Vancouver Whitecaps 2021 Season

[Watchmen]

And there we go. MDS gone.

 

[The Beaver 2.0]

2 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

And there we go. MDS gone.

 

Holy hannah! For some reason I figured the Caps would give him a few more games, especially in light of their recent form of (less than mediocre) play. But I guess they saw everything the needed to see.  Sad that he did not work out. He's still young and can learn a ton, but I am not convinced we'll see him at this level anytime soon. 

As for Sartini taking over as interim head coach: what the hell is "director of methodology"? And what method are we talking here? Rhythm? Stanislavski? To my Madness?

[Ingham]

They should hire a manager from CPL.

I always say that Canadian and American managers are best for the MLS. Foreigners rarely ever work out. Only big success story was Tata Martino really.

[narduch]

17 minutes ago, Ingham said:

They should hire a manager from CPL.

I always say that Canadian and American managers are best for the MLS. Foreigners rarely ever work out. Only big success story was Tata Martino really.

Kah, Wheeldon and Smyrniotis all deserve a shot.

[toontownman]

Can't really understand why they didn't sack him earlier. I guess there is money saved somewhere. Less of an excuse to hire someone more legit now while a few months ago a proper interim or permanent hire might have been expected.

Glad Axel can be out in the open with a search for a new coach now.  

[Unnamed Trialist]

1 hour ago, The Beaver 2.0 said:

Holy hannah! For some reason I figured the Caps would give him a few more games, especially in light of their recent form of (less than mediocre) play. But I guess they saw everything the needed to see.  Sad that he did not work out. He's still young and can learn a ton, but I am not convinced we'll see him at this level anytime soon. 

As for Sartini taking over as interim head coach: what the hell is "director of methodology"? And what method are we talking here? Rhythm? Stanislavski? To my Madness?

I could point you to a good discourse on the subject.

True story: I actually teach method in a specific field, there you go. Method can include creativity, novelty, outlier options, there is no reason for method to be dry, stunted or an impediment to quality results. 

But like most here, I have no idea what a Director of Methodology is.

[Unnamed Trialist]

1 hour ago, Ingham said:

They should hire a manager from CPL.

I always say that Canadian and American managers are best for the MLS. Foreigners rarely ever work out. Only big success story was Tata Martino really.

So you think MDS is not Canadian then but a foreigner?

[Unnamed Trialist]

I just saw the email, which was sent to me a few minutes before the hour. No explanation, no reference to the Voyageurs Cup match. And no real replacement, which is pretty poor. Decide on a quality option, have it ready, then sack the bugger and announce it. 

The MLS results were actually better than they'd been in a long time, and if you look at the dumb late points losses, Caps could be said to be having a decent season. Our possession is even up, those are coachables. 

[dyslexic nam]

48 minutes ago, narduch said:

Kah, Wheeldon and Smyrniotis all deserve a shot.

Smyrniotis just on the basis of that scarf commercial.  

[youllneverwalkalone]

2 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

I just saw the email, which was sent to me a few minutes before the hour. No explanation, no reference to the Voyageurs Cup match. And no real replacement, which is pretty poor. Decide on a quality option, have it ready, then sack the bugger and announce it. 

The MLS results were actually better than they'd been in a long time, and if you look at the dumb late points losses, Caps could be said to be having a decent season. Our possession is even up, those are coachables. 

I think the improvement is largely down to spending a bit more on the squad. 

I thought Sartini was one of MDS' guys, but I guess not. He took over for Darymple last season, who himself wore the interim tag when Robinson was fired. This does give them some time to search and interview and, who knows, possible a healthy side can sneak its way into the playoffs. There aren't that many folks, certainly locally, with the Pro license. He must know his Xs and Os.

I don't tend to give the Caps much credit, but "having the replacement ready" typically leads to rash decisions. Better to let your institutional guys take over and do a proper search.

[Ingham]

24 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

So you think MDS is not Canadian then but a foreigner?

You know what I meant - Canadian and American managers both understand the MLS and American sports better than the rest of the world - and that is my hunch as to why foreigners struggle. Look at Frank de Boer and Matias Almeyda.

[youllneverwalkalone]

De Boer actually has one of the higher winning percentages amongst foreign managers, albeit with a club where that was expected.

[Unnamed Trialist]

8 minutes ago, Ingham said:

You know what I meant - Canadian and American managers both understand the MLS and American sports better than the rest of the world - and that is my hunch as to why foreigners struggle. Look at Frank de Boer and Matias Almeyda.

