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23 hours ago, Gian-Luca said:

To expand on my point: A lot of teams - Canada included - who have a very strong regional cup performance  sometimes crash out in their next tourney (usually WCQ). Denmark & Greece both did that when they won the Euro's (respectively) in 1992 and 2004 (Denmark of course only got into Euro1992 because the Yugoslavia as it then was broke apart into war shortly after the team qualified so they were kicked out of the tourney, which tops coin tosses and lot-drawing in my book).

I accept this argument. We can throw Wales in too after euro 2016, although they still have time to turn it around. 

But I suppose it begs the questions as to what you’d rather do: win a gold cup or just qualify for a World Cup?

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5 minutes ago, RJB said:

I accept this argument. We can throw Wales in too after euro 2016, although they still have time to turn it around. 

But I suppose it begs the questions as to what you’d rather do: win a gold cup or just qualify for a World Cup?

I'd rather do both because it's not an either/or. But speaking of Wales Euro 2016, I am hoping that Canada's current situation becomes similar to Belgium who had a semi-decent Euro2016 by getting to the Q-F but could and should have been better. They lost to Italy in the round-robin (similar to losing to Mexico but at that point the Belgian team was favoured over an Italian team/program that had been in decline) and then lost in the Q-F to Wales, who they also should have beat based on overall quality of their roster. It didn't seem like they could win the big knockout games, but then they had an excellent World Cup in 2018 with their own character come-from-behind victory and even knocking out Brazil. (I'm not expecting Canada to do specifically that in 2022, but hoping that they learn from the experience, learn how to win the pressure games and come back stronger & qualify for Qatar following a disappointing exit from their continental tourney that they could have done better in).

Another potential parallel to Belgium is that comparatively speaking we are an attacking team now, like they are, whereas Canada 2000, Greece 2004 and Denmark 1992 were all a bit similar in being more defensive teams who rode an incredible keeper to the championship (Forrest, Nikopolidis (sic?) and Schmeical).

 

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1 hour ago, RJB said:

But I suppose it begs the questions as to what you’d rather do: win a gold cup or just qualify for a World Cup?

It is an interesting question what each would so to the broader public interest in soccer.  Lets say we make it to the big show in 2022 and get our asses kicked.  Lets say 3 losses, 8 or 9 goals against and 1 for.  Does that kind of performance ignite the imagination of Canadian children or do most casual viewers watch and feel pretty much validated that we are in fact shite, just like they thought. 

Contrast with winning our regional tournament.  Lower competition obviously, and far less glamourous, but it would garner media attention, be viewed as a success, and couldn't be completely written off as amateur hour since there is respect for the US and Mexico even among the unwashed hordes. 

The WC is a clear winner for me personally and I suspect most on here (would result in increased investment, friendlies, recruiting efforts, etc), but I am curious which would reverberate with the public in a sustained way.  It's not like our participation in '86 kick started a new golden age of soccer.

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Jamaica must be disappointed to lose to the USA. They were ripe for the picking this year.

Another Mex-USA final, but the first since 2011. 

I hope both of these teams could lose, but I will wish for Mexico to win, just to knock the Americans down a few pegs. Their whining about missing the WC really got under my skin. 

Mexico are also objectively better, top to bottom, though USA do have that Pulisic guy who is pretty good. Hasn't looked great this tournament, for what one would expect, but neither has Leon Bailey for Jamaica. Soccer truly is a team sport, clearly.

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The USA had the easier bracket while the other side was definitely way more talented, so easy path to the finals for them.

Like the last WCQ, there's no hiding in CNL and next WCQ for them. Time to put up or shut up for everyone.

International window=everyone will be at full strength with their A teams

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Posted (edited)

Thought the first 15 minutes the US totally dominated Jamaica...thought Cannon played great and threw Jamaica off...McKennie was a monster as well...the weather delay was a big break for Jamaica they made some tactical adjustments and settled in...the US adjusted again at the half though and to me controlled things...easily their best performance under Berhalter IMO

 

Mexico is better overall and should handle the US but barring a big win for Mexico dont believe a loss will move the needle too much for the Americans...

Edited by mrstepp817

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Posted (edited)
11 minutes ago, mrstepp817 said:

Thought the first 15 minutes the US totally dominated Jamaica...thought Cannon played great and threw Jamaica off...McKennie was a monster as well...the weather delay was a big break for Jamaica they made some tactical adjustments and settled in...the US adjusted again at the half though and to me controlled things...easily their best performance under Berhalter IMO

I agree completely with your opinion ^. 

Should be noted, US has played a ton of friendlies since before the World Cup last summer. To his credit, he has tried out many different players and many different formations and tactics during these friendlies, has taken tons of heat in the media at times also.

The US have definitely not looked pretty at times this tournament including some of their friendlies over the last year. I am not a Berhalter fan by any means but no denying they still got the job done and Berhalter's tactics did produce the result needed last night.

There will be tons of criticism going into 2020 qualifying,maybe they get exposed or maybe all the playing time together they find a way to get results, we will see.  In my opinion,  I do think the Americans qualify for Qatar, I'd be surprised if they didn't.

Edited by apbsmith

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On 7/4/2019 at 3:04 PM, mrstepp817 said:

Thought the first 15 minutes the US totally dominated Jamaica...thought Cannon played great and threw Jamaica off...McKennie was a monster as well...the weather delay was a big break for Jamaica they made some tactical adjustments and settled in...the US adjusted again at the half though and to me controlled things...easily their best performance under Berhalter IMO

 

 

Jamaica was close to tying that game.

