though, who are healthy. Hard to say if Herdman really rates Sturing or if he's saving those two for Gold Cup duty. Perhaps both.
  • The last CB left from Suriname, which there really is no comparison, is Ryan Donk. No need to go further as the Galatasaray captain is certainly the best CB of anyone mentioned on both teams, based on resume.

Donk might play DM that's what he's been doing for them.

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Just now, Obinna said:

I'm with you on that brother. They talk about our defense like their a bunch of scrubs, but let's take a closer look..

Vitoria - We have a 34 year old who played 19 league games for the 8th place team in Portugal, scoring 3 goals. He often wears the armband.

  • If Suriname had a 34 year old center back who captained Sparta Rotterdam (who finished 8th in the Netherlands), they wouldn't shut up about it.
  • Just based on resume, Ramon Leeuwin is probably a good comparison. Likely is a bench player for them, whereas Vitoria is likely a starter for us, but I mean if our likely-starters are their likely-bench guys, the gulf isn't that big. 

Henry - We have a 27 year old center back playing for the 2nd place team in Korea, who when healthy is a starter for them. 

  • I think Suriname fans just roll their eyes at the K-league, they don't factor in that Henry's club are regular participates in the Asian Champions League. 
  • Just based on resume, Myenty Abena is probably a good comparison, who plays with Slovakian giants Sloven Bratislava and just won the league. He played 14 league games for them. Him and Pinas are supposedly fighting for the CB spot next to Donk.
    • Anyhow, similar age to Doneil with a similar transfer value and playing for a club with similar transfer value as Doneil's club, so I don't see the big difference. Henry obviously has more international experience.

Kennedy - We have a 24 year old uncapped center back who started in the DFB Pokal quarter finals against Werder Bremen (and did quite well). He played 22 league games (mostly starts) on a bottom half team in the 2.Bundesliga.

  • I get the impression that Suriname fans see that he plays in a second division league and pay him no mind.
  • The best comparison, albeit not perfect, is Shaquille Pinas, who likely starts ahead of Abena (though there is some debate). He's a year younger than Kennedy and played nearly double the minutes in a better league (Eredivisie). 
    • So I am tempted to say clear advantage here to Suriname in this particular comparison, but ADO Den Haag have a similar squad value to Jahn Regensburg and were just relegated, so in a few months time Pinas will actually be playing at a lesser league than Kennedy. Just goes to show how flawed these comparisons are.

Sturing - We have another 24 year old playing center back (Sturing), who shows promise but plays at a lower level and one the Suirname fans will be familiar with.

  • Fair if Suriname fans don't rate Sturing due to his resume, it's not that impressive and he probably doesn't get in their squad for this game. To be fair to us though, he arguably shouldn't be in ours, since we are missing Miller to injury.
    • He did get picked ahead of Cornelius and Waterman though, who are healthy. Hard to say if Herdman really rates Sturing or if he's saving those two for Gold Cup duty. Perhaps both.
  • The last CB left from Suriname, which there really is no comparison, is Ryan Donk. No need to go further as the Galatasaray captain is certainly the best CB of anyone mentioned on both teams, based on resume.

I am too busy to do a deep dive comparing the teams in terms of full back options, but I hope what comes across here is how their supposed advantage in defense (on paper) is not so great. That's why I feel way too much is being made about their "advantage" here. Defending requires a team/system approach, which is just as important as the individual talent of the players, and since our guys in theory should have more familiarity, I would like to think it mitigates any talent advantage they have.

Final point on this: We must also consider the match ups, but we are instead looking at each defense in isolation. Both sets of fans have been talking about "who has the better defense on paper", but there has been less talk about match ups. For instance, Suriname can have a better defense on paper than Canada, but the gulf between our front 2 and their CBs is pretty stark. Even if we say Larin and Donk cancel each other out, I am pretty sure David will out play Pinas or Abena, unless they somehow have the game of their lives (which can happen).

But if we start throwing that "if" around, it renders the whole debate about who has the advantage moot anyways.

And maybe that's fair to render it all moot and just sit back and say "may the best team on the day win". 

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10 minutes ago, VinceA said:

Pretty long but its an interesting listen from the Suriname perspective especially as they are not familiar with many of our guys. They do regularly point out our weakness is the defence.

The two guys also seem to rate the midfielders with Suriname higher than ours which I think will come back to bite them in the ass.

Shared that yesterday in the thread. It really is a good listen. I encourage you guys to check it out to get some insights into Suriname.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, Kent said:

I was expecting to listen to a few minutes of that 2 hour video. Ended up spending about a 45 minute lunch listening to it.

Same. 

Felt almost like a free scouting report. Haha. 

Even listening to that lots of unknowns with so many new faces. 

The one thing I will say is experienced vets and journymen are usually good at slotting into various systems. I don't think they will look completely out of sorts or anything because of the lack of playing together. The fact they are 28+ really helps them to quickly mold and create a system.  My understanding is they have been in camp together for quite some time now as well. 

