Shame on TSN and Sportsnet

[Mikmacdo]

34 minutes ago, Obinna said:

I recall in a Caldwell/KJ podcast that both men were saying that Davies had the potential to be a solid Bundesliga winger, but a world class full back. I recall Caldwell in particular being adamant about that. He certainly got that analysis right, during a time where Dunfield and others were calling for Davies to play as a winger for Bayern and not a full back. I was on the side of Dunfield at the time.

The other thing I like about Caldwell is his dedication to Canadian soccer. I thought it was cool to see him give our coaching staff a hand. I mean, last time I checked is not a Canadian, but he is very clearly down with the cause, be it broadcasting, podcasting, coaching.

He seems like an all-around good guy as well, as does KJ and Sherman and Dunfield and many others like him. I get why people don't like Wheeler (although I do), but I don't get why some people dislike Caldwell so much. Is his analysis that bad? Does he have some personality quirks like Wheeler? Is it the Scottish accent? I am genuinely curious, because to me he seems no better or no worse than anyone else, just different.

I dislike Caldwell because hes negative towards TFC. He praises the opponents like they are bayern munich. I also cant understand half of what he is saying because his accent is so thick. Wheels annoys the shit out of me too. KJ seems like a great guy and was awesome on TV. 

[Obinna]

6 minutes ago, Mikmacdo said:

I dislike Caldwell because hes negative towards TFC. He praises the opponents like they are bayern munich. I also cant understand half of what he is saying because his accent is so thick. Wheels annoys the shit out of me too. KJ seems like a great guy and was awesome on TV. 

Thanks, I never noticed this either. There must be some truth to it if more than one person feels he is harsh towards Canadian/TFC players. Perhaps not being a Canadian he is just being honest in our flaws and doesn't wear red coloured glasses like the rest of us? I agree his accent can be hard to understand, but I got use to it and can understand him fine now.

[Mikmacdo]

3 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Thanks, I never noticed this either. There must be some truth to it if more than one person feels he is harsh towards Canadian/TFC players. Perhaps not being a Canadian he is just being honest in our flaws and doesn't wear red coloured glasses like the rest of us? I agree his accent can be hard to understand, but I got use to it and can understand him fine now.

They should really have a Canadian voice calling games for TFC. I'm fine with Wileman as the play by play guy by to have a British and Scottish duo is just odd. 

[Obinna]

10 minutes ago, Mikmacdo said:

They should really have a Canadian voice calling games for TFC. I'm fine with Wileman as the play by play guy by to have a British and Scottish duo is just odd. 

You mean two British guys

I do know what you mean though, in all seriousness. It's just never bothered me personally. Wileman is Canadian enough for me, I guess. Much easier to understand

I guess the other thing is that Caldwell is a former captain of the club. I like having a broadcaster who use to be on the field for the team he is commentating on. I see it more in that way than where he is from.

Dunfield never captained the side, but he's a former player for the club. He's done some broadcasting. Maybe he'd be a better choice?

Edited February 5, 2021 by Obinna

[Bison44]

Agree with all above on Caldwell, been saying this for years.  But the useless part is more directed at KJ being useful, an actual reporter, he does interviews, pieces at halftime breaking down strategy that are smart and informative.  Caldwell may care just as much about CDN soccer, and may help with coaching..well then go be a coach.  The color half of the team doesnt need to be a player.  KJ brings more to the table, better communicator of the game, he has an accent but is understandable (my brother in law is Scottish so I can decypher it but its more his montone droning).  Maybe Caldwell is a part timer and KJ is a full time big salary etc and thats why they let him go, but everything else being equal, I would rather have Dunfield, Wheels, Dolan, Forrest, Dasovich, DGZ, KJ etc etc.  

[El Diego]

I always wondered if KJ could be like a consultant for a club or NT. My tinpot theory is that his ideas actually influence Herdman through Caldwell.

[Obinna]

9 minutes ago, Bison44 said:

Agree with all above on Caldwell, been saying this for years.  But the useless part is more directed at KJ being useful, an actual reporter, he does interviews, pieces at halftime breaking down strategy that are smart and informative.  Caldwell may care just as much about CDN soccer, and may help with coaching..well then go be a coach.  The color half of the team doesnt need to be a player.  KJ brings more to the table, better communicator of the game, he has an accent but is understandable (my brother in law is Scottish so I can decypher it but its more his montone droning).  Maybe Caldwell is a part timer and KJ is a full time big salary etc and thats why they let him go, but everything else being equal, I would rather have Dunfield, Wheels, Dolan, Forrest, Dasovich, DGZ, KJ etc etc.  

I don't actually think De Guzman is the best communicator. I like him, but I have always found he stumbles when he speaks, even during his interviews as a player. I find it to be distracting. Maybe he improves as he continues and gets more comfortable. He's pretty green as far as being an analyst goes.

