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Watchmen

Vancouver Whitecaps 2020 Season

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On 6/21/2020 at 5:05 AM, Big_M said:

the way the are talking they dont see it as temporary at all..they really believe in him as a great leader and wanted one voice

Well maybe we should expect him to hire a sporting director before too long then. Curious to see how this evolves. Sort of sounds like Schuster and Pannes were treading on each other’s toes, perhaps.

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5 hours ago, The Beaver 2.0 said:

Well maybe we should expect him to hire a sporting director before too long then. Curious to see how this evolves. Sort of sounds like Schuster and Pannes were treading on each other’s toes, perhaps.

No, the club framed it as they were treading on each other's toes, what with the whole "one voice" shtick.  But Pannes and Schuster both mentioned the other in their posts/press conferences, thanking the other.  Not mentioned: Anderson/Lenarduzzi/Lewis, or the ownership.  This feels much more like the long time executives had their feelings hurt because someone was telling them they've been doing a ****** job, and they conspired to get him fired.  Wouldn't be the first time.

On 6/21/2020 at 5:00 AM, Unnamed Trialist said:

Pannes was already a doubtful signing, after the NY Knicks and a Roma with huge problems, he was not exactly your ideal exec.

That said, a sporting director cannot be CEO, it is ridiculous. Maybe it is just temporary while this season plays out, and they have less work to do. After, they'll have to hire someone else, and if they want Schuster to supervise a team in sporting direction, signing, then fine, but he cannot be hands on in both areas, not even clubs in 3rd or 4th tier do that sort of thing.

I think at this stage it's widely accepted that the Knicks problem is ownership.  Maybe you know more about Roma and some problems he had their, but Italian clubs always seem to be a bit dysfunctional. And they chose Pannes after an exhaustive search and signed him to a 4 year deal.  So I'll ask you: what kind of a quality exec would take the CEO job of the Whitecaps, after watching his/her predecessor fired 6 months in for seemingly no reason beyond "we wanted one voice"?  Hell, if they do go out and hire either another Sporting Director or CEO, then they look like idiots for so quickly going back on their "one voice" reasoning.  No, they've chosen the method that is utterly ridiculous because as you say, a CEO and Sporting director shouldn't be the same.  But that's exactly what they're going to do.

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Posted (edited)

I think Mike Pannes had a great resume and seemed like a smart guy but even at the time the position felt a little unnecessary. I think he was there to build towards a stadium project and that was the main purpose of his hire. Maybe that just doesn't seem like much of a priority at the moment and considering his experience I'm sure he didn't come cheap

Edited by SpursFlu

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12 hours ago, SpursFlu said:

I think Mike Pannes had a great resume and seemed like a smart guy but even at the time the position felt a little unnecessary. I think he was there to build towards a stadium project and that was the main purpose of his hire. Maybe that just doesn't seem like much of a priority at the moment and considering his experience I'm sure he didn't come cheap

I'll disagree heavily here.  I thought it was absolutely a position they've needed filled.  They've struggled on the business side of things (they went a year without a sponsor in one of the major categories).  They've struggled with PR and having a good spokesperson.  They've struggled with attendance, which granted is a factor of being poor on the pitch, but they've also struggled in recent years to connect with the community.

At a pre-season event, I had a long time member of the whitecaps staff mention to me that Pannes and Schuster had come in and been pretty blunt with a number of key people: that they haven't been good enough.  That the combination of the two had been a breath of fresh air for the organization, and it's what was needed.  It seems to me that the people who were told they haven't been good enough got their feelings hurt, and then did what they needed to get Pannes out the door.  I'll be fascinated to see what Schuster does.  Wishing him the best of success, and if he has it that he sticks around a bit.

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On 6/23/2020 at 3:04 AM, The Beaver 2.0 said:

Well maybe we should expect him to hire a sporting director before too long then. Curious to see how this evolves. Sort of sounds like Schuster and Pannes were treading on each other’s toes, perhaps.

In the history of football that is what always happens, it's standard and for a reason. Execs and sporting directors are working with contrasting paradigms and the tension between them has to be managed. The owners have to tell them both to live with it, you don't cower to one and annul your own hiring criteria for the other. 

