The Road to Qatar.

[dyslexic nam]

Interesting comments by Herdman on “the road to Qatar”...

 

https://aftn.ca/herdman-admits-to-shock-and-frustration-at-new-concacaf-world-cup-qualifying-criteria/

[CanadaFan123]

35 minutes ago, dyslexic nam said:

Interesting comments by Herdman on “the road to Qatar”...

 

https://aftn.ca/herdman-admits-to-shock-and-frustration-at-new-concacaf-world-cup-qualifying-criteria/

I’m sorry, but what? Herdman is supposed to be the man on top of everything and focused on details is he not?  Probably should have thought this one out better.

[SthMelbRed]

4 hours ago, king1010 said:

If FIFA Rankings are the only  acceptable way to seed teams for WCQ then CONCACAF really needs to somehow address allowing non FIFA members into Gold Cup and Nations League. There just isn't a level playing field if teams are playing one maybe two games a tournament against non FIFA opponents. 

I'd like to see non-FIFA members removed from CONCACAF official competitions. Either throw off the colonial shackles and be a nation on your own, at least for football purposes, or stand down and stick to being a provincial outpost for the French/Dutch.

[dyslexic nam]

22 minutes ago, SthMelbRed said:

I'd like to see non-FIFA members removed from CONCACAF official competitions. Either throw off the colonial shackles and be a nation on your own, at least for football purposes, or stand down and stick to being a provincial outpost for the French/Dutch.

It does seem odd that they can be official enough to be recognized by CONCACAF as a legit footy nation, but not official enough to be treated that way by FIFA. 

[BrennanFan]

Herdman: “Then, at the same time, we weren’t taking FIFA games in those windows because our priority was to gather those ranking points."

Absolute hot garbage. Every other Concacaf team was playing friendlies in those windows as well, to gain FIFA points, to get better, because every serious team always plays two games in a FIFA window. We sat idle. We cheaped out. And we got screwed in the end.  

We are not victims of circumstance, we are the authors of our own misfortune.

Edited August 30, 2019 by BrennanFan

[RS]

2 hours ago, CanadaFan123 said:

I’m sorry, but what? Herdman is supposed to be the man on top of everything and focused on details is he not?  Probably should have thought this one out better.

Kinda hard to plan for being given incorrect info.

[RS]

57 minutes ago, BrennanFan said:

We are not victims of circumstance, we are the authors of our own misfortune.

Why not both?

[BrennanFan]

32 minutes ago, RS said:

Why not both?

Bc deciding to only play minnows while avoiding competitive friendlies should not be acceptable for any national program under any circumstances.  

Edited August 30, 2019 by BrennanFan

[Bison44]

1 hour ago, RS said:

Kinda hard to plan for being given incorrect info.

Ok, so you play it cute and maximize your CONCACAF points, that doesnt mean you skip everything else.  Stop playing friendlies like the only reason you played them was for FIFA rankings and they dont matter anymore.  Ooops, it still matters and we look like idiots.  Dont try and wriggle your way out of this one Herdman, you got entirely too cute, thought you were smarter than everyone else and it bit you on the ass big time.  Take your lumps.  

[kacbru]

Seems like a worrying trend with Herdman. 3D chess didn't work out for us at the gold cup either.  

[MtlMario]

12 hours ago, dyslexic nam said:

It does seem odd that they can be official enough to be recognized by CONCACAF as a legit footy nation, but not official enough to be treated that way by FIFA. 

I read somewhere that FIFA was thinking about giving points for games involving the so called non FIFA nations. Sorry don't remember where reading it.

[RJB]

https://www.mlssoccer.com/post/2019/08/29/canada-target-perfect-nations-league-campaign-world-cup-hopes

[CanadaFan123]

2 hours ago, MtlMario said:

I read somewhere that FIFA was thinking about giving points for games involving the so called non FIFA nations. Sorry don't remember where reading it.

Surely in official matches at least?!  Even if you ranked them as a 120 ranked team it still beats a useless match.

11 hours ago, Bison44 said:

Ok, so you play it cute and maximize your CONCACAF points, that doesnt mean you skip everything else.  Stop playing friendlies like the only reason you played them was for FIFA rankings and they dont matter anymore.  Ooops, it still matters and we look like idiots.  Dont try and wriggle your way out of this one Herdman, you got entirely too cute, thought you were smarter than everyone else and it bit you on the ass big time.  Take your lumps.  

