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Comparing us to the USA in football right now is like comparing the USA to us in hockey 20 years ago. Our team was definitely the best, and we had enough other good players to roll out 4 more teams that, with a bit of luck, could medal at the Olympics. However, they had 20-25 players that were good enough on their day to compete with anyone.

If everybody is fit and available, for both nations, our first teams are very competitive. Their second team would probably beat ours most times. Once you get to the third teams, it gets increasingly lopsided, in their favour. We need to start building better depth to support our best first-choice team in at least 25 years.

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Here we go!  First premier league action. Congratulations to Theo!

Corbeanu trained with the Wolves first team today, scoring a goal. Wolves play Liverpool on Sunday, Corbeanu could be in contention for a spot in the matchday squad with Jimenez out injured.

Canadian to the core! Looking forward to declare that an EPL striker is Canadian!  

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1 hour ago, SthMelbRed said:

Comparing us to the USA in football right now is like comparing the USA to us in hockey 20 years ago. Our team was definitely the best, and we had enough other good players to roll out 4 more teams that, with a bit of luck, could medal at the Olympics. However, they had 20-25 players that were good enough on their day to compete with anyone.

If everybody is fit and available, for both nations, our first teams are very competitive. Their second team would probably beat ours most times. Once you get to the third teams, it gets increasingly lopsided, in their favour. We need to start building better depth to support our best first-choice team in at least 25 years.

This is a perfect analogy.... if USA Hockey had Gretzky at the time. 
 

Seriously though. We will put our a best XI that will go toe to toe with them on any given day and for them that sucks. In their minds they wish we were Canada of 2012 with 3-4 good players and a bunch of scrubs.

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2 minutes ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

If some of those young American players reach their potential they could blow by us yet again

And likewise, we have some scary good prospects as well. Word is that our top end youngsters 2004 and younger are best in the region.

Both nations are reaching a level where they won’t be out of each other’s sight. Even if they turn out to be the Germany of the region we may turn out to be the Croatia. 

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I'll never shy away from saying the US have more depth and are overall ahead but some of the comments about us not even being in their league...I mean c'mon!!!!

We can 100% compete. Can we stop with the lower mindset and show a little bit of confidence on the guys we have now and those coming up?

Thank you!

Edited by Ansem
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2 hours ago, SthMelbRed said:

Comparing us to the USA in football right now is like comparing the USA to us in hockey 20 years ago. Our team was definitely the best, and we had enough other good players to roll out 4 more teams that, with a bit of luck, could medal at the Olympics. However, they had 20-25 players that were good enough on their day to compete with anyone.

If everybody is fit and available, for both nations, our first teams are very competitive. Their second team would probably beat ours most times. Once you get to the third teams, it gets increasingly lopsided, in their favour. We need to start building better depth to support our best first-choice team in at least 25 years.

I know population isn't an excuse but when they have over 10x the amount of people we do (plus all the dual nats that never even lived in the US, Arfield is our only example we have), it's gonna be hard to match their depth. It also didn't help that we didn't get our own professional league until 2019. The CPL should start helping close the gap there a bit, hopefully more talented kids stay in the game since we now have more professional teams. I like using the Croatia example as well, the 11 we have out there is all that counts.

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7 hours ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

Really? Better than Mexican and American '04s? Who is saying this?

@Dominic94 posted this in another thread referring to Assi, Pellegrino and Rutty.

But Rutty is supposedly the best 2004 in CONCACAF. This according to Ali Curtis and a few others I've seen on social media.

Just take a look at our players 25 or younger without even including these youngsters: Larin, Laryea, Kennedy, Eustaquio, St. Clair, Cornelius, Miller, Brym, Tabla, Millar, Buchanan, Davies, David, Okello, Nelson, Corbeanu, Mitrovic, Priso, Baldisimo, Bair, Fraser, Johnston...

And we could go on.

From that list already 4 of those guys could walk onto the USMNT (Larin, Eustaquio, Davies and David). Another handful would get looks (St. Clair, Laryea, Buchanan). That's seven blue chip players right there. Then you have to think a handful of the others will pop in the next couple years as well - plus a few unknowns who aren't even on this list. 

