Pacific FC Launch / 2019 off season thread

[shorty]

Got my email too. Finally!

 

[Unnamed Trialist]

It's as if you do the test run for Nanaimo, so you can get Victoria right the next time. 

On election day, though being a Saturday should not matter. I do agree that if they can find a way to get a few hundred down each game from Nanaimo and other communities north, that would be smart. Nanaimo fans actually go to Vancouver for the BC Lions, I recall years ago them streaming off the hovercraft when that was going, so maybe there is stronger sports base there than many realise. 

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

 

Edited October 22, 2018 by BringBackTheBlizzard

[Unnamed Trialist]

3 hours ago, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

I think we are going to see a few hundred families in Langford and the western communities signing up for a few games a year as they'll see it as kids' or family entertainment. It will be close to home and for once it won't mean going to Victoria to do something different. 

Victoria also gets decent, CPL type numbers for amateur baseball and BCHL hockey. And that is to watch teams from, almost always, smaller places. So I would think there has to be some base there. 

I see 3-4000 a game as reasonable. I think 6000 will be pretty hard to achieve.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

Will definitely be interesting to see what happens. I don't fully understand why this Pacific FC team is attracting relatively few memberships in what is very much a traditional soccer hotbed, so it makes me wonder whether it's the Langford angle and the reason the municipality were so accommodating on getting the team to move in was that it's a lousy location. Agree that 3-4000 would be a reasonable target for CanPL teams in the smaller markets and hope that's what they are really budgeting for.

[Unnamed Trialist]

Just now, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

Will definitely be interesting to see what happens. I don't fully understand why this Pacific FC team is attracting relatively few memberships in what is very much a traditional soccer hotbed, so it makes me wonder whether it's the Langford angle and the reason the municipality were so accommodating on getting the team to move in was that it's a lousy location. Agree that 3-4000 would be a reasonable target for CanPL teams in the smaller markets and hope that's what they are really budgeting for.

The mayor of Langford was just reelected. He is an ambitious guy, basically building a slightly tacky bedroom suburb for the upper-middle class, though trying to apply some basic zoning ideas to create a town centre nucleus. I find the whole town a bit odd the architecture for both offices, shops and homes is quite mediocre. Mind you, the parks, gardening, attention to detail in services, roads, schools, all good.

PacificFC has to be smart enough to run the club themselves and do proper vetting on the stadium, marketing, so he isn't overly involved. There are only about 35,000 in Langford, the population base is in Victoria proper and just north, in Saanich, which is in fact bigger in population--and technically closer by road to the Langford stadium site.

[ted]

I was saying to someone earlier today that while my politics don't actually align with the mayor generally, for the sake of the stadium I was glad he was reelected. We don't need any political hiccups at this point.

[Kent]

Apologies because I am sure I should know this, the Highlanders are continuing next season right? Could the splitting of fans in Victoria proper be an explanation for the low membership numbers?

[BenFisk'sBiggestFan]

From what i can tell Victoria area is a pretty fickle market. My uncle lives there and it is really a very unique place. It has a high amount of wealthy people for its size, accompanied by a very unique culture. The city seems fairly slow to adapt to new things. Pacific FC has been increasing very steadily since their launch, and i think as the season comes along we will see higher membership numbers. In fact, i think they will increase the most out of any team throughout the season. As people attend the games they will get interested. On the island i think the product itself will be the best marketing tool.

[ted]

13 hours ago, Kent said:

Apologies because I am sure I should know this, the Highlanders are continuing next season right? Could the splitting of fans in Victoria proper be an explanation for the low membership numbers?

Yes, the Highlanders are returning next year. IMO the low membership numbers have everything to do with the fact that the marketing has only now begun and nothing to do with VHFC. 

 

7 minutes ago, BenFisk'sBiggestFan said:

In fact, i think they will increase the most out of any team throughout the season. As people attend the games they will get interested. On the island i think the product itself will be the best marketing tool.

I think Josh Simpson will be the best marketing tool. His passion for the game and his excitement is infectious. Seeing the pictures from the event this past Saturday you could see how he was engaging the youth and their parents with his love for the game. 

As I mentioned in another thread, I expect a sellout on opening day and strong numbers all season as people get onboard. This city will get behind the team in a way that has not been seen for decades in the soccer world. 