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On 6/28/2020 at 7:34 AM, Unnamed Trialist said:

In the history of football that is what always happens, it's standard and for a reason. Execs and sporting directors are working with contrasting paradigms and the tension between them has to be managed. The owners have to tell them both to live with it, you don't cower to one and annul your own hiring criteria for the other. 

I know this is going to be a shocker, but it seems to me that the Caps' ownership is so out of their depths--or, at least, they feel they are so out of their depths--that they aren't trusting their own strategic plan. I mean, the fundamentals of effective leadership within a corporate environment tend to be consistent across industry and (most) cultures.  Having said that, maybe in Pannes they figured they were paying far too much for a guy whose primary strength was marketing.  Maybe they figured Schuster can be CEO and they can hire somebody great, and less expensive, to handle marketing etc.

At this point I don't know what to think. But from the outside none of this gives me confidence in the Caps' ownership.  Proof is in the pudding, but I fear what they are offering is seriously undercooked. (See what I did there: metaphor!)

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17 hours ago, The Beaver 2.0 said:

I know this is going to be a shocker, but it seems to me that the Caps' ownership is so out of their depths--or, at least, they feel they are so out of their depths--that they aren't trusting their own strategic plan. I mean, the fundamentals of effective leadership within a corporate environment tend to be consistent across industry and (most) cultures.  Having said that, maybe in Pannes they figured they were paying far too much for a guy whose primary strength was marketing.  Maybe they figured Schuster can be CEO and they can hire somebody great, and less expensive, to handle marketing etc.

At this point I don't know what to think. But from the outside none of this gives me confidence in the Caps' ownership.  Proof is in the pudding, but I fear what they are offering is seriously undercooked. (See what I did there: metaphor!)

I was left wondering how you cook a pudding. 

Which is also a decent metaphor for Caps fans. 

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25 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

Whitecaps game against Dallas has been officially postponed. 

https://www.whitecapsfc.com/post/2020/07/04/caps-dallas-match-postponed

And the madness begins.  So I wonder if this is because Dallas is quarenteed, or Van is too late getting down there to quarenteen? Or maybe Dallas doesnt have enough players with clean bills of health?? Ugghhhh.   I cant believe we havnt worked out something for the CPL and MLS has got it organized right in the middle of the worst hotspots in the world.  

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1 hour ago, Bison44 said:

And the madness begins.  So I wonder if this is because Dallas is quarenteed, or Van is too late getting down there to quarenteen? Or maybe Dallas doesnt have enough players with clean bills of health?? Ugghhhh.   I cant believe we havnt worked out something for the CPL and MLS has got it organized right in the middle of the worst hotspots in the world.  

It's the Dallas issue.  Vancouver got a clean bill of health.  Only hasn't flown out now because the Dallas game as been postponed.

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Posted (edited)

I actually put this on the FCD players. How on earth does 10 players test positive. That's not 10 players have had covid. That's 10 players test positive right now. Either these guys have been completely ignoring the rules at the one specific time they should have been following them or the rules are completely useless. They should be forced to play with a depleted roster for being numb nuts

Edited by SpursFlu

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1 hour ago, SpursFlu said:

I actually put this on the FCD players. How on earth does 10 players test positive. That's not 10 players have had covid. That's 10 players test positive right now. Either these guys have been completely ignoring the rules at the one specific time they should have been following them or the rules are completely useless. They should be forced to play with a depleted roster for being numb nuts

It's a pandemic.  It spreads easily.  One player catching it could easily spread it to the others.  This has all been known for a long time.  You've spent the last few months choosing to ignore this, while mocking anyone who took it seriously.

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24 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

It's a pandemic.  It spreads easily.  One player catching it could easily spread it to the others.  This has all been known for a long time.  You've spent the last few months choosing to ignore this, while mocking anyone who took it seriously.

Wait a second. There are rules that are pretty simple to follow to not catch it, especially if your really focused over a short period of time. To me you're logic makes no sense. You want people to follow rules, yet these people didnt knowing they were going to be retested and your fine with that. You make no sense. If they followed the simple rules and they got it, then it means the rules are dumb and we just need to accept most peopld will catch the virus. Which one is it?