Whatever we're doing with development we're right there with the States. Both nations are going to be putting out top tier national teams and the margins only get thinner at the top. They're not "blowing past us" ever again, that ship has sailed and was contingent on us being awful anyhow.

 

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8 hours ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

Really? Better than Mexican and American '04s? Who is saying this?

I'm not sure who is "saying" this, but in the last Concacaf U15 Championships (2004s) Canada beat Mexico 2-0 and, from game reports, were full value for the win.  That team was led by Marshall-Rutty, Assi and Mbongue.  Since then, Passaqule, Pellegrino and Abatneh have also emerged (we don't know who has emerged for the US or Mexico).  Flores did not play for Canada or Mexico.

In the semis, Canada lost 2-1 to Slovenia is extra time.  US lost 3-0 to Portugal.  Portugal won the tournament with a 1-0 win over Slovenia.

I know this doesn't say anything definitive, but it is an indicator.

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12 minutes ago, CanadaFan123 said:

@Dominic94 posted this in another thread referring to Assi, Pellegrino and Rutty.

But Rutty is supposedly the best 2004 in CONCACAF. This according to Ali Curtis and a few others I've seen on social media.

Just take a look at our players 25 or younger without even including these youngsters: Larin, Laryea, Kennedy, Eustaquio, St. Clair, Cornelius, Miller, Brym, Tabla, Millar, Buchanan, Davies, David, Okello, Nelson, Corbeanu, Mitrovic, Priso, Baldisimo, Bair, Fraser, Johnston...

 

 

A lot of these names are not particularly impressive at all and would only be to someone immersed in a CanMNT bubble. If you did the same thing 3 years ago you would have had Jordan Hamilton, Adonijah, and others on that list in the same vein. If you did the same exercise for USMNT it would be a blowout.

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1 hour ago, Floortom said:

A lot of these names are not particularly impressive at all and would only be to someone immersed in a CanMNT bubble. If you did the same thing 3 years ago you would have had Jordan Hamilton, Adonijah, and others on that list in the same vein. If you did the same exercise for USMNT it would be a blowout.

These names are in different leagues than Hamilton or Reid. They've actually played and made impacts at MLS or similar/higher levels.

But I think you just proved my point anyhow. Hamilton and Reid are both under 25 and not close to making this list anymore. 

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12 hours ago, CanadaFan123 said:

These names are in different leagues than Hamilton or Reid. They've actually played and made impacts at MLS or similar/higher levels.

But I think you just proved my point anyhow. Hamilton and Reid are both under 25 and not close to making this list anymore. 

In 2019, Hamilton scored 4 goals in 14 regular season appearances with TFC. Quite honestly, that alone is more impressive than anything at least half of your list has ever accomplished.

I mean Priso has played two matches with TFC - I hope he turns out but who knows. Tabla might not even be in MLS next year. Okelllo, mitrovic,...Most of these are just names that we know because we’re in a weird bubble. 
 

again do the same to with the US pipeline and it’s night and day. 

Edited by Floortom
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3 minutes ago, Floortom said:

In 2019, Hamilton scored 4 goals in 14 regular season appearances with TFC. Quite honestly, that alone is more impressive than anything at least half of your list had accomplished.

I mean Priso has played two matches with TFC - I hope he turns out but who knows. Table might not even be in MLS next year. Okelllo, mitrovic,...Most of these are just names that we know because we’re in a weird bubble. 
 

again do the same to with the US pipeline and it’s night and day. 

This isn't the argument though. Unless FIFA changes the rules to allow for 22 players on the pitch at once it's not a worry. The USA isn't pulling way ahead of Canada with the players we're producing. 

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6 minutes ago, CanadaFan123 said:

This isn't the argument though. Unless FIFA changes the rules to allow for 22 players on the pitch at once it's not a worry. The USA isn't pulling way ahead of Canada with the players we're producing. 

Right that’s fine if you just restrict it to top end talent but even there they are starting to pull ahead more and more. They have five U22s that will be playing in the Champion’s League knockout rounds (Pulisic, McKennie, Dest, Adams, Reyna) and some others on the rosters (Richards, de la Fuente).