[Unnamed Trialist]

21 hours ago, ted said:

I was saying to someone earlier today that while my politics don't actually align with the mayor generally, for the sake of the stadium I was glad he was reelected. We don't need any political hiccups at this point.

I agree Ted, better for him to continue. He's a maverick, and can be irritating, but he has the vision. If we had just one mayor like that in all the Fraser Valley, we'd have a Metro Van team right now in CPL. So these types are hard to come by.

BTW, one of the candidates for Mayor of Victoria is a close friend, I was helping with some background stuff in the campaign (which was very bare bones). He literally lives close enough to Royal Athletic to hear the fans and see the lights when they play night baseball. I convinced him that RAP could have worked, and he seemed convinced. But as you may have seen, the subject of sports, beyond bike lanes, or Crystal Pool, was absent from the Victoria campaign.

Edited October 23, 2018 by Unnamed Trialist

[ted]

^ I hope that by the time the next election rolls around the team will be filling the stadium regularly and the club will have a high enough profile to warrant a place in the campaign.

[Watchmen]

8 hours ago, BenFisk'sBiggestFan said:

From what i can tell Victoria area is a pretty fickle market. My uncle lives there and it is really a very unique place. It has a high amount of wealthy people for its size, accompanied by a very unique culture. The city seems fairly slow to adapt to new things. Pacific FC has been increasing very steadily since their launch, and i think as the season comes along we will see higher membership numbers. In fact, i think they will increase the most out of any team throughout the season. As people attend the games they will get interested. On the island i think the product itself will be the best marketing tool.

Would memberships actually keep increasing?  At some point, wouldn't people simply skip the "membership" aspect and simply sign up as a season ticket holder or partial-season ticket holder instead?

[Watchmen]

On 10/22/2018 at 12:38 PM, BringBackTheBlizzard said:

Will definitely be interesting to see what happens. I don't fully understand why this Pacific FC team is attracting relatively few memberships in what is very much a traditional soccer hotbed, so it makes me wonder whether it's the Langford angle and the reason the municipality were so accommodating on getting the team to move in was that it's a lousy location. Agree that 3-4000 would be a reasonable target for CanPL teams in the smaller markets and hope that's what they are really budgeting for.

If the target in the early seasons is 5000 to break even, then being at 3-4k is a bad spot to be in.  It means you're not only losing money, but if the league grows you have to grow even more just to try to catch the break even point.  I'm not saying 3-4k is an unreasonable expectation, but I think they're setting up to be a weaker team in the league on a permanent basis, and that's a tough spot.

[Aird25]

1 hour ago, Watchmen said:

I think they're setting up to be a weaker team in the league on a permanent basis

That's an incredibly bold prediction.

[ted]

14 hours ago, Watchmen said:

... I think they're setting up to be a weaker team in the league on a permanent basis, and that's a tough spot.

And I think that is a ridiculous conclusion based on nothing.

As someone who has met the owners a couple of times now, observed what they have been doing and listened to the words they have been saying, I think they are setting up a club that will grow and succeed in the long term. A club that will develop players on the Island and develop as a business that will be sustainable for the future.

They believe they can fill the stands and I have yet to see any reason to doubt either their sincerity in that goal nor their ability to deliver.

[Ansem]

A sustainable Vancouver Island team with local talent that could grow one day as a top team? Why not?

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

15 hours ago, Watchmen said:

If the target in the early seasons is 5000 to break even, then being at 3-4k is a bad spot to be in...

What I'm suggesting is that the publicly stated goal may be different from what they really expect privately.

[Watchmen]

10 hours ago, ted said:

And I think that is a ridiculous conclusion based on nothing.

As someone who has met the owners a couple of times now, observed what they have been doing and listened to the words they have been saying, I think they are setting up a club that will grow and succeed in the long term. A club that will develop players on the Island and develop as a business that will be sustainable for the future.

They believe they can fill the stands and I have yet to see any reason to doubt either their sincerity in that goal nor their ability to deliver.

Well, they're lagging behind in membership sales.  The owner has openly been talking about wanting a much lower cap than what other owners seemingly wanted at the start.  The owners also spent time talking about how much they want a team in the lower mainland, and it was quite obviously their first choice on locations.  I'm don't doubt their sincerity in wanting it to succeed on the Island, nor on their desire to develop local players.  I just think they'll be working with a smaller budget and will have more trouble actually having success on the field in the league.