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55 minutes ago, SpursFlu said:

Wait a second. There are rules that are pretty simple to follow to not catch it, especially if your really focused over a short period of time. To me you're logic makes no sense. You want people to follow rules, yet these people didnt knowing they were going to be retested and your fine with that. You make no sense. If they followed the simple rules and they got it, then it means the rules are dumb and we just need to accept most peopld will catch the virus. Which one is it?

You've spent the entire pandemic saying people were exaggerating and advocating for everything to reopen while mocking the simple rules. So when a state that reopened early and didn't follow the simple rules now has all sorts of problems and half the team has caught Covid-19, you seem confused as to how this happened.  Your logic makes no sense.

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3 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

You've spent the entire pandemic saying people were exaggerating and advocating for everything to reopen while mocking the simple rules. So when a state that reopened early and didn't follow the simple rules now has all sorts of problems and half the team has caught Covid-19, you seem confused as to how this happened.  Your logic makes no sense.

Ah no I know how it happened. Everyone has, had or will have it at some point. I would think the MLS would lay out some guidelines as far as how many people can test positive or and then the protocol to return to play and those timelines. We've been dealing with this for over 6 months, how do you have like 1/3 of your players test positive now. I'm not worried about anyone's health I'm saying you would almost have to try and get that many positive tests all at once

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Seriously?  You are playing how did this spread so fast??  The guy who was telling us to get back to reality?? Not to believe the talking heads pushing fear agendas??  

 One guy gets it.. maybe he was having a americano at his local coffee shop, then hangs out a little too close to the other players during stretching, or sprints, showers, bus rides, flights etc and he infects 10 other guys before he even knows he has it.  This seems perfectly reasonable and is exactly why most people have been so worried about this spreading like wildfire if uncontrolled.  And you might not be worried about anyones health, I just hope none of those 10 guys has a sick kid, or a wife/parent with lung problems.  

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Five Vancouver Whitecaps players, Real Salt Lake defender Nedum Onuoha opt out of MLS is Back Tournament

Vancouver Whitecaps FC will be shorthanded for the MLS is Back Tournament, as five players will not be participating in the tournament. Forwards Lucas Cavallini, Tosaint Ricketts and Fredy Montero are among the five — along with Andy Rose and Georges Mukumbilwa.

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Posted (edited)

The great thing about Cavallini is that he speaks his mind: his most recent interview on TSN  Vancover radio is definitely worth the listen.

Edited by BearcatSA

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Posted (edited)
On 7/4/2020 at 9:57 PM, Bison44 said:

Seriously?  You are playing how did this spread so fast??  The guy who was telling us to get back to reality?? Not to believe the talking heads pushing fear agendas??  

 One guy gets it.. maybe he was having a americano at his local coffee shop, then hangs out a little too close to the other players during stretching, or sprints, showers, bus rides, flights etc and he infects 10 other guys before he even knows he has it.  This seems perfectly reasonable and is exactly why most people have been so worried about this spreading like wildfire if uncontrolled.  And you might not be worried about anyones health, I just hope none of those 10 guys has a sick kid, or a wife/parent with lung problems.  

You have 14 days to not get this. Why are you at a coffee shop now? Go to a coffee shop 2 months ago,  not now. Again it's fine cuz it's just another flu but the rules have been stated and expectations have been set. It's like getting a job that requires you to take a drug test. You may smoke weed but you dont fire up a blunt a day before you piss in a cup. Plus, Dsllas has s great residency program. Just put a team of there. Get on with it

Edited by SpursFlu

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2 hours ago, BearcatSA said:

The great thing about Cavallini is that he speaks his mind: his most recent interview on TSN  Vancover radio is definitely worth the listen.

What did he talk about? I don't think I can access the interview from overseas. TSN usually blocks all its content outside of Canada.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, SpursFlu said:

You have 14 days to not get this. Why are you at a coffee shop now? Go to a coffee shop 2 months ago,  not now. Again it's fine cuz it's just another flu but the rules have been stated and expectations have been set. It's like getting a job that requires you to take a drug test. You may smoke weed but you dont fire up a blunt a day before you piss in a cup. Plus, Dsllas has s great residency program. Just put a team of there. Get on with it

Sure...put a bunch of kids into danger in a tournament that most MLS fans don't give a crap about because they shouldn't be playing it at all.  Any player who boycotts this fiasco has my support.  

Edited by JamboAl

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