canuckgbp Posted May 7, 2023 Share Posted May 7, 2023 27 minutes ago, costarg said: Wow, really? That's a new take on defending TFC management to the death. What power does a 18 year old under contract have to force a move? Can you give an example of someone who successfully managed what you propose? I’m not defending TFC. And especially not to the death… He has seen how TFC has treated similar players with potential in the past. Okello is a good example. Wolfsburg sniffing around around age 17/18, (if memory serves) doesn’t get sold. Continues with TFC and suddenly he is 22, going on 23 and all he can really say is he has potential. JMR signed with the first team in January 2020. I’m bringing up his contract because it may not have a lot of time left on it. Unless he has re-upped recently but I haven’t seen news on that. So he should have bargaining room in the future. So back off when you say I am defending TFC management, because I can assure you I am not. Loans are common. If he isn’t playing regularly then get a move. That would also help TFC with a transfer in the future if he performs while on loan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominic94 Posted May 7, 2023 Share Posted May 7, 2023 His agent should have gotten him out by now like this guy is poorly advised, Barca is starting a 15 year old kid for Christ sakes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phresh Posted May 7, 2023 Share Posted May 7, 2023 10 minutes ago, Dominic94 said: His agent should have gotten him out by now like this guy is poorly advised, Barca is starting a 15 year old kid for Christ sakes. This isn't exactly true. Yamal played one game for them, and it was a 7-minute sub appearance. Nevertheless, JMR needs minutes. He's been very promising this season and the fact that his playing time is so inconsistent makes you wonder if Bob even knows what the hell he's doing with him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kadenge Posted May 7, 2023 Share Posted May 7, 2023 There is value training with the 1st team with Insigne, Bernardeschi etc to a point, but JMR has been doing that for 2+ seasons and Kosi is in his 2nd season after playing a lot last yr. They both need playing time at this stage. canuckgbp, Jack1997 and narduch 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jordan Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 Likely gets 90 Tuesday… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
costarg Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 14 hours ago, canuckgbp said: I’m not defending TFC. And especially not to the death… He has seen how TFC has treated similar players with potential in the past. Okello is a good example. Wolfsburg sniffing around around age 17/18, (if memory serves) doesn’t get sold. Continues with TFC and suddenly he is 22, going on 23 and all he can really say is he has potential. JMR signed with the first team in January 2020. I’m bringing up his contract because it may not have a lot of time left on it. Unless he has re-upped recently but I haven’t seen news on that. So he should have bargaining room in the future. So back off when you say I am defending TFC management, because I can assure you I am not. Loans are common. If he isn’t playing regularly then get a move. That would also help TFC with a transfer in the future if he performs while on loan. Yes, i agree that he "should" get a loan, move or anthing really. Ideally he never would've signed with TFC in the beginning since the list of guys they've wasted is already long. How exactly do you propose he or his agent "forces" that? He has a contract with TFC, they don't and obviously won't do anything that they feel doesn't suit their needs or wants They don't need the cash, so even selling below what they feel is worth it, won't happen. A player can't just walk out or give ultimatums. narduch 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dominic94 Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 41 minutes ago, costarg said: Yes, i agree that he "should" get a loan, move or anthing really. Ideally he never would've signed with TFC in the beginning since the list of guys they've wasted is already long. How exactly do you propose he or his agent "forces" that? He has a contract with TFC, they don't and obviously won't do anything that they feel doesn't suit their needs or wants They don't need the cash, so even selling below what they feel is worth it, won't happen. A player can't just walk out or give ultimatums. He can literally do what Larin did, leave in an option year and force a transfer by training with another club. canuckgbp 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckgbp Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 1 hour ago, costarg said: Yes, i agree that he "should" get a loan, move or anthing really. Ideally he never would've signed with TFC in the beginning since the list of guys they've wasted is already long. How exactly do you propose he or his agent "forces" that? He has a contract with TFC, they don't and obviously won't do anything that they feel doesn't suit their needs or wants They don't need the cash, so even selling below what they feel is worth it, won't happen. A player can't just walk out or give ultimatums. I assume he has 2 years left. (Could be wrong, but not sure they do more than 5 year contracts in MLS). If one is an option then he has even more sway. Depends on the details. It’s not immediate. Not literally demand this instant. This summer ask for a loan. He had a decent run last year before he got injured so this is the first noticeable stretch where questions should be asked. Thought he has been playing well, then doesn’t