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18 hours ago, narduch said:

I've seen a few comments on Twitter saying they got to get these games on TSN or similar but I'm wondering if they want to.

Look let’s be honest here, I get it it the more subscriptions for one soccer and the CPL and soccer in general the better. They are the station that will show the soccer the mainstream stations are not going to show. However, we need the casual soccer fan and sports fan to get behind this team and the casual fan is not going to pay to get a subscription to a soccer app. As an example no one at my work even knew about Canada’s campaign to qualify for the World Cup . However, they are catching the odd Euro game and even the odd TFC game because the games are on regular tv. One of the mainstream stations needs to step up and show at least some of Canada’s Oct. games so that more people can get behind this team. I think the TV numbers for our men’s team has been pretty good in past World Cup qualifying campaigns and also Gold Cups . Moreover, the the team finally in the final round again I think the TV numbers will be pretty good and only get better if they start winning in the Oct. I’ll be very surprised if one of the mainstream stations doesn’t buy some of the games at least .

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13 minutes ago, SoccMan said:

Look let’s be honest here, I get it it the more subscriptions for one soccer and the CPL and soccer in general the better. They are the station that will show the soccer the mainstream stations are not going to show. However, we need the casual soccer fan and sports fan to get behind this team and the casual fan is not going to pay to get a subscription to a soccer app. As an example no one at my work even knew about Canada’s campaign to qualify for the World Cup . However, they are catching the odd Euro game and even the odd TFC game because the games are on regular tv. One of the mainstream stations needs to step up and show at least some of Canada’s Oct. games so that more people can get behind this team. I think the TV numbers for our men’s team has been pretty good in past World Cup qualifying campaigns and also Gold Cups . Moreover, the the team finally in the final round again I think the TV numbers will be pretty good and only get better if they start winning in the Oct. I’ll be very surprised if one of the mainstream stations doesn’t buy some of the games at least .

I agree the games should be on more mainstream networks.

I'm just wondering what's in it for One Soccer. 

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I do know cord cutters really hate cable companies. But in reading twitter comments over the past month, I see there is a segment that gets really upset at streamers "stealing" content away from the tv networks. Instead of blaming TSN/SN for dropping the rights and laying off their soccer people, they go after OneSoccer & the CSA for putting it behind a so-called paywall.

These people don't seem to realize that the soccer viewing audience has been growing but since there a lot of leagues and competitions, no one or two tv networks can carry it all. And it is no coincidence that the only 2 sports streamers in Canada have a soccer focus. A fragmented audience suits the streamer business model better than cable tv. 

For those who think CBC will carry matches. Little to no chance as they don't show sports in prime time ex NHL, Olympics & the Stampede. They also focus on teams qualifying or have qualified for the Olympics - on a few days delayed basis, they did show a couple of women national team matches earlier this year using OneSoccer's feed.

For SN, they blew their money on NHL and their ownership ties means they need to show the Jays & Raptors. They also laid off all their soccer people in the past 2 years. 

That leaves TSN as the most probable. They have been off and on in their commitment to the sport in recent years. They dropped rights to Canada, PL & CL. They're showing Copa America, will get la Liga via ESPN this fall and are covering Canada during their Euro coverage but passed on showing Euro WC qualifiers and Nations League. I can see them using the Canada matches to promote their Qatar coverage and they still have a soccer broadcast crew to do a match. But similar to when they had Canada rights, they'll pick and choose which matches to broadcast.

 

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1 hour ago, narduch said:

I agree the games should be on more mainstream networks.

I'm just wondering what's in it for One Soccer. 

I was wondering if OneSoccer had rights to both home and away matches. But Kurt Larson has tweeted that all 14 are on OneSoccer. So, from their perspective, I would only sub license max 1 match per window or just the home matches. This will act as samplers to get people to subscribe. 

I hope they also consider carrying at least selected matches of the other 7.

 

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1 hour ago, red card said:

I was wondering if OneSoccer had rights to both home and away matches. But Kurt Larson has tweeted that all 14 are on OneSoccer. So, from their perspective, I would only sub license max 1 match per window or just the home matches. This will act as samplers to get people to subscribe. 

I hope they also consider carrying at least selected matches of the other 7.

 

I have no idea of OneSoccer does or doesn't have the away matches, but I do know I'd want someone who isn't Kurt Larson confirming it.  The man's an idiot.