We’re nowhere near able to produce that level of top end talent 

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2 hours ago, CanadaFan123 said:

 

 From that list already 4 of those guys could walk onto the USMNT (Larin, Eustaquio, Davies and David).

 

I suggested this on Twitter a couple months ago to an ignorant USMNT fan named Bryan. He didn’t agree with me haha. 

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I'm gonna push back on the pass Mexico thing. Every game is a chance for someone to push pass someone. Has Belgium pushed passed Brazil? Has Croatia pushed pass England? I think it makes for good conversation but you need to compete and its all fluid. US soccer is getting better but clearly much like Canada will, the US has benefited from this new world of people moving all over the place. For instance, Bayern has that great yound midfielder Musiala or whatever. Could play for England, Germany or Nigeria. That wouldn't even be a thing 20 years ago. US soccer grows Mexico will also get even better. Why? Because there are 60 million Mexican Americans now able to plug in to the MLS and other academies along with everyone coming from a successful Mexican football system. So its all changing in multiple ways and yah US can't help but be a top team but by that I mean a consistent top 20 team but its gonna make Concacaf all that more exciting because I think Canada and Mexico will also keep getting better. Canada and US for sure but then you play a game and can only put 11 players on the field. Just ask Brazil

Sorry Theo Corbeanu thread. Can't wait to see him play

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1 hour ago, Floortom said:

Right that’s fine if you just restrict it to top end talent but even there they are starting to pull ahead more and more. They have five U22s that will be playing in the Champion’s League knockout rounds (Pulisic, McKennie, Dest, Adams, Reyna) and some others on the rosters (Richards, de la Fuente).

We’re nowhere near able to produce that level of top end talent 

Not to detract from you point too much, because I agree that we are not keeping pace with the number of high end youngsters they are pumping out, but I think we need to consider the age of these players, their lack of accomplishments, and bear in mind that it remains to be seen what becomes of them.

Richards and De La Fuente in particular may reach the level of John Brooks and Christian Pulisic, but it remains to be seen.

Richards was able to get some Bayern time while players were out injured, which is great for a 20 year old, but now that players are back he's either been back with the second team or glued to the first team bench. He probably gets in some cup games, when they come, but when it comes to the UCL knock out rounds and a tight Bundesliga race, his first team chances are probably going to be few and far between. Yes Bayern are the best team in the world, but the time will come where he'll need to play, and like Davies he is going to have to prove he is better than the other options. He's not there yet and may never get there.

De La Fuente, similarly, has not played much with the Barca first team at all. He is mostly on the bench or playing for the B team. I don't expect him to go off the rails like Tabla, but he hasn't accomplished much more than Tabla either. He could develop into a stud, or something wonky could stall his progress. We just don't know yet. 2 years ago we thought Ballou was headed for great things and look what happened. Hell, for all we know he turns it around and goes on to have a better career than De La Fuente. Probably not, but we don't know yet.

I would be confident in saying that Pulisic, Dest, Adams, Reyna, Mckennie and probably Sargent are "can't miss" at this point, but De La Fuente, Richards, Aaronson, Llianz, Ledezma and others are still a question mark, for now anyways.

Edited by Obinna
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9 hours ago, Bertuzzi44 said:

^ Yes. We needed to follow that up with another result (ie a draw away) to show it wasn't a blip. Instead we got rolled 4-1 😕

The weirdest thing about that game was it was their MLS guys playing out of their boots scoring some highly unlikely and crazy clinical goals. Not their fancy pants euros. 

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2 minutes ago, grigorio said:

The weirdest thing about that game was it was their MLS guys playing out of their boots scoring some highly unlikely and crazy clinical goals. Not their fancy pants euros. 

Well quite a few of them (including pulisic and Adams) weren’t available. US didn’t play that great tbh..we just did our usual disappearing act. Totally disorganized, clumsy and unprepared. Any decent side would have blown us out.

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50 minutes ago, Floortom said:

Well quite a few of them (including pulisic and Adams) weren’t available. US didn’t play that great tbh..we just did our usual disappearing act. Totally disorganized, clumsy and unprepared. Any decent side would have blown us out.

Agree and once again that has a lot to do with coaching which is a huge concern for me going forward!

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