see the field. They moved Nelson. Similar thing can happen for JMR. It doesn’t help that TFC put a 20m price tag looming over him tho when there was interest last year. But it is up to JMR and his agent to not extend the current contract and push when it’s appropriate. That doesn’t mean become a problem or make ultimatums. There is nuance. I forget which player (not on TFC), had a one year contract with 3 additional options years? Well then you are screwed. I assume (and hope) JMR contract is better than that, though without specifics we can’t be certain. Fraser wasn’t planning, asked for a loan and got it. Then got sold. Think TFC should be way more active with this, instead of sending people to TFC 2 or riding the pine. That’s more of what I mean with the player taking onus rather than just blaming the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckgbp Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 I assume JMR and the rest on the bench aren’t being used because of trust. BB has his core and doesn’t trust the rest. Last year used youth because that’s what he had. I would think he could secure a loan move if that is the case. Training with the first team is nice but playing real minutes at a good level trumps that doesn’t it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Hombre Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 9 minutes ago, canuckgbp said: I assume JMR and the rest on the bench aren’t being used because of trust. BB has his core and doesn’t trust the rest. Last year used youth because that’s what he had. Interesting to see that after 11 games last year they had 11 points. This year they have 12. Bison44, johnyb and dyslexic nam 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckgbp Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 (edited) 7 minutes ago, El Hombre said: Interesting to see that after 11 games last year they had 11 points. This year they have 12. They let in so many goals last year that it skewed things I think. They are a lot tighter in defence this year, but as you say, similar results. Edited May 8, 2023 by canuckgbp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaFan123 Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 Absolutely insane that heads aren’t rolling at TFC. Seems to be an MLSE trend to coddle coaching/management. dyslexic nam 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozzie_the_parrot Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 Bringing in Bob Bradley would not have been cheap so he'll be given time to turn this around. If there isn't an uptick after injury issues start to clear though... johnyb 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaFan123 Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 7 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said: Bringing in Bob Bradley would not have been cheap so he'll be given time to turn this around. If there isn't an uptick after injury issues start to clear though... No doubt but bringing in the Italians cost even more. Easy decision to make at this stage. He’s lost the room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InglewoodJack Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 TFC reminds me of my golden state warriors. The owners want to win a championship and develop young talent at the same time but the coach just wants to win, so you end up with like 5 rookie contracts on your bench, the coach doesn't trust them, so he overplays the vets, they start to break down, and all of a sudden you're forced to play an 8 man lineup in decisive games, just like TFC pulling 2 subs per game. Now your 21 year old youngsters are underdeveloped, they're pissed because their peers are signing their second contract for generational money while you're stuck on the bench and they get unhappy. JMR has looked excellent in his stints this year, so don't want to write off his development already, but there has to be a serious lack of cohesive vision between BB and ownership here. BB's not keeping his job just because he developed the next great Canadian youngster, but BB can't win games by playing 2 subs every game either- he's in a difficult spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stryker911 Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 BB isn't really in a difficult spot when it comes to JMR. BB just makes baffling decisions in regards to him. When JMR started a couple games he was literally in the team of the week. This means not only was he competent, he was actually a standout. But rather than keep that going he decides he can't play at all. It is simply a rediculous decision regardless if what sport or team you are talking about. Corazon, Bertuzzi44, johnyb and 6 others 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
costarg Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 1 hour ago, InglewoodJack said: BB's not keeping his job just because he developed the next great Canadian youngster, but BB can't win games by playing 2 subs every game either- he's in a difficult spot. That's the thing, he's not in a difficult spot. BB has a great reputation and earned it. He's done some great things. Unlike a young and fresh coach, BB can just cruise and play par and not worry about needing to win to keep his job. I feel he literally does not care about the results or developping. He's just playing the simplest and most logical lineup and playing one-dimensional soccer. No changes to formation, tactics or the 11. He could just stay home and fax in his game sheet and instructions at this point. Any one of us could not do much worse with that team and budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