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3 hours ago, narduch said:

I agree the games should be on more mainstream networks.

I'm just wondering what's in it for One Soccer. 

Honestly, it probably depends on what type of numbers One Soccer has seen (ie new or temporary subscriptions) so far, what they anticipate they'll be able to get, but also...how much they need the money.  Because we saw the rough financial shape One Soccer parent company Media Pro is in, and I'd be willing to bet that One Soccer has lost money for them since it's inception.  They might be willing to sell some games just to get the guaranteed cash.

Having said that, I still there's likely only going to be a few select games that TSN or Sportsnet might be interested in.

Edited by Watchmen
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12 hours ago, narduch said:

I agree the games should be on more mainstream networks.

I'm just wondering what's in it for One Soccer. 

They might be looking ahead to the Finals next year.  A content sharing agreement that would put Canada's matches on OneSoccer (should they qualify) has to have value even if those matches will also be on cable. 

Kinda like the way getting some of the Octo tests and maybe a playoff match on TSN would have, whether Canada qualifies of not. 

Intersting to see what happens.  

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11 hours ago, Watchmen said:

I have no idea of OneSoccer does or doesn't have the away matches, but I do know I'd want someone who isn't Kurt Larson confirming it.  The man's an idiot.

Whether he’s an idiot or not, he’s pretty high up at OneSoccer and is in a position to know what OS has the rights to.

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11 hours ago, Watchmen said:

I have no idea of OneSoccer does or doesn't have the away matches, but I do know I'd want someone who isn't Kurt Larson confirming it.  The man's an idiot.

Remember that time he told people One Soccer would cover Concacaf League but TSN had the rights.

That being said perhaps One Soccer has already pre negotiated deals with each other nation. IE we will give you the feed to the match in Canada in return for the away leg.

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13 hours ago, red card said:

I was wondering if OneSoccer had rights to both home and away matches. But Kurt Larson has tweeted that all 14 are on OneSoccer. So, from their perspective, I would only sub license max 1 match per window or just the home matches. This will act as samplers to get people to subscribe. 

I hope they also consider carrying at least selected matches of the other 7.

 

How much longer do they need to do that kind of thing though? There were CPL games on CBC in 2019 and the thinking was it raises awareness of the league which in turn should result in subscriptions to OneSoccer. Then in 2020 I think people were still complaining about there needing to be more games on CBC (although I honestly can't remember if any games were on CBC or not last year).

If there are Oct games on TSN, then all of a sudden the potential World Cup clinching game is only on OneSoccer, lots of people will be pissed off. I feel like right now a OneSoccer subscription is at it's most valuable. If someone signs up now they get the CPL season from the start, next month they get the Gold Cup, and then September through November they get tons of massive World Cup Qualifiers. This is the time that OneSoccer has the potential to get some traction with soccer fans that aren't already subscribers. If they sell off their games to TSN they lose a golden opportunity and people will continue to expect games to be available on TSN, so no need to get OneSoccer.

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2 hours ago, narduch said:

That being said perhaps One Soccer has already pre negotiated deals with each other nation. IE we will give you the feed to the match in Canada in return for the away leg.

Oh I definitely think One Soccer would have been talking to the other nations about a rights swap long before TSN would have thought about acquiring them. I think it's a safe assumption that One Soccer probably has most of the rights locked down, with the potential exceptions of the US and Mexico games. And I say those ones only because I could see both federations wanting more than just a rights swap. 

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4 minutes ago, Watchmen said:

Oh I definitely think One Soccer would have been talking to the other nations about a rights swap long before TSN would have thought about acquiring them. I think it's a safe assumption that One Soccer probably has most of the rights locked down, with the potential exceptions of the US and Mexico games. And I say those ones only because I could see both federations wanting more than just a rights swap. 

For the Group Stage that just finished Concacaf and Media Pro worked together to sell off the matches as a package. That's how games ended up on Paramount +. I bet they will be doing the same for the Octagon.

I hope One Soccer picks this up.

 

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On the new Tim & Sid (don't know which one is gone) show on Sportsnet he mentioned that people were asking why the Canada games are not on TV and he said that the rights are on a streaming service and made it sound that the games aren't available to them.