Exactly this.  It’s like going into Honduras playing for a draw.  Naive.

[Stouffvillain]

I could be completely wrong but I thought the whole point of the Nations League was to eliminate meaningless friendlies and replace them with meaningful games against regional opponents while sorting out the tiers of nations for WCQ. 

Now you've forced countries into trying to fit friendlies into international windows on top of the Nations League matches.  Doesn't this now devalue the Nations League?  Why would you want to do well in Nations League if friendlies can get you to the WC?

International football really sucks, stupidity like this turns me off.  Glad the CPL is here and I can turn my spare time to that instead of this garbage. 

[RJB]

41 minutes ago, Stouffvillain said:

I could be completely wrong but I thought the whole point of the Nations League was to eliminate meaningless friendlies and replace them with meaningful games against regional opponents while sorting out the tiers of nations for WCQ. 

Now you've forced countries into trying to fit friendlies into international windows on top of the Nations League matches.  Doesn't this now devalue the Nations League?  Why would you want to do well in Nations League if friendlies can get you to the WC?

International football really sucks, stupidity like this turns me off.  Glad the CPL is here and I can turn my spare time to that instead of this garbage. 

The Nations League was created in part to provide more meaningful games to the lower ranked associations.  But now WCQ is being used for that.  I think this format is going to be a disaster.  Entertaining and intense, but a disaster nonetheless.

 

[BrennanFan]

8 hours ago, kacbru said:

Seems like a worrying trend with Herdman. 3D chess didn't work out for us at the gold cup either.  

I like the 3D chess description of Herdman's style. 

Like why he didn't make our third sub against Haiti.  Waiting for extra time that didn't materialize in the end.

Managing minutes through the tournament so players would be fresh for a a semi final we didn't make.

[Bison44]

38 minutes ago, BrennanFan said:

I like the 3D chess description of Herdman's style. 

Like why he didn't make our third sub against Haiti.  Waiting for extra time that didn't materialize in the end.

Managing minutes through the tournament so players would be fresh for a a semi final we didn't make.

And the "not tipping his hand" against mexico for the remach that never happened.  

[RS]

On 8/29/2019 at 11:33 PM, BrennanFan said:

Bc deciding to only play minnows while avoiding competitive friendlies should not be acceptable for any national program under any circumstances.  

It’s entirely valid to acknowledge that Canada (and a handful of other countries) did indeed get screwed by the system while also acknowledging that it’s silly to not play friendlies for the purposes of team cohesion / testing new players / etc.

One does not beget the other, so again I ask: Why not both?

[jtpc]

According to ELO, Panama has 4 home friendlies scheduled during November, which is in addition to their one Nations League match in November against Mexico. The home friendlies are against Nicaragua, Bolivia, the UAE, and Suriname.

I guess they figure they had to do that since they're in Mexico's Nations League group, so they're looking at a scenario where they might only earn points from 2 matches with Bermuda. Honduras is in a group with Martinique, so in the group stage at least, the only points they can earn come from 2 matches with Trinidad and Tobago. If Montserrat can give El Salvador a run for their money again like they did in Nations League Qualifying, that could be massively helpful for us. I know we have 2 matches against Cuba first, but I'm really getting excited for our home match against the US on October 15th.

[BrennanFan]

14 hours ago, RS said:

It’s entirely valid to acknowledge that Canada (and a handful of other countries) did indeed get screwed by the system while also acknowledging that it’s silly to not play friendlies for the purposes of team cohesion / testing new players / etc.

One does not beget the other, so again I ask: Why not both?

If we'd been responsible and played friendlies, won those friendlies and improved our FIFA ranking, we could have avoided getting screwed. 

I don't believe our current predicament was inevitable. The CSA tried to get away with doing the absolute bare minimum and got burned in the end. Thus whether the CSA was in fact screwed by Concacaf becomes a matter of perspective. In these circumstances, they'll get no sympathy from me. 

[apbsmith]

4 hours ago, jtpc said:

According to ELO, Panama has 4 home friendlies scheduled during November, which is in addition to their one Nations League match in November against Mexico. The home friendlies are against Nicaragua, Bolivia, the UAE, and Suriname.