InglewoodJack Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 19 minutes ago, costarg said: That's the thing, he's not in a difficult spot. BB has a great reputation and earned it. He's done some great things. Unlike a young and fresh coach, BB can just cruise and play par and not worry about needing to win to keep his job. I feel he literally does not care about the results or developping. He's just playing the simplest and most logical lineup and playing one-dimensional soccer. No changes to formation, tactics or the 11. He could just stay home and fax in his game sheet and instructions at this point. Any one of us could not do much worse with that team and budget. By difficult spot, I mean that where he's at in his career and what he's accomplished, he's a coach you hire to win games, not develop players. They've got the two Italians, supposedly the 24th highest valuation in the world (lol)- these guys should be competing for hardware, and yet he's in a situation where with a few injuries, half his bench is young, undeveloped future talents, and I don't think he has any interest being part of that process. Last game, TFC needed goals, instead of going to Akinola off the bench, he goes with the 33 year old Diomande who isn't exactly lighting it up. Last win, they were up 1-0 after 46 minutes, and instead of making subs to protect the lead (or get another one), he waits until '90 to sub on JMR and Diomande to kill the clock. This is a guy who doesn't trust his bench players, doesn't seem to really trust any young players, and he's willing to stay rigid, even when the team isn't very good, instead of using his bench players. BB just seems like a coach that knows to win, you need star players and you need to surround them with smart vets. The McNaughton for Sapong trade fits this idea too, even though LMC isn't that young, but they got back a guy who's probably top 15 all time goals in MLS. I think if TFC had a way to send some of their young Canadians over to Montreal in return for Wanyama, BB would drive them to Saputo himself. FWIW, I don't fault him. He's earned the privilege to work with teams he can win with, and unfortunately, he's found himself in a situation where he doesn't have the players to do so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rydermike Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 JMR signed a six year contract. TFC has him through 2025. Dominic94, canuckgbp, jordan and 1 other 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckgbp Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 (edited) 27 minutes ago, rydermike said: JMR signed a six year contract. TFC has him through 2025. Do you know if any of those are option years? Edited May 8, 2023 by canuckgbp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PopePouri Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 1 hour ago, rydermike said: JMR signed a six year contract. TFC has him through 2025. Good move from them if they want to make bank on him. johnyb 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rydermike Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 (edited) 3 hours ago, canuckgbp said: Do you know if any of those are option years? No idea, but even if they are, it's not like TFC would choose to not exercise them. He's on less than 150k. Even if they sold him for even just $1 million, it'd still be an overall net profit. So basically he's with TFC until 2025 or until sold. So hopefully the latter soon, or actually start playing him more than once a month Edited May 8, 2023 by rydermike canuckgbp 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bison44 Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 3 hours ago, InglewoodJack said: FWIW, I don't fault him. He's earned the privilege to work with teams he can win with, and unfortunately, he's found himself in a situation where he doesn't have the players to do so. Its not unfortunate, he did it himself. FIrst year, ok you need some time, but this year..come on. He brought in Diomede, Vasquez, 2 huge old turds. Jimenez for Servania?? He moves out cheap depth pieces Petrasso, Shaff and Nelsen then surprise, there is no one left on the bench. He doesnt seem to trust Kerr, Akinola, JMR etc enough to use them, but didnt bring in anyone to replace them. I havnt seen the numbers but I am sure TFC is still in the top 5 payroll in the league. How can we continually spend the most on our roster and then cry we dont have any depth?? We dont have any depth but the most promising young player we have cant seem to get on the field..ggggrrrrrr. narduch, TOcanadafan, El Hombre and 2 others 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CanadaFan123 Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 I’m quite confident the reasons for not firing BB are more emotional than financial at this stage. The club wants MB to be happy and stick around forever in some capacity. It does give you a glaring example of how a club like LAFC has left TFC in the dust in 5 short years. Stryker911 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phresh Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, InglewoodJack said: FWIW, I don't fault him. He's earned the privilege to work with teams he can win with, and unfortunately, he's found himself in a situation where he doesn't have the players to do so. I don't understand what this means. He's sporting director and has a large supply of cash at his disposal. It's not like TFC's roster comprises a bunch of bums. He's also extremely stubborn when it comes to player selection Edited May 8, 2023 by phresh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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