Gold Cup 2021

[Obinna]

4 hours ago, Floortom said:

Despite the shadiness of the Qatar regime this is good move. Brings some money to Concacaf and Qatar is a pretty good team (half a level above us and right there with CR and USA).

They are definitely underrated, but I don't think I would put them "right there" with the USA. That seems like a bit of a stretch. Despite Qatar winning the last Asian cup (in the middle east), they are still below Japan and Korea, two teams roughly on the level of the Americans.

Are they roughly the same level as Costa Rica? Probably. I think we would give them a stern test. I would like to face them.

[Colliedor]

They already had to reschedule the WCQ matches in a all ready tight deadline and we have no idea what the future holds. Part of me thinks this won't even happen.

[lamptern]

My guts tell me there would be 3 stage tournament in bubbles if no vaccine available before next summer.

[Alex]

So they reduced the number of qualification spots from 4 to 3 with the addition of Qatar, I just hope Montserrat doesn’t get screwed again, I could see them finishing fourth! They lost out of the gold cup on goal differential the first time after Barbados had to forfeit a game 3-0. 

[MtlMario]

I was never a fan of having guest nations. As Kent mentioned before what if they should win? How would that look? I just don't see the point of having another country from another confederation playing in ours. Let our nations play in it.

Edited September 3, 2020 by MtlMario

[Obinna]

2 hours ago, MtlMario said:

I was never a fan of having guest nations. As Kent mentioned before what if they should win? How would that look? I just don't see the point of having another country from another confederation playing in ours. Let our nations play in it.

I can relate to that. Part of me feels that way. Let concacaf be for concacaf, you know?

On the other hand, it ups the standard of the tournament. I would be less thrilled if Brazil or Argentina was a guest. You don't want a guest to be a favorite. It would be weird. Qatar are in the sweet spot.

That part of me that likes it is curious to see how they fare. If they don't get out of the group stage, can we say concacaf is better than asia? No....but I will say it anyways 😁 

[CanadianSoccerFan]

I feel that if they want to have guest teams they should make it a different tournament and call it something else.  Have the normal Gold Cup (CONCACAF only) the year after the World Cup and then hold a different tournament with guest teams.  If they have this "partnership" with the Asian Confederation then just create a Pacific Cup with an Asia vs CONCACAF theme.  

[Watchmen]

On 9/3/2020 at 4:26 PM, CanadianSoccerFan said:

I feel that if they want to have guest teams they should make it a different tournament and call it something else.  Have the normal Gold Cup (CONCACAF only) the year after the World Cup and then hold a different tournament with guest teams.  If they have this "partnership" with the Asian Confederation then just create a Pacific Cup with an Asia vs CONCACAF theme.  

I think the partnership that's going to (eventually) form is with CONMEBOL.  They've tried it once, with decent success. Rotate it between confederations (none of this "always in the US" crap), and I think you'd have a fairly entertaining (and financially lucrative) tournament.

[xabuep2]

Some news of the 2021 Gold Cup: there will be VAR and the matches of the last group phase will be played simultaneously:

 

 http://www.jamaicaobserver.com/sports/new-moves-aim-to-add-suspense-unpredictability-to-gold-cup-montagliani-guest-qatar-will-add-flavour-to-expanded-tournament-platform-adds-concacaf-boss_202614?profile=1511

[Kent]

Yay to the last group games being simultaneous, but boo to VAR. I am sure lots of people will be pleased but this is a net negative for me.

[Watchmen]

1 hour ago, Kent said:

Yay to the last group games being simultaneous, but boo to VAR. I am sure lots of people will be pleased but this is a net negative for me.

As always, I think it depends how VAR is used.  I thought it was used really well at the last World Cup.  I think it's been used poorly (or at least been inconsistent) in a lot of leagues since.

[Kent]

10 hours ago, Watchmen said:

As always, I think it depends how VAR is used.  I thought it was used really well at the last World Cup.  I think it's been used poorly (or at least been inconsistent) in a lot of leagues since.

For me it doesn’t matter how it is used. Part of the problem for me is getting more offside goals scored (that eventually don’t count) even when the refs assistant knows it is offside because they wait for the play to pan out just in case. Or when a goal is scored and you aren’t sure if you can cheer yet because it might be reviewed. Or the lame secondary cheer when the ref is done reviewing and indicates that yes it is in fact a goal.

Add to that the inherent problems with correcting subjective calls or nit picking offside calls and I am not a fan.

I do like goalline technology though. Remember back in the day when it took years for goalline technology to get approval because FIFA insisted that it be instantaneous? Now they are fine with minutes going by for video reviews.

[SkuseisLoose]

I don't like VAR either but for slightly different reasons. I personally prefer the human error in the game rather than some computer precision down to a couple millimetres. And in the past it would have benefited us to have it i.e. Atiba's goal vs the USA in 2007 but there's also been times where we've benefited from it not existing. Yeah it's annoying when the call doesn't go our way, but I find that a lot better than a stoppage after every goal because the player was potentially offside because he wears size 12 cleats.

[Watchmen]

10 hours ago, Kent said:

For me it doesn’t matter how it is used. Part of the problem for me is getting more offside goals scored (that eventually don’t count) even when the refs assistant knows it is offside because they wait for the play to pan out just in case. Or when a goal is scored and you aren’t sure if you can cheer yet because it might be reviewed. Or the lame secondary cheer when the ref is done reviewing and indicates that yes it is in fact a goal.

Add to that the inherent problems with correcting subjective calls or nit picking offside calls and I am not a fan.