 

Not surprised, the president of Panama's federation  publicly stated they will do everything in the federation's power to play as many friendlies as possible and do whatever it takes to ensure they make the top 6.

All 4 of those friendlies are winnable games (briefcase full of $ or no briefcase full of $). Conspiracy theory joke aside, I see it as 3 wins and 1 draw at worse for Panama in those 4 friendlies.

Edited August 31, 2019 by apbsmith

[nolando]

5 hours ago, apbsmith said:

Not surprised, the president of Panama's federation  publicly stated they will do everything in the federation's power to play as many friendlies as possible and do whatever it takes to ensure they make the top 6.

All 4 of those friendlies are winnable games (briefcase full of $ or no briefcase full of $). Conspiracy theory joke aside, I see it as 3 wins and 1 draw at worse for Panama in those 4 friendlies.

Crazy and true. Here's an article in Spanish quoting the same....

Ahora se está jugando por puntos, es como una liga. Panamá tiene que buscar rivales para conseguir puntos en amistosos", apuntó Stempel.  

 

 www.elgrafico.com/amp/selecciones/Stempel-Creo-que-Panama-puede-alcanzar-a-El-Salvador-en-el-ranking-de-FIFA-20190809-0001.html

Why are we so slow to the uptake? I don't get it...

[Kent]

On 8/31/2019 at 4:53 PM, apbsmith said:

Not surprised, the president of Panama's federation  publicly stated they will do everything in the federation's power to play as many friendlies as possible and do whatever it takes to ensure they make the top 6.

All 4 of those friendlies are winnable games (briefcase full of $ or no briefcase full of $). Conspiracy theory joke aside, I see it as 3 wins and 1 draw at worse for Panama in those 4 friendlies.

They are playing 2 teams ranked lower than them, and 2 ranked higher (although Bolivia is only 1 spot above them) and you think the worst case scenario is 1 draw?

Side question, I just looked up their schedule on wikipedia (I know, I know) to see if all these friendlies are at home or something, and the UAE game is the only one that shows up on their schedule. Are we sure the other friendlies are official friendlies that are worth FIFA ranking points?

[apbsmith]

4 hours ago, Kent said:

They are playing 2 teams ranked lower than them, and 2 ranked higher (although Bolivia is only 1 spot above them) and you think the worst case scenario is 1 draw?

Side question, I just looked up their schedule on wikipedia (I know, I know) to see if all these friendlies are at home or something, and the UAE game is the only one that shows up on their schedule. Are we sure the other friendlies are official friendlies that are worth FIFA ranking points?

Yes, I do, Panama is a VERY VERY GOOD home team ( hence Auto-qualifying to the WC last year as top 3 in hex).

The 4 November friendlies are: Nicaragua, Bolivia, UAE, Suriname.  To be honest, I think they go 4-0-0, but I hope I am wrong. The games are all in Panama and much more important to Panama. I think Bolivia and/or UAE brings some of their B team, which only helps Panama get the result.  UAE's fifa ranking is currently inflated IMO, Panama is a much stronger team, especially at home.

I prefer using ELO to confirm fixtures https://www.eloratings.net/fixtures  (you can CTRL+F and search Panama)

According to ELO, Panama have 6 home friendlies to close out 2019 ( 1 september, 1 october, 4 in november). We really want Mexico to beat them in both Nation League games because there is a very good chance Panama goes 6-0-0 in their home friendlies. I think one of countless reasons Panama have scheduled so many friendlies is that they are anticipating to take the point hit vs Mexico.

Cheers.

 

[jtpc]

El Salvador has an interesting quirk in their Nations League schedule. After opening at home against Saint Lucia this Saturday, they play 3 away matches in a row, September 10th in the Dominican Republic, October 12th in Montserrat, and October 15th in Saint Lucia. All of their away games in League B, Group B, will be done by the time the October FIFA rankings come out. You'd think that El Salvador's ranking would be a bit more vulnerable in the short-term with all the upcoming away matches, so hopefully we can make up some of the current +30 point differential that separates us. October could be quite an exciting window knowing that El Salvador has 2 away matches and we have our home match against the US.