[frmr]

I would much rather have two British guys calling Canadian MLS games. North America has just not mastered the fine art of narrating a football game yet, and maybe never will. Canadian broadcasts are better than American at least, I absolutely cannot stand a stereotypical American broadcaster calling a game and trying to make every little play sound exciting, talking a mile a minute. Football games can be slow and ponderous and the commentary needs to reflect that sometimes. And as a beautiful game, there needs to some elements of poetry in its description which the British are very good at. Canadians/Americans, not so much.

[Kent]

KJ is awesome, I'm sad he got let go. He'll get another job before too long I'm sure, I hope it's in Canada. Reunited with James Sharman perhaps???

As for the Britishness of TSN soccer coverage, I don't mind it so much during the game with Wileman and Caldwell calling a game, but I swear there have been times when they have had 4 British dudes on the panel talking at halftime. It's a bit much. I can't think of who the 4th person would have been, but it is at least very common to have Wileman, KJ, and Caldwell on a panel together, whether during a game or Sportscentre.

What are people's thoughts on Kelcey Brade? I think he is solid and I like that he is (presumably) Canadian and it isn't just a wall of English and Scottish accents when he is on screen. Other non-Brits on TSN that I have enjoyed, Dunfield is OK, Karina LeBlanc, Andy Petrillo (now with OneSoccer of course), and Clare Rustad.

KJ is definitely the best at breaking down plays as far as my non-tactical brain can tell.

[Kent]

46 minutes ago, frmr said:

I would much rather have two British guys calling Canadian MLS games. North America has just not mastered the fine art of narrating a football game yet, and maybe never will. Canadian broadcasts are better than American at least, I absolutely cannot stand a stereotypical American broadcaster calling a game and trying to make every little play sound exciting, talking a mile a minute. Football games can be slow and ponderous and the commentary needs to reflect that sometimes. And as a beautiful game, there needs to some elements of poetry in its description which the British are very good at. Canadians/Americans, not so much.

Re: Americans. I hate Lalas and Twellman very, very, much. I'm not sure I can name any other Americans, but there aren't others that bother me. I don't even mind that "It's in the net!" guy, but I only ever hear him on MLS highlights.

[dyslexic nam]

I have never heard a Canadian or a American sports commentator use the terms “serendipitous”, “mercurial”, or “effervescent”.  The same cannot be said for English soccer commentators.   

[narduch]

I would support TSN hiring Ray Hudson. 

[Lansdude]

Just now, dyslexic nam said:

I have never heard a Canadian or a American sports commentator use the terms “serendipitous”, “mercurial”, or “effervescent”.  The same cannot be said for English soccer commentators.   

"Acrimonious", "histrionics", imperious", "Paris Saint-Germain are seen in Europe as nouveau-riche", etc.

I hate American announcers. They all do that annoying Bob Costas thing where they nasally, artificially deepen their voice. I don't know who started that but it's a cancer on sports commentary.

[Obinna]

13 minutes ago, Kent said:

KJ is awesome, I'm sad he got let go. He'll get another job before too long I'm sure, I hope it's in Canada. Reunited with James Sharman perhaps???

As for the Britishness of TSN soccer coverage, I don't mind it so much during the game with Wileman and Caldwell calling a game, but I swear there have been times when they have had 4 British dudes on the panel talking at halftime. It's a bit much. I can't think of who the 4th person would have been, but it is at least very common to have Wileman, KJ, and Caldwell on a panel together, whether during a game or Sportscentre.

What are people's thoughts on Kelcey Brade? I think he is solid and I like that he is (presumably) Canadian and it isn't just a wall of English and Scottish accents when he is on screen. Other non-Brits on TSN that I have enjoyed, Dunfield is OK, Karina LeBlanc, Andy Petrillo (now with OneSoccer of course), and Clare Rustad.

KJ is definitely the best at breaking down plays as far as my non-tactical brain can tell.

Thumbs up for me.

Don't know a lot about him but he seems like he was a "converted" soccer broadcaster, if you know what I mean. Does anyone know it that's the case?

Either way, I like the cut of his jib. Seems newish to the sport and I find that refreshing. 

Of course this post will look silly if he was a soccer guy all along, but that's not my impression.

[Yohan]

9 minutes ago, narduch said:

I would support TSN hiring Ray Hudson. 

Hudson... he's so overdramatic that it's ridiculous.
I swear he's secretly fapping under the broadcast table cuz he sounds like he's orgasming whenever a goal goes in

[LeoH037]

Hudson is cringe, as are the majority of American commentators... they try to narrate a soccer game as if it was a North American sport, if that makes sense.

[costarg]

19 hours ago, Dominic94 said:

At a time when soccer is picking up in Canada this is a bizarre move.

maybe that's why.  they don't want to see soccer pickup.  its not ideal for commercial breaks, remember the world cups and euros a few years back that actually went to commercial breaks *during games* ?