I do like goalline technology though. Remember back in the day when it took years for goalline technology to get approval because FIFA insisted that it be instantaneous? Now they are fine with minutes going by for video reviews.

A bunch of this happens, even without VAR though.  We've all been at a game, cheering wildly only to then notice the linemen's flag up for offside. But, a change I'd like to see: the ref can only review the play "in real time".  No slowing down the replay to see if he was a millimetre offside. It would catch the obvious calls (oh, you're 5 feet offside and the linesmen missed it somehow?  Busted.) but would cut down on the length of the delays.

[Kent]

31 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

A bunch of this happens, even without VAR though.  We've all been at a game, cheering wildly only to then notice the linemen's flag up for offside. But, a change I'd like to see: the ref can only review the play "in real time".  No slowing down the replay to see if he was a millimetre offside. It would catch the obvious calls (oh, you're 5 feet offside and the linesmen missed it somehow?  Busted.) but would cut down on the length of the delays.

I was acknowledging that it happens sometimes without VAR by saying there are more of these goals specifically because in addition to the cases where the ref doesn’t see it in time, there are also these cases when they let the play go and raise the flag afterwards. I believe there were a couple of those goals in a recent game, but I have already forgotten if it was Montreal v Vancouver or Montreal v Toronto.

But maybe I am biased because when I am at the stadium I have a habit of glancing at the refs assistant when the goal is scored if I have any doubt.

I do prefer your solution about replaying it in real time over what we have, but I still don’t like it as much as no video review. I’ve gone through most of my reasons why I am against VAR and will leave it at that.

[Obinna]

1 hour ago, SkuseisLoose said:

I don't like VAR either but for slightly different reasons. I personally prefer the human error in the game rather than some computer precision down to a couple millimetres. And in the past it would have benefited us to have it i.e. Atiba's goal vs the USA in 2007 but there's also been times where we've benefited from it not existing. Yeah it's annoying when the call doesn't go our way, but I find that a lot better than a stoppage after every goal because the player was potentially offside because he wears size 12 cleats.

This is precisely how I feel. Computer precision on offside is incredibly ridiculous. That bothers me more than anything. Being offside by a literal whisker is not an unfair advantage. Goal line technology is fine, VAR is great for things like upgrading/downgrading fouls after the fact, but offside and handball are problematic. But yes, if the player is a mile offside and it's missed, call it back. We want to correct the clear and obvious. 

[xabuep2]

Look how "random" will be the draw of the 2021 Gold Cup on September 28:

Pot 1 is pre-seeded:  Mexico in A, USA in B . Qatar is in Pot 4 in group D to avoid the Manitos and the yankees. If the USA and Mexico win all their matches, they will be seen in the final.

 https://www.goldcup.org/en/article/concacaf-announces-details-for-first-ever-gold-cup-draw

Edited September 18, 2020 by xabuep2

[jtpc]

September 28th at 8 pm ET it is. It's nice we'll be able to watch it on One Soccer.

So now that we know Mexico is in Group A, the US is in Group B, Costa Rica is in Group C, and Honduras and Qatar are in Group D, we can see who collides with 1A in the knockout stage according to the tournament bracket.

In the QF, 1A plays 2D, so if we're drawn into Group D, it would be best to win it.

In the SF, 1A plays the winner of 1C vs. 2B.

If you want to be on the US side of the knockout stage bracket and potentially avoid Mexico until the final, the best positions after the group stage are: 2A (get drawn into Mexico's group and finish 2nd), 1B (win the United States' group), 2C (finish 2nd in Costa Rica's group), or 1D (win the group with Honduras and Qatar).

[SkuseisLoose]

15 hours ago, xabuep2 said:

Look how "random" will be the draw of the 2021 Gold Cup on September 28:

Pot 1 is pre-seeded:  Mexico in A, USA in B . Qatar is in Pot 4 in group D to avoid the Manitos and the yankees. If the USA and Mexico win all their matches, they will be seen in the final.

 https://www.goldcup.org/en/article/concacaf-announces-details-for-first-ever-gold-cup-draw

They haven’t done the draw yet, have they, so Qatar isn’t in group d or am I wrong?

Edited September 19, 2020 by SkuseisLoose

[SthMelbRed]

1 hour ago, SkuseisLoose said:

They haven’t done the draw yet, have they, so Qatar isn’t in group d or am I wrong?

Looks like Mexico is locked in Group A, USA is locked in Group B, Costa Rica is locked in Group C, and Honduras and Qatar are locked in Group D. The other teams will be randomly drawn, based on the pots.

[Shway]

10 hours ago, SkuseisLoose said:

They haven’t done the draw yet, have they, so Qatar isn’t in group d or am I wrong?

Read the small print in the bottom right corner. 
they are put into group D to allow them full rest time from Copa America.

[johnyb]

Group D would be interesting. Best chance to finish first and probably best chance to miss advancing at the same time. Group C looks like the best bet for advancing and going deep.

[Kent]

The draw is about to happen on OneSoccer. 15 minutes into the show already.

[jtpc]

A nice draw for Montserrat in the qualification tournament. If they're successful against Trinidad and Tobago, they would avoid Haiti and Guatemala, and play the winner of Cuba and French Guiana to be one of the final 3 teams to qualify.

[Alex]

1 minute ago, jtpc said:

A nice draw for Montserrat in the qualification tournament. If they're successful against Trinidad and Tobago, they would avoid Haiti and Guatemala, and play the winner of Cuba and French Guiana to be one of the final 3 teams to qualify.

I’d like to know what happens if Trinidad are still suspended. A bye for Montserrat?