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CDNFootballer

2019 Canadian Premier League Attendance

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1 hour ago, Ansem said:

Season should be less compressed. Start the season beginning of April instead of end of april

Beginning of April does not work in Winnipeg. Attendance would be terrible.

Most of Valour's matches this season were midweek and the attendance numbers were decent.

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48 minutes ago, Lofty said:

Beginning of April does not work in Winnipeg. Attendance would be terrible.

Most of Valour's matches this season were midweek and the attendance numbers were decent.

That's why I said to have as many home games as possible in BC and Southern Ontario at the beginning of April

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I realize rain is better than cold, but outdoor in the rain is a tough draw as well.  You'd be putting a team in Pacific that relies more on a walk up crowd to be reliant on the weather.

People don't want to admit it, but midweek is going to have to be a fact of life.  Even numbers of teams will reduce it, but they can't be eliminated.

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On 9/18/2019 at 6:24 PM, An Observer said:

In many ways, I am more worried about FC Edmonton ...

This is the real problem. As an existing club with years of experience marketing to the local community they should be knocking it out of the park (to mix my sports metaphors).
 

On 9/19/2019 at 4:11 AM, grasshopper1917 said:

In Halifax generally our Saturday games draw a little better but I have talked to many who also enjoy the weekday matches as the evening out Wednesday breaks up the week.

I've said it before but it bears repeating, downtown stadiums should have an easier time selling midweek games than suburban ones. It is easier to stay downtown after work or even get downtown than it is to get to a suburban stadium in rush-hour traffic. It also increases revenue as more people will come out and eat and drink at or around the stadium before the game as they will have the time and the need. 

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1 hour ago, ted said:

This is the real problem. As an existing club with years of experience marketing to the local community they should be knocking it out of the park (to mix my sports metaphors).

Maybe they need a new stadium and new location?

Stadium experience is not a negligeable explanation for low turnover. Edmonton have "world class venues" for it's major sports (NHL & CFL). Clarke Stadium in comparison could be a major obstacle in attracting casuals to the games.

FC Edmonton, in my opinion, needs SSS starting with 6k seats but expandable to 10k like the ones we post on the Stadium thread.

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They have a nice little stadium in the city and fath is done pumping money in the team..now if a new owner with big money wants to come in and make significant changes why not..anyway at some point it will be time for fath to sell

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One problem with the Eddies is they don't seriously market themselves so they are stuck with the same base that never seems to grow much. I'm sure the Fath's thought they would be averaging more rather than roughly 300 less per game in CPL vs NASL 2017 numbers. Luckily expenses are less and the mediapro deal brings in $ or I'd worry about their longevity.

Comparing to their last year in NASL in 2017, they averaged 3408 per game, compared to their current CPL average of 3040 per game.

Edited by CDNFootballer

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On 9/19/2019 at 9:47 AM, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

The Fury picture above is a hint at how seriously you should take some of these numbers. The Fury tend to use discount season ticket sales through youth clubs to pad their stats and that leads to unusually low crowds when the youth soccer types don't show up. From what I saw on Reddit during the game there was a suggestion that a lot of free tickets had been distributed amongst York students.

You have no idea what you’re talking about. You’ve never been to a Fury game.

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16 hours ago, Winnipeg Fury said:

I thought EFC had done a solid job on Clarke.  Not the same level as Pacific's, but I would have no problem watching games there.  The concessions were far better than IG Field.

 

Don't get it.  Yeah, OK, it a mechano set and it needs a roof over the main grandstand but it's got a good lay out, solid stands all around, lots of parking, is within sight of a train station and $6 beer that isn't Budweiser.  I expect they're still trying to figure out their market, same as every other CPL city. 

Hell, the league as an entity is still trying to figure out their market.

Lots of work in the close season but at least now there is some sort of data to work with and no shortage (I am sure) of feedback from the marketplace.  Everyone is going to look at what did and didn't work.  Pricing, fixture dates, sponsorship and business sales,community outreach.  All of it.

And that included Valour.  Think they can call Year 1 a success off-field, mostly, but they're underachieving big time and I hope they realize that.  You're accepting too low a ceiling if it's good enough to just let the product sell itself.  Valour just doesn't have that sort of market presence yet and it'll take time, effort, and of course some patience to make that happen.

Funny, still five matches left and I'm already looking forward to next season.   Bigger & better! 

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2 hours ago, Cheeta said:

Don't get it.  Yeah, OK, it a mechano set and it needs a roof over the main grandstand but it's got a good lay out, solid stands all around, lots of parking, is within sight of a train station and $6 beer that isn't Budweiser. 

