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Kent

CPL bilingualism

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44 minutes ago, ChrisinOrleans said:

Cela dépend du journaliste. Les journalistes du journal Le Droit à Ottawa ont suivi la première division canadienne, mais seulement dans le contexte d'Ottawa. Je pense que Moncton, Ottawa, Sudbury et même Winnipeg et Halifax pourraient tous être qualifiés de marchés avec une présence francophone suffisante pour mériter l'attention des médias.

I mean, point taken here, but honestly if the <Canadian> league cannot be bothered to put out content in French for the 2-million French speakers outside of Québec, then it's not really <our Canadian leauge>, is it? 

1

Je défend continuellement les commentaires péjoratifs que Filosa ou que TVA sports peuvent avoir (ils étaient clairement contre le fait que Choinière choisisse la CPL plutôt que d'accepter d'être prêté à Ottawa). Mais même s'il est vrai que les journalistes devraient s'intéressé à la diffusion de l'information sportive nationale, il est difficile de blâmer des journalistes de ne pas soutenir le produit avec lequel ils ont une entente commerciale (IMFC et la MLS). Sachant celà, c'est à la CPL d'être plus proactif. L'attitude de Paul Beirn en dit beaucoup sur la priorité que le marché francophone semble occupé au sein du FO de la ligue malheureusement.

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16 minutes ago, Vic said:

About 30 years ago when the train still ran on Vancouver Island, I remember seeing a railway employee throwing out boxes of French pamphlets. When I asked him why he said no one ever asks for them, but he added we get asked for Chinese every day and have none. Don't know about French in Alberta but there are way, way more households speaking Chinese and Punjabi than French in BC. Ergo things like Hockey Night in Punjbai.

2-million Chinese in Canada ;)

 

There are 10,4 million of French speakers in Canada. Chinese isn't a language by the way. There's 565,270 Cantonese speakers and 592,040 mandarin speakers. There are almost as many Spanish, Punjabi or Arabic speakers. Regardless of these numbers, those languages are not part of a historical nation within Canada that uses that language in all aspects of life (business schooling, public affairs, etc). English is one, French is another, and aboriginal languages are others that we too often forget about. I'm not shocked that you tried to undermine French however. Its been on an upward trend for the past few years. 

Putting politics (or basic respect) aside. If the CPL wants to do everything it can to be successful, it should reach out to the extra 10,4 million fans its currently ignoring. I understand that having a team in that market will help, but it could/should be doing more that what it currently is. 

For instance, IF it's only Tony Marinaro (or English media) that received a CanPL jersey in Québec, that is incredibly shortsighted.

 

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I've been there a number of times and am well aware of the differences between Mandarin and Cantonese. But thanks for the preaching. I'd say undermining but that would just be dickish. There are 2 million Chinese in Canada. Who get how much basic respect when it comes to language in their community?

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5 minutes ago, Vic said:

I've been there a number of times and am well aware of the differences between Mandarin and Cantonese. But thanks for the preaching. I'd say undermining but that would just be dickish. There are 2 million Chinese in Canada. Who get how much basic respect when it comes to language in their community?

And there is over 314k people in BC alone that speak both english and french (10M in Canada).  Doesn't compare to any other language.  If the CPL is serious about being a national league, that can't be ignored over the long term.  It is nice that they appear to be recognizing that.

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Inclusivity of all groups and minorities is always to be lauded. There are too many places in the world the game is highly politicized, hopefully we're not one of them.

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6 hours ago, Vic said:

Inclusivity of all groups and minorities is always to be lauded. There are too many places in the world the game is highly politicized, hopefully we're not one of them.

But you see, THAT is specifically the problem. You've come in here and politicized this topic. Canada is a bilingual country (both legally and factually). The fact that you're trying to pass the francophone community as another "minority" is highly disrespectful. I think its pretty self explanatory. Try to say the same thing in Spain in regards to Catalonia, or in the UK with Scotland. Its just basic common sense.

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Perhaps it's just me but a post in a soccer forum, about soccer, from people who play and enjoy the game of soccer called "CPL bilingualism" doesn't need me to politicize it.

I was there for the protests and talked to many amazing Catalans over the past month. About football, food and politics. They really are wonderful and very charming people with a beautiful energy and lifestyle. And if I learned anything it's that the Catalonian situation is very different from anything here. That and Lionel Messi is truly and without a single thread of doubt the best player I have ever seen grace a field.

Between my flippance and your misleading misrepresentations this is about as bad as conversations go. So I'll leave you to your language politics, or not as you prefer.

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Posted (edited)

You've basically totally derailed this topic by bringing up the relevancy of bilingualism within CPL by contrasting it to your perception that bilingualism is irrelevant within our country. I don't think this input was necessary for this discussion. This topic should be about the best way to assure CPL access to the francophone masses to the benefit of creating a truly pan-canadian league. 

Edited by fmfranck

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2 hours ago, fmfranck said:

You've basically totally derailed this topic by bringing up the relevancy of bilingualism within CPL by contrasting it to your perception that bilingualism is irrelevant within our country. I don't think this input was necessary for this discussion. This topic should be about the best way to assure CPL access to the francophone masses to the benefit of creating a truly pan-canadian league. 

Seconded. 

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Posted (edited)

Pragmatically, surely bilingualism is not going to be there significantly until there teams from any French-speaking areas, such as Ottawa, New Brunswick, or Quebec.

There's some French speakers elsewhere - particularly in Toronto and around Winnipeg. Though typically if you look at the census data, these speakers also speak English. Personally, I do hear a fair amount of French on the street (or more likely streetcar) in Toronto - perhaps because there's a large French elementary school nearby where I live. More often than not though, it's European French I hear and not Canadian French!