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It's Tim that is still around, and there was a clip of him on the show last week I think about the CMNT. Talking about how this team is different and it's time for people to jump on the bandwagon. Sid seemed to be the guy who was more passionate about soccer, but Tim repped us well in that segment.

Here it is, although this is pretty off topic. That's how we do here.

 

Edited by Kent
Added link.
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10 hours ago, Kent said:

How much longer do they need to do that kind of thing though? There were CPL games on CBC in 2019 and the thinking was it raises awareness of the league which in turn should result in subscriptions to OneSoccer. Then in 2020 I think people were still complaining about there needing to be more games on CBC (although I honestly can't remember if any games were on CBC or not last year).

If there are Oct games on TSN, then all of a sudden the potential World Cup clinching game is only on OneSoccer, lots of people will be pissed off. I feel like right now a OneSoccer subscription is at it's most valuable. If someone signs up now they get the CPL season from the start, next month they get the Gold Cup, and then September through November they get tons of massive World Cup Qualifiers. This is the time that OneSoccer has the potential to get some traction with soccer fans that aren't already subscribers. If they sell off their games to TSN they lose a golden opportunity and people will continue to expect games to be available on TSN, so no need to get OneSoccer.

It’s not about us soccer nerds or even the soccer fans, it’s getting the whole country on board and the casual fan is not going to buy a subscription to a soccer only app. We need to showcase this team of young stars to the general sports fan in a final round it has not been too since 1997. If this team actually qualifies for the World Cup only the diehard soccer fans see it , it will be an opportunity lost to the excitement of do or die final round World Cup qualifying.  But the whole country will be able to watch on national TV our Olympic men’s basketball team trying to qualifying for the Tokyo Olympics without having to subscribe to an app but not our soccer team interesting.

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8 minutes ago, SoccMan said:

It’s not about us soccer nerds or even the soccer fans, it’s getting the whole country on board and the casual fan is not going to buy a subscription to a soccer only app. We need to showcase this team of young stars to the general sports fan in a final round it has not been too since 1997. If this team actually qualifies for the World Cup only the diehard soccer fans see it , it will be an opportunity lost to the excitement of do or die final round World Cup qualifying.  But the whole country will be able to watch on national TV our Olympic men’s basketball team trying to qualifying for the Tokyo Olympics without having to subscribe to an app but not our soccer team interesting.

CBC basically broadcasts/streams all Olympic qualifying events since they show the Olympics. Basketball is also a top 5 tv sport in Canada while soccer is not. But in general, these Olympic qualifying events get less than 100k on CBC. Ratings for any type of CBC show nowadays is below average to poor ex NHL. A few of these BB games are in prime time, so it should get more than 100k but it will not match Raptors regular season ratings.

In looking back at how the women's team captured the interest of the general sports fan and beyond, it wasn't due to qualifiers being on cable tv. Even most Voyageurs weren't interested. But one classic match and then winning the bronze did it. 

The men's game is different. So, there will be one off higher interest for qualifiers against Mexico/US. But the real interest will only come in the final March window if Canada is still in it. It will be hard to hold the interest of the general sports fan for something that has intermittent matches across 7 months. But given most soccer fans in Canada don't follow Canada, it is a chance to get them on board since they know about the joys and despair of WC qualifying.

So, even if some matches end up on TSN, it won't be the panacea that some here think. The lowest rated Euro match so far that I have seen numbers for has been Poland/Slovakia at 280k. If we get that for a 2021 Canada qualifier, it will be a success but it won't move the needle. The real window of opportunity occurs when Canada qualifies and then it is time to soak up all the glory, hype & monies in anticipation of the World Cup.

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10 hours ago, SoccMan said:

It’s not about us soccer nerds or even the soccer fans, it’s getting the whole country on board and the casual fan is not going to buy a subscription to a soccer only app. We need to showcase this team of young stars to the general sports fan in a final round it has not been too since 1997. If this team actually qualifies for the World Cup only the diehard soccer fans see it , it will be an opportunity lost to the excitement of do or die final round World Cup qualifying.  But the whole country will be able to watch on national TV our Olympic men’s basketball team trying to qualifying for the Tokyo Olympics without having to subscribe to an app but not our soccer team interesting.