Edited February 5, 2021 by costarg

[Kent]

3 minutes ago, costarg said:

maybe that's why.  they don't want to see soccer pickup.  its not ideal for commercial breaks, remember the world cups and euros a few years back that actually went to commercial breaks *during games* a few years ago?

By "a few years ago" do you mean, over 30 years ago? 1994 had the advent of the picture in picture style commercials, and I don't think I have seen commercial breaks during play since. So I think the last World Cup with "proper" commercial breaks would be 1990, but I don't think I watched that one, certainly not much if I did catch bits of it.

[Kent]

25 minutes ago, Obinna said:

Thumbs up for me.

Don't know a lot about him but he seems like he was a "converted" soccer broadcaster, if you know what I mean. Does anyone know it that's the case?

Either way, I like the cut of his jib. Seems newish to the sport and I find that refreshing. 

Of course this post will look silly if he was a soccer guy all along, but that's not my impression.

I assume by "converted" you mean a sports guy who then got assigned a soccer job? I don't get that impression. When you talk like that I think of guys like Vic Rauter and Gerry Dobson. I feel like Brade probably grew up with at least a functional understanding of the game and knowledge of World Soccer. Not a former player, or an aspiring coach, or as hardcore as people on this board, but a guy that knows the difference between Manchester United and Manchester City, watched World Cups and probably a decent amount of pro games growing up, probably played for a decent number of years maybe even at a decent level for an amateur, and has an appreciation of the sport even if perhaps a bit on the casual side.

Guys like Rauter and Dobson on the other hand, I feel like they were briefed on the rules moments before their first broadcast, and never ever played an organized game.

[El Diego]

I'm ok with Brade. I like the concept of a straight man, who just asks the questions and reports the facts. You need a moderator type who doesn't have an opinion for flow. So long as he gets the pronunciations right and shows a bit of enthusiasm, then I think that's all you need for that role.

[red card]

Caldwell being viewed as TFC and/or Canada negative is our bias showing. American MLS fans regularly pick the TSN crew in the top 3. Main reason why? They're not homers like nearly every American MLS broadcast crew.

But TSN soccer broadcast crews have been way too British. It's especially obvious during men's World Cup/Euro coverage - other than bringing in an ESPN analyst of American/Balkan origin for a few days, they have had no perspective of any other football culture. Given the sport's global footprint, Canada's demographics and TSN covering World Cup/Euros for a number of cycles, this is a glaring flaw.

Sportsnet has only been a bit better with having Dichio and also Serioux for a few cameo appearances. 

So, if JDG continues to show up on TSN, it is an improvement. But KJ was the best (and maybe only) tactical football mind in the Canadian media (you may know him for his Formation Geek segments on the Score). So, hopefully, we see him on OneSoccer panel and pre/post match shows.

[Shway]

1 hour ago, El Diego said:

I'm ok with Brade. I like the concept of a straight man, who just asks the questions and reports the facts. You need a moderator type who doesn't have an opinion for flow. So long as he gets the pronunciations right and shows a bit of enthusiasm, then I think that's all you need for that role.

fack no. Kelcey is horrible. He's absolutely clueless in regard to the sport. I hate how it seems like he's always unsure of what hes saying - reality it he probably is if he's not referring to his notes. 

[Kadenge]

2 hours ago, dyslexic nam said:

I have never heard a Canadian or a American sports commentator use the terms “serendipitous”, “mercurial”, or “effervescent”.  The same cannot be said for English soccer commentators.   

"Audacious"...I recall watching a  Leicester game and just as Ndidi took a long range shot at goal that hit the back of the net,  commentator quote " Ndidi......yes he did"

 

[Obinna]

2 hours ago, Kent said:

I assume by "converted" you mean a sports guy who then got assigned a soccer job? I don't get that impression. When you talk like that I think of guys like Vic Rauter and Gerry Dobson. I feel like Brade probably grew up with at least a functional understanding of the game and knowledge of World Soccer. Not a former player, or an aspiring coach, or as hardcore as people on this board, but a guy that knows the difference between Manchester United and Manchester City, watched World Cups and probably a decent amount of pro games growing up, probably played for a decent number of years maybe even at a decent level for an amateur, and has an appreciation of the sport even if perhaps a bit on the casual side.

Guys like Rauter and Dobson on the other hand, I feel like they were briefed on the rules moments before their first broadcast, and never ever played an organized game.

Yup. that's exactly what I meant. Maybe he played some house league or something growing up, but he doesn't strike me as someone who's ever played the game at a competitive level, Like Wheeler who played in CIS for Western Ontario. 

I like him though. @El Diego put it well, he's a straight man who keeps things flowing. He servers a purpose for sure. 

[El Diego]

1 hour ago, Shway said:

fack no. Kelcey is horrible. He's absolutely clueless in regard to the sport. I hate how it seems like he's always unsure of what hes saying - reality it he probably is if he's not referring to his notes. 

My expectations for him are pretty low, but maybe I'm misremembering 🤷‍♂️