[snip]

Funny, still five matches left and I'm already looking forward to next season.   Bigger & better! 

As someone who has never been there, I understand from people who have, that the location is simply too far out out of the way. I have been told it feels like a chore to get there. Parking and transit is great but if the perception persists that it is a chore to get there, attendance will continue to suffer until and unless people feel more urgency to attend.

I think your last point is critical to the league. If I was running marketing for the league #seeyounextyear would the hashtag for the last games of the season. I would have giant banners carried onto the fields by players that say "See you next year". We have established the base of something wonderful and can build on that next year.

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32 minutes ago, ted said:

As someone who has never been there, I understand from people who have, that the location is simply too far out out of the way. I have been told it feels like a chore to get there. Parking and transit is great but if the perception persists that it is a chore to get there, attendance will continue to suffer until and unless people feel more urgency to attend.

I think your last point is critical to the league. If I was running marketing for the league #seeyounextyear would the hashtag for the last games of the season. I would have giant banners carried onto the fields by players that say "See you next year". We have established the base of something wonderful and can build on that next year.

It’s right next to the Eskimos stadium that 30k a week seem willing to attend

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22 hours ago, Winnipeg Fury said:

I thought EFC had done a solid job on Clarke.  Not the same level as Pacific's, but I would have no problem watching games there.  The concessions were far better than IG Field.

As someone who's been there multiple times in the last few years, I have to say that Clarke Field is probably one of the biggest reasons people are staying away from FC Edmonton games. It is an absolute dump. There are other reasons such as the lack of marketing, absence of any sort of growth in the supporters scene, and complete mediocrity on the pitch, but Clarke has to be the biggest.

The stadium has all the drawbacks of a temporary stadium without any of the benefits, such as being a stadium that is solely built for soccer and fosters the atmosphere people are drawn to. The family section is 20 yards back from the goal, the supporters section is close but you can't see the game unless you're at the top of the stand, there are barely any food and concessions near the main stand, the once decent state of the turf has deteriorated and the stadium itself in a sketchy location. It is near the LRT but also requires a 10 minute walk through said sketchy location to get to the stadium. The views from the main blue stand are quite nice, but you also feel like the stand could blow over at any moment. Beer is $6, but it is also half the size of the beers at Spruce Meadows, so not quite the attractive price one might think. 

If the Fath’s had any sense on how to run a soccer club they would have had the foresight to build a soccer specific stadium with temp stands elsewhere in the city - something that Cavalry, Halifax and Pacific have done.

I don't think any stadium in the CPL is perfect, but Edmonton's is by far the worst. And until Fath changes things up, attendance will continue to suffer in Edmonton.

Edited by shermanator

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2 hours ago, Aird25 said:

It’s right next to the Eskimos stadium that 30k a week seem willing to attend

Exactly the point of my "urgency" comment. The Eskimos attendance is not negatively affected by the location of the stadium because CFL games are such a big event that people are willing to overcome their concerns about the trip. It feels worth it to them because they know what they are getting and they have a relationship with the team. Overcoming barriers to getting new fans is as huge part of marketing.
 

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5 minutes ago, ted said:

Exactly the point of my "urgency" comment. The Eskimos attendance is not negatively affected by the location of the stadium because CFL games are such a big event that people are willing to overcome their concerns about the trip. It feels worth it to them because they know what they are getting and they have a relationship with the team. Overcoming barriers to getting new fans is as huge part of marketing.
 

I should have added that it’s not a difficult place to get to. It’s close to downtown and it’s on the LRT line. Westhills is much less accessible, and I still don’t think the location is that bad

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1 hour ago, shermanator said:

As someone who's been there multiple times in the last few years, I have to say that Clarke Field is probably one of the biggest reasons people are staying away from FC Edmonton games. It is an absolute dump. There are other reasons such as the lack of marketing, absence of any sort of growth in the supporters scene, and complete mediocrity on the pitch, but Clarke has to be the biggest.

The stadium has all the drawbacks of a temporary stadium without any of the benefits, such as being a stadium that is solely built for soccer and fosters the atmosphere people are drawn to. The family section is 20 yards back from the goal, the supporters section is close but you can't see the game unless you're at the top of the stand, there are barely any food and concessions near the main stand, the once decent state of the turf has deteriorated and the stadium itself in a sketchy location. It is near the LRT but also requires a 10 minute walk through said sketchy location to get to the stadium. The views from the main blue stand are quite nice, but you also feel like the stand could blow over at any moment. Beer is $6, but it is also half the size of the beers at Spruce Meadows, so not quite the attractive price one might think. 