I think there is already enough interest among the soccer nerds to have good sized crowds to our home games, if they are allowed to go to games. What I think we need more than a temporary little bump from casual viewers is long term success for CPL, and part of that is success for OneSoccer. If a few thousand people subscribe to OneSoccer month to month during World Cup Qualifying, they might end up gaining interest in CPL. It might be enough that they end up going to games, buying merch, etc. OneSoccer and CPL won't invest in Canadian soccer indefinitely if they don't start seeing a return on that investment.

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11 hours ago, Kent said:

It's Tim that is still around, and there was a clip of him on the show last week I think about the CMNT. Talking about how this team is different and it's time for people to jump on the bandwagon. Sid seemed to be the guy who was more passionate about soccer, but Tim repped us well in that segment.

Here it is, although this is pretty off topic. That's how we do here.

 

I knew it was him just wasn't sure if he was Tim or Sid. Anyways the interview he did was after the second Haiti game when he mentioned why the games are not on TV. Thanks for that clip.

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3 hours ago, Kent said:

I think there is already enough interest among the soccer nerds to have good sized crowds to our home games, if they are allowed to go to games. What I think we need more than a temporary little bump from casual viewers is long term success for CPL, and part of that is success for OneSoccer. If a few thousand people subscribe to OneSoccer month to month during World Cup Qualifying, they might end up gaining interest in CPL. It might be enough that they end up going to games, buying merch, etc. OneSoccer and CPL won't invest in Canadian soccer indefinitely if they don't start seeing a return on that investment.

Think/hope we'll see a significant portion of the qualifier games on mainstream cable from here on because somebody will be willing to pay to put it on by that point assuming the octagon campaign gets off to a good start. If Onesoccer are still doing the broadcast feed that isn't necessarily bad for working in some CanPL related content.

In general the CanPL investors need to realize that in the absence of a huge investment in youth academies the CMNT has little to do with them and is not likely to any time soon because the elite 20 or so players called up for games will be following the money in terms of their club careers.

Halifax points the way to a successful league. Not pretending to be something they are not but instead going after the live entertainment dollar in midsized markets where junior hockey draws well in the winter but there is no CFL or baseball worth mentioning in the summer.

Edited by Ozzie_the_parrot
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44 minutes ago, Ozzie_the_parrot said:

In general the CanPL investors need to realize that in the absence of a huge investment in youth academies the CMNT has little to do with them and is not likely to any time soon because the elite 20 or so players called up for games will be following the money in terms of their club careers.

I know you love to harp on this, but I don't think it's the slight you think it is. We may not see many call ups directly from CPL, but as the league ages and grows more and more national team players will likely have spent some time in CPL. This is pretty typical around the world, even amongst some of the best teams like Brazil or Argentina. 

We're really only 1.25 seasons in with relatively low investment compared to where we might end up in a few years, and we've already seen Waterman and Pantemis make the jump, and some of the U-23 callups could be close.  

 

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2 hours ago, narduch said:

Do not think CPL has any say in this.

One Soccer (Media Pro) are their own entity.

Of course CPL doesn't have any say in this, but Media Pro will want all the competitions they cover to do well. If fans make a financial commitment to OneSoccer to watch World Cup Qualifiers they might think they might as well get a bit more out of this thing they just signed up for. Maybe they watch OneSoccer Today to catch talk about World Cup Qualifiers and as a result they also hear some CPL discussions. Maybe they have nothing to do on a weekend and think why not watch one of the CPL games. They might start to like it.

Now more directed at Ozzie, the pro game prospering in Canada is important for the national team, even if no current national team players play in the CPL. It's not like the Brazilian league is unimportant for their national team due to the lack of senior team players that play in Brazil. Give the CPL time and there will be players that pass through the league on their way to the national team, just like League1 Ontario has done.

Edited by Kent
ugh, "hear" not "here".
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32 minutes ago, Aird25 said:

I know you love to harp on this, but I don't think it's the slight you think it is. We may not see many call ups directly from CPL, but as the league ages and grows more and more national team players will likely have spent some time in CPL. This is pretty typical around the world, even amongst some of the best teams like Brazil or Argentina. 

We're really only 1.25 seasons in with relatively low investment compared to where we might end up in a few years, and we've already seen Waterman and Pantemis make the jump, and some of the U-23 callups could be close.  

 

Had it been a normal year where the season started in April we may have seen a few players, imo.

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