It will be a solid test that's for sure and a super quick turn around. I'm confident but let the journey begin!

 

Edited by apbsmith
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On OneSoccer they showed tweets from Suriname fans going off on Platt and Wheeler lmao.

 

Sidenote: Does anyone actually like Wheeler on commentary? Him and Dunfield for me have to be the worst commentary duo in Canadian soccer broadcasting at the moment. 

That OneSoccer commercial with Dunfield's laugh after Cavallini's goal haunts my dreams.

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Just now, VinceA said:

On OneSoccer they showed tweets from Suriname fans going off on Platt and Wheeler lmao.

 

Sidenote: Does anyone actually like Wheeler on commentary? Him and Dunfield for me have to be the worst commentary duo in Canadian soccer broadcasting at the moment. 

That OneSoccer commercial with Dunfield's laugh after Cavallini's goal haunts my dreams.

This actually made me laugh out loud. Well played sir, well played. 

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23 minutes ago, VinceA said:

On OneSoccer they showed tweets from Suriname fans going off on Platt and Wheeler lmao.

 

Sidenote: Does anyone actually like Wheeler on commentary? Him and Dunfield for me have to be the worst commentary duo in Canadian soccer broadcasting at the moment. 

That OneSoccer commercial with Dunfield's laugh after Cavallini's goal haunts my dreams.

‘Alphonso Davies having all the fun’ to me has to be one of the strangest calls ever.

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31 minutes ago, VinceA said:

On OneSoccer they showed tweets from Suriname fans going off on Platt and Wheeler lmao.

 

Sidenote: Does anyone actually like Wheeler on commentary? Him and Dunfield for me have to be the worst commentary duo in Canadian soccer broadcasting at the moment. 

That OneSoccer commercial with Dunfield's laugh after Cavallini's goal haunts my dreams.

'The rich get richer!' after Laryea's goal vs Bermuda is up there

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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, VinceA said:

On OneSoccer they showed tweets from Suriname fans going off on Platt and Wheeler lmao.

 

Sidenote: Does anyone actually like Wheeler on commentary? Him and Dunfield for me have to be the worst commentary duo in Canadian soccer broadcasting at the moment. 

That OneSoccer commercial with Dunfield's laugh after Cavallini's goal haunts my dreams.

That was Pierre McGuire levels of bad for ruining a call 

Edited by Atlantic
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1 hour ago, VinceA said:

On OneSoccer they showed tweets from Suriname fans going off on Platt and Wheeler lmao.

 

Sidenote: Does anyone actually like Wheeler on commentary? Him and Dunfield for me have to be the worst commentary duo in Canadian soccer broadcasting at the moment. 

That OneSoccer commercial with Dunfield's laugh after Cavallini's goal haunts my dreams.

yeah, they're pretty cringe

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I like them. I like the Dunfield laugh after Cavalinni's goal. It's how I felt when that goal happened and when I see the replay that laugh brings me right back into that moment. They are both passionate and it comes through and I enjoy that. A lot of people in the sports media business are boring. Not offensively so, but you watch them talk about something and it all seems fine but if you stop and think "what did he just say" it's usually not much of anything. The Wheeler jokes are corny but lovable in my opinion. Novak? Yesvak! works for me. I like Luke Wileman quite a bit, but I couldn't quote anything he has said. It's nice to have a character calling games and/or on a talk show like One Soccer Today.

All that being said, to play devil's advocate I hate that guy that screams like he has been stabbed in the heart whenever he sees Messi score and then goes on and on about throwing toasters in bathtubs or whatever. He is a more extreme version of Wheeler, so I guess I can understand how Wheeler annoys lots of people.

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I hated Wheels but now kind of like him. I thought it was amateurish at first but now I realize it’s intentionally schticky. And I like Dunfield, I like a colour commentator to be partial and he’s definitely invested.

They could be more polished for sure but considering they’re both relatively new to this I’m okay with it. If they don’t clean it up a bit it will eventually get annoying though.

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I appreciate that the guy has been involved in the Canadian footy scene for quite a while but if I am being honest, I am just not a Wheeler fan.  Corny jokes are okay when you have the street cred of a Ron MacLean but I just don’t get the same vibe from “Wheels”.  

Not trying to be a dick - just not my personal preference. 

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59 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said:

I appreciate that the guy has been involved in the Canadian footy scene for quite a while but if I am being honest, I am just not a Wheeler fan.  Corny jokes are okay when you have the street cred of a Ron MacLean but I just don’t get the same vibe from “Wheels”.  

Not trying to be a dick - just not my personal preference. 

I always found Ron MacLean boring, but perhaps that was because he was next to Don Chery.

Wheeler is a lot of things, but boring isn't one of them!

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1 hour ago, Kent said:

All that being said, to play devil's advocate I hate that guy that screams like he has been stabbed in the heart whenever he sees Messi score and then goes on and on about throwing toasters in bathtubs or whatever. He is a more extreme version of Wheeler, so I guess I can understand how Wheeler annoys lots of people.

Ray Hudson.

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