If the Fath’s had any sense on how to run a soccer club they would have had the foresight to build a soccer specific stadium with temp stands elsewhere in the city - something that Cavalry, Halifax and Pacific have done.

I don't think any stadium in the CPL is perfect, but Edmonton's is by far the worst. And until Fath changes things up, attendance will continue to suffer in Edmonton.

 

I would have no problem buying a season ticket to EFC.  EFC season tickets are dirt cheap and INCLUDE a jersey.  Right now a 5 game pack for $80 AND a free jersey, (which retails for $110) !  The drinks at Clarke are half the price and twice the quality over IG Field (Newcastle for $6 !).  And the concessions are also half the price and twice the quality.  

VFC are playing on a CFL field and the supporters section starts at the back corner of an end zone.  Much further than EFC fans located anywhere at Clarke.  Generally speaking, you are much closer to the field at Clarke than anywhere at IGF.

Clarke's concessions may not be huge, but when you are averaging 3000, it is absolutely fine.  I had a quality dog and Newcastle in my hand in 2 minutes.  IGF doesn't sell quality like Newcastle, only crap beer for twice the price.

I would say EFC fans are getting far better value for their money than Valour fans.  The game day experience at Clarke was absolutely fine.  It has to be a lack of marketing, because at the prices EFC charge, they are basically giving tickets away.

 

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Regarding the VFC supporters' section, I wonder if Valour might narrow their available sections by one at each end and move the supporter's section to 101. They've had a few "sellouts" of their regular allotment but not often enough that it makes sense to isolate the Trench so far into the corner.

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Im with Aird the location is not difficult at all to get to and i'm coming all the way from the west side. Hard to find a better location that close to downtown

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22 hours ago, shermanator said:

As someone who's been there multiple times in the last few years, I have to say that Clarke Field is probably one of the biggest reasons people are staying away from FC Edmonton games. It is an absolute dump. There are other reasons such as the lack of marketing, absence of any sort of growth in the supporters scene, and complete mediocrity on the pitch, but Clarke has to be the biggest.

The stadium has all the drawbacks of a temporary stadium without any of the benefits, such as being a stadium that is solely built for soccer and fosters the atmosphere people are drawn to. The family section is 20 yards back from the goal, the supporters section is close but you can't see the game unless you're at the top of the stand, there are barely any food and concessions near the main stand, the once decent state of the turf has deteriorated and the stadium itself in a sketchy location. It is near the LRT but also requires a 10 minute walk through said sketchy location to get to the stadium. The views from the main blue stand are quite nice, but you also feel like the stand could blow over at any moment. Beer is $6, but it is also half the size of the beers at Spruce Meadows, so not quite the attractive price one might think. 

If the Fath’s had any sense on how to run a soccer club they would have had the foresight to build a soccer specific stadium with temp stands elsewhere in the city - something that Cavalry, Halifax and Pacific have done.

I don't think any stadium in the CPL is perfect, but Edmonton's is by far the worst. And until Fath changes things up, attendance will continue to suffer in Edmonton.

And that pretty much support what I was saying.

FC Edmonton doesn't have a problem attracting hardcores and big soccer fans. Converting "Casuals" & "none-fans" is the biggest issue and you're right, that stadium won't do.

Edmonton has "World Class" venues for hockey and football. Casuals would be more inclined to check out CPL if FCE also had a "Westhills Stadium" type of venue at the minimum.

I can speak for Montreal where I grew up, it took Saputo stadium for the Impact to have any remote amount of credibility or attract some casuals. We had Olympic Stadium for baseball, Forum & Bell centre for the Habs and Percival Molson for the Alouettes.

There's no way Montrealers would take Centre Claude Robillard seriously for soccer.

realisation-complexe-laude-robillard-pis

It took Saputo which was somewhat of a "Wanderers Grounds +" Stade_Saputo.jpg

Edmonton should have had this at the bare minimum. I recall Clanachan suggesting that Edmonton might need a new venue altogether. He wasn't wrong about that.

This is where the owners needs a vision because Edmonton has all the tools to ace it. The stadium and elevating the team status are their #1 priority. Until then, low attendance will be the  new normal which is dangerous. If the on pitch product gets too poor to keep hardcores from going, that's really bad. You need the casuals to go and get converted. 

Clarke Stadium is a massive tough sell to casuals in a city like Edmonton like Claude Robillard was in Montreal. It took Saputo Stadium, Edmonton needs something similar to what Halifax has done at the minimum.

Hoping the Fath Brothers aren't trapped in the sunk cost fallacy loop... best to let go and look for something new

Edited by Ansem

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