Mckennie is awesome but he faded last half an hour.

If that was their best performance, we can easily take them in the Nation’s League. 

On 7/4/2019 at 12:49 AM, BearcatSA said:

The Leverkusen man for Jamaica always looks like he's going to fall on his face while on the dribble but he makes things happen:  his cross set up the Jamaican goal.

That boy is smooth like butter. Chelsea should get him.

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Next Gold Cup will have VAR.  

Vic addressed the Mexican media for several minutes.  For those who don't speak Spanish, here's a translation: 

Vic says: "This is a historic day in the history of CONCACAF.  Just over 12 years ago here at Soldier Field in Chicago and 10 feet behind where I'm standing now, a robbery was committed by that bast@rd Archundia against the undisputed GOAT Atiba Hutchinson.  Had VAR been in place back then, Canada would've won the Gold Cup and conquered the planet in short order"

 

 

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27 minutes ago, badname22 said:

Quick question, If Jimenez scores just 1, and he and David both finish on 6, who gets the boot?

I suspect it will be David for having played fewer minutes. Or possibly because none of his goals have been PK's. Another possible tie-breaker could be assists, but I think the Gold Cup goes by fewest minutes in terms of golden boot tiebreakers as that is now Davies got it in 2017. Currently this is what the official Gold Cup sight has as stats - David in first and note that Cavallini is actually 2nd ahead of Jimenez:

https://www.goldcup.org/en/statistics

1
Canadá
Jonathan David
 
 
 
6
3 First Half
3 Second Half
0 Extra-time
2
Canadá
Lucas Cavallini
 
 
 
5
4 First Half
1 Second Half
0 Extra-time
3
México
Raúl Jiménez
 
 
 
5
2 First Half
2 Second Half
1 Extra-time
4
México
Uriel Antuna
 
 
 
4
3 First Half
1 Second Half
0 Extra-time
5
Guyana
Neil Danns
 
 
 
3
1 First Half
2 Second Half
0 Extra-time
6
Estados Unidos
Gyasi Zardes
 
 
 
3
0 First Half
3 Second Half
0 Extra-time
7
Estados Unidos
Christian Pulisic
 
 
 
3
0 First Half
3 Second Half
0 Extra-time
8
México
Andrés Guardado
 
 
 
2
0 First Half
2 Second Half
0 Extra-time

 

 

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Some other interesting stats on that Gold Cup stats page:

  • Cavallini is leading on shooting percentage with a 41.7% shooting accuracy. David is second with 37.5%. Jimenez isn't in the top 13 (he is leading with 32 shots overall). Hoilett is at #13 with 18.2%. There is a 5 shot minimum to get on the board.
  • Scott Arfield is 3rd in the tourney with the highest number of incomplete passes. Alphonso Davies is 4th & Hoilett is 6th. #1 is Joel Campbell and #2 is Leon Bailey, something to keep in mind as that's a lot of high quality players with the greatest number of incomplete passes, and all attacking players (Weston McKennie is at #5). The stats don't say where on the field the passes were attempted of course.
  • On the flip side, Kamal Miller is tied for 1st in the tourney for passing accuracy with Navarro of Mexico. Let's all cheer for Navarro to start & to make an incomplete pass so that Miller can with the "Golden Postman" (a new term I have coined here and now for accurate delivery - I will rely on the rest of you to make it go viral across North America)
  • Davies is tied with Pulisic for most assists with 3. David has 2 assists (as does Hoilett) so that may answer my earlier question as Jiminez doesn't seem to be credited with an assist, so unless he scores 2 or scores one and assists on two others, the golden boot will go to Davies (of course, that's not an impossible or unlikely scenario that he could do that).
  • For "steals", Samuel Piette and Derek Cornelius are tied in 3rd place, each having stolen the ball off their opponents 13 times - but Piette is ranked 3rd presumably because he played fewer minutes. Atiba is in 7th with 10 and the much-maligned Marcus Godinho is actually in 6th with 12 steals. Piette is actually leading the tourney with an average of 6.5 steals per game.
  • As a team Canada leads in goals per game with 3.5

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9 minutes ago, Acid-Tone said:

Most USW soccer fans aren't necessarily US men's soccer fans.  And a lot aren't even really soccer fans at all.   

You’re probably correct.  But i bet the same can be said of Canadians when our women were playing at the World Cup; and if our men ever get there again.

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2 hours ago, Gian-Luca said:

I suspect it will be David for having played fewer minutes.

Whoohooo! A benefit for losing in the quarters.

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7 minutes ago, JamboAl said:

You’re probably correct.  But i bet the same can be said of Canadians when our women were playing at the World Cup; and if our men ever get there again.

Agreed.

Only it's made worse by the fact that the US women are clearly the best in the world*, and so you have a lot of "front running" fans  that just want to be known as supporting a winner. 

 

* They have a lot of built in advantages such as the sheer size of the country and the title IX law.

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Posted (edited)

A large number of the El Tri fans at the game are probably Americans...probably a significant portion of the potential USMNT fan base there (but that's another story about USSF and their terrible job reaching out to the latino market)

Basically any USA-Mexico game in the US outside of just a couple of venues are Mexico home games in essence 

Edited by mrstepp817

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Posted (edited)

7 minutes to play

Losing 1-0 to Mexico

Subbing out Altidore for Zardes was bad enough

But using the last sub for Lovitz???

Seems the US have the same coaching issues that we do 

 

Edited by Ansem

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