[BringBackTheBlizzard]

A lot depends on whether Pacific FC are the only ones that wanted a low budget and a legitimate shot at viability straight away. Sustainability was also a major stated concern where Tom Fath and FCE were concerned and there was a lot of drama in Edmonton before they finally joined. Have seen it claimed that was no sure thing up until a week before it was announced back in May/June.

[Cheeta]

All speculation but I'll play.

Whatever "lowest common denominator" is used to determine the salary cap it's always going to handicap the bigger clubs and create struggles for the smaller ones.  And if the league gets it right that's exactly the way it should be.  However,  I'm pretty sure Pacific is going to fall on the hardship side of that salary cap boundary.  They simply won't have the revenue generating potential some of their competitors have.  But... you take the good with the bad.

On the negative, their revenue potential may be more limited and there is of course the exaggerated travel cost burdens (since this seems to be a club responsibility and not a league responsibility even though there WOULDN'T BE A LEAGUE without Pacific and Halifax).

On the positive they're in a labour rich environment.  There are going to be CPL quality players in BC that won't be lured away from playing in BC by the $10K or $15K more a year they would make playing for Valour or Forge or Halifax.  They will play for Pacific "on the cheap" or they simply won't go pro.  And I'm sure that reality will be echoed in Ontario as well, and not just with the on-field labour,  Coaching and support staffing as well (a very underestimated value to my mind) 

Still speculating, but if 4 years from now this league proves half-assed successful well that "good with the bad" keep balancing itself out for Pacific?  Don't know but I doubt it.  Doesn't matter what you're discussing at the end of the day its the money that talks.      

Zen Cheeta 

[shamrock]

2 hours ago, Cheeta said:

  There are going to be CPL quality players in BC that won't be lured away from playing in BC by the $10K or $15K more a year they would make playing for Valour or Forge or Halifax. 

 

Doesn't matter what you're discussing at the end of the day its the money that talks.      

 

This seems to contradict. Surely better players will be lured away with a couple K more pay. We'll see that after 1 season.  

[Unnamed Trialist]

Cheeta is right, no Lower Mainland player is going to say no to going to Vancouver Island. It would probably reduce his living costs, apart from the fact that quality of life is high. So the player captation area of Pacific FC represents about 2.5 million people, realistically. 

Just because the BCSA has been very poor growing amateur soccer, and has let the presence of BC players fall, does not mean they are not there waiting for a chance. I think it is a question of having the team to aspire to. 

I predict Pacific being mid-table,  at least, first because of players, club owners and captation area; and then because the other teams are going to suffer more travelling to Victoria, and that is a major home advantage. Also because the stadium configuration, regardless of having the fans required in numerical terms, will give them an intense home game atmosphere. 

So there!

[ted]

14 hours ago, Watchmen said:

Well, they're lagging behind in membership sales.  The owner has openly been talking about wanting a much lower cap than what other owners seemingly wanted at the start.  The owners also spent time talking about how much they want a team in the lower mainland, and it was quite obviously their first choice on locations.  I'm don't doubt their sincerity in wanting it to succeed on the Island, nor on their desire to develop local players.  I just think they'll be working with a smaller budget and will have more trouble actually having success on the field in the league.

Membership sales: already dealt with the overblown and idiotic complaints about the membership numbers.

Salary Cap: There are three owners (not one) and the "business guy" seeking to limit expenses is neither surprising nor of concern.

Lower Mainland: now you flip your error and say "owners". AFAIK Rob Friend was the owner (one of three) who wanted the Lower Mainland. Simpson is an Island boy and Shillington, as the aforesaid "business guy" probably only cared about the best deal/market.

You think we will struggle, I think we will be in the mix for top of the table. We'll see in 2019.

Edited October 25, 2018 by ted
spelling

[Aird25]

Friend, Simpson, and Silberbauer all have experience at high levels of the sport. There's no guarantee that will translate into on field success, but for me they appear to have a leg up in that department. I don't think that's any less important than early membership numbers, as on field success is the surest way to sell tickets.  

Edited October 26, 2018 by Aird25