Put teams in Quebec and Ottawa, and this will follow naturally. They are the horse - the cart will follow.

Edited by nfitz

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Posted (edited)

I agree that bringing in teams in francophone areas will definitely help raise the coverage the league gets in french. But what can CanPL do in the mean time? The league starts in six weeks (!!), and there are plenty of franco viewers to attract, if their aim is to give global appeal to its product. I mean, maybe they're aiming at only attraction local viewership and not televising most games, at which point its their decision. Fact is, we still dont know what Mediapro's game plan is, really. But in my opinion, they should aim for mass popularity, and that includes areas where the CPL won't have a presence at launch. 

I think, for one, CanPL should reach out to franco journos more. What I read on twitter in this regard is pretty discouraging and might explain why most of them in Québec have painted a negative image for this league. 

Edited by fmfranck

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, nfitz said:

Pragmatically, surely bilingualism is not going to be there significantly until there teams from any French-speaking areas, such as Ottawa, New Brunswick, or Quebec....

If they are going to make a fuss over the concept of being Canada's pro soccer league, both official languages should be taken very seriously from the get-go rather than having one treated as an afterthought. If that's their underlying mentality should we really be surprised that there was no team from Quebec at launch? Even having Alex Bunbury being the one pushing Montreal expansion looks a bit odd given he hasn't lived there for decades and is better known for his soccer exploits in Hamilton than anything he ever did in Montreal.

Edited by BringBackTheBlizzard

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Posted (edited)
23 hours ago, nfitz said:

Pragmatically, surely bilingualism is not going to be there significantly until there teams from any French-speaking areas, such as Ottawa, New Brunswick, or Quebec.

There's some French speakers elsewhere - particularly in Toronto and around Winnipeg. Though typically if you look at the census data, these speakers also speak English. Personally, I do hear a fair amount of French on the street (or more likely streetcar) in Toronto - perhaps because there's a large French elementary school nearby where I live. More often than not though, it's European French I hear and not Canadian French!

Put teams in Quebec and Ottawa, and this will follow naturally. They are the horse - the cart will follow.

During the process of ensuring there were teams on two of our three coasts (the 3rd one being impossible), they've forgotten a huge chunk in the middle.  Surely francophone investors and fans would be more interested in the league if the league didn't have the image of excluding them.  

The horse could haul a lot more if it had a cart.

Edited by SuperCanuck
Embarrassing verb tense error. I've brought shame upon my family.

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Posted (edited)

I've tried so hard to stay out of this but here it is: I am not dismissive of our French bretheren but the fact is that bilingualism is expensive and would be a millstone around the neck of a league that is working hard just to become financially viable. What is wrong with each team being unilingual based on the majority of the fan base? As an Anglophone, if I lived in Quebec or Montreal I would have no problem with everything being in French. And anyone who cares about the league should feel the same, be they unilingual English or French (and if you are bilingual then WTF?!).

Edited by Lofty

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Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, Lofty said:

I've tried so hard to stay out of this but here it is: I am not dismissive of our French bretheren but the fact is that bilingualism is expensive and would be a millstone around the neck of a league that is working hard just to become financially viable. What is wrong with each team being unilingual based on the majority of the fan base? As an Anglophone, if I lived in Quebec or Montreal I would have no problem with everything being in French. And anyone who cares about the league should feel the same, be they unilingual English or French (and if you are bilingual then WTF?!).

mediapro is handling the onesoccer app and they are a multi-billion dollar organization that is actively planning a french broadcast for next year when they go into france. the letter seems more "wtf seriously?" than anything because they're already in quebec. i think the combo of not having it yet but also knowing they're doing it because of a somewhere else getting it in the future would piss anyone off

also i do disagree with the end, if you have an issue with the league you have ever right to voice it and the french language thing valid and it is kind of stupid that it's the case as a fifth of the nation speaks it as their mother tongue and it's in the dark

Edited by matty

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4 hours ago, Lofty said:

I've tried so hard to stay out of this but here it is: I am not dismissive of our French bretheren but the fact is that bilingualism is expensive and would be a millstone around the neck of a league that is working hard just to become financially viable. What is wrong with each team being unilingual based on the majority of the fan base? As an Anglophone, if I lived in Quebec or Montreal I would have no problem with everything being in French. And anyone who cares about the league should feel the same, be they unilingual English or French (and if you are bilingual then WTF?!).

You are totally off base, the cost is negligible, and the need to grow the product requires this basic step. Their vision is lacking, the effort is LAZY. This is of course the CPL's fault for not insisting, and it is plain stupid to boot: One Soccer being MediaPro, and MediaPro banking the league, I can say this: everything they do in Spain gets said in Spanish and Catalan, of course. And Catalan as a % of the Spanish market is less than French in Canada. Meaning if CPL says, Mediapro, in this regard, for sure, 100%, does.

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I am not even close to fluent in French, but I have to admit I was a bit disappointed that even the mini soccer balls given out at the inaugural game didn't even have the league name in French on them. Like, that would have been the simplest thing ever to do. The league name is on the ball exactly twice, why isn't one in English and one in French?

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2 hours ago, Kent said:

I am not even close to fluent in French, but I have to admit I was a bit disappointed that even the mini soccer balls given out at the inaugural game didn't even have the league name in French on them. Like, that would have been the simplest thing ever to do. The league name is on the ball exactly twice, why isn't one in English and one in French?

Pretty simple I think. It is a business and there is no team in Quebec, or anywhere with a meaningful Francophone population (with apologies to the 50,000 Franco-Manitobans and the good people of St. Albert). Once there is a team in those markets, things will change. This isn’t a government subsidized entity with cash to burn. 

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