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2019 Canadian Premier League Attendance

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22 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

No sign of a crowd number so far for the Forge game, but will leave the links so it is easy to check:

https://ca.soccerway.com/matches/2019/09/15/canada/canadian-premier-league/forge/hfx-wanderers/2991897/

https://canpl.ca/matchcentre/5dzgbpowfq3bfc0jp50nxi0yy/highlights

Could post more screen grabs with more depressing evidence of there being acres of empty seats rather than packed sections of fans, but I'm sure you all saw that on the Onesoccer coverage. Hopefully the Wanderers are going to provide reasons to be upbeat over the coming week and to believe this league can actually work.

Edit: 6016 announced

It just saw the highlights (great match it looked like) and it didn’t look half bad at all.....😐

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19 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Link to York 9, no number yet:

https://ca.soccerway.com/matches/2019/09/15/canada/canadian-premier-league/york-9/valour/2991898/

https://canpl.ca/matchcentre/5e6552cfhize1wrtn1985u6p6/highlights

But there are people on the far side (York students?), so might be higher than usual.

Looked higher than usual in person, but I’m not sure of a number. 

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22 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Hopefully the Wanderers are going to provide reasons to be upbeat over the coming week and to believe this league can actually work.

Edit: 6016 announced

Are you part of the solution or part of the problem?

Majority of these clubs didnt exist 2 years ago, allow them a few more cup runs, a few more seasons to actually develop fan bases before you start jumping to conclusions. 

Developing and selling players on, sell on percentages, camps, merch sales, prize money and sponsorships shouldn't be overlooked. This is not MLS where the league is eating your transfer fees and sharing your profits with other owners. 

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Not sure what most of that has to do with this thread. You appear to be reading way more into posts than is actually there. The main reason why it would be better for the league to keep things grounded in reality where attendance numbers are concerned as some of the teams have been doing most of the time this season is that it helps people to understand why they are not watching any CMNT regulars or big money import signings and to be content with what they have.

Beyond that if you look at the history of pro soccer in North America a recurring pattern is that pretending you have significantly larger crowds than you actually do usually doesn't lead anywhere good because it suggests ownership are not comfortable with how things are really going and may soon tire of not having what they really want. Hopefully the downsize on active capacity in Hamilton will be a case of far fewer freebies and cut price deals happening in year two with a focus on catering to the core ticket paying fanbase after using year one to get lots of people in to sample the product.

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51 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Beyond that if you look at the history of pro soccer in North America a recurring pattern is that pretending you have significantly larger crowds than you actually do usually doesn't lead anywhere good because it suggests ownership are not comfortable with how things are really going and may soon tire of not having what they really want.

It actually happens in every league in North America, so much so that it's the status quo. It's been done routinely in the NFL, NHL, MLB and minor leagues, even college football has had this issue the last couple seasons. 

Because of that no one obsesses about it, except for you.

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1 hour ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Not sure what most of that has to do with this thread. You appear to be reading way more into posts than is actually there. The main reason why it would be better for the league to keep things grounded in reality where attendance numbers are concerned as some of the teams have been doing most of the time this season is that it helps people to understand why they are not watching any CMNT regulars or big money import signings and to be content with what they have.

What do you mean by "believe the league can actually work" after you bash the crowd in Hamilton? Comes off as you implying the clubs need instant high attendance to be sustainable. My bad if im off base

 

 

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1 hour ago, BuzzAndSting said:

It actually happens in every league in North America, so much so that it's the status quo. It's been done routinely in the NFL, NHL, MLB and minor leagues, even college football has had this issue the last couple seasons. 

Because of that no one obsesses about it, except for you.

It happens especially in MLS, a lot. The league that this guy fawns over

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As a point of interest, Steven Vitoria's team in Portugal's tier 1 averaged 2,274 last season and are under 2000 this season, I would think a much higher salary budget and less travel  costs, but puts into context the CanPl attendances, i think if you take the bottom 10 teams in Portugal's Tier 1, their attendance average is less then the CanPL.

Edited by MM3/MM2/MM

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The timeline would be whether the league is still around 10 years from now. Halifax are already at where things will definitely need to be across most of the league on fan interest by that point or investors are likely to have lost patience. Having a model franchise like that is very important for being able to convince others to invest. 

Winnipeg, Hamilton and Calgary are far enough along to be viewed as a reasonable start but probably not quite where the league would have hoped to be, Victoria looks OK occasionally and other times such as the last two games worrying, while Edmonton and York are definitely in the worrying category.

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56 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

The timeline would be whether the league is still around 10 years from now. Halifax are already at where things will definitely need to be across most of the league on fan interest by that point or investors are likely to have lost patience. Having a model franchise like that is very important for being able to convince others to invest. 

Winnipeg, Hamilton and Calgary are far enough along to be viewed as a reasonable start but probably not quite where the league would have hoped to be, Victoria looks OK occasionally and other times such as the last two games worrying, while Edmonton and York are definitely in the worrying category.

Except you’re not qualified to make any of these assessments because you only have access to and are basing everything on one parameter.

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3 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

 The main reason why it would be better for the league to keep things grounded in reality where attendance numbers are concerned

Beyond that if you look at the history of pro soccer in North America a recurring pattern is that pretending you have significantly larger crowds than you actually do usually doesn't lead anywhere good because it suggests ownership are not comfortable with how things are really going and may soon tire of not having what they really want. Hopefully the downsize on active capacity in Hamilton will be a case of far fewer freebies and cut price deals happening in year two with a focus on catering to the core ticket paying fanbase after using year one to get lots of people in to sample the product.