But you are posting in the context of a Canadian who not only struggled but was just fired. So I don't know what you meant.

 

[Ingham]

2 minutes ago, Unnamed Trialist said:

But you are posting in the context of a Canadian who not only struggled but was just fired. So I don't know what you meant.

 

Of course some managers do poorly here and there, but the ones that tend to do best in the MLS are the local managers.

Not 100% sure on Canadian history, but only 2 foreign managers were in the MLS Cup finals in the past decade, and only Tata Martino won it.

I threw Canada in there because I assumed they would be similar thanks to us having teams in their league.

[youllneverwalkalone]

I'm guessing locals do better in most leagues. The one outlier is probably England, although I think soccernomics has some sort chart that compares league position vs. wage bill over a number of years and many of the foreigners get filtered out somehow.

[costarg]

I don't really understand the timing behind all this.  So they start winning and they finally decide to sack him?  

[youllneverwalkalone]

They started drawing mostly.

[Dominic94]

27 minutes ago, costarg said:

I don't really understand the timing behind all this.  So they start winning and they finally decide to sack him?  

They have 0 identity, questionable results and team selection, hard to say if players are improving.

[BearcatSA]

33 minutes ago, costarg said:

I don't really understand the timing behind all this.  So they start winning and they finally decide to sack him?  

I'm of the same opinion.  They are starting a big stretch of home games with their attacking mid saviour finally in place.  Firing him following a cup loss (albeit humiliating) after a lengthy undefeated league streak on the one hand might look impetuous but on the other hand it also looks like the upper level leadership was looking for a reason to gas him.  Hard to read.  

I thought he would get to the end of the season then not re-signed.

Edited August 28, 2021 by BearcatSA

[Watchmen]

1 hour ago, BearcatSA said:

I'm of the same opinion.  They are starting a big stretch of home games with their attacking mid saviour finally in place.  Firing him following a cup loss (albeit humiliating) after a lengthy undefeated league streak on the one hand might look impetuous but on the other hand it also looks like the upper level leadership was looking for a reason to gas him.  Hard to read.  

I thought he would get to the end of the season then not re-signed.

Do you mean Schuster or the rest of the FO/ownership group?  Because most people have complained that MDS should have been out ages ago and it was only because FO/ownership were too cheap that he was still around.

I think going for the Voyagers Cup and potentially sacrificing the playoffs (which were still a bit of a long shot) was the right call.  MDS talked about how much he wanted to win it.  So it was one of the biggest games of their season, and they put in one of their most embarrassing performances.  I think regardless of MDS staying or not, the MLS playoffs were done.  So, might as well move on from him now.

[toontownman]

8 hours ago, narduch said:

Kah, Wheeldon and Smyrniotis all deserve a shot.

Still surprised Bobby wasn't given consideration for TFC. He would have been so much better than Armas and an ideal fit for bringing through the youth movement there. 

Only a matter of time for Kah.

[nolando]

2 hours ago, toontownman said:

Still surprised Bobby wasn't given consideration for TFC. 

Lenurduzzi has proven time and time again he just isn't up to this standard of football.

[Ozzie_the_parrot]

5 hours ago, toontownman said:

Still surprised Bobby wasn't given consideration for TFC...

What would he be able do when there is no Sigma to stock his roster and give him the inside track in the context of a newly formed league would probably be the concern. Think he will probably get a closer look this time around as the Manning/Curtis/Altidore era is probably drawing to a close.

[youllneverwalkalone]

I would guess that all the best talent west of BMO would just follow him over there. Bobby S. reminds me a little of MDS. The commercial on OS really says it all. He thinks he's pretty smart. 

[Ingham]

I was told by someone that Bobby doesn't have the resume to manage at Whitecaps.

He definitely does in my opinion. Nearly qualified for CONCACAF CL last year, won 2 titles in Canada and has been able to manage cores for years. 

If he isn't good enough to manage one of the weakest sides in the MLS now, he never will. I personally never got the ideology that you shouldn't hire a manager in a weaker league. Everyone has to start somewhere, and there's often a lot of misconception on the power of a certain league/team. Don't believe me? Look at Ange Postecoglu at Celtic or Juan Reynoso at Cruz Azul. Both were crucified initially for being nobodies and are both doing good jobs there.