The CPL clubs announce tickets distributed like other pro sports leagues and that is the reality, they're not "pretending" they have significantly larger crowds at all. Pretending is you claiming an attendance number that Pacific FC never had on Sept 11(1200) is real.

All pro sports teams offer freebies and you have no idea the amount Hamilton offers or if its any different in percentage on average than other NA sports teams.

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1 hour ago, Gopherbashi said:

I'm not going to lie, whenever I see entire sections near the first base line at the Skydome practically empty, I think there's no way in hell they're even close to their reported 21k average attendance.

Then I think of this thread.

They better turn it around if they want to be around in 10 years!!! /s

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1 hour ago, Aird25 said:

I’m just amazed how many times people are willing to have the same argument

What I find completely mind-boggling that neither side can recognize the validity of the point the other is making. This is the internet at its worst. Yes, it is the M.O. of most leagues and a standard operating practice. Yes, a first year team in a first year league reporting 2500 when its more like 900 is more worrying than an established big league club adding a few thousand to a five figure attendance. Not hard guys.

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3 hours ago, Gopherbashi said:

I'm not going to lie, whenever I see entire sections near the first base line at the Skydome practically empty, I think there's no way in hell they're even close to their reported 21k average attendance.

Then I think of this thread.

I never...EVER thought about what percentage of tickets sales were freebies, or would have ever dreamed of searching ticket master to try count blue dots and prove/disprove a teams announced attendance. Let alone do that after almost every game all season.  

The almost constant narrative that started IMMEDIATELY after launch, that certain teams were in trouble, the league isnt doing as well as everyone here thinks and the fact finding missions to go and try and prove it, for some sort of NAH NAH NAH, I"m smarter you than you ego trip, is what really makes me wonder.  I cant believe this lasted the entire season.  

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5 hours ago, Aird25 said:

I’m just amazed how many times people are willing to have the same argument

To be fair I think each new bout has different combatants plucking feathers off the same parrot, which must surely be close to bald by now. I'm not sure what happens when the feathers are all gone. Strangulation? A garrote for the parrot has a ring to it.

Edited by Lofty

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6 hours ago, The Real Marc said:

...Yes, a first year team in a first year league reporting 2500 when its more like 900 is more worrying than an established big league club adding a few thousand to a five figure attendance...

Amidst all the deflection and whataboutery to use a UK expression that's the part that is genuinely on topic for this thread. Still no crowd number for Pacific vs FCE. Announcing that there were 2500 people there towards the end of the game on Saturday would have invited ridicule on a nationally televised broadcast but I thought they would have circulated something by now.

The first step to solving an issue is admitting that you have a problem that needs to be fixed. The optimistic outlook on this that I am reasonably confident is what's going on is that they have found out the hard way why North American pro leagues have playoffs in the absence of relegation. Once teams are out of contention for the championship title a lot of fans will lose interest and drift away. The average Canadian soccer fan really wasn't craving Euro style authenticity that MLS wasn't providing them regardless of what a few hipsters types who have yet to show up in any huge numbers at York 9's league games were posting online.

The league will find out if a more pessimistic outlook was applicable once they know what season ticket renewal rates are looking like.

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55 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

The first step to solving an issue is admitting that you have a problem that needs to be fixed.

Are you finally going to engage in some soul searching to determine why it is that your personality is so universally considered to be repellent by those you come across?

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9 hours ago, Bison44 said:

I never...EVER thought about what percentage of tickets sales were freebies, or would have ever dreamed of searching ticket master to try count blue dots and prove/disprove a teams announced attendance. Let alone do that after almost every game all season.  

The almost constant narrative that started IMMEDIATELY after launch, that certain teams were in trouble, the league isnt doing as well as everyone here thinks and the fact finding missions to go and try and prove it, for some sort of NAH NAH NAH, I"m smarter you than you ego trip, is what really makes me wonder.  I cant believe this lasted the entire season.  

This is it exactly. BBTB/Ozzie is still sour this league started without USL involvement or the MLS reserve teams, proving his viewpoints to be wrong that he is itching for any little evidence the league is not doing well to eventually say “I told you so.” He is an insecure man that wants to be right rather than see the league succeed and he will grasp at any straws to see that objective through.

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16 hours ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

Not sure what most of that has to do with this thread. You appear to be reading way more into posts than is actually there. The main reason why it would be better for the league to keep things grounded in reality where attendance numbers are concerned as some of the teams have been doing most of the time this season is that it helps people to understand why they are not watching any CMNT regulars or big money import signings and to be content with what they have.

Beyond that if you look at the history of pro soccer in North America a recurring pattern is that pretending you have significantly larger crowds than you actually do usually doesn't lead anywhere good because it suggests ownership are not comfortable with how things are really going and may soon tire of not having what they really want. Hopefully the downsize on active capacity in Hamilton will be a case of far fewer freebies and cut price deals happening in year two with a focus on catering to the core ticket paying fanbase after using year one to get lots of people in to sample the product.

IMG_20190917_083656.thumb.jpg.56462ebdcf86aa51db58b0b6edf3a624.jpg

So, should we start lamenting about the unevitable doom of the USL?

Where's that same criticisms for the USL, a league you are still claiming should have been the focus of the CSA instead of launching CPL

@admin This is clearly trolling and a distraction at discussing more productive things... this none sense turns people off from this thread like it did on the Voyageurs.

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